Dating a younger man from online dating site

[rapunzel]

 

[Yet I have to remember that I am the one who made the initial meeting happen, I pretty much pursued him in the online setting (which I think is different and more acceptable than pursuing a man you meet in "real life")

 

Nope. It still sets a tone and precedent. (Again - mainly traditional man or mainly new man?)

 

 

BTW, the reason I pursued him online is that I do not have a photo posted and have sort of a "stealth" bare bones profile. For privacy reasons and because I'm a performer, I don't want to advertise. People rarely respond to profiles with no photos. So until I bite the bullet and post a photo, I will have to be the one making the initial contact and then sending the person to a URL where I do have photos posted.

[Batya33]

Are you sure he's not just logged in all the time but not as active as you think he is? You and I did most of our dating before this facebook/dating sites nonsense -the most unlucky I got was running into a date at a singles event or into his friends who would give me some hint about where he was that night. I agree that you shouldn't have sex with him or bring up exclusivity yet - I'd give it a few months. Hang in there.

[rapunzel]

Are you sure he's not just logged in all the time but not as active as you think he is? You and I did most of our dating before this facebook/dating sites nonsense -the most unlucky I got was running into a date at a singles event or into his friends who would give me some hint about where he was that night. I agree that you shouldn't have sex with him or bring up exclusivity yet - I'd give it a few months. Hang in there.

 

No, I'm not sure of this but I've noticed when he's on that sometimes he has the IM thing turned ON and sometimes he has it turned OFF. I just assume when it says "ONLINE NOW!" that he's online actually active on the site because I know he works at home and sometimes he's not online (I'm able to see what he's doing without him knowing I'm online on the dating site). Do you mean a few months for SEX or for exclusivity? Or both?

[Batya33]

No, I'm not sure of this but I've noticed when he's on that sometimes he has the IM thing turned ON and sometimes he has it turned OFF. I just assume when it says "ONLINE NOW!" that he's online actually active on the site because I know he works at home and sometimes he's not online (I'm able to see what he's doing without him knowing I'm online on the dating site). Do you mean a few months for SEX or for exclusivity? Or both?

 

I would do both -and I really do think you and I experienced the whole "is he online?" thing differently because we had so many years of dating without it when ignorance was bliss. It's so hard not to check, I know. I hope he makes plans to see you soon.

[rapunzel]

I've only known this man for just over three weeks so it is silly for me expect he's going to immediately take his profile down and focus on just me. If he wants to date other people, then I will do the same and we just don't sleep together and/or have sex. Of course, I rarely find people I want to date so this will be a challenge.

[Nattersmatter]

I dunno. I responded to his 12/31/12 email several hours later, basically "mirrored" him - he indicated in the 12/31 email he would not have his kids as of tomorrow but did not actually come out and ask me out. He did start off the email sort of apologizing for being "off the grid" during his holiday week away. So in my response I jokingly said I would not have my kids either (of course, I don't have any). Now I'm waiting for his reply. He was active on the dating site this morning AND last night.

 

In that case - forget it. He is definitely trying to replace you with something better(/worse) but meanwhile wants you to keep interested so that you'll still be there should his fishing expedition remain yielding insufficient results.

 

My gut is that he is looking for better prospects. I don't want to have an "exclusivity" conversation so soon as I think it is a romance killer and can often make people/men feel pressured. We hardly know each other, and yes, I gave into some instant chemistry/attraction and passion (of course, he being a willing participant) which I don't necessarily feel badly about but now I feel like "damned if you do, damned if you don't" I'm damned if I decide at 51 years old to have fun, feel confident and go with natural impulses to kiss an attractive man passionately on the first date rather than be calculating and rigid and only let him peck me on the cheek. I'm damned if I don't, as I may go another 4 years without finding an attractive man I want to do this with..

 

Read my earlier mail again. It's "doesn't matter if you do/doesn't matter if you don't". It only matters if you let it become a reason to believe it represents some sort of forging of commitment and heighten your expectations accordingly.

 

It's too late to put the passion back in the bag. If we go out this weekend, what am I going to do - suggest a day time coffee date and then go home?

 

No, it's not too late. Be honest. Say, 'I'm sorry but... I don't do that level of intimacy outside of a committed and exclusive relationship, i.e. with a BONA FIDE BOYFRIEND. Not that it's not your prerogative at this stage (and same for me), but... the fact you barely contacted me over Christmas and didn't want to spend NYE with me makes it obvious we're not a bona fide couple yet, which itself is understandable considering it's very early stages, but, still... I wouldn't now feel comfortable behaving as if we *are*'.

 

I almost want to email him and say "hey, I like you and we had fun but I think we'd be better off as friends". I almost mean it. And I almost don't care. And you know, if I make myself unavailable, I become SO much more attractive. THEN he'll be chasing me. Ugh. Such a game.

 

You didn't go on there to make friends - even as a secondary aim - so don't pretend like you did or he did by using that concept as making it wholly appropriate to contact him to basically say, UP YOURS, I DON'T CARE, EITHER! The action, unfortunately, will say, you absolutely do care. And men understand this.

 

Sorry, I guess I'm just a little depressed that he's still trolling on the site and I was thinking he'd be looking forward to seeing me again. He'll probably get in contact later today, I would guess. I just have to be patient, stop thinking so much and see what happens today/tomorrow.

 

If the guy isn't interested in you unless you're LEAVING his vicinity, then, forget it. He should be interested in chasing you to catch you and put you into his close-by vicinity and to KEEP you in that close-by vicinity... by making you want to stay via ENTERTAINING you. Ignoring someone for days and days on end, isn't them entertaining you. Only entertaining you when you're almost out the door, isn't entertaining you, either. It's LOSS AVOIDANCE only. Loss of an OPTION.

 

You want to be patience so as not to lose being barely an option? And then not even one near the front of the queue???

 

I could understand this behaviour from him had he not met you yet or had only one date with you. But THREE? Pfff. FORGET IT.

 

"Neeeeeeeext!"

 

xoxo

[PaintWithLight]

If you don't want to end up in intimate encounters, then make sure the date is somewhere they won't happen. Plan to go out rather than hanging around your place or his. I definitely would avoid inviting people into your place or going to his until you are ready for some intimate contact. Especially with online dating, until you are sure he is who he says he is. If he's always wanting to meet at your place, then a good chance you can't go to his place because he has a GF or wife!

 

^^^

combined with being off the grid during the holidays??? This combination spells MARRIED Man.

[rapunzel]

^^^

combined with being off the grid during the holidays??? This combination spells MARRIED Man.

 

No, he is definitely divorced and was definitely out of the state with his entire family for the week. I know this for a fact.

[Batya33]

I think he's interested in seeing you again. There's not much more to expect at this point - definitely a one date at a time situation.

[Nattersmatter]

Well, you *don't* know for a fact that he's divorced, going by what you told us, Rapunzel, because you saw his kids' room, not his (right?). He could be merely separated, and only for a fixed period (to give them both a break before they start counselling (as far as wifey's concerned, that is)). Or his wife could be away on business on an x months contract. And even if you do somehow know for a fact (that's *fact*, not supposition) that he's divorced, and knew for a fact he *wasn't* logged on and cruising on that site, none of that matters, anyway. Three dates - especially that features talking/emailing in the interims plus reflecting and daydreaming positively (thus winding yourselves up even more) - is perfectly sufficient for really, heavily clicking with someone chemically - enough that you believe you know, Yep, this is the person for me!, or Nope - next!. ...Assuming it's love in the heart you're looking for, rather than some arranged marriage but whereby the prospective bride and groom make the decision to 'grow to love each other' themselves?

 

The occasions where three dates isn't enough despite knee-wobbling, thigh-clenching chemistry, occur because the person is not RIPE/READY for a relationship - they have some influence or other blocking their level of receptivity and mental availability. For example - as I said before - he could even be deliberately keeping his distance BECAUSE the chemistry was a bit too overpowering for his liking. Where normally that might be a good thing - due to his particular circumstances, it's not, it's a bad thing because, for example, said circumstances demand that he NOT lose his head, his time, his freedom, energy and concentration, and that he NOT have to see what he deems top priorities at the moment slip from the front of the attention queue (e.g. he wants to put his kids first because the divorce knocked them for six).

 

Whatever. If it's a love like no other you're seeking, there are certain associative urges and corresponding behaviours that are displayed right from the start. You give it three meetings at the most - just in case nervousness and awkwardness or plain bad moods at the time block normal chemical receptivity, but - if not at first sight - you expect within those three dates a *mutual* excitement to take hold. And I do mean take hold.

 

This 'mutineering' translates, not just to wanting to get anywhere from snoggy and clinchy with you to ripping your clothes off (- you do want them to FEEL that way about you in spite of the fact they behave according to the Not yet/It's too soon cues you're giving), but them acting like they've just experienced THE most fun and thrilling fairground ride... wanting to go on it again and again and again! ("Yeh-yeh-yeh-yeh-gimmie-gimmie-gimmie-gimmie!!!!"). They may wish to try to HIDE that excitement, but you usually find their efforts insufficient (as are yours).

 

For example, they *don't* wait three days to contact you. And they don't just text or email, they PHONE. And they want to phone you at least every other day if not every day if not three times daily! And you want them to, as well.

 

So bad are your respective acts of hiding how you feel - which is presuming you don't come clean about how you feel immediately (most do, in fact) - that confession certainly happens sooner rather than later... and that's because it strikes you as both downright churlish *not* to, given how bad thus mutually humiliating your respective attempts in front of each other to keep better control are. (We're talking CHEMISTRY - HONEYMOON HEROIN. It's potent stuff. You don't control it, it controls *you*. Have you ever seen anyone take a Class A drug for the first time or first time in ages and manage to hide that they're under its influence? There you go.)

 

So - pretenses at being cool or chilled or downright not giving a damn are discarded along with so-called sensible rules (because they too at this point seem petty and churlish) - he dares to ask to see you (that's PRE-ask!) at least for *some* days over Christmas and definitely New Year's Eve. He doesn't worry about coming over too keen at that point or suffer anxiety at the thought of a refusal from you because he's been getting clear and badly hidden signs or outright say-so that you feel the same way, for days or weeks already!

 

And if ever circumstances conspire to prevent you from seeing them for a week? YOU SUFFER... YOU SUFFER *BIG* TIME! The pair of you.

 

That's how it goes when you're ripe for it and you want it *before* you even met the person. (Probably not the best analogy but...) The right frame of mind and at least critical amount of willingness is like the dinner plate, and the luck of meeting someone with matching chemistry to a worthwhile degree is like the chateau briand that gets plonked on it. No plate? The lamb served onto where it should be situated hits the floor and may as well not exist. No lamb? Having brought a plate along ends up feeling like a complete waste of effort.

 

...But again, it depends what you're looking for based on what YOU believe a romantic relationship should look and feel and operate like at right from that very first point. I'm talking, Who gives a toss about your looks, your job, your bank balance, or anything that true love doesn't need to make it happen? It needs huge chemistry and then LATER ON a willingness and capability to work out the nitty gritty of who has what or likes/dislikes what or does what or is responsible for what or thinks what (when/when not, and how and for how long).

 

You can't make someone feel that initial small but very potent bud of love that later inevitably blooms into a full-blown rose of love whereby they "only wanna be with you!" (and that means, be with you rather than going to work, sleeping, seeing their family, whatever), whether convenient, practicable, sensible or NOT, as an UNCONTROLLABLE COMPULSION. It's either there hence they do all the right bog-standard behaviours and actions, or it's not.

 

And I'll tell ya summat else: when *you* are ripe and ready, willing and capable, that's precisely the being knocked for six sensation you hold out for; you do not settle for anything less. If you do, same as if he does, you're NOT quite as ripe, ready, willing and capable as you'd have yourself believe.

 

Again, Rapunzel - what do you WANT? Until you know what you want you won't stop (scuse French) farting around with and waiting around for anything different/less.

 

xoxo

[EssexMan]

the luck of meeting someone with matching chemistry to a worthwhile degree is like the chateau briand that gets plonked on it. No plate? The lamb served onto where it should be situated hits the floor and may as well not exist. No lamb? Having brought a plate along ends up feeling like a complete waste of effort.

 

Chateaubriand is beef (a pedant writes) - but otherwise a great post with some perfect descriptions of how it feels when it really is right!

[rapunzel]

Your message came through loud and clear, Nattermatters. Phew. Got it!

 

And yes, for the record, I do know for an absolute fact that he has been legally divorced for 5 years, you see there is this handy tool called the internet...and I am an accomplished sleuth.

[PaintWithLight]

when is the last time to two of you got together on a date? i would make it sooner rather than later so you get more real time together.

[Nattersmatter]

Chateaubriand is beef (a pedant writes) - but otherwise a great post with some perfect descriptions of how it feels when it really is right!

 

Oh, yeah! You're right - it is! That's probably why I don't like it despite I adore roast Lamb! Sod it - Gravadlax and Caviar, then! (And don't reply with Ugh, LOL)

 

(Cheers)

 

I could go on, by the way. For example, we could discuss the massive differences in the bedroom department? ;-)

 

xoxo

[Nattersmatter]

Your message came through loud and clear, Nattermatters. Phew. Got it!

 

And yes, for the record, I do know for an absolute fact that he has been legally divorced for 5 years, you see there is this handy tool called the internet...and I am an accomplished sleuth.

 

Oh, ARE you, indeedie???? Cool! I'm such a techie duh-brain I'm surprised I made it ON here, LOL. But anyway - in that case we're left with you representing loss of control and being sucked back into potential war again or him wanting to concentrate on his kids and adapting as quickly as possible to his new lifestyle (wouldn't surprise me - men are far more practical and pragmatic than women) (sorry but true) but where a Relationship Lite (for the shags-on-tap) would suit and stop him suffering sexual frustration. That latter one fits with the behaviour and overall pattern, doesn't it?... him 'revving you up' to a certain temperature and then......... turning the gas down to a slow simmer?

 

Well... somebody should tell him: YOU CAN'T DO THAT. IT DOESN'T WORK. That's like under-watering a pot-plant. It's still going to die... just that bit more slowly than if it were never watered... not to mention fail to flower properly or ever, and generally look and feel very worse for wear the entire time. In fact, an underwatered pot-plant does this: dying, dying, almost dead, [bit of water], resuscitated just enough to barely function yet not actually gain or give any pleasure....dying, dying, almost dead [and repeat]....

 

It's all. Or Nothing. Now't in between.

 

But it's so easy to forget when you've come out of a marriage - which by the fact it died a death has proven itself seriously lacking love and still feeling IN love, so... little wonder you forget what it feels like and mistake and for The Big L.

 

That's not to say, don't date. Do. But don't expect too much for the time being. Best to use it as practise... to hone your skills ready for Mr WHOAH!

 

xoxo

[rapunzel]

when is the last time to two of you got together on a date? i would make it sooner rather than later so you get more real time together.

 

Our last date was 12/21/12.

 

He emailed me last night, I woke up to it this morning. I have decided to give him the benefit of the doubt; I've made all these assumptions and hashing this out online here has helped me get clear on how to handle this next delicate step of negotiations - ha ha. He asked if I was free for a weekday/weekend get together, well the week is almost over and I can't see him until Saturday or Sunday. So I will see him, I will put on my big girl panties and just relax and have fun with him. We had fun all the other times so I don't see any reason why we won't have fun this time. My monkey mind is just getting the best of me. And not to worry, the big girl panties will stay ON.

[Batya33]

A good sign!

[rapunzel]

A good sign!

 

Yes, thanks!

[lavenderdove]

Yay! Good news... and for the record, i think he has done nothing at all wrong up to now.. You only had 3 dates before the holiday season, then he went out of town and returned to work as soon as he was back. I don't really see any big opportunity for him to have dates during that time, so the expectation that he should act like a long-time BF with instant and continual contact from day one really is kind of over the top.

 

And please don't assume anything about those 'online now' and 'available for chat' notices on websites. I am a computer person and do know that those websites earn their money from advertisers etc. based on the number of people that are surfing their sites and clicking ads, and they will try to entice you to get online, and have cookies on your computer that report back anytime the computer is on and report that your status is 'online' in order to get other people visiting the site to think lots of people are available to date, and checking things out (and hence more money for them). So if he works on his computer at home, he may be shown as online and 'available for chat' simply because he is on his computer and the cookie is reporting he is online. And depending on how he has his computer set up and the type of internet access he has, he may be reported as online MOST of the time, even when he is not sitting at the computer and it is just idle.

 

And for all you know, he is checking the site to try to determine if YOU have been online dating other guys. So you are both busily checking on each other and coming to the WRONG conclusions based on those silly computer cookies and how they work. So please don't put too much weight on that. I would not try to guess what he is doing, i would ask him what his expectations are (i.e., does he like to date multiple people, or does he like to be exclusive until you both decide whether it is working or not?).

 

Communication is your best hope of keeping a relationship on track and understanding what is going on and what both people's views/expectations are and whether they line up. If he's an honest guy then you can decide whether your goals and expectations are similar and whether you want to continue with him based on that. If he is a liar or cheater, then that is something you will eventually find out regardless because a pattern of bad behavior will emerge.

 

And the truth is that some of the guys who put on the biggest rushes in the beginning trying to run you into the ground with supposed interest in a serious relationship, are really just rushing things to rush you into bed, and they will evaporate as quickly as they pushed in the beginning. So my own experience is that sincere guys don't feel the need to push heavily in the beginning because they are looking for someone who is really good for them on multiple levels and don't want to rush into anything they'll regret after a few dates, or rush things so they can use a woman sexually then drop her just as quickly to chase the next one.

[rapunzel]

Thanks lavenderdove. We have a date Saturday night, details to be announced. The thing I don't like is he only emails and texts me to make plans and he's 45. He's also a computer person for work so this may explain it but it would be nice after three dates if he picked up the phone. Also, he tends to let me have the last email reply and then he waits a day or two to respond...but I'm not too worried about that. It does seem like a bit of game playing.

 

I would rather not ask him what he wants, what his expectations are, I think it is too soon and in my experience, men can easily feel pressured when there is "chemistry" and I start asking about the status of the relationship or what the man is looking for. He did tell me he wants companionship. I will definitely let him know I'm not ready to have sex with him but I'm not going to talk about exclusivity and "where is this going" but more from the standpoint of how it will affect ME emotionally and how I don't take sex lightly, nor engage in it until I feel truly comfortable with the person nor do I want to be exposed to possible STD's when people are having multiple partners.

 

Thanks for the information about "cookies", etc which could very well be true but my intuition tells me he is still keeping his options open and I will do the same.

 

Edit: Oh and I agree with you that he has not done anything wrong and that I could not expect he's my boyfriend nor to act like one after only knowing him for three weeks. He contacted me on both holidays while he was out of town and that was nice.

[EssexMan]

Thanks lavenderdove. We have a date Saturday night, details to be announced. The thing I don't like is he only emails and texts me to make plans and he's 45. He's also a computer person for work so this may explain it but it would be nice after three dates if he picked up the phone.

 

I'm about his age, and I'm completely out of the habit of making voice calls. It's nothing to do with who the person at the other end is. Except in a major major crisis, I'd always text or email rather than call. It almost wouldn't occur to me as an option.

[rapunzel]

Yes, I realize we have become a texting and emailing world and talking on the phone is almost antiquated. I do think this whole trend makes dating/courting less threatening as actual speaking with the human voice in real time is direct and immediate, and the emailing/texting form of communication takes away a couple of layers of intimacy that talking on the phone provides. Thus it is safer with less chance for a bad conversation or immediate rejection.

[Nattersmatter]

It wasn't about the fact you'd only been dating him for three weeks, it was the fact that HE hadn't been behaving like he barely knew you (geddit right). But now (as in lately, since the 12th Dec) he has... he's shown that that exceptional ardour during those clinches was *not* an indication of his strength of emotions, just that of libido.

 

Also, the fact that, since the sudden drop in contact that (by clear evidence of how it left you feeling) *didn't* gel with his otherwise seeming keenness, he's booked a date again, is not a "good sign", either. It's just a component of a sign, which will either be proven as demonstrative of being positive or negative or neutral. After all, if he were again to leave it too long before asking for another, or never asked for another again, what would that render this so-called sign? Geddit? Actions have to be *sustained*.

 

What definitely is a good sign on its own is that the date is for today/*Saturday* as well as that adequate notice was given - because it's prime dating night which must mean you (at this point in time, anyway) are again or still his number 1 favourite. IF, however, he'd invited you as late as last night, then we could have worked out that another woman (to whom he had given longer notice) had declined, hence you were next on his list. So this date being prime night AND with adequate notice having been given, in itself is a good sign.. or *start of*.

 

If it transpires he wants to see you NEXT Saturday as well? That definitely proves this one to have been the mere start of a good sign.

 

See the difference? "Do it again (and again) and *then* I'll believe ya!".

 

Good decision not to have The Talk and take all the mystery out of it (tick!). Say nothing about how you feel getting sexual as opposed to just snoggy and cuddly is inappropriate outside of a Steady situation UNLESS HE TRIES TO and right at the point where he tries it, as well. By all means put humour into it to help save faces - example, say, 'I think you've dropped something?', and when he asks what, grab and hold up his wandering hand saying, 'This!'. And then give him a cheeky wink. (Works for me, anyway.

 

So where's he proposing to take you?

 

xoxo

[Nattersmatter]

the emailing/texting form of communication takes away a couple of layers of intimacy that talking on the phone provides. Thus it is safer with less chance for a bad conversation or immediate rejection

 

Agree! But once they have fallen head-over-heels in love with you, seeing characters on a screen as opposed to hearing your warm and sexy voice, just doesn't do it for them. If it does - there's a problem(, Houston).

 

xoxo

[Nattersmatter]

How did the date go?

 

xoxo