Tell me if I'm wrong

[bluecastle]

Just want to say that was a lovely post, Sherry, and that I had the same thoughts in reading Pepper’s response. Always wonderful to see someone able to turn the prism of themselves with that kind of humility, and to not feel attacked or judged by others. Bodes well for the future, Pepper, and for getting past this snag, if you can keep channeling that attitude.

 

It’s easy to adapt a me vs them approach to the world, be it against a random in a pool league or even a spouse. But it’s limited, and limiting, and quite isolating. An approach that we are all in it together, that leaves room for some ideas (a person being rude, a partner being careless) to be seen as ideas rather than facts? Not always easy, but more rewarding and less limiting.

 

Best of luck.

[Cherylyn]

I've since learned that when you say nothing, you are letting others know that they can continue to disrespect you. Then when you speak up (or your husband), suddenly there's a wake up call to behave graciously and respectfully. Sometimes it takes "burning bystanders" and necessary drama in order to let them know that their behavior towards you is uncalled for. Snubbing you is arrogant behavior and in this society, we're supposed to be polite and well mannered otherwise you'll feel uncomfortable and unwelcome in an atmosphere that is supposed to be enjoyable such as billiards, right? Isn't the purpose of pool games to share good times with your friends? How can you share good times when there is an old rude sour puss dude within your midst? Ask your husband to break the ice for you. I'm sure you would but obviously the rude guy ignores you so ask your husband to say, "Look dude, be kind and show respect to my wife, please." How hard is that? Then everyone can enjoy pool, relax, share laughter and have a good time. This is a social event which should be a happy atmosphere; not a tense atmosphere.

 

Snubbing, arrogant, obnoxious rudeness is not an option. Why would you want to be treated this way? Unless you're a robot who has no feelings? That type of behavior is shameful and disdainful.

 

It's bad enough that the OP, Pepper12 had zero input as CO-CAPTAIN when deciding to accept the rude dude into the fold. A consolation would be at least for everyone to get along cordially and peacefully. That's not an unreasonable request by any stretch.

[Pepper13]

Seriously y'all I'm truly grateful to each of youand your kind words and even your harsh ones. Things have a way of getting to us at times and I'm first to admit that I learned from y'all that I should stand for some things and that becoming blinded by my own hurt only led to fear and monstrously engulfed my existence to the point of lashing out in a manner that merely made me appear as spoiled baby.... and in all actuality it should have lit a fire under my ass to get all dolled up and step into those 7 inch platforms and shake rude dudes hand REAL good while stating welcome to OUR team to remind him that I am my husband's co captain and just show up every Monday fearless(and flawless) just the way my hubby loves me to be. I have become meeker and less than myself as our communication has become flawed and the relationship strained. I opened the dialogue tonight *** I apologized to my king tonight and we laid in the bed and had a good solid talk about alot of stuff and at the end of it before going to sleep I told my husband that I had posted this and asked perfect strangers to chime in and that it hurt me to hear the truth in my mistakes but I explained that I did it because I care about us and that to be so vulnerable in the presence of others was a chance I wanted to take for the sake of our marriage .....i admitted to him my wrongs and I did apologize for several things. I could tell that he was surprised yet appreciated the position I put myself in. When I offered to him the chance to read it and he said "no baby I don't need to" ......i said "oh NO you're gonna read it..... you get your lumps too!!!" We laughed for the first time in about 2 weeks and after we kissed goodnight he's asleep next to me while I'm writing this to y'all. Please everyone remember be humble and kind we are all blessed. We only get 1 LIFE but many opportunities to Live it with LOVE

[SherrySher]

Thanks, Blue. Very kind of you.

 

The gentler approach is often the better one. After all, isn't there enough upset in this world?

 

Stay close to your husband, Pepper. He sounds like a good one. No need to start a war with this other man, he's no one. Keep your focus on the one who matters, your husband. He loves you dearly by the sounds of it.

 

Cheers.

[SherrySher]

dudes hand REAL good while stating welcome to OUR team to remind him that I am my husband's co captain and just show up every Monday fearless(and flawless) just the way my hubby loves me to be

 

There you go!

Honey attracts more bees than vinegar. You've got a good heart, Pepper. Shine brightly. You won't shine brighter by putting out others light or to start wars.

Smile, be your dazzling self, stand up as co captain and remember this is about you and your husband, no one else.

[catfeeder]

Not necessary. It will only be asking for more trouble and more drama.

 

I'm sure Pepper and her husband can work this out without burning bystanders unnecessarily. As long as you and your husband focus on each other, Pepper, then this new player won't even be a speck on your radar, nor should he be.

He is only there to play pool. It's not worth it. As long as he keeps to himself, so be it.

Keep your eye on what matters and that's your husband.

 

I agree. I'd make room for the idea that a new person joining a group is overwhelmed. Unless husband introduced the guy and THEN he deliberately snubbed, I'd consider the guy too focused on hearing husband to notice anything or anyone outside of that scope at the moment.

 

I tend to watch my own perceptions and work them in my own favor instead of jumping into injury over every possible slight. I often learn that I was mistaken, and if not, there are far far worse things than one person in a group who isn't outwardly friendly to me. Sometimes things take time. I'm glad to have grown out of knee-jerk reactions.

[boltnrun]

Great update. Glad it worked out this way.

[ThatwasThen]

Seriously y'all I'm truly grateful to each of youand your kind words and even your harsh ones. Things have a way of getting to us at times and I'm first to admit that I learned from y'all that I should stand for some things and that becoming blinded by my own hurt only led to fear and monstrously engulfed my existence to the point of lashing out in a manner that merely made me appear as spoiled baby.... and in all actuality it should have lit a fire under my ass to get all dolled up and step into those 7 inch platforms and shake rude dudes hand REAL good while stating welcome to OUR team to remind him that I am my husband's co captain and just show up every Monday fearless(and flawless) just the way my hubby loves me to be. I have become meeker and less than myself as our communication has become flawed and the relationship strained. I opened the dialogue tonight *** I apologized to my king tonight and we laid in the bed and had a good solid talk about alot of stuff and at the end of it before going to sleep I told my husband that I had posted this and asked perfect strangers to chime in and that it hurt me to hear the truth in my mistakes but I explained that I did it because I care about us and that to be so vulnerable in the presence of others was a chance I wanted to take for the sake of our marriage .....i admitted to him my wrongs and I did apologize for several things. I could tell that he was surprised yet appreciated the position I put myself in. When I offered to him the chance to read it and he said "no baby I don't need to" ......i said "oh NO you're gonna read it..... you get your lumps too!!!" We laughed for the first time in about 2 weeks and after we kissed goodnight he's asleep next to me while I'm writing this to y'all. Please everyone remember be humble and kind we are all blessed. We only get 1 LIFE but many opportunities to Live it with LOVE

You go, girl. Sink all those balls next Monday and have fun.

[Cherylyn]

Seriously y'all I'm truly grateful to each of youand your kind words and even your harsh ones. Things have a way of getting to us at times and I'm first to admit that I learned from y'all that I should stand for some things and that becoming blinded by my own hurt only led to fear and monstrously engulfed my existence to the point of lashing out in a manner that merely made me appear as spoiled baby.... and in all actuality it should have lit a fire under my ass to get all dolled up and step into those 7 inch platforms and shake rude dudes hand REAL good while stating welcome to OUR team to remind him that I am my husband's co captain and just show up every Monday fearless(and flawless) just the way my hubby loves me to be. I have become meeker and less than myself as our communication has become flawed and the relationship strained. I opened the dialogue tonight *** I apologized to my king tonight and we laid in the bed and had a good solid talk about alot of stuff and at the end of it before going to sleep I told my husband that I had posted this and asked perfect strangers to chime in and that it hurt me to hear the truth in my mistakes but I explained that I did it because I care about us and that to be so vulnerable in the presence of others was a chance I wanted to take for the sake of our marriage .....i admitted to him my wrongs and I did apologize for several things. I could tell that he was surprised yet appreciated the position I put myself in. When I offered to him the chance to read it and he said "no baby I don't need to" ......i said "oh NO you're gonna read it..... you get your lumps too!!!" We laughed for the first time in about 2 weeks and after we kissed goodnight he's asleep next to me while I'm writing this to y'all. Please everyone remember be humble and kind we are all blessed. We only get 1 LIFE but many opportunities to Live it with LOVE

 

I'm glad it all worked out for you, Pepper13. It's your marriage and you're married to him so you know best how to navigate your marriage as opposed to a bunch of faceless strangers in cyberspace who are not in your household.

 

I hope for your sake you won't remain meek and kowtow to others including your husband. I'm not sure why you have to apologize given that he didn't bother to consult with you to invite the rude dude into your billiard group since, after all, are you a co-captain as in co-manager of the billiard group? Are you forbidden from all input and decision making regarding who is admitted and eliminated from your billiard group? What's the role of co-captain if you're not privy to the decision making process regarding admission of new members? You've apologized but don't you think your husband owes you a sincere apology?

 

It's one thing to invite a rude dude into your billiard group without consulting with your husband's co-captain (you) and then in addition to that affront, you have to tolerate a poor choice as a member who continues to snub you? How awkward is that for you? Then your husband doesn't bother to do any damage control by saying to the rude dude: "Hey dude, respect my wife and we can all relax our shoulders so we can have a good time playing pool." Something to that effect will give the rude dude a wake up call to behave like a decent human being. It's not enjoyable to be in a social setting when some people are not amiable because it feels so cold.

 

If you can brush all offenses under the rug after you've groveled to your husband, that's your marriage and as long as you're both happy, it's all that matters. I'm just seeing the principle of the matter and I would never acquiesce nor kowtow to my husband nor anyone otherwise my meek demeanor will become an expectation. Meek people get taken advantage of.

[boltnrun]

"Meek" and "kowtow"?

 

I don't see an apology as either of those things. And I don't see the need for the OP's husband to say anything. Yes, what that man did was at the very least thoughtless and bad manners, but not worthy of the husband going all he man on him.

[bluecastle]

"Meek" and "kowtow"?

 

I don't see an apology as either of those things.

 

Agreed.

 

To add, I don't see an apology as currency, meaning I don't think we apologize to someone in order to get them to apologize back, pressing start on the stop watch on our resentment meter when that apology fails to materialize.

 

In the annals of human behavior, particularly in social settings, I think someone failing to say hello can be chalked up to a lot of things before landing on "rude," so I'd also add that it's worth asking, as it always is, if that's the sort of hill one wants to fight to the death on. Maybe dude was a bit absentminded, maybe dude was a little overwhelmed. Maybe, just maybe, it was not a "snub."

 

For years, per Pepper's own self-assessment, she has been a non-committed co-captain of a team. Yes, in the utopia that no human lives in, it would have been nice if her husband discussed a new teammate to shore things up against future absences in the same manner he had discussed the challenges of co-captaining with a part-time co-captain. But given those early discussions, and given that teams generally function well with present teammates, I think it's one of those moments where everyone benefits from the humility that Pepper found inside her than the hubris that led, in part, to a small tear becoming a rip in the fabric of their connection.

 

I'm happy to hear things have leveled off, and hope, in that, you two have found a new plane on which to communicate: as co-captains of the ship that is your marriage and, by extension, as co-captains in the pool league. Have played on many of those myself, and know how fun a ritual it can be. Know how it can get a little heated as well, as happens in life.

[Cherylyn]

Yes, meek and kotow. We agree to disagree.

 

Yes, the husband should apologize for not consulting with his wife regarding co-captain / co-managerial decisions regarding the billiard group.

 

Not saying 'hello' to the co-captain as a new member is an act of arrogance and indeed a snub. And yes, it is considered very rude unless you were raised by a pack of animals.

 

However, as long as Pepper13 is happy in her household, hooray!

 

I'm just saying there are times when you need to see the principle of the matter and take care of it otherwise there are bigger slights in the future which were preceded by previous slights which eventually morphed into layers of slights, biting your tongue and looking the other way each time. Sooner or later patience runs out in the future. For now, everything is peachy which is awesome, Pepper13.

[SherrySher]

"Meek" and "kowtow"?

 

I don't see an apology as either of those things. And I don't see the need for the OP's husband to say anything. Yes, what that man did was at the very least thoughtless and bad manners, but not worthy of the husband going all he man on him.

 

Agree, bolt.

 

Cheryl, why are you so harcore wanting this couple to start a battle with each other and with this man? Honestly, it's not necessary. There are other ways to go about it without resorting to anger and upset like this.

[catfeeder]

Agree, bolt.

 

Cheryl, why are you so harcore wanting this couple to start a battle with each other and with this man? Honestly, it's not necessary. There are other ways to go about it without resorting to anger and upset like this.

 

I agree. Stomping and demanding is not against the law, it's just not a great strategy for gaining respect.

[Cherylyn]

Agree, bolt.

 

Cheryl, why are you so harcore wanting this couple to start a battle with each other and with this man? Honestly, it's not necessary. There are other ways to go about it without resorting to anger and upset like this.

 

To the contrary, if I were co-captain, you would think a co-captain is reminiscent of a co-manager and co-anything as top administrators to any organization makes decisions together and mutually as opposed to behind someone's back. The icing on this cake is it's not even a courteous guy entering the billiard group; it's a rude dude who ignores Pepper13 which doesn't make for a comfortable, amiable social setting. It's awkward and feels so cold when you're ignored in what is supposed to be a joyful social gathering. Then to be meek, kowtow and grovel begging for forgiveness is beyond me.

 

However, like I've said before, as long as Pepper13 is happy in her household and marriage, that's just wonderful.

 

And, I agree to disagree.

[ThatwasThen]

Apologizing for one's childish behaviour that resulting in having your nose cut off to spite your face isn't being "meek" or "kowtowing" or "grovelling" or even "begging for forgiveness." (BTW: Pepper you did none of those things with a simple apology) It is being humble and realizing where you were wrong.

 

It's nice to read that you understands the difference, Pepper.

[Cherylyn]

Apologizing for one's childish behaviour that resulting in having your nose cut off to spite your face isn't being "meek" or "kowtowing" or "grovelling" or even "begging for forgiveness." (BTW: Pepper you did none of those things with a simple apology) It is being humble and realizing where you were wrong.

 

It's nice to read that you understands the difference, Pepper.

 

Yeah, meek, kowtowing, groveling, begging for forgiveness. We're all entitled to our own opinions on this forum. I respect all of your opinions and I respect mine as well.

 

And, her co-captain husband wasn't wrong for taking it upon himself to invite the rude dude into the group without consulting with his co-captain wife? What is she? Chopped liver? Does her opinion and consultation not matter? Is she not co-captain as in co-manager?

 

Then the cherry on top of this sundae is that the rude dude ignores Pepper13? He's not even courteous, polite and well-mannered and instead ignores Pepper13? How awkward and rude is that?

 

Yes, Pepper13 apologized but her husband should've apologized, too since he had a part in all this. It's unfair for only one person to do all the apologizing when the husband is at fault with what he did such as not consulting with his CO-captain wife and invite the rude dude into the billiard group on top of that. At least the new member guy could've at least been a non-rude dude but he's a rude dude instead.

 

I agree to disagree.

 

As I've said before, I'm glad Pepper13 and her husband are enjoying the billiard group despite not consulting with each other as co-captains to invite the rude dude into their social billiard group. Happy pooling!

 

And, I will tell you straight up, I've been in familial situations with extended family members when there should've been apologies especially from the other side. However, in order to keep the peace, I am the one who groveled, apologized and asked for forgiveness despite wrongdoings done unto me. I swallowed my pride and apologized despite knowing that their apologies would never be forthcoming in a million years because some people deny fault to death, would never own up to it in a million years and it's simply never going to happen, period. They did take me back into their fold. We're all supposed to simply sweep everything under the rug, pretend it never happened and all is jolly and merry now, right? Uhhh, I don't think so. We're all supposed to accept others warts and all, "foibles" and all, right? Nope, not always. Granted, we're all at peace now but it doesn't mean I'll never forget what they did, said and wrote and what I had to do in order to make amends with them. Forgive? Yes. Forget? Never. And with that "never," a huge part of me got up and left or simply died.

 

For Pepper13's sake, I'm glad it all worked out for her nonetheless. For me, what was once a close relationship with some of those folks, either ended up with estrangement (with my former dear childhood cousin) or with some extended relatives and in-laws, there's always a permanent polite yet frosty distance. It can't be helped. Yes, there's peace but my previous unequivocal trust, devotion and loyalty has since died.

[HeartGoesOn]

This thread has run its course...Closed.