Somewhere in between indifference, confusion, and sadness

[Ksol9]

No, you didn't mention that. I think you were trying to convince everyone (including yourself) that everything was JUST FINE!!! and that you two were so much closer and communicating so much better. You kept insisting, things are different this time!!!

 

It was the classic example of "me thinks the lady doth protest too much".

 

And I get it...you really, really wanted it to work. You wanted it to be different this time. And it is. It's worse.

 

I do believe you will have an easier time walking away for good. The only way you'd ever go back is if you make a determined, concerted effort to pretend you don't know what you know. And I bet you're going to have a hard time doing that, if at all.

 

I agree. I don't think this is going to take any twists or turns. I think I know what I have to do even if I don't want to. I know I have to. He really is this horrible person and I tried to convince myself he wasn't. He can't even hide it anymore and he knows that. I won't be able to move past this. I've reached a limit and I think he knows this too. I know he knows it. That is why he ran and hasn't said a word to me since. He's not thinking of some magical plan and I he isn't going to pop up anytime soon. This thing is going to be pretty straightforward. As soon as I get myself fully on board, there is only one direction to go and I know deep down in my heart it is to move on. I can't live like this anymore. I think I always knew deep down inside, this wasn't the right relationship for me. I love him, but Ill find a way to put that aside. This is over and the love will die eventually.

[browneyedgirl36]

You want so badly to have someone convince you what he did was not wrong. I think you'd have an easier time believing you are over-dramatizing and overreacting so you can go back to him.

 

But, as Mrs. Darcy said, look at the big picture. How many episodes have there been? How often were you fearful, anxious, panicky?

 

A woman in a healthy relationship does not feel compelled to rifle through her partner's overnight bag, does not feel compelled to look through his phone the second his back is turned, does not feel compelled to check his Facebook page using someone else's access. NONE of those things are indications of being in a healthy, loving and secure relationship.

 

Whenever anyone pointed out you were rug-sweeping, you vehemently denied it and cited the "wonderful" weekends and days you two had together enjoying one another's company. But you know that was false. You wanted to believe, so you believed.

 

You are NOT crazy, over-dramatizing or over-reacting! You just want it to not be so. But it IS so, unfortunately.

 

I am also disturbed by the fact he screams at you. While you're crying. And continues to scream at you. Sorry, but that is borderline abusive behavior. There is no need to scream when you're right in front of him. He was attempting to intimidate you and cower you so you'd apologize, then shut up about whatever it was that upset you. He believes you want him so badly that you'll just pretend you don't know what you know and didn't see what you saw, just to keep him.

 

Prove him wrong.

 

You cannot and will not accept being screamed at. You cannot and will not accept being lied to. You cannot and will not accept being treated dismissively and without care. You just will not do this anymore. It isn't working and it will not work.

 

I hope you are able to find peace soon.

 

This is all spot-on.

 

I have never once looked through my fiancee's personal stuff -- ever. I have never felt the need to. And he has never looked through mine. The ONLY time I have even looked at his phone has been when he's driving and it's ringing -- he'll ask me to see who it is, and if it's one of his children, to answer it. Otherwise, nothing. There are reasons your guy reacts the way he does to you looking at his phone, and it's NOT because you're invading his privacy. (Yes, you shouldn't really be looking, but I understand why you have.) There's a BIG difference between maintaining your privacy and being secretive about your activities. Once is having healthy boundaries -- the other is obfuscation/dishonesty. There's no place in a healthy relationship for that.

 

And I agree wholeheartedly about the yelling/screaming. He has a horrible temper, and I think your therapist is 100% correct that it's his way of intimidating you into not saying how you feel. My ex could be VERY soft-spoken and mild-mannered when he wanted to be, and although he never screamed at me, I DID hear witness him yelling at other people from time to time (including a current girlfriend -- long after our relationship had ended, I could hear him in the office next to mine, yelling and using vulgar language). And, sometimes he would say REALLY mean stuff to me, even if it was just in a normal voice. It's a form of abuse -- this weird, intermittent reinforcement that they do. One minute they're nice as pie, the next they're on to yelling, swearing, saying mean things, etc. It keeps you constantly hyper-vigilant, constantly in a sort of "fight or flight" mode. It's awful!

 

You are definitely in the anger/denial stage right now. You WILL get to the bargaining stage (if you're not somewhat there already). Hold firm. Keep asking yourself, "Why don't I think I deserve better than this?" "Why do I let this person have so much power over me?" No one should ever have that kind of power over you.

 

Hang in there. It's going to be hard, but you can make it!

[SparklyBoots]

Always so so hard to see what is going on when you are in the thick of it....but....If a really good friend told you all this story, honestly, what advice would you give to them...always a good thing to think about....xxx

[Ksol9]

Hi beg, I'm so scared of this bargaining stage. I had a little bit of it today and it feels so real. I'm literally in tears just thinking about it. It feels so real. The thoughts feel so real. Like it plays with my mind. I really need help. Right now I don't even feel like this is real. I know things are still very very fresh, but I'm scared to death about what I'm going into. It's like going into a completely dark cave. I don't know how better to explain it.

 

I went back and started reading my earlier thread. I read parts from after the email incident. It's crazy to see how naive I was. How insistent I was on being with this man no matter what. How I missed him so much that it overtook my life. I just pray to god that doesn't happen again. Please let there be something inside of me that makes me stronger. I just want to get through this seamlessly. I'm in pain, but I understand I can't be with this man any more. The fact that he knew I was so hurt by everything I saw and blamed me for it...then took off while I was still at his house and hasn't contacted me since that day should only show me further this is not a good person. Hes got everything to hide and nothing to lose. He's a terrible individual and has been doing things like this for a long time. This playing around on Facebook with other women has been going on for so long and that is why it was such a big deal to me when he wouldn't re-add me. Now I'm seeing what a huge red flag it was that he refused. I let it slide because he wouldn't budge. A healthy partner should never be so secretive.

 

I'm in so much pain and part of it is fear of what I'm about to experience. He isn't going through anything close to what I'm feeling so why should I suffer like this when it wasn't me who did this? It makes me so sad to know there isn't anything that can be done and we just have to be apart. I just can't believe it. He wasn't my friend. Imagine I began to feel like we were building a close friendship. Close friends don't betray you as soon as you turn your back. He really did a number on me this time. The scrambling I was doing to try to make sense or even make excuses for it was unvelievable. I came up empty handed. There is nothing I can do this time. It can't be salvaged. I'm positive of this. Honestly beg, my mind is so clouded right now, I don't know what I really feel. I think I'm telling myself what I'm supposed to feel. I know what he did was wrong and I'm telling myself I have to not accept this. I don't even know if I'm making sense right now.

 

I just need to get through the night. Tomorrow is another day. I'd be lying if I said I didn't wish I could run to him, but he's not my friend nor is he a lover to me anymore. Everything just got ripped away from me from one day to another. One minute he was here and the next he wasn't. All there is is silence. I need to get out of this room. Screw him!

[Ksol9]

Always so so hard to see what is going on when you are in the thick of it....but....If a really good friend told you all this story, honestly, what advice would you give to them...always a good thing to think about....xxx

 

Very true. When you're in the middle of it, you can't see clearly. From the outside, if a friend was in this position, I would be saying all that every last one of you have said to me. Save yourself and run....that would be my advice. No one wants to see someone hurt over and over by an individual who accepts no blame or seeks help.

[boltnrun]

One thing I think could be helpful is to stop assigning feelings to him. You don't really know what he's feeling or thinking. You can speculate all day long, but your speculations only hurt you more. I see this is a recurring pattern with you; you assign him feelings and motivations and then your feelings react to those assignments.

 

You cannot know what's in his mind. All you know is what you've seen; he lies, he screams at you, he conceals things. And none of those things are the way a loving partner behaves. His motivations for doing what he does are a mystery, but again, speculating why he does what he does just sends you on an endless loop of misery.

 

I recommend you focus instead on what is healthiest for you. It would be extremely damaging to you to return to a partner who screams at you, who lies and who deceives. You're already fragile emotionally...returning to him may be the final nail in the coffin of your emotional health. You must triage yourself and determine the healthiest and best course of action. Living with constant anxiety, pain, panic and fear is not the way to a healthier you.

 

Care for you. Never mind about him, this needs to be the time when you do what is best for YOU.

[Ksol9]

You're right bolt. It's exactly what my therapist said. Stick to facts. Don't let your mind wander further than the facts. I've saved your post so I can go back and re-read because my mind is very cloudy right now. I was dozing off because I was laying in bed and then I woke up in a panic. I feel a huge storm of anxiety. I feel really terrible right now. I wish there was a way to avoid this. What can I do? I don't feel good at all.

[boltnrun]

I've found the only way is to power through.

 

Giving in to what your anxiety tries to tell you is the best and only solution (Contact Him!!!!!) is wrong. Your anxiety does not have your best interests in mind.

 

Anxiety can be a good thing because it helps you determine where threats lie, but it can also steer you wrong with regard to how to relieve the anxiety. We think the correct fix is to go to the source of the anxiety and get that person to relieve it. But that just causes more anxiety! Temporarily it relieves the anxiety but then you're right back where you started...attaching yourself to what damages you.

 

Is there someone you can go to, to whom you can say "Look, I'm not feeling so great right now. Can we talk?" Or is there someone you can meet for coffee or dessert who will let you vent? I find having a "breakup buddy" is super helpful because that person cares for me and will not tell me what I think I want to hear ("Of course he loves and misses you! I bet if you texted him you guys would be back together tonight!!!!!"), but instead will have my best interests at heart. Someone who would never, ever encourage me to return to someone who damages me. Do you have someone like that?

[Ksol9]

Yes I do have a friend who I chat with often over the phone. She has really gone above and beyond to help me through previous breakups. Even this time, when it happened she keeps telling me to try to remain calm, to keep my composure. I really do feel like running straight to him. To let him know all of my frustrations, but what is that going to solve? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. You said it well in one of your previous posts. He screamed that I was crazy and there wasn't anything wrong with what he did. He left me in his home, running away from conflict, and hasn't contacted me since. He doesn't want to deal with anything, he won't take accountability for anything because it's all my fault, so me contacting him with my hurt and pain would be the biggest mistake I make. He will most likely do exactly what he did before...blame and turn it all around on me. I should not even be having anxiety. I can't even explain why I'm having it. I know what I have to do from this point forward. I just can't believe everything that happened. It truly feels like a nightmare. that's why I wake up feeling frantic and I then have to remind myself of what is happening. I'm afraid to go to sleep. I know what my nights are going to turn into. I can't take this anymore.

[boltnrun]

Please let your parents know if you get to a crisis point. I am concerned about you.

[Ksol9]

Yes I will let them know. I'll be ok. Thank you for your concern.

[figureitout23]

Ksol, I want to apologize for my confusion in all this. I began reading your journal recently so everything that happened with the email incident and the condom and facebook were all very fresh in my brain and I think I saw your 'resistance' towards warnings during your last honeymoon stage to mean maybe I as a reader got the wrong impression about the relationship. I'm sure we all have that one friend who breaks up with their boyfriend every other day goes into dramatics on facebook and then 2 days later everything is good. I think I pigeon holed you because of that and again I apologize. Seeing recent comments it does appear this is borderline abuse and as someone who went through actual abuse - emotional, physical even financial, I can tell you one of my bigger regrets is not getting out sooner.

 

You said you went back and read your journal during the breakup over the emails. I remember you were very adamant and clear during that time period too but that bargaining stage really seemed to get to you. Stay strong, you're telling yourself 'he will never contact me again so its over' that's the same mindset you had before, like others have said you should change that line of thinking. focus on you. Its over because YOU SAY its over and you mean it this time.

 

I agree wholeheartedly with lostlove, you needed this to happen. One of the reasons her journal had been hard for me to read is because I felt she wasn't ready. That last straw didn't happen. So as she said she held out hope. With these yo-yo relationships, its so hard to recognize when enough is enough and unfortunately often times because of that it takes something big for our eyes to finally see whats been in front of us the whole time. After my ex husbdand and I broke up, as I said, I was heartbroken for about a month. It was far from easy, but I knew it was time to be over, this time was different. He came sniffing around about 4 months later (I swear thats the scumbag timeline, hah) I contemplated taking him back, but I was so dang happy living my life drama free the thought of getting back on the roller coaster is what actually caused me anxiety!

 

I'm sharing my story with you to say, you can do it, its going to be hard but if you stay focused, you can do it! Consider blocking him.

 

Do you need a break up buddy? I'm currently in a FWB situation I'm considering ending. I'm sure it wont be nearly as hard as what you're going through but I'll walk through this journey with you! Whatever you need to do to stand strong, do it! The long term emotional damage is so hard to undo, TRUST ME. ((hugs))

[Ms Darcy]

I really don't think the the whole "she NEEDED this to happen" is particularly helpful or healthy. No one needs to go back to a borderline abusive situation to find him lying and maybe cheating again and getting yelled at.

 

She was only five weeks or so out of a break up of an addictive on off (and borderline abusive) relationship and got bad advice to get in touch. At least now, hopefully that will stop.

 

Hopefully this time when you go through the bargaining stages you can rely on your emotional support network to help you through the moments when you want to go running back. If I were you, I would also specifically advise your therapist to assist you with not going back and coping strategies for that.

[Ms Darcy]

Btw, my husband has a friend of a friend who is sort of like your ex. I don't believe he ever yells at his wife though. However, he made it clear to her that sometimes he might do things with other women on the side. And she accepts it without a word.

 

It's not that uncommon I understand. That's why the boundaries thing is so important. You don't want that life.

[Ksol9]

It's ok figureitout. There's a lot in the journal to cover. This is over a year of material. I do believe I have been very hypervigilent and maybe there were times I was just paranoid. That was part of my guilt after some of the breakups. That I pushed him constantly and I think I absolutely did at times. I was never able to relax because there were times he displayed untrusting behaviors and I carried it with me always. He never stopped these behaviors and consistently changed, so when I got to the point of actually calming down and trusting again, boom...something was discovered again. Another reason for me to constantly snoop. I mean there isn't any reason to snoop and if I felt that I had to then that was reason enough to end it, but I stayed and I tried and I tried. I was wrong too. I had plenty of part in all of this mess. UNTIL, I started therapy in January. I wasn't flawless, but I really made an effort to change. To work on communication, to be a better partner for him or for anyone else should I meet someone new. When we got back together, I don't think I pressured of nagged constantly about trust issues at all. At least I don't think so or maybe I'm not seeing things clearly yet. I don't believe I did anything in terms of feeling guilty about what he did this time. There was nothing in the relationship this time to say he had any reason whatsoever to contact other women on Instagram or to lie about visiting massage parlors at night. We were in the height of the honeymoon stage.

 

Thank you for sharing your story. This, I think, is what is helping me. The bargaining stage is very detrimental. I have to constantly remind myself the realities of this because I am very quick to forgive. I am being completely honest with all of you. I think I will look for any excuse to take him back. Luckily he's not the type to be in my ear trying to fool me into returning. He's leaving me alone and I'm not moving toward him. This is happening just as the other times did and I need to see it for what it is. An unhealthy relationship that is never going to work.

 

I too believe this had to happen. I'm a firm believer that everything happens for a reason. During each breakup, I kept saying I'll never hear from him, I'll never hear from him...I heard from him. With the exception of this last time. I contacted him and he didn't take long to get things moving again. I truly believe deep in my heart that I went above and beyond to help out relatuonship and he just didn't meet me halfway, so i don't think guilt will be a factor in bargaining this time. This time, it was filled with lots of good times and laughter. We had those few obstacles...the condom and the Facebook issue before this massage thing. Put it all together (like you all said) it's pretty bad on his part. I handled much of it in the best way I knew how. It's really too much for me to ignore so I'm really hoping through the bargaining stage I won't have much difficulty. I think the only thing that may dance around in my head is the hole he would change or that I'd have to settle for this, forgive it, and just try again. BUT why would I want to live like that? I really believe whatever I try to bargain with, I will hit a brick wall and dismiss the thought. There is no way around this. What he did was wrong from every. Single. Angle. And I believe he knows this as well.

 

I'm trying so very hard to change my mindset. I don't want to dwell on what happened but right now talking about it serves as a reminder as to how terrible it is. What he did was really bad right? Visiting a massage parlor known for prostitution at night is wrong right? Lying about it is wrong? The Instagram messages are wrong and should not be forgiven right? Do you think he really believes these things are not a big deal or did he just make me feel this way and knows what he did was really bad? I'm asking you these things because this is what has been going through my mind. I know I may sound ridiculous but my mind is not in its right senses. I feel really off. Like I can't make up my mind on my own.

 

I'm trying to change my mindset. It really doesn't matter what he thinks or feels or anything about him. I have to focus on what I'm going to do and my course from here. He's not a factor anymore. I don't believe he'll say a word to me (and I know I've said this before), but it's gone too far now. So far that it will never be the same. He's not the same person that I once knew or thought he was. I'm not mistaken or overreacting. I know I'll be ok. I just need to be strong. Thank you for helping me.

[Ksol9]

No I don't want that life at all. It's a miserable life. If he flat out set those boundaries, ok I could have made a decision on if I wanted to live that way, but he's not that dumb. He lied and convinced me he wasn't that person and most of the he wasn't..I believe. It's just when he felt comfortable or that he could get away with, he did these things. He probably has been doing these things for a long time. And he will continue to do these things. He knows it's not acceptable and that is why he hasn't said a word and I know I can't live with that so that is why I left.

 

I hope you're right Ms Darcy. Hopefully this time will be different. I don't want that kind of life.

[Ms Darcy]

I think in time as you heal, when you go back and reread what you are writing at this point (which is quite normal) I think you will see all of the contradictions and bargaining thiughts you are struggling with.

 

I wonder if it might help you to even write down those contradictions. Your cognitive dissonance is something that your therapist can help you with.

[Ms Darcy]

I am not a fortune teller. I don't know if you will go back ... Especially if you don't know. I am just concerned that you are telling yourself some of the same stuff that you told yourself last time.

 

I mean it's your life. But I think you have been emotionally unavailable for a long time.

[Ksol9]

I am not a fortune teller. I don't know if you will go back ... Especially if you don't know. I am just concerned that you are telling yourself some of the same stuff that you told yourself last time.

 

I mean it's your life. But I think you have been emotionally unavailable for a long time.

 

This is the most powerful (and truest) thing you've ever said to me.

 

I am beginning to tell myself the same thing as last time. (Also evidenced in some of my writing.)

 

And I think I am realizing I have been emotionally unavailable for a very long time. This is the reason I have chosen to be in relationships with men like him.

[Ksol9]

Something just occurred....remember during the second breakup (email incident). Him and I were still friends on Facebook at the point and I was signing on and then deactivating just to peek around. If you can remember, he would often post indirect messages, songs, things like that to let me know he was thinking of me. A day or two before he contacted me, he posted a couple photos of them going to church. This completely softened me. I said to myself...oh he's changing. He wants to do the right thing.

 

I am so naive and innocent that I believed he did this genuinely. I can bet my last dollar, he dragged the kids and himself out of bed early Sunday morning to go to church because he knew by posting that it would leave a good impression on me. I have no doubt in my mind that it was all apart of the plan. Maybe he did have good intentions at the time and did want to start going to church, but he is incapable of continuing to live a clean life and he can not keep any motivation to continue to make changes. He knew I was signing on and off because it shows a time stamp of when I was last on regardless of if the account is deactivated or not. I know he knew I was signing off and on to look at his page.

 

This was all apart of the manipulation. I could be wrong for thinking this, but I'm pretty sure his whatever he posted were motivated by what I would think.

 

Just like the receipts in the side pocket of the traveling bag..either he is really dumb or he put them there intentionally (subconsciously or not) so that I could find them. My therapist said to me...I have never in all my years seen something like this. He never fails to leave evidence and it is my progressional opinion that this could be apart of his manipulation scheme or either he is just really, really dumb.

 

Just something to think about...I need to continually highlight myself of all of these things. Now is not the time for me to be naive and inncocent.

[boltnrun]

There you go assigning motivations to him again!

 

You really have no idea why he posts things on Facebook or why he goes to church or why he left receipts in his pockets or condoms in his bag (how could he know you'd rifle through his belongings????). I just know that last time you assigned motivations for his actions (washing his truck, driving by your work, etc.) and concluded it was because he was hurting and missed you. In hindsight, was that really accurate? Who knows.

 

But ruminating on his motivations for things he did months and months ago, as well as things he did more recently, doesn't help IMO.

 

Is it easier to try to interpret his motivations instead of trying to interpret your own?

[Ksol9]

You're right! It doesn't matter what I assign as his motivation, it's actually quite simple. I was a fool to ever give him so many chances to play this game with me.

 

It's all very simple, he is a dirt bag..just trash! I don't want to associate myself with that. He lives a disgusting lifestyle and he can't keep anything good. All this talk he gave me about teamwork. Ha! I've given so many chances after his many transgressions. He dragged me through this craziness too many times! There has to be something wrong with me. He's a cheat. What do cheaters do? Manipulate! I don't care about anything right now. This pain should be a joke to me. God please let this be one time too many!

 

Ive been feeling like this all day. Having a burst of anger...

[boltnrun]

When it came to "why" my ex lied, cheated and hid things from me and why he acted mean whenever I got up the nerve to call him out over it, I concluded it was because he wanted to. Plain and simple.

 

He'd call me whenever he hit a dry spell after he dumped me, or whenever he was fighting with his girlfriend. I didn't interpret it as "He loves and misses me! He realized he made a mistake letting me go!!!" I presumed it was because he was feeling lonely and sorry for himself. But again, who knows. I just knew I didn't want to be a part of his world anymore.

 

And that's all that matters. DO YOU want to go through Cycle #4 with him, going through the exact same things over and over, being riddled with anxiety and panic and fear, trying to convince yourself that "this time", things are different and better? Or are you sick and tired of going through this hell every few weeks? What is it about him that would make it worth it to put yourself through this again?

[figureitout23]

I really don't think the the whole "she NEEDED this to happen" is particularly helpful or healthy. No one needs to go back to a borderline abusive situation to find him lying and maybe cheating again and getting yelled at.

 

She was only five weeks or so out of a break up of an addictive on off (and borderline abusive) relationship and got bad advice to get in touch. At least now, hopefully that will stop.

 

Hopefully this time when you go through the bargaining stages you can rely on your emotional support network to help you through the moments when you want to go running back. If I were you, I would also specifically advise your therapist to assist you with not going back and coping strategies for that.

 

She was only 5 weeks out but she was still very stuck in her typical cycle. Its easy to be on the outside looking in and say 'just leave' but its not that easy, especially with these back and forth relationships. The last break up was him bolting when things got hard, she internalized that, she felt it was her fault. How many responders told HER she needed to change AB and C to have a healthy relationship?

 

Its only now that shes starting to be honest with herself and us about the situation that the reality of the situation is seeing the light.

 

**Ksol sorry for referring to you in third person, I was simply responding to a comment.

[Ms Darcy]

It's also easy to say she needed to go back to the relationship. I do think that many posters did tell her that she needed to change things to have a healthy relationship. And in many ways, it's still true. There is a big difference between blame and responsibility. Blame is punitive. Responsibility is empowering. Anyone who goes through any breakup does well to reflect and identify ways they can deal with conflicts better in future relationships.