Is it possible for people NOT to be turned off by too much contact/interest?

[justagirl2]

I agree that the question should have already been asked. I was waiting until this weekend to ask but we where interrupted by his lovely friend. So, it will have to be via writing. I talked to my friend who knows him and has a better overview of the situation and we came up with something short: "I was just thinking how our friendship is a little ambivalent, so just to make things clear and leave the grey area, do you like me as more than a friend or just as a friend?"

 

This has been sent.

[Deciduous]

I agree that the question should have already been asked. I was waiting until this weekend to ask but we where interrupted by his lovely friend. So, it will have to be via writing. I talked to my friend who knows him and has a better overview of the situation and we came up with something short: "I was just thinking how our friendship is a little ambivalent, so just to make things clear and leave the grey area, do you like me as more than a friend or just as a friend?"

 

This has been sent.

 

Yet you asked him this exact question several weeks/months ago. And he gave you a very clear answer

 

On the 14th October you wrote this;

 

It's true. The thing is knowing myself, until Z tells me point blank: I'm not into you I won't be able to move on. I need very direct closure to stop being optimistic.

 

Woke-up and already has 3 texts from Z. Just nothing much but like I said, we've been talking everyday.

 

On the 2nd November this happens

 

 

Well that was interesting.

 

So he had planned this sweet date, made reservations at a really nice restaurant for us. I had expected just drinks. I was quite surprised. He pays for everything seems like he likes me.

 

Then we make-out come to my place and I was not going to have sex with him but before I can stop him he stops me and says we shouldn't go farther because it would just be more confusing (?). So he basically says he's not ready for a relationship now and with me it would be either everything or nothing. Said he hadn't dated anybody in years and that subconsciously his only long-term girlfriend f'ed his emotions over and he just haven't been able to be close to any girl since.

 

He said it's not fair to me that he has to figure some of his stuff out and he doesn't want to drag me into his mess.

 

I was shocked I was looking really hot and we had crazy chemistry I've never had a guy be so honest about not wanting sex. He was being really ambivalent though saying he really likes me but I shouldn't wait for him.

 

So that was that.

 

It's sad because I feel like we have such a great connection and he just cannot let himself be happy. I mean I can tell he really likes me by the way he acts around me and kisses me but then wow, shocked by him not wanting to go farther (which I wouldn't have let anyways but wish I could have been the one to stop things).

 

He ends up saying he can't wait to come visit me though which is just more ambivalent. I ask him if he sees this working out someday or just never and he says of course it's not never but it's not fair for him to tell me to wait around for him. Great answer.

 

I feel like this is just going to screw me over more.

 

Thought of the night: Why can't I just love T? WHY WHY WHY? I really miss him right now because of this awful night. I mean great minus the part that the unavailable guy tells me with every letter of the alphabet he is unavailable. I want to cry. Damn. I'm going to be alone forever.

 

If I could ONLY had invested into my relationship with T I would not be in this situation right now.

 

The worst part of this is that this guy is just... not going to come to his senses. So it's not like I can play games and not talk to him and he's going to realize he misses me. He just won't. So I just have to not talk to him to get over him and not with the hopes he'll realize he likes me. He won't. He's been so passive all this time it won't change now.

 

I feel like this weekend has been an emotional mess and like I said, I just miss T so much (I know it's cause he's my security blanket).

 

I want to be strong enough to not go crawling back to him but I feel weak and vulnerable. I feel like I dont have the strength.

 

May I re-iterate;

he basically says he's not ready for a relationship now

 

You then go and visit him over the last few days when he chooses to hang out with his friend, rather than you, when given the choice. This is despite the shortness of time you will have together.

 

Justa, do you have good cause to believe that this man is lying about his disinterest in pursuing a relationship with you? Do you have reason to believe that he has changed his mind since the beginning of November.

 

If so can you tell us a little bit about what you are basing this on.

 

I do not believe this guy is in the wrong or behaving inappropriately. He has been honest from the start. He has clearly stated that he has nothing to give a relationship. His behaviour also reflects this.

 

On the surface, you have choosen to accept his terms, whilst below the surface you attempt to manipulate him.

 

You do this by providing endless emotional support, which comes with strings attached. Those strings are that he will fall in love and pay you back in kind for your time and effort.

 

You believe that making him feel guilty over this weekend will bring you what you want. Yet he has been absolutely honest with you.

 

In your last text you berate him for YOUR CHOICE I get that you are in love with him. I get that you have strong feelings. There is not one of us here on this thread that hasn't had to deal with unrequited love.

 

It's a tricky subject.

 

But make no mistake, it is you doing the choosing here. He has been honest about where he stands, yet you refuse to be honest about where you stand.

 

You are choosing to cater to his emotional needs in the hope that he falls in love with you. You are controlling and manipulating the relationship in the hope that it gives you what you want.

 

Can a healthy relationship be based on these initial dynamics?

 

Isn't it time you accepted that you are very much in love with this man, but HE CANNOT GIVE YOU WHAT YOU SO DESPERATELY WANT. And he has told you and demonstrated this time and time again.

 

The thing is, if he had told his best friend that he was madly in love with you and couldn't bare to be parted from you, there is no way that best-friend would have asked for his time that night. NO WAY.

 

So we must ask exactly what he is telling his best friend, (who you have decided to cast as the villian of the piece) I suspect he is telling his best friend EXACTLY what he has told you time and again over the last 6 months. This is why his best-friend felt entirely at liberty to horn in on your time together. And Z proved his hunch right, by choosing him over you.

 

Lets have a bit of honesty here.

 

I hate to be harsh, but we are now on post #702. It is time to face the very painful facts of this situation in a candid manner.

 

Deci

[Batya33]

Your question won't give you the answer you need because he likely will hedge it and you will use that as an excuse to keep chasing. You didn't ask him the relevant question -only a high-schoolish question he can dance around (again). I don't buy for a minute that you were waiting to ask him that question (especially since you asked him already and he already told you, a few months ago, how he felt) - you didn't ask him at dinner because you didn't want to (you knew what the answer would be) and if it was that important to you you would have insisted that he meet his friend later so you two could talk. Nothing "has to be done" in writing -you basically set it up that way.

 

Sure, the friend part was a surprise to a small extent - but in a way once he chose his friend over you then you had your answer -he didn't feel he needed more private time with you after dinner either to talk or whatever. The more you chase him the more it's obvious that you much prefer chasing unavailable men to looking for a relationship. (Well you said recently you didn't want a serious relationship so I'm not sure why it's so crucial to ask Z this question -and by writing!-if that's true.

 

If you want to work towards any kind of serious relationship with anyone- stop chasing unavailable men, ok?

[justagirl2]

He was actually very honest on his reply. "I like you as a friend a lot".

[Batya33]

He was actually very honest on his reply. "I like you as a friend a lot".

 

Great -I am glad you got the information you needed. I hope you feel some sense of relief. I know you're also disappointed but the relief is there too, I hope.

[missmarple]

He was actually very honest on his reply. "I like you as a friend a lot".

 

I hope this will help you to move on. If I were you, I'd stop being friends with him, at least for a while. There are too many emotions involved.

[Batya33]

I agree also because I don't think he's being a good friend -he's known about your romantic interest in one way or another for a long time and he should have stopped the flirting and huggy/kissy stuff.

[bluebell29]

Having read parts of your thread, it's amazing how much you remind me of myself! Ivy league, great career, etc. And also in some of your behaviours and thinking. If it helps, I realised that my problem was dealing with rejection. I was never used to it - straight A's, top business school, top job and all. When other people were busy getting their hearts broken and facing rejection in various areas of their life, I was always setting an example of how to be an over achiever. I think, like me, you have to learn that when it comes to relationships, it's not so formulaic. You may be the brightest and prettiest but that doesn't mean you can have whoever you want. It's learning to deal with rejection that makes you realise that in relationships you have to have a more 'take me or leave me attitude' and trying to change someone's mind is often futile. Not everyone will fall in love with you just because you have it all. I'm trying to figure things out myself and this may or may not be spot on for you but I wanted to share in any case, if it helps!

[justagirl2]

I don't even know what to say. I don't feel sad. Which is so weird. I'm feeling ok. I keep waiting for the sadness wave to hit me. It hasn't yet.

 

I'm glad Z was honest but at the same time I can't help to feel angry at him for kissing me and leading me on. I mean, he has never been a good friend to me so I don't really want to be his friend at least not right now. I acted very nice and thanked him for being honest! I did tell him: "I do like you though so for me I'd rather we don't talk much because it gives me a false sense of closeness". I think he will respect that. I have to respect that first, and if I do, I think he will too.

 

It's so weird but I'm just NOT sad.

 

The only thing that bothers me is feeling like I have to start all over finding someone that I like. I also talked to my mom and told her everything and she's normally a LOT more supportive about me dumping my boyfriends than my dad and this time she kept telling me: "I can't believe you dumped G and T, two amazing boyfriends, to chase something that doesn't even exist. Do you think guys like G's and T's will continue to appear in your life? You are going to be 27. If I were you I'd call T and try to get back together with him".

 

That is like worse advice ever. I was not happy with T even before Z came along. I don't miss T right now. But, it's hard to hear EVERYONE echoing the same sentiments that I keep dumping amazing boyfriends to chase "nothing".

 

Bluebell - It sucks. I'm glad there is someone here who can relate to me. Sometimes I feel like I could have done this differently, acted in another way, and things would have worked out. Like in a class, or in a job interview.

 

I mean, it's very weird that I don't feel sad. I just need to be VERY strong NOT to contact him because that would be ridiculous since I asked him NOT to contact me. In the beginning he was not as assertive but after I pushed him a little he seemed very assertive about friends only. I wonder if that fact I flipped on him yesterday over saturday made him feel more pressure and prefer to be just friends. But well, doesn't matter.

 

I keep wondering why I'm not sad but I guess Z never really gave me anything so there's nothing really to be sad about?

[browneyedgirl36]

I'm glad he was honest with you, and I hope you can use this information to move forward.

 

My general rule of thumb in these situations is this: If you have to ask, you probably already know the answer. Except in cases where a guy is extraordinarily shy (this is VERY unusual -- not the norm at all), you'll be able to tell if a guy likes you as more than a friend. He won't necessarily pounce on you like a rabid lion in the jungle or anything, but you'll know. You'll also have a pretty good idea if you're being "friend-zoned." In this case, the whole "I don't want a relationship right now" and the stopping you while you were making out and not having sex with you means he sees you as a friend and doesn't want anything more than that, at least at this point.

 

Now, though, you're open to pursuing opportunities to meet guys who ARE into you. That's good news!

[justagirl2]

Yes, I agree brown eyed. Things with Z were a bit more complicated because he IS very shy and he doesn't like ANY girls. With other unavailable man I pursued, they'd always have other girls around who they would texts, go on dates. Z doesn't go on dates at all and I know there's nobody in his life.

 

He is strange in that way but I guess I have to respect the way he is. He has other focuses and woman is clearly not a main one.

 

I mean, I guess i could have pushed this friends thing until he got attached, but what for? Waste more time?

[Deciduous]

I mean, I guess i could have pushed this friends thing until he got attached, but what for? Waste more time?

 

Hello Justa,

 

I think you did push this friends thing. And he failed to get attached. You pushed it for well over six months. And am I understanding you correctly? You're saying, the only reason you are choosing to not push this "friends thing" is because it's a waste of your time. Not because you finally realise that you cannot manipulate a human being into falling in love.

 

Justa, isn't it time you admitted, you loved him very deeply and you have been rejected. It is time to grow from this experience. It is time to accept it as it is and face your pain. This is precisely what I said in November, yet you choose a different path, which has led to this.

 

WHAT WILL YOU CHOOSE ON THIS 3RD occasion OF REJECTION. What will you do?

 

The next three months completely depend on the decisions you make this week. You can choose to remain stuck in GroundHog day - or you can choose to feel your grief and begin to face it - and heal it.

 

Those are your choices. There is nothing else. In November you choose to go through this cycle again. On Monday 20th January 2014, what do you choose?

 

Deci

[justagirl2]

To move on for sure. The thing is it was ONLY on November that I put a final end with my ex so I felt like this was only the "start" with Z. But you are right, it has been 6 months. No human being can be forced to fall in love with you. I choose to move on. I feel grief, but at the same time, I'm relieved to be able to move on. There are things about Z that I know are not perfect and I know I can find someone who is better suited for me.

 

I've been doing so well with my goals in 2014 though that I don't want this to derail it. I just felt a huge need to have chocolates but I forced myself and ordered a little salad!!!

 

For my whole life, I've been TINY. I was a kid that needed to take meds to increase my appetitive because I was so small and under the normal curve. I was a professional gymnast too which meant 30 hours of intense workout a week. With that said, I've always ONLY eaten junk food. I never liked veggies or salads. Eventually, of course my habits caught up with me and the tiny girl became NOT so tiny. I was unhappy that no clothes looked good on me. So for the past 10 days I've been on the Dukan Diet and just weighted myself. I lost 7 pounds. I went from 114 (52kgs) to 107 pounds (48.8kg). I can't believe how easy it was to accomplish this with discipline. I also did not even do the mandatory 20-30 mins of exercise. I thought my metabolism has stalled with age but I've always been very lucky with my metabolism and it is still working very well if I'm disciplined.

 

My goal is to get to 46kg (101 pounds) and start exercising. When you reach your desire weight, you go the 3rd phase which is consolidations and you re-introduce carbs slowly and even have 1 cheat day where you can eat french fries, cake, whatever. I cannot wait to get to that phase and I think with 2 more weeks of discipline I can do it!!!

 

In case anyone is wondering I'm 5'1 so anything over 100 is a healthy weight according to the BMI calculator. I am SO happy of being so close to getting my body back.

 

Secondly, I want to focus on my grades and do very well this quarter. Thirdly, I NEED to get a job.

[Batya33]

I think if you want to maintain a certain weight that type of diet is just a bandaid- perfect if you want to look different in a certain outfit for a special occasion - you have to develop healthier habits for the long term. Exercise is what's kept my metabolism at a healthy rate (I am 47).

[justagirl2]

I think if you want to maintain a certain weight that type of diet is just a bandaid- perfect if you want to look different in a certain outfit for a special occasion - you have to develop healthier habits for the long term. Exercise is what's kept my metabolism at a healthy rate (I am 47).

 

But the diet goes onto a consolidation and stabilization phase where you introduce carbs back and maintain a healthy diet. I've definitely learned to eat healthier these past 10 days and I did not starve myself at all. I can always eat. I only starve myself if I'm lazy to go to the kitchen and get me a fat-free yogurt or some chicken.

[Batya33]

But the diet goes onto a consolidation and stabilization phase where you introduce carbs back and maintain a healthy diet. I've definitely learned to eat healthier these past 10 days and I did not starve myself at all. I can always eat. I only starve myself if I'm lazy to go to the kitchen and get me a fat-free yogurt or some chicken.

 

Yes - I've done those kind of diets before. It's a good kick start. I think the really relevant part is the part where you incorporate new eating habits over the long term.

[justagirl2]

So Z is not happy that we can't be close and talk all the time but he says it's fair. He thinks being just friends is simpler and will be best for us. Whatever. He said he's always there if I need him though. I said I'm always here too but that it's best to have some time apart and not be as close.

[Deciduous]

But the diet goes onto a consolidation and stabilization phase where you introduce carbs back and maintain a healthy diet. I've definitely learned to eat healthier these past 10 days and I did not starve myself at all. I can always eat. I only starve myself if I'm lazy to go to the kitchen and get me a fat-free yogurt or some chicken.

 

Hi Justa,

 

Yes, I've also done those diets (10 days or so of veggies in my case) and it did help me curb a massive and overwhelming sugar addiction. Then watching the movie "Fat, Sick & Nearly Dead" really helped me to keep up with the Vegatable and Fruit eating, after the diet had officially ended. It provided a mental paradigm shift for me, which was needed. Also by the end of the 10 days, my sugar tolerance had drastically gone down, so I felt satisfied with a lot less sugar, than I'd been chowing down before.

 

Hope it continues to go well for you. Keep up with the mineral water.

 

Deci

[Batya33]

So Z is not happy that we can't be close and talk all the time but he says it's fair. He thinks being just friends is simpler and will be best for us. Whatever. He said he's always there if I need him though. I said I'm always here too but that it's best to have some time apart and not be as close.

 

Yes- he wants what is best for him. No surprises there. I think you are right but don't use this as an excuse to have back and forth with him about what it means to be friends.

[justagirl2]

Yes- he wants what is best for him. No surprises there. I think you are right but don't use this as an excuse to have back and forth with him about what it means to be friends.

 

Batya you are a psychic. This back and forth is exactly what is happening. It will NOT draw until tomorrow though. I will stop replying.

[Ms Darcy]

Well he wants to keep hanging out and to remain "close" without actually having to be in/move towards a relationship with you. Stop talking to him.

[justagirl2]

I stopped the back and forth. Man, this first month will be HARD. I know he won't speak to me, if I asked him not to, he simply won't. Which is what I need in the longterm but in the short-term will make me sad.

 

I am fairly confident with my decision, but I do think this weekend was too much drama for him. I getting upset with the saturday thing and then asking this. Ugh. Well, you promise this wouldn't have changed how he felt, right??? In fact this only happened BECAUSE of how he doesn't feel, right?

[justagirl2]

Ok, the sad wave is finally hitting. I can't help but think how cold Z was today actually. Ugh, he never cared about me and is probably relieved about the whole situation.

[justagirl2]

Ok so Z kept pushing a little now and implying I want a serious relationship bla bla. In all honesty, that annoyed me a ton. Like I know you guys think I want a serious relationship and marry this dude today, but I've said in a few pages of this journal. I do not want a seriously relationship with him at all. I do not know him in a real man/woman context. All I wanted is to spend time together and plan to do things with the POTENTIAL of a relationship in the future. But, I know it could go either way. I mean I haven't slept with this guy and considering sex was a somewhat big issue in my past relationship how could I start dating him today? Also, I really haven't gotten a job in the US so I don't even know if I'll be able to stay here after school in June.

 

I ended up telling him something that was probably unnecessary but was in my chest since the November incident when he told me: "I feel like with you things would have to be serious". It probably was unnecessary and you guys won't approve but I had to get it out of my chest. Now I can go on with NC feeling like I said everything I wanted.

 

He was saying: "Please, I want you to know you can count on me for anything, anytime I'm here".

 

I said:

 

"I know Z. I don’t want this to be anything too dramatic just think it’s good for us. Also, I just want to make it clear that I didn’t want any sort of serious relationship with you, as I really don’t think we know each other in a man/woman context at all. All I meant when I said I like you is that I really enjoy spending time with you and I’m attracted to you as more than a friend. Nothing too intense or complicated, just see where things go with no expectations. But, if you are not attracted to me like that it’s a lot better for us to just stop constantly talking for a while because I don’t think it’s fair to feel like you are letting me down or anything like that, you know? I’m sure we’ll cross paths again Z. Haha. I mean, it’s not like we didn’t in a city of more than 20 million people

Good night!"

 

The ending part is funny because we met 8 years ago in the second most populated city in a world. We met a few times but never exchanged information. He was just visiting my country. I fell for him at first sight, to be honest. Anyways, he went back to the US to finish college we never spoke again. I of course got over him and never even thought about him anymore. Then, 2 years ago, I see him in the elevator of my apartment in the same city of over 20 million people and he moved there for work and became my next door neighbor. I guess this "coincidence" aspect also fueled my "romance" in my head.

 

Anyways, I feel 100% free now that I said this and I think it's mature to me to be nice to him and don't act like I hold any resentments or grudges or am mad.

[justagirl2]

PS. Judging what I wrote won't help me since it's sent!! I need help just staying on track and not replying contacting him at all. I said good night which I believe ends the convo.

 

I am feeling very good about this I have to say. A little lost? Yeah but I know I had to do this. And in hindsight, considering my final talk with my ex, T was in November, I feel like I resolved this situation in 2 months and didn't let it drag for 2 years.