Need some clarity...not sure if I'm being genuine with her

[Guitarguy_82]

**Disclaimers**

1. This topic involves adult themes that one might typically find only in the fetish/kink realm. If this offends anyone, please feel free to read another thread on this great website.

2. If I have posted in the wrong section, please let me know!

3. I ramble and tend to get lost in my writing. I wasn't an English major. Please bear with me.

4. My posts can get long...feel free to grab a snack, drink, etc...

5. I'm just a guy trying to sort this stuff out. Some of what I say may be completely stupid and incoherent. I accept full responsibility for this.

**End of Disclaimers**

 

Hi all,

 

I've been dating this girl I met online for almost a month now, and things have been going really great. Almost too great. It is scary how well this girl and I get along.....which is why I'm afraid that I may not be genuine about how I feel about her now that the honeymoon dust has settled. That or possibly things have been moving too fast.

 

The conundrum is that I feel like I may be diving into some deep waters here and might be saying how I feel about things with her in a manner that might not be true to myself. It's almost like I'm caught in a trap of saying what I think she wants to hear...whereas I might have felt that way at a certain point in time, I'm starting to have doubts about those feelings now.

 

A few pros and cons about her (from my perspective anyway):

 

Pros:

-We have said that we love each other, and tomorrow I'm supposed to meet her dad and the three of us are supposed to meet up for drinks and hockey watching action. He likes me already (according to her).

 

-She's extremely smart, funny, honest, and knows how to make me laugh. Not many women are able to make me laugh so easily!

 

-She genuinely enjoys pleasing me (more on what I mean by that later, bear with me for a bit)

 

-She and I share a lot of similar goals personally, career wise, family, etc..

 

-She and I share a lot of similar interests (more than just a similar taste in movies I might add...)

 

Cons: (again, please bear with me here, as some of these might sound extremely "shallow"...but I'm posting here to be 100% honest about how I feel and I'm trying to sort this all out)

 

-To be blunt and completely honest...there are times when I'm not attracted to her physically. Her weight concerns me somewhat. That in itself isn't really even an issue. People can lose weight easily. I'm a little chubby myself, but I'm tall, so it kind of balances out. She is rather short and, again to be totally honest, her neck kind of gets lost in there sometimes. It's one of those things where (shallow guy warning) the pics she had on her profile looked REALLY great...and then in person I said to myself "hmm...she's definitely NOT the same in the pics!" (Honestly though, who hasn't posted a pic on a social site that in our minds only captures what we think is our best side?)

 

To expand on that, I was able to put looks to the side (at first) because we hit it off really well. We clicked instantly and quickly realized that we had some chemistry.

 

-One other con is that she has a LOT of emotional baggage for a 21 year old girl. She's been through some...lets just say...."uncommon" stuff and had just ended a relationship about a month before we met for the first time. I'm still not 100% sure if I was her rebound, and that is the reason she is latching on to me so hard at the moment (from what she has mentioned about her past ex, he and I are very similar in her opinion...)

 

-Not necessarily a con, more of a possible red flag: She is heavily involved in the "kink" community and has a large network of connections there. I myself had just started exploring what was in my area purely out of curiosity. After poking around and finding her by total chance, I decided to drop her a message and essentially that is how we met. Needless to say, that was one of the reasons we got along so quickly. We both realized we had that "world" in common and wanted to pursue that type of lifestyle. Why the red flag? Well honestly I was intimidated by her involvement in the community. She had had a lot of different "play" partners and it concerned me that she was basically just looking for fun with anyone and everyone and then some as opposed to something serious. Can't really blame her for that though, she's 21 and single and exploring her sexuality...of course she just wants to have fun. (Interest in cheating under the guise of "play" would be the red flag)

 

This frustrated me at first because myself being in my early 30's, while I'm certainly still ready to have fun, I am also trying to get in a position where I could possibly settle down with someone long term. She and I have talked about this and very recently she has made it known that she could see herself and I having kids and getting married. I agree, or rather I agreed at the time. (Possible red flag again that she is so quick to suggest a future together after a month)

 

If I had to say I have any fears, it would be that if she and I broke up, I would essentially not want to continue exploring the kink community, solely due to the fact that she is so intrinsically engrained into it already, and I would not want to "start all over again" finding new friends that she hasn't "played" with. (Shallow, yes, but it is something I still would need to deal with and get over. I realize its a small world and nothing is ever going to be just the way I want it).

 

The community, while interesting to me, is not my life however. To her, it seemed as though it IS her life.

 

My feelings about her involvement in the community are mixed at best, and since the moment we said the big "Love" word I asked her that she and I stay exclusive for a while and I asked her not to engage in any "play" with others. She agreed to this. Down the road I would definitely be open to expanding our involvement and perhaps playing with others, but not right now. I feel like courting her a bit (I'm really just a big romantic at heart).

 

Oh and this leads back into one of my pros: that she wants to please me. That essentially is her "role" as she sees it. She loves to serve and do things to make me happy. As someone who is new to the kink world, it was a huge shock, albeit a pleasant one. I've never had a girlfriend whose sole purpose was to please me....needless to say I was not ready for it (and again, not to be shallow, but its one of those things that I would have never expected from a girl, but I'm not exactly crying about it)!

 

She wants me to be her "Master" as well. That is something I am not 100% sure about either. I have read up on it and know what it would entail to a certain extant...but truthfully I don't have enough experience in it. I wouldn't know how to do it correctly for her in a way that she is already used to. I would possibly be doing her a disservice.

 

She and I talked about this as well and she said that she is OK with the fact that I am inexperienced in that "role". She wants me to learn and to grow and even "play" with others to learn more about it. I am hesitant to say the least. I want to learn but I am not ready to just go out and randomly find people to try and Dom over (Dom is a term in the kink community used to define someones particular role, feel free to look it up and educate yourself). Needless to say I have much yet to learn in that regard.

 

Being a Master also requires much time involvement and focus. Personally I am still working on myself. I am still trying to better myself and want to be the best "Me" I can be. That's not to say I can't do both, however. Plenty of people balance a relationship and a personal life...its just tricky at times!

 

***

 

So here's the real question:

What's the point of all this?? Why can't I commit to this girl? Why am I so hesitant? What is stopping me from really feeling comfortable with all this? Am I being genuine with her and with myself if I have all these questions and doubts?

 

Is it the looks? Honestly I can deal with that. But then am I settling? Shouldn't I want to be with a girl that I am head over heels for (not just in looks but in personality too)?? Is it possible I could find better??

 

Is it the kink involvement? I rather like that about her honestly. It's something I want to learn more about. I definitely don't want her to "play" with random old guys though....just a big NO on that one.

 

Am I being an idiot? That is quite possible...it happens a lot. That's why I come to this website...to have you wonderful folks bash me on the head and get me on the straight and narrow.

 

To sum it up, this girl is a possible gold mine. She has everything I'm looking for in the personality of someone I can see being with long term. The superficial (jerk, shallow, caveman, whatever you wanna apply) side of things says I can find a "hotter" girlfriend somewhere...but there is almost zero chance she would have the same "interests" as this current girl let alone her personality.

 

And really its more than all that. She's so much more than the sum of her parts. This girl gets me. She understands me. She genuinely wants me to be happy and wants to please me.

 

I have great conversations with her too. We bounce ideas off of each other and sometimes I just sit back and think...wow she is a genius! I like having the ability to just converse with her.

 

So now I leave it up to you guys and gals....what's my risk/reward ratio? Do I need to slow things down with her (seems almost impossible at this point to go slower now that we've said we love each other)? Should I just take a chill pill and relax? Should I just be in the moment and enjoy the ride?

 

Please leave your constructive comments and criticisms below...

 

**and I will go ahead and take the full blame upfront for being shallow about the looks issue...I realize I'm not going to get much sympathy there nor am I seeking it. I'm simply trying to sort all of this stuff out in my head**

[InkedBrunette]

First of all, kink can be a VERY deep and intrinsic community. Especially when you toss in bdsm. Asking you to be her Master and saying she loves you after a month - you can't commit because your intuition is SCREAMING at you to run. You obviously know already that she isn't stable.

 

A Master/slave relationship is a delicate one. She's basically asking that you make all the decisions, punish her, guide her, and become the center if her world. Are you ready for that kind of dependence ?

 

Anyhow, I'm assuming you two met on collar me or fetlife. Both sites are full of young and naive girls. She is very young at 21, and you being around my age , lol I'm scratching my head wondering how you can deal with that level of immaturity.

 

I would suggest walking away if you aren't truly interested in a woman who supports and engages in casual play. I wouldn't let her discourage you from exploring kink, it's a vast sub culture with a variety of outlets and lifestyles.

 

Maybe you should step away now before this gets any worse, and take time to explore. A woman that entrenched in kink will either grow bored and frustrated with your lack of know how or she'll cling to you and drain you until you feel emotionally exhausted which you're already hinting at.

[RainyCoast]

uhm tough one...

 

(LOLLLLLLZ i love the disclaimer

 

the looks thing...it doesn't sound like "she's okay but not the best looking girl i could get", it sounds (at least from the neck description) that her looks kinda put you off at times. If it's really that important to you, won't the hair on your back stand up straight when she leans towards you with the lack of a neck in full close up view? If it's that off putting maybe you're settling. Looks can improve, true. they can also deteriorate, and most of the time, at least with age they do. If she doesn't fit your standards looks wise you'll probably be majorly put off at some point. I wouldn't sweat about that and I probably wouldn't even notice it if I cared for the guy a lot but people are different. To some it's a big deal. But then, if you're looking for great looks- do you think the next girl would have all you want? If disease or time or whatever took her looks down a notch would that put you off? It's time to get honest about just HOW much you mind physical imperfections.

 

the kink thing...i'm trying not to be judgmental here because again, people are different and you both seem into it so at least partly you're a good match.

how does she react to you for not wanting her to play with other guys? If she's more open about multiple sex partners than you then of course it'll be a problem. You need to ask her if she was planning to continue playing with folks while in a relationship with you, whether she would consider having you as an exclusive sex partner a huge restriction and whether she thinks she can simultaneously pull off a family life (wants serious commitment and kids with you? in your opinion, does that combine well with the kink habit? Does it combine well in her opinion? You guys need to be very very honest about that because if it's something you're not compatible in then it is a red flag). It sounds like you just want to experiment for a while with the kink thing while to her it's a way of life. Would that be okay? Could you live like that long term? Would you, the Dom have to walk her to the store with a leash and choker, dressed in a leather suit and equipped with a whip when she needed to buy diapers for the kid? Are you sure this person can lead a family life she wants? At 21+with baggage+unusual sexual practices what she says she wants in the future is not what she's capable of. Suggesting a future together a month after a BU adds extra weight to the "she knows squad about long term commitment and adult family life" argument.

 

she's young plus has tons of baggage. I would say her chosen lifestyle isn't a reflection of just "open sexuality", it's a reflection of her being seriously messed up. I doubt, in her current state of mind, youthful experimental phase, lack of experience as a responsible adult etc she can be taken as a serious partner. She wants a sadist-masochist relationship and considers that just an alternative lifestyle. Does that not make you think she has a pathological mechanism and schism she's unable to bridge in a healthy way? Do you really think this subconscious drive will stay confined to her sexual behavior? My guess is the dominated victim/excitement seeking/madonna-**ore/inner frustration and what other complex not will display itself all over the place as it's part of her psyche and she's not seeking professional health to resolve these issues in a healthy way- they cannot stay swept under the rug for very long.

 

I'd say, best you can do with this girl is have a "fun" (may turn out to be too hardcore for you to consider fun any more), experimental phase and break it off when her inner psycho becomes too difficult to handle (or even better, break it off now). Then just put it down to experience. She probably thinks she's just sexually fun and doesn't think she has issues, despite the baggage so i wouldn't count on her seeking help in resolving these issues maturely. You'd have to tell her honestly that if the extent of her quirkiness isn't confined or controlled and her maturity doesn't show up you'd not be considering her a candidate for a future together.

 

I do think, however- and I mean no disrespect- that you attracted this girl because you share some of her issues, albeit to a lesser extent than her probably.

The attraction to the madonna-**ore thing? Want a kinky girl but also want a committed woman to settle down with and possibly have children with.. Yeah...get that sorted out. I think it'll prove to spawn difficulties in serious relationships and attempts at family life. If you're seriously considering settling down you'd want to do it the healthy way. As for having some kinky sex- would it have to be that extreme for you to feel excited? I'm sure there are more mature women out there who make great, fun, exciting sexual partners without reaching out to other males as partners, without needing you to hurry to their apartment dressed in leather and with a foldable whip in your briefcase during lunch break for some "fun" molestation. Without playing out their pathological response to trauma or a break up by getting all psycho with you. You can have crazy monkey sex with healthy people too, you know...Do you think you could do with "crazy monkey sex" or do you really require wearing a mask and leaving blood trails on her skin during sex? How far exactly does this girl plan to go and how far are you comfortable with?

 

think it through...maybe you just want some fun and excitement. Can that be done in ways that don't leave you questioning someone's psyche?

 

p.s. i'm assuming you've addressed the issue about protection and she has been tested for stds?

[Guitarguy_82]

Thanks for the great replies!! I appreciate the time put into the responses.

 

I will try to address them both and clear up any misunderstandings. I am not trying to nitpick every single sentence, but I think you both brought up very very good points.

 

@ InkedBrunette:

First of all, kink can be a VERY deep and intrinsic community. Especially when you toss in bdsm. Asking you to be her Master and saying she loves you after a month - you can't commit because your intuition is SCREAMING at you to run. You obviously know already that she isn't stable.

 

Agreed. I know the feeling that comes over me when I realize that I just don't feel that spark of overwhelming gooey and gushy warmth when I think about being with her. It's my internal defense mechanism apparently!

That being said, when I am actually physically with her, we smile constantly, we laugh, and generally we can't get enough of each other.

 

A Master/slave relationship is a delicate one. She's basically asking that you make all the decisions, punish her, guide her, and become the center if her world. Are you ready for that kind of dependence ?

 

No. I have my own goals and things I want to accomplish as an individual...things which I find I barely have the time for as it is, let alone work/family/friends thrown in. I definitely think I have the capability to be a Master...but I don't know if that is something that will happen any time soon.

 

One thing I'd like to mention also is that I don't think she wants this lifestyle 24/7 either. It's one of those things where she lives the lifestyle when she can. She is also an A+ psychology undergrad at the university here, has a job, family, friends, etc... We both realize we can't do this lifestyle all the time.

 

My perspective on it would be that I will do what I feel is important to me first. That's my inner Dom so to speak. I determine where my time is spent and with whom. She is very much the type to "Dom from the bottom" if you catch my drift. She is great at suggesting things for us to try, and to a certain extant I need that due to my inexperience, but at the end of the day its her job (in the kink role) to please me in that particular session.

 

Anyway, back on topic

 

Anyhow, I'm assuming you two met on collar me or fetlife. Both sites are full of young and naive girls. She is very young at 21, and you being around my age , lol I'm scratching my head wondering how you can deal with that level of immaturity.

 

Fetlife, yeah. Was not aware of Collar me. (**Disclaimer, this is the kink in question, if it offends anyone, please feel free to stop reading**) Honestly its a DD/lg situation, if you are familiar with that. In her role as "babygirl" yeah she is somewhat of a brat and likes to be immature...and my role as her "Daddy" is to teach her and punish her and take care of her accordingly.

 

Outside of the role play, I would say she's about in the norm for a 21 year old. Youthful, energetic, and prone to mistakes, but I think she has good direction overall. She does have similar goals as I do (regarding family and marriage...she and I do see similarly on this) as well as wanting to grow as a person spiritually and emotionally and I think that she is on the right path as far as her schooling goes. She is also going for her Masters degree and then her PHD (at least that's what she said she plans to do). I was absolutely lost and had no idea what I wanted to do at 21...here she is almost ready to graduate with honors.

 

I would suggest walking away if you aren't truly interested in a woman who supports and engages in casual play. I wouldn't let her discourage you from exploring kink, it's a vast sub culture with a variety of outlets and lifestyles.

 

Well I talked to her about that..the casual play. It was her opinion that if sex was desired with other people, that we should discuss it first. She then proceeded to tell me that she only wants me sexually, but might still want to play with others (others in the community that she has a rapport with already in those activities). To be specific, I would think that involves non-sexual contact, whippings, floggings, other things that a slave might be required to do. I was of the mindset that if I am seeking sex with others while still trying to date her, then things were going to end badly. Now, that being said, if she and I decide to pursue that later on down the road after we've had more time to be a "couple" then I wouldn't be opposed to discussing it at that time.

 

And agreed about not getting discouraged. I know there's LOTS AND LOTS out there...things I stumble accross and just look in shock and awe...but if things end with her and I, I would feel alienated. At least for a while before I got my bearings back.

 

Maybe you should step away now before this gets any worse, and take time to explore. A woman that entrenched in kink will either grow bored and frustrated with your lack of know how or she'll cling to you and drain you until you feel emotionally exhausted which you're already hinting at.

 

Yes. I can already tell that its starting to take up a lot of time. Then again, what relationship isn't about sacrificing some personal space to then share with the one you are with? I believe a healthy balance can be obtained somewhere in there. Like any new relationship during the honeymoon phase (and even a bit after) we are stuck to each other like glue right now.

 

As far as my lack of experience, all I can do is try to learn as I go. I do agree with her about playing with others, for example, learning to tie someone up properly, etc...I could definitely benefit from that and in turn she would benefit as well when I try it on her She has said that she wants me to learn and grow in that role and realizes I'm not fully 100% living this lifestyle. I don't believe she expects me to either.

 

I would overall agree with you, InkedBrunette, about perhaps stepping back and exploring, especially before things get out of hand. There's lots of girls who are into this kink apparently (way more than I had first thought a year ago when I even realized DD/lg was a real thing) and its something I feel like I could be good at. It feels right to me.

 

Whether or not I can actually step away though at this point is something I need to consider. I feel like she and I have a good connection. If I had to step away it would need to be very soon to reduce the emotional impact as much as possible.

 

***

 

@ RainyCoast : thank you for the reply! That is a lot to digest!

 

First and foremost: yes we are both STD free. This was brought up the first time we slept together.

 

I'll try to address your post in bite-sized chunks, only because you brought up so many good points. Hopefully I'm not taking anything out of context.

 

the looks thing...it doesn't sound like "she's okay but not the best looking girl i could get", it sounds (at least from the neck description) that her looks kinda put you off at times. If it's really that important to you, won't the hair on your back stand up straight when she leans towards you with the lack of a neck in full close up view? If it's that off putting maybe you're settling. Looks can improve, true. they can also deteriorate, and most of the time, at least with age they do. If she doesn't fit your standards looks wise you'll probably be majorly put off at some point. I wouldn't sweat about that and I probably wouldn't even notice it if I cared for the guy a lot but people are different. To some it's a big deal. But then, if you're looking for great looks- do you think the next girl would have all you want? If disease or time or whatever took her looks down a notch would that put you off? It's time to get honest about just HOW much you mind physical imperfections.

 

Great point, and yeah like I mentioned in my original post, yeah its not like she's hideous or anything. She's a very cute girl and there are times where I would just stare into her eyes (On that note, I think I fall way too easily for girls with pretty eyes....its like a spell I'm put under).

 

And the weight issue is something I even say to myself is ridiculous. I've dated "curvy" or "thick" girls before no problem...its truly not an issue. The neck thing does bother me but that's only from a certain angle (and again, its just me being shallow and nit picking).

 

Would I be able to find a "slimmer" girl and be happy with her as well? 9 times out of 10 I'd say yeah.

 

Overall I'm not going to continue to focus on my hang-ups with her looks anymore...she's still a cute girl regardless of a little chub here and there.

 

the kink thing...i'm trying not to be judgmental here because again, people are different and you both seem into it so at least partly you're a good match.

I'll try to address this part in bite-sized chunks.

 

how does she react to you for not wanting her to play with other guys? If she's more open about multiple sex partners than you then of course it'll be a problem. You need to ask her if she was planning to continue playing with folks while in a relationship with you, whether she would consider having you as an exclusive sex partner a huge restriction and whether she thinks she can simultaneously pull off a family life (wants serious commitment and kids with you? in your opinion, does that combine well with the kink habit? Does it combine well in her opinion? You guys need to be very very honest about that because if it's something you're not compatible in then it is a red flag)

 

She said she was OK with the two of us being exclusive for now. One of the other red flags was a conversation she and I had about flirting and cheating. She enjoys flirting and thinks cheating is a huge rush. BIG RED FLAG RIGHT THERE. But then if it is put into perspective of the kink community, all of a sudden its labeled as "oh we are just in an open relationship" which apparently is very common in the kink world.

 

Myself as a relatively "vanilla" newcomer, was not able to fully wrap my head around this idea. I've cheated before and been cheated on in the past. Either way its ugly and it hurts badly. Not cool with that at all.

 

I'm not totally opposed to some open relationship elements in the future (ie adding a 3rd girl, for fun), but for now I want it to be just her and I. She has also expressed large interest in a fantasy of hers of getting gang raped and being in a gang bang. Big NO. I'd like to think I'm an open minded guy, but I can be selfish at times. I'm not about to have my girl tossed around by a group of dudes. Possible deal breaker but only if she truly pursues it and thinks its somehow necessary in her life.

 

As for having a family...obviously we would dial down the kink activity. That is just to be expected with kids in the picture. I want to be a father and raise my kids to the best of my ability. I look forward to having a family and from what she and I have talked about, she thinks the same way.

 

It sounds like you just want to experiment for a while with the kink thing while to her it's a way of life. Would that be okay? Could you live like that long term? Would you, the Dom have to walk her to the store with a leash and choker, dressed in a leather suit and equipped with a whip when she needed to buy diapers for the kid? Are you sure this person can lead a family life she wants? At 21+with baggage+unusual sexual practices what she says she wants in the future is not what she's capable of. Suggesting a future together a month after a BU adds extra weight to the "she knows squad about long term commitment and adult family life" argument.

 

I would have to discuss that with her in the long term if she truly wants to have kink be a part of her life. It is fun and I like exploring it, but I definitely cannot and will not live it 24/7. I have personal pursuits as well (martial arts) and my passions would take up time away from the relationship. I would need someone who is capable of being able to function without me, their Master, ordering them around for every single little thing. To me that level of control is just entirely unrealistic.

 

LOL @ having her walk to the store as a dog in collar and leash to buy things. That sounds like it would be humiliating to her (which she really really enjoys). I would not be dressed in leather, I'm not particularly a leather Dom as it were, not that I'm opposed to it. I realize it has its place however.

 

She is inexperienced in long term relationships, yes, but is that her fault? She's 21. I didn't have my first real long term relationship until I was in my mid-20's anyway.

 

she's young plus has tons of baggage. I would say her chosen lifestyle isn't a reflection of just "open sexuality", it's a reflection of her being seriously messed up. I doubt, in her current state of mind, youthful experimental phase, lack of experience as a responsible adult etc she can be taken as a serious partner

 

Fair point, but I think there's more to it as well. She's a smart girl studying psychology and sexual studies and gender relations... I would like to think she is more in-tune to be able to see how relationships evolve and are flexible and would enjoy exploring what she finds to be enjoyable at her age. She told me she read a book about being a "sexually free" young woman and apparently that turned on a light bulb with her.

 

To be honest, she has also confessed to me that she used to have sex for money and got a huge thrill from it. I was shocked at first. She said it was a point in her life that she felt she needed to do, (and did safely) and was able to profit from. She has since stopped it but she confesses as well that she still would enjoy aspects of it again. She also does adult cam modeling shows here and there.

 

She has an extremely high libido, which works great for me (as I imagine it would be great for any guy) but it also worries me that she might seek sex outside of the relationship purely for the thrill of being sneaky. She said she only wants sex with me, and I have to believe she's being honest about that. Anything to the contrary is an automatic deal breaker.

 

She wants a sadist-masochist relationship and considers that just an alternative lifestyle. Does that not make you think she has a pathological mechanism and schism she's unable to bridge in a healthy way?

 

That is entirely possible. I had not considered that. It is a concern that she might slip into her old ways (ie cheating/sex for money)...but I have to believe she is being honest when she says she doesn't want to live that life anymore. The S/M aspect however is very much still ongoing.

 

Do you really think this subconscious drive will stay confined to her sexual behavior?

 

Again, that is entirely possible. She may or she may not decide to exhibit those qualities in other ways. Time will tell I suppose.

 

My guess is the dominated victim/excitement seeking/madonna-**ore/inner frustration and what other complex not will display itself all over the place as it's part of her psyche and she's not seeking professional health to resolve these issues in a healthy way- they cannot stay swept under the rug for very long.

 

Agreed. She has also admitted to me that she has type II bipolar disorder and has sought counseling in the past for depression. It is a concern going forward how that might manifest itself.

 

I can deal with small amounts of crazy, but not all crazy all the time. To be fair, she doesn't seem insane around me. She seems rather grounded...albeit always "in the mood" (for sex).

 

I'd say, best you can do with this girl is have a "fun" (may turn out to be too hardcore for you to consider fun any more), experimental phase and break it off when her inner psycho becomes too difficult to handle (or even better, break it off now). Then just put it down to experience.

 

I would hope I can deal with a little turmoil if she has a bad day and her inner psycho comes out...but if its an ongoing issue then yes definitely we would need to discuss it. I want to have fun, but I am also ready to get in position to settle down and get married soon... My wandering eye definitely does not help in this regard. Even today I found myself ogling other women while out getting lunch. Not a good sign

 

She probably thinks she's just sexually fun and doesn't think she has issues, despite the baggage so i wouldn't count on her seeking help in resolving these issues maturely.

 

Agreed. She does in fact think its all in good fun. I think she does want to deal with it in some manner, but as to how and when that remains to be seen.

 

You'd have to tell her honestly that if the extent of her quirkiness isn't confined or controlled and her maturity doesn't show up you'd not be considering her a candidate for a future together.

 

I would have no problem with that discussion. I told her from day 1 that I want her and I to be transparent and honest about everything. She agreed to that and I want to keep my end of the bargain. That is why I am turning to you guys...to help me clarify my thoughts!

 

I do think, however- and I mean no disrespect- that you attracted this girl because you share some of her issues, albeit to a lesser extent than her probably.

 

Again, that is entirely possible. I know I have my own issues too!

 

The attraction to the madonna-**ore thing? Want a kinky girl but also want a committed woman to settle down with and possibly have children with.. Yeah...get that sorted out.[/quote

 

Agreed. It is a bit of an unrealistic expectation. To be fair though, it comes with the idea that, once we are ready for the family life, that the kinky and "extreme" behavior would be dialed down a whole lot. I would expect to be focused on the family from both of our perspectives.

 

I think it'll prove to spawn difficulties in serious relationships and attempts at family life. If you're seriously considering settling down you'd want to do it the healthy way. As for having some kinky sex- would it have to be that extreme for you to feel excited?

 

Yes I'd want to do it the healthy way for sure. I want stability going forward. I can't completely say that she is stable right now, but then again who is totally stable at 21? She has told me that before she has kids she wants us to be married. I can agree with that. Kinky sex is fun, but its not required.

 

I'm sure there are more mature women out there who make great, fun, exciting sexual partners without reaching out to other males as partners, without needing you to hurry to their apartment dressed in leather and with a foldable whip in your briefcase during lunch break for some "fun" molestation. Without playing out their pathological response to trauma or a break up by getting all psycho with you. You can have crazy monkey sex with healthy people too, you know...Do you think you could do with "crazy monkey sex" or do you really require wearing a mask and leaving blood trails on her skin during sex? How far exactly does this girl plan to go and how far are you comfortable with?

 

Haha I am starting to enjoy your thoughts on what this kinky sex is all about! She has expressed an interest in "blood play" and yeah that is a hard limit for me. I'm not interested in that.

 

Honestly though I totally agree about not needing kinky sex. I've had "vanilla" relationships before that didn't involve D/s relations whatsoever and I had plenty of good times. I'm well aware that sex can be fun without whips and chains (although I would suggest it can enhance it, but I digress).

 

As to how far she wants to go...that remains to be seen. We are both very open-minded and have a lot of creative ideas about things we want to try together and (possibly) with others. That is one of the main reasons I decided to pursue her. She and I think a LOT alike in certain regards.

 

I know that this community means a lot to her. It is her passion. I cannot in good faith get in the way of that and pretend like I can keep her from it. If anything I would want to have her dial it down and be something we do together...but again, that all remains to be seen.

 

For right now, she seems really interested in just being with me, and that scares the lights out of me. It has been a long time since I was in a serious relationship...and I'm getting cold feet big time.

 

About a week ago I had intense emotions for her....and since we said the L word, the fight or flight mechanism has gone largely to the "flight" direction.

 

It could be me, it could be her, I really don't know anymore.

 

think it through...maybe you just want some fun and excitement. Can that be done in ways that don't leave you questioning someone's psyche?

 

Valid point. I do want fun and excitement on a level that most "vanilla" relationships don't offer. That being said, there's lots of people out there....so I can't say for sure that this girl is my one and only just yet.

 

I just want to be happy and feel like I'm head over heels for someone. More and more it just feels like I'm trying to fit a square peg in a round hole and pretending like its how I see it in my head rather than how it really is.

 

I have made plans with her for a few nights from now to meet my sister and her long time boyfriend to go to a hockey game (another Pro on her side, she loves hockey like me) and so that will be interesting to see how the dynamic works.

 

***

 

Thanks for the comments so far! Please feel free to contribute more!

[Ms Darcy]

I think if you, as a man in his early 30s, want to settle down and have a slightly less than vanilla, stable marriage and a family with someone then pursuing a 21 year old, recently broken up girl you not only met via kink site but who is also very involved in that community is inconsistent with your goals.

 

She's in a different place in life. The relationship is a rushed one right after another relationship. And you are already talking about her dialing back her involvement. Sounds very bad to me.

[Guitarguy_82]

Thanks, Ms. Darcy

 

I think if you, as a man in his early 30s, want to settle down and have a slightly less than vanilla, stable marriage and a family with someone then pursuing a 21 year old, recently broken up girl you not only met via kink site but who is also very involved in that community is inconsistent with your goals.

 

Well perhaps I should clarify my goals a bit. I do want to settle down and get married....but in a few years at best. I'm nowhere near ready for that kind of commitment right now. My career is on a decent path, but my living situation needs a serious upgrade (Currently living with parents, saving money, helping out with elderly parents who are dealing with a few medical issues, plan to move out in a few months).

 

After that, I plan on focusing time into martial arts, which is one of my passions.

 

What if she and I simply date during that time while exploring kink together? That remains to be seen if it is feasible in the way that I see things going. I do want her to dial down her involvement (only when it comes to the idea of her spending time with old men that use her as their slave), but I fully realize that the other aspects of it (ie whippings, flogging, being tied up, etc etc) would never just go away, nor would I want it to. The DD/lg aspect of our relationship is appealing to me and is where she and I really click.

 

After all that is settled and we both feel like its where it needs to be, only then would I bring up the marriage and family aspect. I am nowhere near ready for children...not for a few years. She has told me she wants to have kids soon, but I would definitely not.

 

I realize she has a lot of baggage with her recent previous relationship...and she has been open and honest about her feelings in that regard. I respect that. I gave her space at first. And still we both wanted to spend time together.

 

Again, that goes back to my main point about the possibility that I was merely her rebound, but then she developed feelings for me as a result. That could be a potential disaster in waiting.

 

She's in a different place in life. The relationship is a rushed one right after another relationship. And you are already talking about her dialing back her involvement. Sounds very bad to me.

 

Agreed that she is in a different place in life.

 

I will ask her again about her involvement in the community....get a realistic feel for where she thinks she is wanting to be with that.

 

It has the potential to be bad, for sure. That is why it's been on my mind.

 

It also has the potential to be something great. She and I get along more than just in a sexual regard or a kink regard (but then again, I could get along with a lot of people if I really wanted to. There's plenty of my "type" of woman out there (ie the geek girl which is oh so popular right now, I've been dating geek girls for years)...so its not like I'm overly worried that this current girl is the end all be all. She is simply someone I met online and was not expecting to get along with so well)

 

***

I think overall the opinion is that this is a slippery slope at best. I would have to agree overall. I think the question for me is if I believe the pros outweigh the cons.

 

A part of me just wants to enjoy it for what it is and have fun. She is a fun girl and we both always have a great time together.

 

It's just too early to tell right now where this thing might go.

 

The fact that I'm not jumping for joy is also somewhat indicative though

[itsallgrand]

I think you should look longer term of what you want out of life.

 

So you are in your thirties and living at home, still working on getting your career and ducks all in a row. And you think it is a reasonable idea to spend time pissing around with a seriously screwed up twenty one year old.

 

Dude, think. The fact that you sit back and have thought "wow, she's a genius". Oh my god, really?!

 

I think she's easy for you right now; all about pleasing, doesn't require anything. Women your age out there who are not seriously messed up are going to require of you.

 

I think you are wasting your time and going backwards. And I'm picturing you entering your next relationship and explaining this. It doesn't bode well for selling the idea that you are serious about having a future with someone.

[Guitarguy_82]

Thanks, itsallgrand. I appreciate the blunt honesty!

 

I agree with you to a point, but let me address your points individually and ask a few questions.

 

I enjoy a spirited debate, and I genuinely am trying to sort all this out in my head, so I might get frustrated at times. Please bear with me!

 

So you are in your thirties and living at home, still working on getting your career and ducks all in a row. And you think it is a reasonable idea to spend time pissing around with a seriously screwed up twenty one year old.

 

Well to clarify I had just moved back from a work assignment in Georgia and decided to move in with them temporarily...get some family time, save some cash, then get an apartment again. Then my dad had a stroke and since he can't drive (and since I can work from home and telecommute) I decided to stay at home and help out until he is healthy again.

 

I think I'm spending my time where I want to in pursuit of having fun and being happy. I like to hang out, go to sporting events, all that stuff. I suppose I could be a hermit for the rest of my life and focus purely on scholarly pursuits and martial arts and ponder the mysteries of the universe full-time...but I want a relationship as well. I am trying to find the right one. This girl might or might not be that person.

 

Dude, think. The fact that you sit back and have thought "wow, she's a genius". Oh my god, really?!

 

Yes really! I guess you would have had to be there, right? She's a smart girl (straight A student in college planning on getting her masters degree) so I think she's OK in that regard. We are able to talk about other things besides sex which is another reason I was starting to get really interested in her. We share a lot of views on religion, science, culutre, etc.

 

I think she's easy for you right now; all about pleasing, doesn't require anything. Women your age out there who are not seriously messed up are going to require of you.

 

There might be some truth to that. She immediately found me attractive (from what she told me) and I think wanted me sexually right off the bat. Then again, if that is what is labelled as "easy", then is that necessarily a bad thing? Who is judging what is easy or hard? The fact that she is all about pleasing me is a part of her role as a "sub". She enjoys being at my "service".

 

The notion that I still can't get out of my head is that I could be potentially settling. I think this might be a topic for another thread as well. Basically I can't help but look at other women and it all boils down to the idea of "we want what we can't have".

 

What is the solution to that? Pretend like the girl I have is going to satisfy me 100% of the time? Break up with her and find the next girl and just hope upon hope that she's into the same things I am (on the kink side, I mean) and that she's "hotter"?

 

I might sound like an idiot here (something I fully take responsibility for) but what is the point of grinning and bearing it just for the sake of doing what is right? Shouldn't I want to be with a woman that I am head over heels for (going back to my main post)?

 

I don't know if I am head over heels for this girl, despite her amazing qualities and her interest in the same kink that I am.

 

I think you are wasting your time and going backwards. And I'm picturing you entering your next relationship and explaining this. It doesn't bode well for selling the idea that you are serious about having a future with someone.

 

I definitely am serious about finding a future with someone. That's why I started this thread...to figure out if this girl is it! I would think that its a step forward especially if she in fact is the girl for me. I feel like its still up in the air.

 

I've already told this girl pretty much everything there is to know about myself and my past, and it scares me that I was able to open up to her so quickly and so easily. She reciprocated and basically gave me her entire history as well.

 

That being said, sometimes its fun to be a little mysterious. I don't try to be deceptive on purpose, but that doesn't mean I need to give my life story to every girl I date. If it heads into something serious, then yes, I'll honestly answer whatever is asked.

 

***

 

Last night I hung out with her, and was supposed to meet up with her dad to watch some hockey. Well apparently her 2 younger sisters and their boyfriends also showed up...so basically I got to meet the family. I was a bit hesitant at first, but decided to go with the flow, enjoy the moment, relax and have fun.

 

They all seemed to like me (at least her sisters did, though their boyfriends didn't seem too interested in talking to a guy 10 years older than them lol) and her dad and I were able to talk about sports and have a few laughs. We had a fun night overall.

 

All in all I truly don't know how to explain how I feel about her right now. On one hand I feel like I have the potential partner I've always wanted (kink-wise, smarts-wise, personality) and on the other hand I wonder if I would be able to find a "better looking" girl that I am head over heels for but would potentially sacrifice in the kink department.

 

When I am with her, we have an absolutely amazing time. We are very much in the lovey dovey stage. I realize that that won't last forever. There will be peaks and valleys and twists in the road.

 

When I am not with her, I wonder what the hell I'm doing. I have a sinking feeling in my gut, and I panic a little bit.

 

I dread the idea of breaking up with this girl who could potentially be amazing, only for the possible prospect of having to search again and hope I find someone better looking. (Shallow guy disclaimer again)

 

I am still at a loss, despite everyone's great input.

[Ms Darcy]

You are talking in circles and saying nothing. People have given the advice. Choose to take it or not. Good luck!

[Guitarguy_82]

You are talking in circles and saying nothing

 

Yep! I tend to do that a lot. I wish it wasn't the case. It is frustrating to say the least when it is all up here in my head and it keeps swirling back and forth adding doubt upon doubt.

 

She and I hung out today and it was a good fun time. The whole time however I think I came to the conclusion that we are just a different places in life.

 

She and I had a good talk about our goals and we both kind of hinted at the fact that we want some independence for the near future. She needs that and I need that. Lovey dovey talk about getting married and having kids is all fine and dandy during the honeymoon phase...but I believe we are done with that.

 

She's a great girl, no doubt about that....I just think I'm not attracted to her at the end of the day. Pure and simple and honest.

 

I think she and I can remain friends in the way I see this ending. I basically will tell her honestly that I don't have the spirit for a relationship right now. It's unfair to her and unfair to me for this to continue if one of us doesn't have the heart for it. I think I would be doing her a kindness by ending things now early and letting her continue to explore herself...and on the same token allow me to explore myself and get established. I would hope I can remain in the kink community but if anything I would just probably take an extended break... and that's OK.

 

She and I will hang out one more time tomorrow (along with meeting my sister and her longtime boyfirend at a hockey game) but after that I think we will need to have a honest state-of-the-relationship talk.

 

It's sad that I'm admitting all this but at the end of the day if I am not able to look her in the face and say I love you and truly mean it then I need to stop this before it gets out of hand.

[Iggles]

She's a great girl, no doubt about that....I just think I'm not attracted to her at the end of the day. Pure and simple and honest.

 

I think she and I can remain friends in the way I see this ending.

 

Yeah, I think this is for the best. With all you spoke about having in common with her, being friends makes sense since you don't feel a spark.

 

I agree with letting her down easy. It's way too brutal to divulge the truth. However, I think you shouldn't wait to go on another date. It's leading her on to have a final date where she meets your sister!

 

 

It's sad that I'm admitting all this but at the end of the day if I am not able to look her in the face and say I love you and truly mean it then I need to stop this before it gets out of hand.

 

You've known her for a month! It's way too early for "love" to develop! You should have never said those words back if you didn't feel it.

[Guitarguy_82]

Thanks, Iggles.

 

I would normally agree about the last date, but the plans for the 4 of us to go to this game have been in the works for a while now. To tell her she can't go all of a sudden would cause great suspicion in my view.

 

I think its fine to go to the game, have fun, and then talk afterwards...perhaps after a day or so and let some of the "fun" dust from the game settle.

 

Agreed about it being too early for love. When she said it to me initially (and when I said it back) I think we both felt like it was genuine at the time. I know it did for me anyway. I don't say it to every girl I meet and I definitely don't just throw it around cavalierly. I had genuine feelings for this girl...albeit short lived.

 

I spoke with a good friend of mine a few days back and he said that at the end of the day I need to love myself and be honest with myself enough to face the truth. I owe it to myself and I owe it to her. I definitely wont bring up the looks issue, but the fact about my spirit not being into it is true as well. I have had a rocky past with relationships in the past few years (as opposed to college when I was dating seriously for 3+ years) and they always seem to end around the one month mark. My spirit is inside myself right now, and I honestly don't think I'm ready to share it with anyone just yet. I need to establish "me" first (or rather, again now that I have moved back to Texas). I need to be at peace with myself and love myself before I should think about trying to share that with anyone.

 

I gave it a go, and it turns out she's not the one for me. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. The square peg does not fit into the round hole in this case....but it was pretty darn close.

 

This will be difficult, but I think its for the best.

 

If anyone has any other comments or similar stories I'd love to hear them as well.

[Batya33]

I'm glad you're going to end things with her. It's not easy but it's simple -you two do not have enough in common as far as values and goals for there to be long term potential here. Casually dating her is lying to yourself and putting yourself at great risk for STDs given her choice to have multiple sex partners. And I agree with Ms. Darcy (I think she wrote this) that women who are looking to settle down will not be comfortable with your involvement with her both because of her sexual fetishes and because of her emotional and psychological instability -and since she is so young they will wonder if you were taking advantage of her. Of course you don't have to share all the details but stories like this have a way of spreading.

[Guitarguy_82]

Thanks Batya!

 

I think we had a few similar goals (speaking way out in the long-term) but short term, yes, I think we both need some individual space right now. She needs to grow and learn as do I. I hope she and I can remain friends and I can help her grow and point her in a good direction. I sincerely would like that.

 

During our "love" phase we both decided not to see other people casually. She is clean as am I and she is using birth control.

 

Down the road for my future relationships, I will be honest about my past...but yeah that doesn't mean I need to divulge every little detail and kink that I was involved with.

 

I would think that with time even a "vanilla" relationship can incorporate kink to some degree...

 

...that is a subject for a different topic though!

[Batya33]

I would not attempt a friendship with her right now especially since you see yourself in the role of teacher -let her teachers/family/therapist if she has one, have that role in her life. Who knows in a few years maybe she'll be more stable and you two can be in touch at that time.