Why being shy and unattractive sucks!

[al7]

On the subject of confidence, I worry that the line between confidence and self-delusion can be a bit blurry at times. I was out last night with a French chap that works in my lab. He's a nice guy, but he is 46, and, to be honest, looks more like 50. But he keeps chasing young women!! ....... Now here's the thing, yes he is very confident, but by God did he look like a fool. I really really don't want to behave like that.

 

Oh by the way, last night I took you good people's advice and was all smiley and tried to make eye contact with various women, but to no effect.

If someone had even just smiled, well heck I probably wouldn't have done anything, but it would have been like a drop of rain on the arid desert of my confidence. Ah well. The drought continues.

 

1. You know, if his approach works... you should not worry about if that is moral and smart or not. It works. If it doesnt, they guy just a fool I guess or got drunk and goofing around...

2. Man, you expect too much.... you smile to a girl and she is supposed to to what to you? Were you looking just for a smile? if yes, how many smiles you have given to girls that day? Maybe it is just a mattar of statistics: 3-7 smiles is not enough, but 10-20 would do it.

[al7]

Hey Corvidae,

I seriously dont think there is anything at all wrong with your looks and I read your other posts and I think you seem like a great guy and seem like a good catch, if you lived in my town I think a lot of my friends would be interested in a guy like you. Maybe the problem is you are focusing too much on getting a girlfriend.

 

I guess it might be right...

By the way where do girls of your town go to meet guys? are there any specific favorite places?

[corvidae]

He's 45 years old and he hits on very pretty women in their 20's...of course his approach doesn't work! It's not so much a strategy as a Kamikaze manoeuvre. I very much hope his was just goofing around!

 

Erm...the whole 'smiling at girls' thing was just to see if they'd smile back. I suppose I was trying to look for positive signals by sending out some of my own first. I don't believe that we should rely on signals, but they can be a positive first step, so I thought I'd try to get some bouncing around...no luck though.

[Shidoshi]

I'd say continue doing what your doing with the smiling and making eye contact, in fact, make it a habit. Like other people have said, your definitely not an unattractive guy, just really shy.

 

I remember when I was a bit younger thinking that I was unattractive in some way, and/or was giving off some weird vibe about myself because girls would seem shy and indifferent towards me (even though some girls would say I was cute). Later I realized that I was misinterpreting their signals.

 

I was in a grocery store checkout line and observed a young female (cute) cashier greeting everyone as she scanned their items. It didn't seem to matter what race, age, etc, the customers were, she was being pleasant to everyone. I made eye contact with her once before it was my turn to pay, but it was just a glance and I didn't think anything of it. When it was my turn to pay for my items, she just looked down towards the register the WHOLE TIME, she even gave me my change without so much as moving her head.

 

She never greeted me, or even looked at me (I could have said hello, but I like to make EC before hand). I was actually quite angered by this because I thought she was being rude for no reason. Later I talked to some people about it, and through other experiences of my own I realized that some women are very shy around people they're attracted to. Sometimes its to the point where they're uncomfortable. You may even be experiencing this in some way, just a thought.

[mjctraider]

Well I know how the original poster of this topic feels, because I feel the same way. I'm shy and think that I too am ugly and feel like I'll never find a girl that likes me. I'm 27 never been kissed, never kissed a girla dn never had a real date in my life let alone a girlfriend. So I know how you feel. I know what it is like for the girls to talk to talk "good looking" guys and ignore guys like me. Happens everywhere I go.

[al7]

Well I know how the original poster of this topic feels, because I feel the same way. I'm shy and think that I too am ugly and feel like I'll never find a girl that likes me. I'm 27 never been kissed, never kissed a girla dn never had a real date in my life let alone a girlfriend. So I know how you feel. I know what it is like for the girls to talk to talk "good looking" guys and ignore guys like me. Happens everywhere I go.

 

Well, did you try to do anything about it?

Did you think of approaching more girls.. online dating.. fast dating...

pulic speaking classes? If yes, what are the results?

[mjctraider]

Tried online dating and girls find me repulsive and I can't find the inner strength to approach a girl. Basically I have no self-esteem and no self-cofidence. I lost them both somewhere along the way in my poor pathetic excuse for a life.

[ShySoul]

mjctraider,

 

It's not how you look, its how you act. You say you have low confidence and esteem. Girls pick up on that and won't be interested in someone who seems like there a downer all the time. Don't be worried about girls right now, work on yourself. Find something in life that your passionate about and through yourself into that. Do things you like to do, take up a fun hobby. Once you start enjoying yourself you'll see that you are a good person and are not ugly or live a pathetic life. Once the confidence picks up, then girls will be more likely to find you attractive.

[al7]

Tried online dating and girls find me repulsive and I can't find the inner strength to approach a girl. Basically I have no self-esteem and no self-cofidence. I lost them both somewhere along the way in my poor pathetic excuse for a life.

 

OK, thats what you did.

Are you currently doing anything about it?

I am no confident man, but I try to do something.

[mjctraider]

I've tried, but after getting rejected by girl after girl and so on and so on I've jsut given up hope really. I mean I don't want to sound pathetic and have everyone try and tell me what to do and tell me to go up to a girl and say hi. I've heard it all and i'm tired of it. I know what to do just don't have the motivation to do it anymore.

[al7]

I've tried, but after getting rejected by girl after girl and so on and so on I've jsut given up hope really. I mean I don't want to sound pathetic and have everyone try and tell me what to do and tell me to go up to a girl and say hi. I've heard it all and i'm tired of it. I know what to do just don't have the motivation to do it anymore.

 

You posed an interesting question: what to do when you lost your motivation? When you feel you got frustrated and burnt enough that you

are just scared to do anything... How to recover?

[Caldus]

That's very simple. If you're not motivated to do something, then you just simply aren't going to do it. thereforeeee, the only way to "recover" from it would be to realize that if you want certain things in life then you need to be motivated to work for them.

[al7]

That's very simple. If you're not motivated to do something, then you just simply aren't going to do it. thereforeeee, the only way to "recover" from it would be to realize that if you want certain things in life then you need to be motivated to work for them.

 

Look, I have a good example: for some reason my laptop started to strike me with some electricity.. ok. I didnt pay attention.

It did Again and again. It hurts, but i didnt do anything.

Eventually... I started to be a bit scared of even touching it.

You see my point? I am motivated to do something, I am motivated to fix the situation but I just dont know how. And looking for some solutions.

[Caldus]

That is different than not having motivation in the first place. To answer your question, we've all answered that quite enough now. I really don't know what else to suggest. Maybe if you be more specific about what you're scared of then we can try to help.

[Shidoshi]

Think of it like this, what do you have to offer the other person in order to attract them to you? You already know what attracts "your" attention, but try to see it from the other side. When you are very shy and have low self-esteem it can be sensed by others around you, and that in itself makes you unattractive. You have to have an "I don't give a **** about what other people think" type of attitude, and go after what you want, no matter how many times you fail. In fact, don't look at them as failures, but learned lessons.

 

The absolute first thing you have to do is change your attitude from a cynical one, to a realistic one. Look at the guys you see are successful with women and ask yourself honestly, "what can I do to increase my chances of success with women."

 

I've seen MANY guys, who I would say are unattractive, with pretty hot looking women. How do they do it? Get out there and find out.

[al7]

Think of it like this, what do you have to offer the other person in order to attract them to you? You already know what attracts "your" attention, but try to see it from the other side. When you are very shy and have low self-esteem it can be sensed by others around you, and that in itself makes you unattractive. You have to have an "I don't give a **** about what other people think" type of attitude, and go after what you want, no matter how many times you fail. In fact, don't look at them as failures, but learned lessons.

"

 

What I am attracted to? A cure girl. Talkative and extroverted.

I am an introvert. Should I try to pretedn I am an extrovert too?

 

How to develop this attitude of "dont care what they think"? It seems I lose it when I approach people. Scared they would laugh at me.

It is worry that doesnt even have any logic, still most worries are like that...any odea how to overcome it?

[Shidoshi]

I completely understand where your coming from because I was like you at one time, still am to some extent, but I have had to actively change my way of thinking to break through the shyness barrier. I don't think I'll ever be completely over my shyness because its just a part of who I am, but I have found ways to over come it so it doesn't have a negative affect on my life.

 

Basically, you have to put yourself out there and be vulnerable. It sounds uncomfortable and sometimes it is, but YOU HAVE TO DO IT. After you've made a habit of it you will slowly become used to it. By this I mean you have to start acting on your feelings more. Make small talk with people, checkout clerk at the store, coworkers, anybody. Talking to people, especially people you don't know very well or at all, is the best way to practice this.

 

Everybody won't react to you in the same way, but thats when you put on the "I don't give a **** attitude". You don't have time to deal with other people's problems and personal issues, it just drains your positive energy. Thats where I'd start if I was you, trust me, the best way to get over your fears is to face them head-on. You know deep down inside that there is no other way to overcome this unless you step up to the plate.

[al7]

Man, I did realize this attitude is cool. The question is now HOW to get it? To develop it? To reinforce?

How did you do it? I understand there is not magick pill for it.

But certainly there are some thing would help.

[Shidoshi]

You have to not care about what people think so much, thats where it starts. Of course you care about the impression you make on people, but at the same time you have to be able to express yourself without fear that someone might not like what you have to say.

 

I like all kinds of music: jazz, pop, rock, classical, blues, etc. Most of my friends and family don't have the same taste in music that I have, in fact, I haven't met anyone who is as open-minded about music as I am. But I refuse to change my mind about music because I could care less that I'm in the minority. I don't keep up with a lot of popculture, not purposely, but I just don't watch a whole lot of TV and what not (practicing a musical instrument can be very time consuming).

 

I don't join in on conversations about pro football, basketball etc, because I don't watch it (I do watch pro boxing though, pride fighting, etc). Some people consider me to be a geek because I like video games (don't really play sports games, which some people think are cool simply because "sports" are involved).

 

What I'm getting at is you have to start respecting who you are and what your about, otherwise why would anyone else? My girlfriend doesn't like a lot of the stuff I do, but she knows "I don't give a ****" We get along great because there is mutual respect between her and I, and I make it clear that I won't put up with any BS from her if she tries to change me.

 

Start respecting your individuality dude, thats the first step.

[al7]

I don't join in on conversations about pro football, basketball etc, because I don't watch it (I do watch pro boxing though, pride fighting, etc). Some people consider me to be a geek because I like video games (don't really play sports games, which some people think are cool simply because "sports" are involved).

 

What I'm getting at is you have to start respecting who you are and what your about, otherwise why would anyone else? My girlfriend doesn't like a lot of the stuff I do, but she knows "I don't give a ****" We get along great because there is mutual respect between her and I, and I make it clear that I won't put up with any BS from her if she tries to change me.

 

Start respecting your individuality dude, thats the first step.

 

I see you your point. In fact I share similar attitude about my preferences in conversations\sports etc etc.

But in this things we do not really expect anything from other people: we dont like sports so what? no one is gonna reject us based on this.

Or we dont like say jazz. No one is gonna judge us based on solely this thing.

In dating\approaching it is different...we do expect somehting.. we expect her to like us, in fact we star a convo in order to make her like us a bit to continue further...And we are gonna be judged by her anyway.

These too "expect" and "be judged" makes situation worse.

You see my point?

[Shidoshi]

we dont like sports so what? no one is gonna reject us based on this.

Thats not necessarily true, people judge everything about you, they may not come outright with it, but they still make assumptions about your character based on your likes and dislikes.

Or we dont like say jazz. No one is gonna judge us based on solely this thing.

Again, people do, but it depends on the person as to what the outcome might be. They may not care, or think you aren't cool because of it. A friend's mother overheard me talking about Stanley Clark, Al di Meola, etc (jazz musicians), and was impressed with the fact that I knew of them and enjoyed their music. This was a positive response, but you can get the exact opposite from anyone else.

In dating\approaching it is different...we do expect somehting.. we expect her to like us, in fact we star a convo in order to make her like us a bit to continue further

Thats just it, you shouldn't expect anything. I mean, if she likes you great, if not, NO BIG DEAL. Having these "expectations" is where you run into trouble. Go into it with curiosity but don't "expect" anything because you may end up VERY disappointed. Of course you want the girl your attracted to to like you, but DO NOT EXPECT IT. You set yourself up for a hard fall when things don't pan out.

These too "expect" and "be judged" makes situation worse.

Exactly!!! Thats a perfect time to adopt the "I don't give a **** attitude"

You see, both men and women can sense insecurity, some are very sensitive to it, and if you display those traits you will not be successful. Everybody has insecurities, but when you let them control you it really messes up your opportunites. The reason I keep bringing up insecurity and confidence is because these traits can be subtle, and VERY STRONG at the same time.

 

When you have confidence in yourself, it shows, when your insecure, it shows, but only one will help and the other will always hurt you in the dating game. It really isn't about being nice or a jerk, its about being confident in your abilities, thats what works. You won't win them all, but you can damn sure increase your chances ten fold.

[Kyoshiro Ogari]

You see, what I write in my post is how I feel about myself, but I do not in any way act this way around a woman I like, or a woman in general. I hold my head up, walk with a smile and with assurance, but all the while with a sense of approachability. I laugh, make jokes, give compliments, the whole kit-n-kaboodle. My normal face is pleasant. I smile sometimes if I pass someone.

 

My theory will be put to the test next week. My department hired a new guy today, a very good looking guy. I am going to see how the women react to him and compare it to how they reacted to me when I first worked. Even a few today said he was a good looking guy, so he has a head start. I feel threatened because there is this girl at my job who I am so crazy about, and I cannot talk to her because I get so nervous that my head gets light. For 3 years I've tried desperately to approach her but I just can't because I know she'll think I am an ugly creep with a crush on her. And now I am afraid that I will be nothing in her eyes compared to the new guy. Why couldn't I be blessed with good looks, something that can give me confidence. The whole confidence issue... well my best friend walks like he has issues with the world, and he gets women falling all over him. I walk with a better air and I get nothing. NOTHING!

 

How many women say, "Oh this really nice guy with a hot personality was checking me out today?" or "This really ugly guy with a great sense of humor thinks I'm hot." No, you hear things like, "He's checking me out? Wow, he's cute." Even if this guy turns out to be a jerk, he gets a chance with this girl. Ugly guys at the club with smiles on their faces and dancing up a storm get rejected left and right. They don't even give him a chance to find out if he's sweet or not because he's ugly. Good looking guys can do whatever and they get their chances. Oh forget it I give up!!

[al7]

These too "expect" and "be judged" makes situation worse.

Exactly!!! Thats a perfect time to adopt the "I don't give a **** attitude"

You see, both men and women can sense insecurity, some are very sensitive to it, and if you display those traits you will not be successful. Everybody has insecurities, but when you let them control you it really messes up your opportunites. The reason I keep bringing up insecurity and confidence is because these traits can be subtle, and VERY STRONG at the same time.

 

When you have confidence in yourself, it shows, when your insecure, it shows, but only one will help and the other will always hurt you in the dating game. It really isn't about being nice or a jerk, its about being confident in your abilities, thats what works. You won't win them all, but you can damn sure increase your chances ten fold.

 

I think no one is arguing about to have high or low expectations anymore.

To care or not, to adop "I don't give a **** attitude or not.

Now it is a time to get a closer look.

How to DO THAT?

have to adopt this attitude? what if in a presense of a girl stranger I seem lose most of my confidence and suddenly start to care??

what should I do... what do you do?

How do you reinforce confidence? IHow to do keep it at a decent level?

How you keep your expectations low all the time?

[Shidoshi]

lol, man I've been posting like crazy recently.

Kyoshiro

You see, what I write in my post is how I feel about myself, but I do not in any way act this way around a woman I like, or a woman in general. I hold my head up, walk with a smile and with assurance, but all the while with a sense of approachability. I laugh, make jokes, give compliments, the whole kit-n-kaboodle. My normal face is pleasant. I smile sometimes if I pass someone.

You see here's the thing, even if you "act" like you're confident, sometimes it can work but most times not. Why? because if you don't trully feel that way people WILL pick up on it. Although what you're doing IS a good thing.

My theory will be put to the test next week. My department hired a new guy today, a very good looking guy. I am going to see how the women react to him and compare it to how they reacted to me when I first worked.

I'm pretty sure I'd be curious, but you are making a huge mistake already. In this situation you SHOULD NOT CARE HOW THEY REACT TO HIM. You shouldn't be thinking about this at all, you should be thinking about running your game and nothing else, I guarantee you he could care less.

I feel threatened because there is this girl at my job who I am so crazy about, and I cannot talk to her because I get so nervous that my head gets light. For 3 years I've tried desperately to approach her but I just can't because I know she'll think I am an ugly creep with a crush on her. And now I am afraid that I will be nothing in her eyes compared to the new guy.

Dude, this is NOT GOOD! If you think people, especially women, can't pick up on your insecurity you are sadly mistaken. Feeling threatened by him is absolutely not what you want to be thinking. The reason you get light headed and haven't approached her in 3 years is because you have already defeated yourself. You've placed her on a pedestal above you and this attitude is going to be your down-fall. Do you think this girl would go out with a guy thats been wanting her for 3 years and hasn't made any attempt because he's scared?

Why couldn't I be blessed with good looks, something that can give me confidence.

Did you know that good-looking people can be some of the most "insecure" people around? You have to let go of your appearance, by all means look your best, but stop gauging your attractiveness based on only on your looks, its a dead-end road. You can't tell me you haven't seen couples together where one is very attractive physically and the other is not. I've seen it plenty of times.

The whole confidence issue... well my best friend walks like he has issues with the world, and he gets women falling all over him. I walk with a better air and I get nothing. NOTHING!

You know why? Because he does it with "confidence."

Oh forget it I give up!!

This is exactly why you're in this predicament. You cannot "act" or "pretend" like your confident, you have to believe you are. Giving up is weak, do women want weak men?

[Shidoshi]

al7

You are missing my points. There is no single "technique" or method of becoming confident. It starts from within, you have to look at yourself and your life and realize that you are a great person and any woman that gets an opportunity to be with YOU would be lucky. It really is that simple, but you won't get there unless you start placing strong value on yourself. You have to be consistent, don't be afraid to disagree with others, don't allow people to take advantage of you, be proactive, speak your mind, all these things and more. Its going to take practice, but don't stop because when it becomes a habit you won't even have to think about it, it will come naturally.