Love vs. In love - some questions

[SleepyOwl1969]

1 hour ago, MissCanuck said:

You're trying too hard to make this all about you being overly-emotional, and not enough about him not being invested the way you are.  

I'm sorry. I think you are fooling yourself here and likely going to wind up struggling with this for however long this relationship lasts. 

It very much reads to me that he likes you well enough and cares about you, and will settle for you. But does he feel deep desire and excitement when he thinks about you? It doesn't appear so. 

How does one ever know if the other partner is as equally as invested as they are? By their words? By their actions?

 

[SleepyOwl1969]

21 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

Hmmm well I do think people can feel love on different levels but I guess what may be worrying is the language he used. Like, the "not sure" type of language. Even if someone doesn't feel the big butterflies and fireworks, after 1.5 years with someone if they know they love that person and see a future, it seems odd to say: "I'm not in love with you". That seems to signify some kind of negative feeling. You know what I mean?

To be fair, I consider myself in love with him however I don't know that I felt butterflies and fireworks when I saw him/see him. Is this the definition of being in love? Does that mean then that I am not actually in love with him because I don't feel those things?

 

[Tinydance]

2 minutes ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

How does one ever know if the other partner is as equally as invested as they are? By their words? By their actions?

 

Well I'd say probably both. And I guess maybe by some kind of measurement if they're acting on your level with everything. E.g. If they say they love you often or if you have particular future goals and they also share those goals and want the same. This is just an example but things like, you want to live together, you want to buy a house together, you want marriage, you want kids  - so do they with you. Like, everything you do to show love or want in the relationship, they do too. They match you.

[SleepyOwl1969]

14 minutes ago, Rose Mosse said:

I wouldn’t have stayed with someone like this and can’t remember this ever happening. There are too many red flags. You’re both older and have pasts which is understandable but the words he uttered are hurtful on different levels.

I’d focus less on the semantics and more on who he is as a person. Does he tend to philosophize and speak in circles? Says one thing and means another? Seems too distracted and busy to be in a relationship? Throws out oddball sentences and loves confusion? I’d weigh all these things against what he’s done with his life and how he treats others as well. Then decide whether I’m compatible with this person. 

What are the "too many" red flags?

An answer to your questions, I'd say no to all of them. 

And again, remember that I'm the one who pushed him to give me an answer as to whether or not he is in love with me. 

He didn't volunteer that information. 

[SleepyOwl1969]

3 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

Well I'd say probably both. And I guess maybe by some kind of measurement if they're acting on your level with everything. E.g. If they say they love you often or if you have particular future goals and they also share those goals and want the same. This is just an example but things like, you want to live together, you want to buy a house together, you want marriage, you want kids  - so do they with you. Like, everything you do to show love or want in the relationship, they do too. They match you.

And I guess that's the thing, and in terms of how we think, we align very very well. We are very communicative and we talk a lot about our past present future etc

There is nothing amiss when it comes to those things, compatibility issues, sexual chemistry etc.

This is why I'm questioning things in terms of him saying those words I want to hear. If everything is wonderful, do I insist upon him feeling that way/ saying those words?

I've been in many relationships in my life and this is by far the healthiest one I've ever been in. 

[Tinydance]

2 minutes ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

To be fair, I consider myself in love with him however I don't know that I felt butterflies and fireworks when I saw him/see him. Is this the definition of being in love? Does that mean then that I am not actually in love with him because I don't feel those things?

 

No I don't think it means that and that's why I was actually giving examples of different ways people can feel about each other and be in relationships. For example, going on big dates like romantic trips, candle lit dinner, staying in a hotel. Versus more low key relationship like just enjoying walking together, cooking, gardening, watching TV together.

I think in some cases you feel those sparks and butterflies strongly but sometimes it's a more level feeling. Some people are actually friends first and after some time realise they really care for each other and love each other as more. But it was a slow burn friendship and companionship relationship from the start. 

I guess what I mean is using a negative kind of response. For example, let's say someone asked their partner to move in with them. If their partner said: "I'd love that but I'd just like to wait another few months before moving in". Versus: "I'm not sure". One is enthusiastic and one isn't.

[SleepyOwl1969]

1 minute ago, Tinydance said:

No I don't think it means that and that's why I was actually giving examples of different ways people can feel about each other and be in relationships. For example, going on big dates like romantic trips, candle lit dinner, staying in a hotel. Versus more low key relationship like just enjoying walking together, cooking, gardening, watching TV together.

I think in some cases you feel those sparks and butterflies strongly but sometimes it's a more level feeling. Some people are actually friends first and after some time realise they really care for each other and love each other as more. But it was a slow burn friendship and companionship relationship from the start. 

I guess what I mean is using a negative kind of response. For example, let's say someone asked their partner to move in with them. If their partner said: "I'd love that but I'd just like to wait another few months before moving in". Versus: "I'm not sure". One is enthusiastic and one isn't.

Gotcha. I understand what you're saying now. Thank you for clarifying.

[DarkCh0c0]

1 hour ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

BUT I'm one of those highly sensitive and emotional people. I tend to overreact emotionally a lot, and I need to try to rationalize things quite a lot of the time. This is why I'm here. So that I can step out of my emotional box and try to gain a more rational perspective of things.

You're talking yourself out of your emotions.

Your feelings of devastation are what you should have stuck to and honoured.... to echo what @MissCanuckmentioned.

[SleepyOwl1969]

1 minute ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

You're talking yourself out of your emotions.

Your feelings of devastation are what you should have stuck to and honoured.... to echo what @MissCanuckmentioned.

I guess what I'm saying is that because I'm so overly emotional about things, not just relationships but everything, I tend not to see straight. There have been decisions in my past for example with work etc that if I had gone by my emotional reaction at the time would not have made a good decision. 

I guess the bottom line is that time will tell. Am I happy ? Absolutely. Is it possible that this relationship can and will end? Absolutely. There are no guarantees.

Am I going to leave him? No. At this point it is not a consideration. Maybe ask me in another 6 or 12 months if the situation is the same. I suppose my desire to be in a happy, stable relationship outweighs whether or not this person classifies himself as being in love with me (whatever that means to him).

 

[DarkCh0c0]

2 hours ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

Am I going to leave him? No. At this point it is not a consideration. Maybe ask me in another 6 or 12 months if the situation is the same. I suppose my desire to be in a happy, stable relationship outweighs whether or not this person classifies himself as being in love with me (whatever that means to him).

Okay. Then you answered your own question. It doesn't matter to you if he's in love with you or not so long his actions are in line with ones you desire from him. This is your relationship deal with him for now and you're satisfied(?) with it.

[Wiseman2]

29 minutes ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

How does one ever know if the other partner is as equally as invested as they are? By their words? By their actions?

That never happens. When you stop living in a romcom, you'll be able to focus on the man, if you're happy and skip the timelines, semantics, etc. Any wolf can utter those words. So pick your battles and try not to worry yourself out of what sounds like a pretty decent thing for you for now.

[Tinydance]

Well I think really all these things about feelings just depend on how you yourself feel and what you want from a relationship. I think there are some people who are happy just with more a friendship and companionship relationship rather than a very "in love" passionate relationship. Usually people have goals and expectations for that relationship but they can be different for different people.

Normally after 1.5 years people want to know if their partner is on the same level as them. It doesn't matter what the level is, just that it's the same. For example, if someone wants marriage and kids, does their partner want that with them? 

I know in your case it's not as simple as you and your partner are in your 50's and you already have children anyway. But still there must be something you want in future in a relationship? Maybe to live together? 

I've been thinking about your question about love and being in love. I think what the difference is, when you say you're "in love", that definitely means it's romantic and it's very strong and something you feel only for your partner. When you say love, it can be any kind of love. For friends, family. So maybe someone can love their partner but not be in love because they love them as more like a friend. They enjoy their company and love them as a person but they just don't feel those strong feelings. 

The other thing is that the being in love stage is usually at the start of a relationship. If your partner after 1.5 years says he's not in love with you then maybe the implication is he never was? But again it also depends his strongest level of actually feeling love. 

You say he never married or had  children and I'm guessing that was by choice? So maybe the love he normally feels for partners is more that of friendship and companionship. So not like in a completely devoted, romance movie way: "I want to be married and spend the rest of my life with that person". But maybe more like: "I really like this person, I love their company and sharing our life together".

[jul-els]

2 hours ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

Yes, I agree.

There is no doubt in my mind that he does love me, that's for sure. And I do know that he takes the idea of a relationship very seriously. So, having me meet his parents and his friends and being introduced to my children are not things that he takes lightly.

Am I willing to throw away a great relationship just because he doesn't use the words that I would like him to despite his actions aligning with my expectations? That's another question. 

It comes down to your happiness. If you are truly happy, then allow yourself to rest in it. It seems as though self-doubt is one of things you have in common in this relationship. As I was saying earlier, love doesn’t come with guarantees. If you’ve managed to find love, that’s a blessing. If however there is a part of you that says this isn’t right for you, you should pay attention to that and address it sooner than later. 

[Tinydance]

I Googled an article and realised I'd already said all the same. Thanks Dr. Tiny  😜

https://www.betterhelp.com/advice/relations/love-vs-in-love-which-is-better/

[MissCanuck]

51 minutes ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

I guess what I'm saying is that because I'm so overly emotional about things, not just relationships but everything, I tend not to see straight.

One doesn't need to overly-emotional to be very hurt by learning their partner isn't in love with them. I am not sure why you assume your reaction is just you being over-reactive. I would wager that most would be quite hurt to hear the things he told you. 

1 hour ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

I'm the one who pushed him to give me an answer

And why did you do this? My guess is because you had been struggling and feeling something was off. If you really felt it from his actions, I don't quite see why you wanted to hear him say it (or not) Thus, I can only conclude you were not actually feeling like he was in love. And you got the answer I am sure you didn't want to hear. 

1 hour ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

He didn't volunteer that information

Of course not. He knew it would hurt your feelings. 

59 minutes ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

Am I happy ? Absolutely.

Are you? If so, again, I question why you pushed him to tell you that he was in love. 

1 hour ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

How does one ever know if the other partner is as equally as invested as they are? By their words? By their actions?

Both, yes. But certainly not a very clear and honest "I'm not in love with you." 

Look, it might be his reality that he's scared, cautious and so on. I am not suggesting that isn't his case. What I am suggesting is that you need to be careful not to dishonour your own needs and wants by trying to find justification to stay when your first instinct was (understandably) a very painful one. 

All you can do is see if you're truly okay with this over time, and listen to your own feelings honestly and sincerely. 

[Batya33]

4 hours ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

Thank you so much for sharing your experience. It sounds like you and your girlfriend have a great relationship and I'm happy that you are able to deal with things prior to developing a relationship. And are also able to manage when things arise.

The truth is that I am very happy in the relationship. He treats me well, we have good chemistry, good communication etc. So now I ask myself the question, if I'm happy, does it really matter if he meets MY definition of being in love?

 

What matters is he is not as into you as you are to him.  Are you ok with that? You're distracting yourself from the real and important issue which is that. Does he meet your standards of what you want in a relationship? Do you want someone who is as into you as you are into them? As committed to you as you are to them?  He is telling you that is not what you two have however you twist yourself into a pretzel telling yourself it's just about definitions.  If he meets your personal standards for a romantic committed relationship it's all good.  Most people would not settle for a partner who is not that into them and not as into them as they are into the other.

[waffle]

4 hours ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

You're right, there are varying definitions of what I'm asking.

For me personally I would like to be in love with my partner. I've had the flip side of that, lack of passion, sexual chemistry etc and I don't like being on that side of the fence. This I know for sure.

Because there are so many different definitions of being in love, or even loving someone for that matter, he could be in love by MY definition of it. If that makes sense LOL

I think it is important to find out what his definition of in love is. It means different things to different people.

 

He has been clear with you that you don't meet his definition of being in love.  What that actual definition is, is irrelevant.  He has said, "I have been in love with someone one time, and that person is not you."  It doesn't matter if it's you pressing the issue or he's volunteering the info, when a partner specifically says they love you but are not in love with you, he is saying that for a specific reason.  He doesn't want you to get the wrong idea, and unfortunately you are getting the wrong idea with assuming he is in love anyway despite him being very clear he is not.

[DarkCh0c0]

3 minutes ago, waffle said:

He has said, "I have been in love with someone one time, and that person is not you." 

Damn this stings. I wouldn't be able personally to stay with someone after saying that to me.

[waffle]

1 minute ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

Damn this stings. I wouldn't be able personally to stay with someone after saying that to me.

Same, and that would be (and is) a 100% instant dealbreaker for me (but not for everyone, and that's fine).  The problem is once a woman (or man) settles for a relationship where their partner specifically tells them they are not in love with them, despite how "happy" they are in that relationship and how great the person treats them, the natural inclination is to try to get them to fall in love.  OP is already doing that by pressing the issue every so often, to see if he has fallen in love yet (i.e. are her efforts paying off yet?).  I promise this does not work.

[SleepyOwl1969]

Thank to everyone for your opinions on my situation. Much appreciated. 

[Cherylyn]

20 hours ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

He on the other hand, says that he's not in love with me although he loves me. Now, by nature he is an EXTREMELY cautious person when it comes to relationships because of his past. So it takes him a lot longer to get to certain places in a relationship than I would. 

That being said, I'm actually wondering if he does feel these things but just doesn't admit it to me out loud. So I'm not sure if he's actually not feeling it or if he feels it but it's just afraid to say it. 

I guess what I should be asking him is what his definition of being in love is. From my recollection I think he said he has only been in love once in his life. 🤷‍♀️

 

Thank you for your kind words, SleepyOwl1969.  😊

To me, I think being "in love" is the initial stage of attraction to someone and the honeymoon phase of a relationship.  Then over time, "in love" transitions to loving a person always instead of the rush of hot to warm to cool.  To love someone is consistent; not the high of being in love.  Eventually you'll come back down to Earth from that high and love is steady, steadfast and unwavering.

For me, whenever my husband does extra for me ❤️  whether it was taking care errands which could've been postponed, extra chores, buying me a little surprise gift I had my eye on for years but always hesitated to purchase, left me something to eat in the refrigerator which he prepared himself,  took care of phone calls or appointments, makes me fall in love with him all over again.  I had never known a man who gave so much of himself to his wife.  I'm sure there are many.  However, I know he is a rare gem.

As for you, I'd be very alarmed if a man told me he's not in love with me yet he loves me.  I feel as if he's giving me mixed messages which is quite confusing.  He doesn't gush over me but he loves me anyway?  He's not in love with me but wait,  he'll do me a 'huge' favor by loving me?  Gee, thanks.  Should I feel grateful for any spare love he can give me and should I feel grateful for crumbs? 🥺 A man telling you that he's not in love with you but he loves you is a backhanded compliment.  It's a rather cynical comment.  What I would really question is his lack of consideration for you.  It's one thing to think this and keep this thought to himself and another to actually say that quote to you and make you feel not that wonderful all the while.  He lacks discretion.  You shouldn't even have to question the difference between the two meanings because it's irrelevant.  His nerve to say this to you in the first place is a red flag because normal people don't say something which has a negative ding to it if they profess to love you.  He's tricky and complex.  I'd be wary if I were you.

I've never scrutinized the difference between "in love" and "love."  To me, you either love someone or you don't. 

He has only been in love once in his life and it's  not  you.  That would sting a lot.  I'm sorry.

 

[MissCanuck]

1 hour ago, Cherylyn said:

He has only been in love once in his life and it's  not  you.  That would sting a lot.

Yes, that's just it.

He knows what "in love" feels like for him, OP. And he's been honest that he doesn't feel that for you. He has his own concept of this feeling and unforunately that's not the connection he feels in this relationship. 

 

[SleepyOwl1969]

3 hours ago, Cherylyn said:

Thank you for your kind words, SleepyOwl1969.  😊

To me, I think being "in love" is the initial stage of attraction to someone and the honeymoon phase of a relationship.  Then over time, "in love" transitions to loving a person always instead of the rush of hot to warm to cool.  To love someone is consistent; not the high of being in love.  Eventually you'll come back down to Earth from that high and love is steady, steadfast and unwavering.

For me, whenever my husband does extra for me ❤️  whether it was taking care errands which could've been postponed, extra chores, buying me a little surprise gift I had my eye on for years but always hesitated to purchase, left me something to eat in the refrigerator which he prepared himself,  took care of phone calls or appointments, makes me fall in love with him all over again.  I had never known a man who gave so much of himself to his wife.  I'm sure there are many.  However, I know he is a rare gem.

As for you, I'd be very alarmed if a man told me he's not in love with me yet he loves me.  I feel as if he's giving me mixed messages which is quite confusing.  He doesn't gush over me but he loves me anyway?  He's not in love with me but wait,  he'll do me a 'huge' favor by loving me?  Gee, thanks.  Should I feel grateful for any spare love he can give me and should I feel grateful for crumbs? 🥺 A man telling you that he's not in love with you but he loves you is a backhanded compliment.  It's a rather cynical comment.  What I would really question is his lack of consideration for you.  It's one thing to think this and keep this thought to himself and another to actually say that quote to you and make you feel not that wonderful all the while.  He lacks discretion.  You shouldn't even have to question the difference between the two meanings because it's irrelevant.  His nerve to say this to you in the first place is a red flag because normal people don't say something which has a negative ding to it if they profess to love you.  He's tricky and complex.  I'd be wary if I were you.

I've never scrutinized the difference between "in love" and "love."  To me, you either love someone or you don't. 

He has only been in love once in his life and it's  not  you.  That would sting a lot.  I'm sorry.

 

Thank you for your reply. 

I don't think he lacks discretion. Remember, it was me who pushed him for the answer. He was being honest with me and I need to appreciate that. Whether or not it's what I want to hear I still should appreciate the fact that he was honest. 🤷‍♀️ 

You said that you don't scrutinize between being in love and love. And a friend of mine is like that. She knows she loves her husband but doesn't differentiate between in love and love. Either she loves someone ( in this case her husband) in a romantic way and feels connected or she doesn't. There is no distinction between being in love and loving.

The woman he was with that he was in love with; their relationship lasted 4 years. I don't know at what point he fell in love with her. Was it early on? Was it later? I don't know I've never asked him.

And yes I understand that it would sting. It does for me and I'm sure it would for many people. 

[SleepyOwl1969]

2 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

Yes, that's just it.

He knows what "in love" feels like for him, OP. And he's been honest that he doesn't feel that for you. He has his own concept of this feeling and unforunately that's not the connection he feels in this relationship. 

 

Yes. I understand that.

I'm just trying to wrap my head around all of this information that I'm getting here. 

[Batya33]

14 minutes ago, SleepyOwl1969 said:

The woman he was with that he was in love with; their relationship lasted 4 years. I don't know at what point he fell in love with her. Was it early on? Was it later? I don't know I've never asked him.

Don't ask -it's irrelevant and it's intrusive.  I'm sorry.