Career moms staying home

[journeynow]

This is a difficult situation - you have children and your husband isn't supportive of you staying home with them, even when they are small.

 

One one hand, shouldn't the woman have the freedom to choose, at least to some extent? After all, she is the one who will have to answer to her children for her choices.

On the other hand, the husband should have a say in this as well.

 

You do have a choice. And when your choice affects other people they have a choice in voicing their opinion.

 

But parents don't have to "answer to" their children. Your partnership is with your husband. You are not married to your children, your friends, your friends spouses, your in-laws, your family. This is something to work out with your husband, not your kids.

 

The future is unpredictable, and someday you may need that career in place to support yourself and/or your children. There is value and strength in all of the choices you are contemplating, a career, SAHM, a part time career...

[BrianH46]

I saw that floating around on the Internet and I was baffled. First of all, why are they wasting these people's time? I would have been extremely annoyed if I was interviewed by them. Also, it's from a greeting card company. I don't need validation from a greeting card company that's trying to guilt my husband/kids into wasting their money on overpriced greeting cards.

 

An aside: you seem a little worked up over a video praising the difficulties of motherhood. So I apologize should that video had offend you.

 

Anyways, what strikes me the most is that it seems to me that you didn't consider being a stay at home mom until you saw these professional women choose to do so themselves. Would you honestly enjoy that kind of lifestyle?

 

I am a current med school student and my gf will be enrolling in pharmacy school. So she certainly classifies as a career orientated woman. However she is very maternal, having helped raise younger siblings and cousins before immigrating to the US. She knows she wants to stay at home to raise children once the opportunity presents itself.

 

Did you feel a desire to stay at home before having your perceptions of a professional woman changed?

[Catherine_3]

An aside: you seem a little worked up over a video praising the difficulties of motherhood. So I apologize should that video had offend you.

 

No, it didn't offend me. I just saw it all over facebook and I left like saying that but, of course, couldn't.

 

Anyways, what strikes me the most is that it seems to me that you didn't consider being a stay at home mom until you saw these professional women choose to do so themselves. Would you honestly enjoy that kind of lifestyle?

 

I am a current med school student and my gf will be enrolling in pharmacy school. So she certainly classifies as a career orientated woman. However she is very maternal, having helped raise younger siblings and cousins before immigrating to the US. She knows she wants to stay at home to raise children once the opportunity presents itself.

 

Did you feel a desire to stay at home before having your perceptions of a professional woman changed?

 

It's not that I didn't want to, I just didn't have the option. My husband was doing his PhD.

 

I've always been very maternal, and still am. I grew up taking care of babies and little kids. I worked in a daycare to put myself through my undergrad. I daydream about my girls all day. I breastfed my kids to their second birthday. I'm into attachment parenting. I know all the children in my daughter's grade one class and I volunteer with her school often. I make my daughter's hair in braids and fun up-dos every day, and my husband irons their clothes every morning. I make them a hot breakfast every day before school. Today it was toast and pears and oranges and zucchini fried with Montreal smoked meat and nuts and cheese. Every night I read with my kids, one by one, then lay down and have a long, deep chat about meaningful things such as the relationship dynamics of the lunch room table in grade 1. (Haha, I love it.)

 

Having said that, I think there are things I would hate about being a stay at home mom. Like sweeping the same floor three times every day. And all the dishes. All day. From morning to night.

 

And I'm not unhappy. I guess that's the thing. When I talked to my husband about this last night, he asked, "ok, so how unhappy are you?" and I said, "I'm not unhappy at all. I'm very happy. I love my life." Maybe if I were depressed with the current situation, he would be more open to discussing it. But we're happy and it's working. So that makes it harder to bring up. And I'm not even sure I would want to be a stay at home mom. I guess I'd just like to feel like I made the choice, not someone else making it for me.

[petite]

You can sweep the floor every night it doesn't have to be three times a day. Mother in-law and husband can also help with chores. Just because you'd be a stay at home mother doesn't mean every chore falls on your shoulders.

 

My husband works full-time now, I am still on leave, we have other personal endeavors we are involved in which we both take turns looking after and attending meetings, and we both take care of the house. Just because I don't get dressed up and head to my office every day it doesn't mean every house chore falls on me. He cooks and cleans and always has. With three adults in the house, you, husband and mother in-law there, everyone pulls their weight, you simply wouldn't need to sweep the floor three times yourself.

 

If you're happy with how things are, then you wouldn't have a desire to be a stay at home mother. That's just my take on it. You want to make your husband happy which is fine, and while you do probably love your life, it doesn't seem like you're living it the way you'd prefer, based on this thread. I guess I'm failing to see the need for this thread if you're so happy; if everything is great and if you love your life as it is now. It really seems like you're not happy with how your husband dismisses your wants so easily. It seems like it's all black and white with him. By him saying "ok, so how unhappy are you?" he isn't even addressing the issue at hand. Of course you're happier than most people that have a smaller salary, that don't have the benefits you have, and the financial comforts and all of that. It would be ridiculous to say you're completely miserable when there are great, positive things going on in your life, but clearly there is also something you seem to want but also try to hide it; and that is staying at home with your girls.

You don't have to be completely depressed with your current situation to not prefer it and to want to change it. It doesn't have to get that bad before you make a change.

 

Do you think he would consider marital counseling?

[Catherine_3]

Do you think he would consider marital counseling?

 

No he would not.

[petite]

That's unfortunate because it can really be of help. My husband and I had some issues to get through while we were still engaged and it really helped us quite a lot.

[Catherine_3]

I would LOVE to see a counselor. I've seen how it's really helped other couples that we're friends with.

 

I feel like it would finally give me a voice. Honestly, it's true that I'm very outspoken and I almost always get my way - not by force but by influencing others, using my network, finding collaborative solutions, etc. at work, with friends, etc. But with my husband, I feel like he always gets his way. Maybe I should even see a counsellor on my own to work through this.

[petite]

That's a good idea, he or she can help you a lot by helping you maybe get through to your husband, and even just discussing things and strategies with a professional.

 

When we were having trouble, we both saw an individual therapist and a couples counselor. I can't even begin to tell you how much it has helped our communication and just understanding and listening to each other. I still see my therapist for personal therapy in which I discuss all aspects of my life. When my husband and I have an argument or disagree about something if I feel the need I discuss it with my therapist and he helps me with how I handle it with my husband. He also helps me see my husband's side. He makes sure to tell me he is my therapist first and foremost, and if he thinks I'm getting the short end of the stick he tells me that, or if he thinks I am being unreasonable he also makes sure I know.

 

One doesn't need to be depressed or feeling miserable about life to seek counseling, it can be like having a friend with whom you're brutally honest and they won't judge you and will help you work through some issues. Believe me, I never thought I'd be ever advocating therapy, but it has helped me and many people I know. If you're willing to make a change and if you do want the help it can happen. I find that often people that say therapy hasn't been of help usually haven't done the legwork needed to make a change. Not all, but many.

Do it. Don't wait another 5 years or until you end up resentful. That first session will feel weird because hey you're opening up to a stranger but overtime it gets easier. I remember my first session I ended up crying my eyes out. Like yours my life wasn't horrible, I wasn't miserable but I also wasn't 100% fine with everything, I know many people that are in worse situations would look at us and say "hey why are y'all complaining, you have food on the table and a job and comforts some don't have" but that doesn't mean that how you're feeling (or how I was feeling) isn't important or that it should be dismissed.

 

And I get you I felt like my husband - fiance then often 'won' our discussions or got his way, and it turned out we both had things to work on. Marriage is hard work, and when children are involved it is harder. I don't even have to tell you that since you've been married much longer than I have. But I really don't want you to wake up five years from now and resent your husband or be very sad that you missed out on things you wanted to do. And if that is working part-time or not working at all that's all fine, find a way to do what you'll be really happy with. Even super happy and work towards getting there.

[Seraphim]

Essentially, I think you are missing your voice in this relationship. Lack of control breeds discontent. You can go to therapy on your own without him. I think you want to be validated by him and it is not happening. This is not about staying home or going to work, but lack of equality in the partnership and validation.

[sophie274]

I think I see what you're saying, bekka, that maybe you would stay home and maybe not, but you'd like to at least be able to talk about it and lay the options out on the table with your husband, rather than defaulting to what he wants and you're ok with.

 

To be honest, reading your threads over the years, I wonder how much there is of your life with your husband that you've accepted because that's the way he wants things to be, not because it's the way you would prefer, or even the way that the two of you, together, have decided on. Even on here, you'll often complain about some aspect of your home life (totally normal, in my book), and then later, take it all back and contradict what you said, like you're scared of expressing unhappiness or dissatisfaction. For example, I read posts about your mother in law (maybe in your journal?) where you felt put upon and also excluded because of the language barrier, and didn't like certain aspects of how she was taking care of your daughters, but if someone suggests talking to her or her moving out, you tell us it's all hunky dory and she's amazing. Maybe she is amazing and you were just having a down moment, of course. But it comes accross, to me, as you being afraid to admit that things are not perfect, or afraid to clash with your husband or inlaws, even over things that do matter to you.

 

I think it's a really big problem that you don't have a strong voice in your marriage, and yes, I think you could work on that yourself even if he would not go to counseling.

[Catherine_3]

To be honest, reading your threads over the years, I wonder how much there is of your life with your husband that you've accepted because that's the way he wants things to be, not because it's the way you would prefer, or even the way that the two of you, together, have decided on.

 

This is true. The city we live in, the huge house in the suburbs, me working full time, the debt we've accumulated, the cars we drive, where we vacation... It's all his. 1000%

 

But I also think I've carried the weight of it being my issue for too long. Managing people, I've come to realise that there are people you're in sync with and people you just can never mesh with. I have some people who work for me who just absolutely baffle me. I've tried a million different ways to motivate them but at the end of the day, it's like paddling up stream. I'll never understand their thought process or why they do the things they do. Then I have other people who just inspire me and work so well with me. It took me a while to realise that the problem isn't me. You just have to surround yourself with people you can work with. And deal with the rest.

 

I don't think the problem is me. Honestly, I'm normal. There's nothing wrong with me. I do make my opinions known. And I fight for them. Hard. I just always end up losing.

[sophie274]

I'm definitely not saying the problem is you!

 

Are you saying your husband is one of the upstream paddle people? Or that you do mesh with him?

 

If you feel like you always "lose", that's no good. You seem like a positive person and not depressed at all, but I just don't see how you can be happy if you're always the one moving towards the other person, acquiescing to what they want. And we're not talking about picking between pepperoni or veggie pizza. I'm not sure how you can change your dynamic given that you've been with your husband for a while and that he doesn't seem inclined to compromise or open to you all getting some help, but I think this is worth a fight, or more "fighting".

[Catherine_3]

Are you saying your husband is one of the upstream paddle people? Or that you do mesh with him?

 

Given that I believe I'm doing all the right stuff, and it's still not working, I have to say the former.

[Seraphim]

Could it be that you guys just don't mesh? If you are at loggerheads all the time about almost everything from little to big it could be that you guys just don't mesh.

[MisUnderstood9]

When it comes to a decision like this I believe its not really a choice but an obligation to what type of life style you have or want to keep for your children. If you have a fairly "elabroate" life style, it probably needs two good paying incomes to have. If you wouldn't mind giving up some luxuries such as trips as a family or just your husband and yourself, dinners outs, new cars etc etc. then being a stay at home mom would be an option.

 

I didnt get the choice of being a "career mom" or a "stay at home mom", I was working 40 hours a week after my mat leave and doing night school. My son was in daycare from 8am everyday until 4:30, I saw him for 2, sometimes 3 hours and then my mom or sister would come over to watch him while I went to my classes. It was difficult but I didnt have a choice, I knew the type of life I wanted to provide for my son, what kind of future I wanted to provide him so I did what was necessary to do it so to make sure that I was able to provide tihngs for him such as sports, trips, a home etc. I wanted a certain life style for him that I didn't have a child because my dad was the breadwinner and my mom stayed home with my sisters and my brother and never went back to work (still isnt back to work) and we didn't get to do trips to Disney or things of that nature like other families did.

 

I do sometimes regret that I didn't get to spend a whole lot of time with him as a baby because I was always working or going to school but, I found that because I did all of it when I did, I now have a job that I can control and I get to see him more now that he's in the first part of his "remembering everything" stage because I worked to get myself to a career that allows me to do that with still being able to provide a life for him that I wanted.

 

I would look at your lifestyle that you have with your husband and your two daughters right now. Since you are working your life style with two incomes probably looks really nice -- you're able to afford dinners out as a family or as a couple, probably trips to Disney or Sea World or Mexico or whatever if you wanted to without hurting you financially, probably drive nice vehicles and live in a nice house with nice things and able to buy your daughters the toys, clothes etc etc all without breaking the bank. Now, if you were to quit your job and become a stay at home mom, what kind of things life style changes would happen if your went down to only one income? Would you have to sell a car to cut costs? Would you have to skip out of future trips together as family? Would there be no more familly dinners out? Would the girls have to endure more hand-me downs instead of new things? Would you be okay with all of these life style changes?

 

I didnt say any of this saying this is what you like actually is it's just more of a general out look on what things to consider when choosing to stay home with the kids or stay working. Personally, it is yours and your husbands decision. Since your MIL does live with you I don't see the need to stay at home with the kids because its not like you have to endure the extra cost of child care because you are working. I am assuming your job is 9-5 or relatively close to that so you don't really miss all that much of what the girls are doing while you are at work and if they are at school age yet, sitting at home from 830 until 330 with not really do anything doesn't sound fun.

[Catherine_3]

So I've made an appointment with a counsellor. Once I move to the new job, I'll see what kinds of benefits they offer for counselling. According to their website they have a good program that includes in-person counselling.

 

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. You guys always help me take a good, hard look in the mirror.

[petite]

That's great. How did you find someone so quick? Gosh it took me weeks to find someone that sounded good, then the initial call then deciding on a date and time. I'm surprised you were able to find someone so quick and make an appointment. Hopefully your first session will go well and you can see if you can work together and go from there. Good first step.

[Catherine_3]

I just made an appointment through a program offered at no charge through my employer. This wouldn't be my ongoing counsellor. After the first session, if I like him/her, I can do a few more sessions. If I don't like him/her, I can request a new one. And if we decide I could benefit from ongoing counsellor, then they would have referral services to help me find the right one.

 

I've made use of these types of services for professional advice and coaching but never personal. It will be interesting.

 

Yesterday I tried to objectively observe the interactions between my husband and me. I'm curious to find out why I don't seem to have a "voice" or whatever, even though I'm plenty assertive. I'm finding out some very interesting things. He has smart strategies.

[petite]

It almost seems like you need a contract lawyer in order to negotiate with your husband. If he's playing with strategies. It isn't poker, it's marriage.

 

That's great that you were able to find someone, hopefully you will be comfortable with the person you have made the appointment with. Would you not be able to have ongoing counseling through this service? Usually one needs more than a few sessions in order for things to change or to get the help they need.

[mhowe]

Is he a lawyer? They can often be difficult to "argue" with, as their brain has been trained to be logical.

 

My college roommate is an Ivy lawyer, and I don't think her hubby (surgeon) "win" many battles.

 

Maybe you need a contract lawyer in your bluetooth when you are dealling with your hubby? Like Sheharezade!!!

[petite]

mhowe - we are thinking the same thing? But I do agree with you.

[mhowe]

I am not a lawyer, but by aptitude and training have a very process oriented brain.

 

My bf is a conceptual thinker, and processes things in a more visual way. I have learned how to "discuss" issues with him that do not put him on the

defensive and give him time to view the issue from all angles without me pressuring him for an answer.

 

Inevitably, he comes to the same conclusion --- and doesn't ever feel like I have bullied him.

[petite]

I was thinking, do you think your mother in-law might be influencing his opinions about whether women should just work and not be stay at home mothers? Not talking about how he was raised, but do you think perhaps she feeds him her beliefs more than she should at present?

[Catherine_3]

He's not a lawyer but maybe he should become one.

 

Strategy 1: Stop talking.

 

If I say something that would start a negotiation, or something he doesn't like, he will stop engaging. The conversation is over. I can keep talking but I'm just making a fool of myself and talking to myself. Later, he will pretend the conversation never happened. Very smart. I don't know why I'm just figuring this out now.

 

Strategy 2: Blatantly refuse to discuss.

 

Something along the lines of "your position is unreasonable and not worth addressing. I refuse to discuss this. I have nothing to say to you. I don't want to hear what you have to say." And then comes the silent treatment, edginess, being snappy even more with the children than with me, etc.

[mhowe]

Wow. I couldn't live with that.

 

His "strategies" are blatantly disrespectful and dismissive.