Opinions, please?

[Heather Dawn]

Hi everyone,

 

I've been with my current employer for almost two years. It's been a bit of a roller-coaster due to the fact that it was a start-up and the two co-founders had never run a company before. Couple that with it being almost entirely men (currently two women [including me] and six men) and very young (I'm the oldest at 39; there are three others aged 30-34 and four aged 21-29), and it's been a bit of a battle due to poor management, and the fact that it's definitely a boys' club. There have even been moments where one of my bosses has yelled at me and crossed boundaries in terms of being mad at me for not wanting to do something in my personal life that he wanted me to do and for which he'd offered to pay (Landmark Forum which, in my opinion, is basically a cult).

 

At the same time, it's had its decent moments and - most importantly - I love my clients, so I've stuck it out. But I work sometimes 10 hours a day, I try to be available to my clients even after-hours and on weekends for emergencies, and I've given a lot of myself to this company. It never seems to be enough, however. (I was once at a Ren Faire with my boyfriend on a Saturday, and when a minor issue came up with a client, I was on the phone and emailing with him from the Faire. Weeks later, during my performance eval, instead of that incident being a positive, I was scolded for not writing longer, more substantive emails to the client...from the Ren Faire.)

 

Anyway, about three months ago I'd finally reached a breaking point and had become so disgusted with the way things are run that, when I was headhunted (which happens a lot), I actually went for the interview (typically I've said thanks but no thanks). After a process that lasted a few weeks, I was offered the job. When I went to one of my bosses (the other was out of town and I had to give notice right away because the new job needed me to give a start date), he panicked and asked if I would be open to a counter offer. I said yes (WHY DID I DO THAT??) and the next day, he and my other boss (who called in) offered me a $10k/year raise to stay. Also, they agreed to let me shift my hours from 8:00-5:00 (though I usually was there even earlier and left late) to 7:30-4:30 in order to give me a little extra time in the evening to study (I'm also in school).

 

So I agreed to stay.

 

Two months went by and I was at work at 7:20 every morning. I even stayed till 5pm a few times. One morning, I arrived at 7:32 and got called into a meeting to be reprimanded for being two minutes late. I'm not even kidding.

 

Another month went by and I had a business trip come up last week. In the week leading up to it, one of the bosses had scheduled a volunteer night for a Tuesday. I begged off because I had two weeks of school to cram into one week in order to be ahead of the game for the business trip. I've made every other volunteer night (we do it every other month), though I left a half-hour early once because of a migraine. I've also attended every other team dinner, team outing, etc. That Friday, I left at my usual 4:30 and went next door to get my nails done. Again - I'd been there since 7:30 (everyone else arrived at 9am), didn't take lunch, and have never done anything but go straight home to study until this day.

 

So the trip was last week. I return to work today (after working from home Mon and Tues due to a health issue) and basically only one person says boo to me. No one asks how I'm feeling or says hello except for one co-worker and the two bosses. I leave for a client visit that takes pretty much all day and when I return, am pulled into a meeting with the bosses which basically goes like this:

 

Everyone is mad at you, you didn't go to the volunteer night, but you got your nails done next door on Friday while we were all working, and no one thinks you're a team player. In fact, we don't think you make the same effort as everyone else.

 

WHAT???

 

These were exact words, except spoken with a nasty tone and there was much more said that I don't even feel like printing here. Basically, nothing I do for them is enough or GOOD enough and they make sure to remind me of that frequently. I've begun having migraines often again, which I hadn't in years, and I'm always stressed out. I feel like on my days off, I still have part of my brain tuned to work in case I need to jump for them. No one else gets treated this way. The graphic designers often log 5-6 hours a day, the other account managers make huge mistakes that are laughed off or joked about while I make a tiny mistake and get yelled at (in front of everyone).

 

I was hoping to make it two years, but I think I'm finally down for the count. Am I crazy?

[alli]

I would leave. I'd probably line up another one before leaving though it sounds like you get offers for interviews fairly often anyway.

 

Did they forget that 4:30 is the time you get off work? I don't understand why they would treat you this way but still panic when you said you were leaving for a new job.

[j.man]

Yeah screw that. Are you getting OT for all these hours? I've never nor will I ever negotiate a contract that doesn't stipulate extra pay for going over 40 hours.

 

Regardless, you're unappreciated to say the least and it sounds like they're using the raise to justify having to bend over backwards. The inexperience of your bosses shows with every meeting you describe with them.

 

I would have lined something up and left ages ago or renegotiated a contract that made any of this remotely worth the hassle.

[Heather Dawn]

I would leave. I'd probably line up another one before leaving though it sounds like you get offers for interviews fairly often anyway.

 

Did they forget that 4:30 is the time you get off work? I don't understand why they would treat you this way but still panic when you said you were leaving for a new job.

 

I actually got approached again today on LinkedIn by a well-known marketing company - they're calling me tomorrow.

 

And no idea. I honestly think I'm their punching bag. It's funny because this morning, I said to my boyfriend, "Well, I'm going back to work today - I'm sure I'll be in trouble for something."

[Heather Dawn]

Yeah screw that. Are you getting OT for all these hours? I've never nor will I ever negotiate a contract that doesn't stipulate extra pay for going over 40 hours.

 

Regardless, you're unappreciated to say the least and it sounds like they're using the raise to justify having to bend over backwards. The inexperience of your bosses shows with every meeting you describe with them.

 

I would have lined something up and left ages ago or renegotiated a contract that made any of this remotely worth the hassle.

 

I TOTALLY regret not taking the job offer I was given in the summer. Needless to say, I'm about to start searching again - and was approached today on LinkedIn by a large company. They're calling me tomorrow.

 

My boyfriend is SO livid - he already loathes the for their treatment of me, but now he's just foaming at the mouth.

 

Oh, and no OT - I'm salaried.

[alli]

I feel lucky that I got a lot of experience in the military being in charge of things and observing good leaders. I think the best ones are those that recognize their good workers. Not just awards but telling them when they are doing a good job and not jumping down your throat when you need to arrive late or leave early every once in a while. People that work their butt off and produce results have earned the right to have a little flexibility I think. And when good employees are treated well, they will work even harder for you.

 

I've experienced the opposite in civilian jobs. The exact attitude your bosses have is the one that drives good employees away.

[ParisPaulette]

It's time to go. Even the possibility of losing you isn't enough to make these people keep their manners in. And yes, I have been there in your shoes exactly right down to the being criticized for getting my nails done on my personal time instead of a volunteer fundraiser, never mind I was the only one who was always there for those and raised more funds than anyone else. Oh yeah, and not doing MORE for a client on the one day off I'd had in months when I got called in a panic to handle a client who the boss had upset.

 

Remember, if you're being headhunted and these guys were willing to at least go through the motions of keeping you then it means you are very, very good at your job. Remember that since they seem to have forgotten it. Smile sweetly, and nod then keep doing your job. If you can maybe go to the company who wanted you in the first place and ask them if the position is still open plus yeah, check out the other job offer.

 

At this point it is time to get out of Dodge. This sort of thing tends to happen when less competent bosses decide a very competent employee should be a scapegoat, plus yeah they likely are just too idiotic to realize they should actually treat their employees well if they want to keep them. And screw the two weeks notice. They'll just make your life a living hell and you have already gone well above and beyond for them.

 

Let them reap what they have sown. And while you're at it, considering you're good enough to be being headhunted in this economy, maybe at some point you should consider opening your own business. Seriously, it is a sign you are very good at your job and very valuable.

[Heather Dawn]

I feel lucky that I got a lot of experience in the military being in charge of things and observing good leaders. I think the best ones are those that recognize their good workers. Not just awards but telling them when they are doing a good job and not jumping down your throat when you need to arrive late or leave early every once in a while. People that work their butt off and produce results have earned the right to have a little flexibility I think. And when good employees are treated well, they will work even harder for you.

 

I've experienced the opposite in civilian jobs. The exact attitude your bosses have is the one that drives good employees away.

 

You said it! The funny thing is, they think they're amazing. Anytime anyone says anything even playfully about wishing they were on vacation or something, they get offended and say, "You guys have it great here. We're very generous to you." Uh, no...

[Heather Dawn]

Thank you so much for this.

 

They have me constantly questioning my abilities, my work ethic, everything. And while I had a brief upswing in my confidence after the raise to keep me, it was quickly smashed. They'll be in a lot of trouble when I leave, though. The one thing they always say is that I am, far and away, the best with the clients. I have a client load of 20, and many who refuse to deal with anyone but me - even if I'm out and there's an emergency. My clients call me just to say hello, or welcome back from vacation. So I can't wait till they find themselves without that kind of connection those clients once I leave.

 

I'd love to start my own business. I'm back in school for PR and Advertising - I'd love to have my own agency at some point.

 

And by the way - that's crazy that you were in almost exactly the same situation! I can't believe that!

[alli]

I've dated people like that. Hypercritical of others but hypersensitive to criticism themselves.

[gaseousclay]

Definitely leave. And for the love of god, if they try to keep you and make another counter offer tell them thanks but no thanks. No amount of money is worth being treated like a doormat

 

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[Heather Dawn]

I've dated people like that. Hypercritical of others but hypersensitive to criticism themselves.

 

Yessssss. My job is like a bad relationship.

[Heather Dawn]

Definitely leave. And for the love of god, if they try to keep you and make another counter offer tell them thanks but no thanks. No amount of money is worth being treated like a doormat

 

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Totally agree! I'm done for sure this time.

[toby17]

All relationships are fundamentally the same - you love this job but it doesn't love you back or treat you well. You shouldn't have stayed. It's like deciding to leave your bf and then staying because he promises to be better and then being surprised when things go back to normal.

 

People who give employment advice always say not to accept a counteroffer. Simply google "counteroffer job".

 

But what's done is none.

 

Now, find another job and leave.

[Heather Dawn]

I'm going to google that right now! Thanks!

 

I'm also taking what I think is my first actual sick day in almost two years (meaning not working from home while sick, but actually turning off).

[ParisPaulette]

And by the way - that's crazy that you were in almost exactly the same situation! I can't believe that!

 

I know I read that and I was like, "Wow, wonder if she works for the same organization?" But my bosses were all women. I got the added pleasure of them crowing whenever I had a bad hair day or my ankles swelled.

 

Also, some of those clients will likely try and follow you if you go elsewhere into a similar business. Certainly they're going to be POed. You don't, of course, have to say anything to them and probably shouldn't if you ever signed any sort of agreements not to poach the company's clients. But the fact is people will quite possibly come searching for you on their own.

 

You are extremely competent and they know it. They also know you won't say anything against them, so they feel free to sharpen their claws. Maybe it's time to stop putting in that extra effort, come in when your agreed upon schedule said you could. Do your job and no one else's. And the next time someone says something smile sweetly and say, "Well, that wasn't what we agreed on when someone else offered me another position now was it. But if you aren't happy with my work I can always go see who else might enjoy having a person that's good with clients?" Leave it as a question and turn and walk away.

 

Or if you can afford it, and have some bleep you money set aside maybe it's time to just walk in with a letter of resignation and the reasons why you are quitting. Then clean out your desk and walk out leaving them holding the bag. It's what I did in the end.

 

Chin up though, remember you are valuable. Go get another job ASAP and like I said even contact that previous company and ask them if they still have a position open. If they ask what happened take the higher road and just explain, "Well, I was concerned about my clients, but they seem in good hands now so I feel confident I can move on to your company. I'm ready for new challenges." It casts you in a very good light. You cared about your clients, which you did and every employer likes to hear about that.

 

It also lets you act surprised and a bit hurt if your ex=employees bad mouth you. "Gee, I'm really sad to hear that. They loved my work and always sang my praises to me. I was trusted with their top clients, so I'm not sure why they have a problem with me that I'm just now hearing about. Oh well, hey about..." And that's all you need to say or do as it sinks in on the other person, "Oh, sour grapes. They're angry you came to work for me." Really, it's a far, far better tactic than getting angry or defensive.

 

Just my two cents having been there. I used that one on a client who had followed me into a new business venture who was all set to walk away after my former boss "imparted some information" to her about me when the two saw each other at a convention. It was all lies of course about how incompetent I'd been. After I said that my client settled down and said, "Oh, I never liked your ex-boss anyways."

 

We still laugh about that sometimes. Good luck in your job search, it's time to spread those competent wings and fly.

[Heather Dawn]

Again, thank you!

 

I actually called in "sick" today - I just desperately needed a mental health day, I had the time, and in the nearly two years of working I've only taken ONE (maybe) actual sick day. (The other infrequent times I've not made it to the office, like earlier this week, I've worked a full day from home.) So my bosses called me, all sweetness and light, knowing that this was a bad sign - and suddenly they're working on something for me (creating a new position, I believe) that they think will "make [me] very happy!"

 

So here we go again. This time, since this is happening so quickly and I don't have another job lined up yet, I'll go with it - and secretly keep searching for something new. I'm tired of renting my soul to them.

[mhowe]

I would also call the company that offered you the job that you turned down. Explain that they countered and because you valued your clients, you stayed on. Explain that they pulled a bait and switch ---- and that you aren't staying.

 

That you totally understand if they are no longer interested, but that you are again actively looking and appreciate their original interest.

 

Life is too short to have migraines associated with work. I did it --- dream job turned to job from hell with management change. Tried to stick it out for a year --- quit it and my mom's response was "Oh thank God --- I thought you were going to have a stroke".

[Heather Dawn]

I would also call the company that offered you the job that you turned down. Explain that they countered and because you valued your clients, you stayed on. Explain that they pulled a bait and switch ---- and that you aren't staying.

 

That you totally understand if they are no longer interested, but that you are again actively looking and appreciate their original interest.

 

Life is too short to have migraines associated with work. I did it --- dream job turned to job from hell with management change. Tried to stick it out for a year --- quit it and my mom's response was "Oh thank God --- I thought you were going to have a stroke".

 

Exactly. No job is worth that kind of blow to one's health - physical or otherwise.

 

I did reach out to the other company but haven't heard back yet. That said, I had a great phone interview today with the recruiter who found me on LinkedIn, and I'm going for an in-person interview on Weds. I'll have to think up a lie to get the day off, but I don't particularly care at this point.

[sleepingdonut]

It's pretty much never a good idea to take a counter offer.

[sleepingdonut]

This is a good thread on it:

[Heather Dawn]

It's pretty much never a good idea to take a counter offer.

 

I googled it yesterday and, yup, now I know. Wish I had bothered to research that sooner!

[sleepingdonut]

I googled it yesterday and, yup, now I know. Wish I had bothered to research that sooner!

 

Once you move to a new company and get a chance to start over, you can put all these bad memories behind you. Sorry you had to deal with it all.

[Heather Dawn]

Once you move to a new company and get a chance to start over, you can put all these bad memories behind you. Sorry you had to deal with it all.

 

Thanks so much. Everything's a lesson, right?

[toby17]

I would also call the company that offered you the job that you turned down. Explain that they countered and because you valued your clients, you stayed on. Explain that they pulled a bait and switch ---- and that you aren't staying.

 

I wouldn't do this. They could decide you're a flip-flopper, that you have bad judgment, and that you're desperate.

 

I did reach out to the other company but haven't heard back yet.

 

If you dump your new bf to go back to an ex, the new bf should never take you back. Neither should the new company. You just need to forget about that job.

 

That said, I had a great phone interview today with the recruiter who found me on LinkedIn, and I'm going for an in-person interview on Weds.

 

Btw: have you thought about going out on your own? As a consultant?

 

I'll have to think up a lie to get the day off, but I don't particularly care at this point.

 

Can't you just make up an appointment, meeting or late lunch?

 

(Ps. If your avatar is your real pic, I'd probably change it to something more anonymous or change the privacy settings. Same for your location - I'd suggest hiding or deleting that entirely.)