Ladies, how would you react if your man said this?

[everyone]

Sigh! And that's my cue to leave! No-one is hearing a word I'm saying and apparently I'm not hearing any of you either, so I'm going to check out as we're clearly getting nowhere. Thanks so much for all the time and effort though everybody. I really appreciate it. And yes Ms. Darcy I clearly communicate terribly with my GF. That's why we've been together for five years; that's why she was able to discuss her insecurity about my tight fitting clothes and I was able to respond lovingly; and that's why she still writes emails to her friends about how much she loves me to this day (face-palm!).

 

Thanks all and take care.

[Ms Darcy]

Have you actually asked her why she has changed the way she dresses as opposed to just telling her you don't like it?

Yes I have and she just said it was because she liked how it made her look and feel about herself and she was doing it 'for her' and not for anyone else. When I asked her if she's considered the fact that maybe she liked how it made her look and feel about herself because of the extra attention she was getting, she got very defensive and said that's not true at all and again said it's about how it makes her feel. This seemed to me to be the same type of avoidance I see other women here employing, but I have just kept my mouth shut about it for now.

 

Wow, five pages in and we are finally getting some information we needed to know upfront! OK, so I think this is very important stuff - as I noted a few pages back - the underlying issues. It is good that you asked her why and she seemed to give an honest answer -- for herself. And then your response was ... well ... if you tell someone how they feel or explain their motivation for doing something then they are going to get defensive. We have done this with you; you have done this with some of us in the thread. The responses in both cases were defensive. Part of defensiveness is frustration with not feeling heard right? Cause you JUST said something else and the other person seems to not believe you or implying that you are not telling the truth. Also suggests to the person hearing that a certain level of superiority from the speaker ... "I know you better than you know yourself."

 

Here is an example. I could say "Wow, you communicate terribly with your gf" or I could say "I think there are some strategies you can employ to help you both hear and understand your points better and more effectively." One can get a much more defensive response than the other.

 

When people tell you something, acknowledge it. If you want to probe deeper, do it with all the tact you can muster and you will get a lot from that person.

 

As for why I think she's doing it, I think it's because she's getting bored of our relationship. ... I even saw an email she wrote to a friend last week ... and in the email she was telling her friend how amazing she thinks I am and how happy she is that she still loves me so much after so long together, but she also said she feels a little bored at times, even though she certainly doesn't want to leave me. I had no problem with this as I feel the same sometimes. Not in the sense that I'm unhappy…just a stupid 'grass is greener' kind of way, which I assume is how she feels.

 

I think that's a cue to start dating her again - go on vacations and do fun things together. I assume you live together ... that can get routine. Spice it up.

 

I think this whole situation is about a mix of things. Firstly she's feeling a little bit bored of monogamy. Secondly she never knew her father or brothers and was rejected by both, so I sense that she puts a lot of stock in how men view her and she feels better when she gets male attention. And thirdly her ex-BF was a total control freak that pushed her around, abused her and dictated what she could and couldn't do. I think that all of these things combined are making her dig her heels in and risk losing me, rather than face the fact that maybe what I'm saying is not unacceptable and that she shouldn't judge me based on how other men have treated her. She should judge me based on how I've treated her for five years, which by all accounts (including hers) is very well.

 

I would be very careful about playing armchair psychologist. I think it's also entirely possible that this woman has come out of bad situations into a healthy one because she has learned to think for herself and set up her own boundaries. So people can guard their boundaries quite a lot. I try not to do that ... not even with family members.

 

Like I said earlier, the problem isn't what she wears, that was just the catalyst. The problem is her refusal to do exactly what she demanded of me previously ...

 

I didn't read every post, so I missed this. If she asked you to do this, then YES this is an additional point to bring up. If someone asked me to change something and I did and then when I asked the same I would be very confused and annoyed.

 

And thanks for saying that you agree that she should, at the very least, try to hear me out. Since she disagrees though, she may well find herself single very soon, as she's showing me very little respect, flexibility or consideration, which is made all the worse by the fact the shoe was recently on the other foot.

 

Of course she should hear you out. Communication is absolutely key.

 

What do you mean by showing you respect? I think people often say this without a real understanding of what the term means and how it applies. How is she not showing you respect? You can respect someone without doing what they want you to do.

[Ms Darcy]

My parents communicated terribly for the first 30 of their 40-year marriage. Length of relationship does not always equal quality.

[DN]

For many people, the way that a partner dresses and look is more than just about securities. Like it or not, you are judged and assessed by whom you associate with. If a woman hangs out with bikers she is going to be thought of as a 'biker-chick' and judged accordingly. If you are with a woman who wears revealing clothing she is going to be viewed in a certain way and so are you.

 

Had she always worn this sort of clothing then you would have to explain why you want her to change when it was OK before. But you were attracted to her partly because of who she was then and if that has changed then it isn't unreasonable for you not to like it to the point of not wanting to be with her any more. That isn't controlling - she can do what she wants. But you get to make your decisions as well.

 

They key thing that so many people are missing is that this isn't a choice of style or look that she has had since you first knew her - this is a change. I agree that there is a lot of knee jerk 'don't be controlling' rather than an attempt to understand where you are coming from and I can see why it is frustrating and unhelpful.

[OptomisticGirl]

Change is the most constant thing in life - OP if she tells you she wants to dress like this, likes to dress that, it's up to you to did if you are comfortable with it. The basic fact is she may have no reason to have changed her dress except that - she wanted change. If that's the case how would you respond?

[DN]

It is true that people change - but that doesn't mean those changes have to be acceptable to one's partner and that you are unreasonable and controlling if you object.

 

It is quite surprising that people seem very supportive of the woman doing what she wants to do and less supportive of the OP doing what he wants to do. If she wants to waer revealing clothing she can. If he wants to dump her for doing so he can. Why is the first OK but not the second.

[OptomisticGirl]

The second I okay, I never said it wasn't. He has evey right to - just as she has every right to do what she wants. His concerns are valid to him bit he has to realize he can't make her change back - she has to want to do that.

[sweetestdesire]

I don't know about you but i would want to feel protected if i was with my boyfriend.

i have your back you have my back type of thing

 

& he's not trying to control her its a sense of respect. when you accept to be in a relationship opinions/thoughts are to be changed.

you can not still do what you want when you want. & if you do, you shouldn't be in a relationship.

[OptomisticGirl]

^ I personally would not be with someone who expected me to change my thoughts/opinions simply because I'm a relationship wih them. Being in a relationship does not mean you cease as a person.

[PhilliesFan001]

Sigh! And that's my cue to leave! No-one is hearing a word I'm saying and apparently I'm not hearing any of you either, so I'm going to check out as we're clearly getting nowhere. Thanks so much for all the time and effort though everybody. I really appreciate it. And yes Ms. Darcy I clearly communicate terribly with my GF. That's why we've been together for five years; that's why she was able to discuss her insecurity about my tight fitting clothes and I was able to respond lovingly; and that's why she still writes emails to her friends about how much she loves me to this day (face-palm!).

 

Thanks all and take care.

 

Getting answers you don't like doesn't mean people aren't hearing you; it means they're hearing you and disagreeing. That's what happens on a public forum. Good luck with your girlfriend.

[Maeva]

Just in case the op comes back for a peek-

 

Maybe you are a male version of me?

 

I saw that and how i would react is to say byebye boyfriend. There would never be an question of my obeying.

 

Cos in my world I get to say what the guy wears, and he doesnt get to say what I wear. Its really unfair of me, and hopelessly sexist.

And it gets worse, because them not dressing as I said, should i ever actually decide to care enough about clothes to say, would be a deal breaker for me.

How can I be so unfair?

It is one rule for me, another for the partner. These matters arent about being fair or right always.

 

Looking for fairness works at intellectual level but at the down home level I am who I am and that isnt a fair person about some stuff.

 

I freely and openly admit that my response would be unreasonable and emotional and a bit childish. And I wouldnt feel bad about that, or feel I had to justify it - except by perhaps loading *more* emotion into it, because emotion is the part that counts for me about such things.

Why am I like that? I dont know and Im not sure it matters because Ive never stayed in a relationship where it came up for long.

 

But I wouldnt be in a relationship after 5 years with no marriage. Heck I wouldnt be in a relationship where anyone cared that much about how I looked. Thatd be deal breaker before the first date. So my response probably isnt that helpful to you. Perhaps others who asked those question were thinking the same thing. Popular culture would say dressing to attract someone new after 5 years kinda sounds like "this one didnt workout so time to move on even if I love him" behaviour at an unconcious level- but you know her bestand she is a person not a bit of popular culture.

 

I do think you have right to say this a deal breaker for me, this matters a lot to me. Looking for fairness isnt going to work. Sometimes you just have to say well this unreasonable of me but its what I am looking for, can you come with me for this or not.

 

Let her know that her classy looks really used to fill you with pride and make you feel good about yourself around her, and her current mode of dress doesnt feel so classy to you and it matters enough to you to be a deal breaker. That is what I would do. It sounds like it what she has done to you in the past?

 

I think we can expect reciprocity - having gone along with a partners deal breaker we can expect them to kind of "owe us one" about some other issue, but when its the same deal breaker issue-- thats sticky.

 

Unfortunately "Deal breakers" are kinda hard to get past, and at least for me some of them arent reasonable or intellectually sound.

 

Perhaps ask yourself how do her girlfriends think. How do they dress?

 

Anyway I wish you luck As a person who expects her partner will just yield without a moments thought to my sartorial choices for them, and would be stunned if there was disagreement, I am probably far more unreasonable than you.