Leaving my Narcissist/Borderline husband

[Mel1313]

This is going to be a long, but enlightening story. I hope what I've been through helps someone else avoid making the same mistakes that I did.

 

I met my soon-to-be-ex-husband on a dating website (thanks for nothing Cupid). He had written a hilariously sarcastic and engaging profile, which completely matched my own skewed sense of humor. I threw him a wink, and waited less than a day for an equally funny reply. Self-admittedly I'm a sucker for witty, funny, sarcastic men with a high intelligence level.

 

Fast forward about ten emails, and then he sent me my first really romantic email. It was a poem, and it was everything I thought I wanted to hear. It was sensitive, creative, and seemed to stem from his heart. I was hooked.

 

Fast forward to three weeks later and we're going to meet for our first in-person encounter. The first red flag was when we had plans set for a Saturday night, I cleared my social calendar and then received a telephone call that morning from him to tell me that he had unanticipated plans with his daughters (teens) and could we reschedule for Sunday? I agreed (first mistake) and we met at a local chain restaurant. Red flag number 2...I specifically asked him to make sure he waited in the lobby of the restaurant so that I could spot him, as his photos weren't as descriptive as I would have hoped. He deliberately took a booth, and I found out later it was because if I didn't "measure up" he would have taken off. I had to hunt him down, but in return, he never looked up once during the conversation, even though the Superbowl was on the TV screen over my head.

He pushed hard for more physical contact than I wanted, and I held him off.

I arrived home to find a message on my machine from him...borderline gushing over how wonderful he thought I was. Who wouldn't find that flattering?

 

The next six months were a whirlwind of overkill on gifts, trips, outings, and attention. I knew it was too much, too soon, but again, it was very flattering and the intimate relationship was pretty good.

 

Before I could catch my breath, I had met his daughters, his family (no friends though....interesting that he didn't have any close friends 'nearby') --next thing I knew he was on his knees with a ring box. I didn't listen to that little voice that kept nagging me and saying ...wait a sec....what's the rush here?

Fast forward....the wedding day arrived.....and I sat up in bed at my friend's house and said to myself..."I should be elated today, why am I not on Cloud 9?" ...so much stress and worry over the wedding to make sure I didn't go over HIS budget (never mind that we were paying equally)--and I was exhausted.

 

Fast forward....welcome to the "It's All About Me" show....every single aspect of our lives, from his kids, his custody battle with his ex-wife, his job, his family, everything....took first place. I came in a distant fourth, at best.

Then began the inappropriate online behavior...the endless hard-core porn, the memberships on "for sex-only, local nsa sex" websites, the unexplained time away from home, the separate lives, the excuses for not putting me on the deed, even though I was paying half the mortgage etc. etc. etc. I finally realized that I was chronically depressed and angry, got into therapy, invited him to join me (to no avail, nothing wrong with HIM, is there?!) ..and found out from my therapist that my husband is a Narcissist/Borderline Personality Disordered.....so no, I'm not crazy, no, I didn't imagine the conversations he's denied having, and no, I don't have to put up with this anymore.

 

The kicker? When I announced my plans to either get joint therapy or I leave? He joined link removed and posted his profile. He had a date this week (I have access to his email, so he either wants me to know or in the heat of the moment, forgot that I have it) and is making dates with three other women. I'm still in the house, but only for a few more days before I move in with an old roommate and then file for divorce (cruel and inhumane treatment will be the grounds).

The day I met with my attorney and paid his retainer was the BEST day of my life. The relief, the realization that it's almost over and I'll get my life back.

Word to the wise....listen to your gut and that little voice in your head that says "something's not right'...

[Lana0120]

Wow, that's some story. I'm sorry to hear you went through that. Personally, after a date like that, I am not sure I would have gone back for more. It sounds as though from the start, there were quite a few red flags. It's a shame that you've realised now rather than then, but better late than never. At least you've learned some things from the whole experience and hopefully won't make the same mistakes again.

[Mel1313]

thanks Lana...it's been a process, but I"m still reasonably "young" (low 40's) and so much stronger as a person now. I've been through hell and back, but I know who I am now, without question, and I have the most amazing "Posse" of girlfriends and my family.....I have a rewarding job, and things can ONLY get better. I hope this serves as a cautionary tale regarding narcissists.

[Diabra]

I too met my ex b/f on a dating site... and he also has very similar flaws... we have been split up for four months now and I overlooked the red flags too... in the name of all the other things we had that were compatible. He turned out to be a commitment-phobe and a narcissist. I'm still reeling from the way he left me four months ago and am still trying to find some peace about it. I am sorry you went through this experience, but you are not alone, we all fall for romantic gestures and big promises early on because we want to believe in the man we are about to get involved with. Mine promised a lot, but delivered on none of it. I am still hoping to meet the right man for me... I am mid-40's also and some days I honestly just want to give up and go it alone for the rest of my life... nothing ever seems to work out well in the romance department for me. Thanks for sharing your story!

[Mel1313]

I know how you feel.....the best thing out of this was getting to know who I am, and realizing that real love takes time, and won't rush you. Hang tough sister...

Personally, at this time I don't care if I spend the rest of my life alone or not ...anything is better than the situation I was in.

[mintblossom]

How can we tell if someone is borderline or a narcissist?

 

I dated a guy who would deny ever saying certain things that I remember very clearly him saying or doing. It was odd.

[Up and Down]

How can we tell if someone is borderline or a narcissist?

 

I dated a guy who would deny ever saying certain things that I remember very clearly him saying or doing. It was odd.

 

Here's an overview, they fall under cluster B disorders. I think my ex was BPD/HPD/NPD....there's some overlap between the disorders. Many are considered high functioning which means that in day to day life they are fine and their interaction with others is relatively normal. Its the ones that are closest to them that get to see the extent of the disorder...it's a roller coaster of a life.

 

Cluster B Personality Disorders

 

link removedPersonality Disorder

APD is characterized by lack of empathy or conscience, a difficulty controlling impulses and manipulative behaviors. This disorder is sometimes also referred to as psychopathy or sociopathy, however, Antisocial Personality Disorder is the clinical terminology used for diagnosis (APA 2000).

The term antisocial is commonly misunderstood as referring to someone who has poor social skills, but usually the opposite is true. Psychopaths can be charming, and are adept at focusing their cold, calculating efforts solely on self-gratification, typically at the expense of others (Hare 1999, Black 1999).

link removed Personality Disorder

According to the DSM-TR-IV, psychology's diagnostic "bible," BPD interferes with an individual's ability to regulate emotion. The characteristic emotional instability results in dramatic and abrupt shifts in mood, impulsivity, poor self-image and tumultuous interpersonal relationships. People with this disorder are prone to unpredictable outbursts of anger, which sometimes manifests in self-injurious behavior. Borderlines are highly sensitive to rejection, and fear of abandonment may result in frantic efforts to avoid being left alone, such a suicide threats and attempts (Friedham 2004, Oldham 2004).

link removed Personality Disorder

To be histrionic is to behave melodramatically—over the top. People with the psychological disorder HPD, have a personality based on histrionic behavior; constantly displaying an excessive level of emotionality.

Histrionics crave the limelight and constantly seek attention and approval. They tend to dominate conversations using grandiose language and frequent interruptions. Those with HPD can be manipulative—negative attention being better than no attention at all (Dobbert 2007, Horowitz 2001).

link removed Personality Disorder

NPD is typified by grandiosity, need for admiration, and lack of empathy. Narcissism occurs in a spectrum of severity, but the pathologically narcissistic tend to be extremely self-absorbed, intolerant of others’ perspectives, insensitive to others’ needs and indifferent to the effect of their own egocentric behavior.

It is not uncommon for persons with this disorder to frequently compare themselves to the accomplished, well-known and well-to-do. They feel entitled to great praise, attention, and deferential treatment by others. Those with NPD crave the limelight and are quick to abandon situations in which they are not the center of attention. Defects of empathy may cause narcissists to misperceive other people's speech and actions, causing them to believe that they are well-liked and respected despite a history of negative personal interactions (Kernberg 2003, 2004, APA 2000).

 

This link seems to be a summary of many cluster B traits and tells you what red flags to look out for:

 

link removed

[Crazyaboutdogs]

I know how you feel.....the best thing out of this was getting to know who I am, and realizing that real love takes time, and won't rush you. Hang tough sister...

Personally, at this time I don't care if I spend the rest of my life alone or not ...anything is better than the situation I was in.

 

That is so true. I think a lot of women get swept away by the early "I love yous" the gifts, and the attention lavished on them. A more solid relationship builds slowly over time and there is none of this desperate attempt to impress and sweep someone off their feet.

[fridagrrl]

Wow.....sounds exactly like the life I left behind.....I saw the red flags, for 6 years, but married him anyway (the naivete of young love). It wasn't until after we had children that things got REALLY bad.

How long were you married to him?

[just M.E.]

Mel -

Pretty much my story too, no we didn't meet on a dating site and I spent 9 yrs in it, but his shelf life was about 4 and by 7 life was pure hell.

 

It's a tough heal, more than I had experienced in the past. I glad you are dealing with a therapist, I am also and have been for a few years, that is what has kept me grounded.

 

Scary people, huh?

[minniegirl]

Narcissist are some of the most frightening people you could ever deal with. Once they have a grasp on you, it's very hard to break free. When and if you do break free, healing is a whole other hurdle to leap over. I've never been through a more horrifying experience in my life and am still trying to fully break free. Definitely keep up with the therapist. Take care of yourself. This is a difficult rode.

[Mel1313]

here's a classic example of how narcissists operate:

 

I'm scheduled for major surgery on Tuesday of this week (woo-hoo, Happy Thanksgiving for me!--not! But at least I don't have to cook) and my soon-to-be ex sent me an email today asking me to join him and his daughters for Thanksgiving dinner. Did I mention that I'm having major (female) surgery on Tuedsay, which would be two days before Thanksgiving?

 

IF all goes well, they'll release me from the hospital on Thanksgiving day.

In his email, this psychopath wants to come pick me up from my friends house where I've been staying for the last month, drive me one hour to his house, have dinner (I won't even be on solid food at that point, what's he going to serve me, gravy?) and then drive me an hour back.

 

His direct quote was "I can guess what your response will be, but I want you to be there, I'm a glass-half-full kind of guy".

This man is expecting me to get in a car for a two-hour round trip with stomach staples and stitches, so that he can put on the "family" show for Turkey day.

This has nothing to do with "missing me" or wanting to be supportive for me post-surgically...it's about how things will look if I'm not there, so he's going to sacrifice his time to pick me and bring me back.

 

Nice.

[Cheryl B]

Mel,

 

I was searching the net for articles about leaving a N family and came accross your blog and immediately related and had to sign up. I can totally relate to what you've gone through. I separated from my N husband this past July after finding once again porn on our laptop....only this time he was looking at it on a work day...that was it! He also never added me to his first house he bought before we got married. We moved out and rented it out and bought another one jointly. now that we are getting divorced, it's still his property, but money has gone into it the last 21 years. He claims it has bought in money too, but what he doesn't realize he's been the spender in the family. Materialistic things and money are most important to my N and his family that it has caused herendous family fueding.

 

To give you a little background, we've been together 22 yrs. and I've put up with physical and emotional abuse so ugly no idiot in their right mind would have hung around. We have 2 teenage daughters. To begin on our wedding night we were a bit drunk and he punched me in the eye because he was sticking up for his drunk brother who nearly ruined our wedding. I had a balck eye. I couldn't begin to give you the number of flags I've seen in our relationship. I've had my front tooth knocked out - been chastised when trying to be a couple because his family came first. His old man is a classic N - his whole family is too. I have been emotionally hurt and when I tell him things, he blows it off saying I am over-reacting. I look back now and could kick myself for not leaving years earlier but I always got the I'm sorry - I'll make it better routine. I had him arrested twice for hitting me...sometimes in front of our girls.

 

I remember when our second daughter was a born....he went to the phone and call the old man and said, "hey dad...yeah, cheryl had the baby and i am sorry, it's a girl." I wanted to get off the bed and beat the crap out of him...I was so hurt. It was all about pleasing the king N. It's ironic that all his sons had girls....thank God...that this family name of N's will die.

 

Like your marriage, I was always last. His family came first, money second, then me, then our kids. I was last because I was home taking care of things while he was taking care of things for his retired N father....who sat and smoked 3-4 pks of cigarettes a day. While he was mowing his dad's lawn, I was mowing ours. It was expected of me to carry my weight. I have given him way too much freedom. When my girls were young, I'd get them ready and drop them off at daycare and then pick them up on my way home......meanwhile the ass got off several hours earlier and would be home just hanging around. I later found out he was home viewing porn. I told him counseling or I am out. It was only due to the counselor pointing it out (the same things I''ve told him for years) that he should pick up the girls and start dinner before I get home.....huh! He picked up the girls, that was about it.

 

Anyway, I am finally free and am not talking to him and it's driving him insane. He sends me email at work, quite lengthy ones and I might respond with a yes or no but no details of my emotions, as he's used them against me.

 

His sister is also going through a nasty divorce. She's an alky, coke head...who refuses to take responsibility for her actions as well. My brother in law and I compare notes and it really disturbs my husband and his sister knowing that were talking about them...it's quite humorous. Their all N's that cant be helped. They all have severe addictions and are totally enmeshed with each other that it's sick behavior. The other brother is a drunk too and the other brother committed suicide a few years back. Guess the N' personality will take people down if they don't get help.

 

Anyway, thanks for letting me share....(vent).

[CallingAllAngels]

Cluster B Personality Disorders

 

link removedPersonality Disorder

APD is characterized by lack of empathy or conscience, a difficulty controlling impulses and manipulative behaviors. This disorder is sometimes also referred to as psychopathy or sociopathy, however, Antisocial Personality Disorder is the clinical terminology used for diagnosis (APA 2000).

The term antisocial is commonly misunderstood as referring to someone who has poor social skills, but usually the opposite is true. Psychopaths can be charming, and are adept at focusing their cold, calculating efforts solely on self-gratification, typically at the expense of others (Hare 1999, Black 1999).

 

 

WOW...

 

When I read this I almost fell on the floor.

 

You descibed my Husband to a "t"...

 

Thank you very very much for this.

 

~Allie

[confusedmama]

I too thank you! Although I had heard my ex had narcissistic tendencies I had never had them explained quite the way that did. Yes there is Bi-polar in there also but more narcissism. How do I raise my kids with that?? When I did the Loser window my ex had 15 of the 20 flags-WOWO I must have been really blinded. NOT NOW

[Up and Down]

WOW...

 

When I read this I almost fell on the floor.

 

You descibed my Husband to a "t"...

 

Thank you very very much for this.

 

~Allie

 

I have been doing a lot of reading on BPD/NPD/HPD, only because I think my ex may fit the bill. Sometimes I wonder if I am trying to force the fit to make myself feel better...or if she was just being a "woman" at times. I am not sure. Once you start reading about it though a light bulb will go off when you realize you can start to put a thumb on what the issues really were internally to your ex. However this does nothing to change them and only minimizes the pain a bit.

[CallingAllAngels]

I have been doing a lot of reading on BPD/NPD/HPD, only because I think my ex may fit the bill. Sometimes I wonder if I am trying to force the fit to make myself feel better...or if she was just being a "woman" at times. I am not sure. Once you start reading about it though a light bulb will go off when you realize you can start to put a thumb on what the issues really were internally to your ex. However this does nothing to change them and only minimizes the pain a bit.

 

I can't say that it minimizes the pain...it DOES however explain a lot of things.

 

Again...thanks for the info....I do find it facinating.

 

~Allie

[Cheryl B]

Another day...

 

The N husband sends me an email saying he'd still like to proceed with the separation ( duh- we've been separated) and also sent me a separation agreement form to fill out. He's always called the shots in our marriage so I think he was fishing to see how I was feeling, but am not really speaking with him. He keeps trying to say I haven't changed. I've changed alot since moving out and am happy, no BS to put up with. He keeps telling me that I am angry....hahaha. The only thing I won't put up with is an unhealthy relationship and that's who he and his family are all about.

 

Just last week our daughter had her first fender bender and she called her dad to tell him (she was afraid for his reaction as she'd bumped cars going in and out of the driveway). The first thing he said to our daughter was,"Oh, that's great, where are you?" The SICK N didn't even ask if she was okay!! Later when I mentioned to him that he handle it incorrectly, he jumped all over me...then later apologized...and he calls me angry. What I told him was that he is telling me that I am angry but I told him he's projecting what HE's feeling.

 

I told him that I have live our marriage through his thoughts and his eyes, not mine that I have a voice, desires, thoughts, and feelings and it is imperative that I know them well and express them. I can be amicable (during this divorce process) and will also be happy.

 

He can do all the leg work in this divorce... he likes to be in charge and I am going to let him do all he can and my reward is getting out! I only have him left to lose. At one point in my marriage, I lost my respect, dignity, became severly depressed and started believing what this ass was telling me, that I was a horrible person. Because I won't bend for him - I am horrible. I won't deal with his psychotic family because I don't have to. He says they deserve respect...ha, these asses have never respected anyone elses boundaries, including mine and neither has my N husband, why should I put up with any of it? It's unhealthy, unbalanced, and just plain sick. I told him that I am a good person and I am not going to allow anyone to take me down again.

 

get away from N's they will take you down....and possibly out if they could. They are above rules, laws, boundaries or paying their share.

[CallingAllAngels]

Just wanted to let you know that in the eyes of the LAW there is a difference between being separated (i.e., living apart) and having a "separation agreement".

 

You can be "separated" (live apart) forever, and in the eyes of the law, you are still married. In order to get a divorce (in some states) you must be LEGALLY separated, per the "separation agreement" that your husband is asking you to work out with him. Once you are legally separated a year, you can get a divorce. If you do not have "Grounds" for a divorce (again, not sure the laws in Virginia as I am from NY), it may be difficult to get a divorce. Some States are easier than others. In NY, you MUST have grounds, or you have to have a Settlement Agreement. "Lucky" for me my husband committed Adultry or I would never get a divorce. I won my Grounds for Adultry, but he is still making this divorce a nightmare on me...stalling and dragging his feet...making offers that are unreasonable. Eventually our case will probably go to Trial (unheard of as we have no children), but at least it will be over.

 

So, it sounds to me that your husband wants a divorce.

 

Here's MY 2cents on this: You have children...I don't. I'm not so sure there is anything as a "nice" divorce. YOU ASK FOR EVERY SINGLE THING YOU WANT AND PUT IT IN WRITING IN THAT SEPARATION AGREEMENT...ESPECIALLY AS FAR AS THE CHILDREN GO. DON'T TRY TO BE 'NICE'. 'NICE' DOESN'T GET YOU ANYTHING 6 MONTHS FROM NOW WHEN YOU CAN'T PAY YOUR BILLS, AND HE'S DATING SOMEONE ELSE.

 

Don't think with your heart...think with your head. GET IT ALL IN WRITING. NO VERBAL AGREEMENTS BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR HUSBAND...GET YOURSELF AN ATTORNEY.

 

I know too many woman who have said "I wished I hadn't signed that..."

 

My best to you...

 

~Allie

[Cheryl B]

Thanks for the info Allie.

 

In Virginia, you do not have to file a legal separation but you do have to be separated (living apart) for one year before you can file. We agreed to do this uncontested because we can agree on things. i don't want to give my money away to an attorney when we can work through this. If I run into any difficulties, I will retain one but I don't think I need to do that.

 

As you mentioned my husband wanting a divorce, he really doesn't. He wants to work this marriage out but as I said, he always wants to call the shots, that's how N's operate, they do not like when others call the shots, which is what I did when I moved out. Since he mentioned the agreement, I told him I would oblige him. What he's looking fishing from me are words that this marriage will work out and I'll come home but that is not going to happen, especially after walking through a new door of life. I have been physically and mentally abused and it has changed me for life. I've gotten some great counseling and am on my way to healing but this abuse has gone on for over 21 years.

 

We both have good jobs and make the same amount yearly. Our girls are comfortable with what is going on. As far as the agreement goes, we'll agree on spliting marital assets 50/50 - it can be amicable.

 

I do hope he finds someone in time, me too - I wouldn't wish loneliness on anyone. I know it hurts to be dumped - my first husband did this to me (we didn't have kids either). I eventually got over it. I know my N-husband doesn't understand why I had to do what I did because he's not the victim. N's are never the victims, only the victimizers.

[confusedmama]

Just be careful!! My N ex-husband also said ALL the right things to make me think that we could work out the divorce for the best of the kids and ourselves-4 years and 2 lawyers later I'm still fighting. As you said, they don't like ANYONE else calling the shots just beware.

[CallingAllAngels]

Just be careful!! My N ex-husband also said ALL the right things to make me think that we could work out the divorce for the best of the kids and ourselves-4 years and 2 lawyers later I'm still fighting. As you said, they don't like ANYONE else calling the shots just beware.

 

I cannot agree more...which is why I STRONGLY advised OP to get an attorney involved IMMEDIATELY....

[confusedmama]

Here we go again with his N behavior!! I don't think it will ever end. Why did I ever believe that he would ever do the "right" thing by the kids or me?? If he didn't do it in 15 years of marriage why would he do it in divorce. I know some get a "GREAT AWAKING"-anybody got an alarm clock for the jerk?

[Mel1313]

Update:

I contracted an attorney before I moved out....the paperwork has been filed, and thus far he is not fighting me on the grounds (cruel and inhuman) but ONLY because he knows I have copies of his accounts with link removed etc. from earlier in the marriage.

 

My attorney initally filed claiming my right to half of everything (my ex actually had his daughters email me asking me why I was "taking their home away" and were they really going to get "tossed out into the street" ....unreal) so when the secondary set of papers were sent to him settling for less (I don't have legal claim to the house)he jumped at the opportunity to settle.

 

That may change depending on what mood he's in when he receives the final paperwork, but I have my fingers crossed.

[chick]

Know that tale too well. Didn't meet online, but ever the charmer, until we settled into our own place and life. Anything he wanted of course took precedence, then slowly he started to get online more too... I had surgery and he ended up spending more time out with his mates than at home helping me. Now we fight over the amount of women contacting him, and that he contacts with inanpropriate matter... we fight over the fact he doesn't clean up anymore and I've become not only my little one's mum, but his as well. He complains he doesn't get enough sex to the women on the internet and meanwhile I'm sitting in the same room ready to go.

 

I've seen in various other posts the same thing in regard to narcissists... they're hard to leave because they're very manipulative without even being aware of it, let alone the fact that because the first period is usually a dream come true... and the love we get in those times and share is elating. But we're left hungry for any form of similar attention for the rest of the relationships life. When we say so to our partners, we get a 'well i'm wanting love and attention too!' - of course dear... of course you are.

 

I've been up and down in this for a long long time, and preparing to leave now