Organs Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 I think you guys aren't getting what I'm saying. I'm saying that people in their thirties living at home who have *never* lived independently throw up major red flags for me. I think it's a question of priorities and what people want. I didn't drive but I lived independently - that would be my preference by *far*. Well, that's completely different. This matter needs quite a bit of clarification. It's one thing if people are living at home because they lost their job or can't afford to buy a house. It's another if they never bothered to try and don't seem as if they ever will. Link to comment
Honey Pumpkin Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Well, that's completely different. This matter needs quite a bit of clarification. It's one thing if people are living at home because they lost their job or can't afford to buy a house. It's another if they never bothered to try and don't seem as if they ever will. I've made this point about ten times in the thread. And to be honest, I don't even think people should always shoot for owning a home. I think it's okay to leave, be independent and RENT. I don't have much sympathy for people who want to live with their parents till they are in their thirties/forties because they want to save. I think personally they are doing that at the expense of their parents. They should be paying rent and utilities as if they were renting, not getting a free ride from elderly parents. I just think it's odd to have different priorities, and I would not date someone who was *still* at home in their thirties. ISH and others - I am not having a go at younger people who are finding it difficult to get a job. I'm sorry if it seems that way. I was talking very specifically about people in their thirties who have NEVER lived independently but are still with mom and dad. I am simply saying that in terms of dating, this for me is a deal-breaker. I have tried this with a couple of guys, and it's just so weird to me. To have a grown man phone his mom and tell him what time he'll be in so she can get dinner for him every night seems odd to me. Link to comment
Organs Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Honey Pumpkin, I hope you'll forgive my confusion. I saw the thread title and I immediately thought of my two older brothers. One did move back home so he could save enough money to buy a condo. The thing is, though, he did! I don't think he was home for more than a year and a half or so. The other one is a very straight forward, status quo white collar worker. It's hilarious how conservative he is (non-politically). Anyways, he did the same thing in his twenties, but he stayed home a lot longer (maybe three years). He bought a town home and an engagement ring and made sure he had a house, furniture, and everything before proposing to his girlfriend (who's been with him since high school). And, given the current economic slump, you can see how I see living at home has its benefits. But you're right. Aging momma's boys are a sad thing. Link to comment
MD Geist Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 I think you guys aren't getting what I'm saying. I'm saying that people in their thirties living at home who have *never* lived independently throw up major red flags for me. I think it's a question of priorities and what people want. I didn't drive but I lived independently - that would be my preference by *far*. Fair enough. I missed understood what you where saying. From personal experience it can be a number of things but overall I can say that lazyness is what prevents many people from making that step to independance. Link to comment
doyathink Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 I dated a guy who is 42, and lived his entire life with his mother. She gets up and cooks his breakfast in the mornings, calls him when he's not home to find out where he is, and when he's coming home....AND would drive to my house to check up on him. He lives with her because he's lazy, and she takes care of him. Needless to say we didn't last long lol....it's a huge turn off in my books unless it's unavoidable. Link to comment
Knotty Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 I've only read the first 16 pages so far... I'd like to add my perspective... I lived at home in my 20's. Looking back, I think there were two reasons. First, it was never instilled in me the benefits of living on my own. I grew up seeing my father work everyday and come home to a wife that yelled at him and wouldn't have sex. They both seemed to have pretty miserable lives. Seeing my parents wasn't a big selling point on wanting to grow up, get married and have kids. Second, my parents never taught me the skills I needed to grow up. There were little things like how to cook and do laundry, and things like how to pay bills or deal with business transactions, like buying a car, getting insurance, paying bills, dealing with landlords. Maybe for some people, these things are intuitive, or maybe they were taught this stuff without realizing it. Or maybe their parents taught them how to face new situations like adults so that they could learn on their own. I also didn't finish college when I was younger, so I didn't think I could get a decent job. Friends I knew that moved out had low paying jobs and didn't live anywhere nice and couldn't afford much. I wanted to and did stay home until I eventually finished college. By that point, moving out was way overdue. Anyway, I realized that I didn't feel like I was an adult yet in my 20's. I felt like I had to learn a lot of things on my own. I needed to gain the confidence in myself to realize I could make my life however I wanted it to be. Some people in this thread blame the kids still living at home for being lazy or immature. I put some blame on the parents for not teaching them how to grow up and showing them how they'd be better off on their own. And in some instances a mother has replaced some emotional connection with the father by the relationship with the son, so she doesn't want to lose him. Many times the father is not emotionally invested in the family and doesn't do his part in raising boys to be men. Learning from my own experience, I think if I ever have kids I will do a good job in teaching them to be adults and wanting to move out. Back to the original question, I don't blame anyone for not wanting to date someone still living with their parents, especially if they are looking for something more serious. But maybe if you meet someone living at home, you could try to understand them and encourage them to move out by showing them the benefits or explaining the benefits of living on their own. Link to comment
itsallgrand Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Honest to god, to blame the parents? I HAD to leave home at 18. Whether I knew what I was doing or not. There wasn't an OPTION. The thinking was "You are an adult now. You have adult responsibilities." And you know what? I agree with that. At 18 - it's your responsibility to put food in your own mouth. Learn to cook if you don't know. Learn to get places. Learn to find housing (even if it's crap, it's YOURS). There was no option to fall back on. So to hear people whine....Oh, it's hard. Yes, it is. It is. And do you think that our parents really had it easier? I know a lot of them didn't. Where I come from, a lot of the older generation didn't even get a chance to go to school until they were adults. Their parents took them out to work on farms, to help take care of kids, to help bring money in. People have it EASY now, and it just gets under my skin to hear all the whining about it. There is this idea that parents and adults should be taking care of adult children - - helping them save money, helping them eat, helping them find shelter and buy clothes and have cars. WHEN THEN is it their responsibility?? I agree with Honey, in that it is certainly sponging. Sponging off of other people. To the part in bold though - - whole whole heartedly agree with you!!! Either extreme, my experiences and seeing the other extreme of it (living at home in your late 20's not even paying full rent) - if I ever were to have children, I'd work my tail off to try and achieve a balance in providing them with a well rounded sense of feeling prepared for the world on their own and knowing they are also valued enough that they aren't expected to be 'adults before their time'. Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Let's say it this way, if your grandfather now come to America dirtbroke in 2009, would he be able to carve out the empire he has now? More competiton. You mean like what most of the immigrants do now?! The problem is the spoiled kids of today don't want to take menial jobs and work their way up. They all think b/c they have some college degree they are entitled to some great paying job. so to answer your question, YES if my G'pa came here today, he would have succeeded in the same respect, because he was a determined and not all "the world owes me something" Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 No way, you are way off on this. yeah, how so? Link to comment
Batya33 Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Just a general question that hopefully is related to this thread but triggered from the previous post. At what point should you stop blaming your parents for not teaching you certain skills like independence, taking care of oneself? 18? 21? 55? At what point is that just an excuse to be a passive vessel that wasn't filled with the right stuff, so that you don't have to put in the effort to be an adult/evolve/grow? Not saying that the previous poster is "too old" to place blame (and not saying he is not, I'm not sure, although my sense is that 20s is a bit over the hill for that type of finger pointing -- I would feel differently had he been abused or something extreme like that). I found it empowering to stop blaming my parents and also to view them more as adult to adult rather than child-parent, so I could accept their limitations, flaws, from that perspective. A lot of that happened after I moved out - and as mentioned I was already 28 because I lived at home through grad school. Probably a mistake as far as personal growth but I caught up eventually. Edited to add: Great minds, ItsAllGrand (although you said it better than I did). Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Life's too short for that kind of work imo... You mean you're lazy? Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 You can't but she will continue to.. Wonder what his car insurance was?! Mine is 2200 a year!! Everything was relative to the times......my God, are you really that unaware???! Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Phewwwwwwwwwww, finally someone making some sense Like I said, these younger folks in here have NO CLUE how hard life really is. My Mom grew up so poor. Her and her brother went to work at 10. My Mom never finished high school. She grew up during the depression (THE REAL DEPRESSION not this little recession the US is having now), and she still managed to hold down two jobs at 14 yrs old ! She helped at the mills and the dry cleaners where they cleaned suits for the military. She moved out at 17, and supported her family. She married my Dad at 21, had 3 little kids and guess what she did while she worked two jobs with 3 kids and a sick husband at home, she started her own business., Yep, she went on to own a great biz. You young people today really need a reality check about how life does not owe you anything Link to comment
itsallgrand Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 You young people today really need a reality check about how life does not owe you anything LOL. I'm only recently 30 - so what the heck?! Y'know, I've probably cleaned some the rooms that some these people have stayed at. LOL. j/k. One guy I dated very briefly, he was close to my age (slightly younger) and was still living at home. I tried to not overthink it - he was in university finishing, he said he had a job. Well as I got to know him a bit more, I found out his job was just a little casual 'for fun' thing. He wanted to save for a condo once he finished school, so he was going to stay home longer. I asked him "Do you pay your share then to your folks?" He looks at me and sort of laughs. And then he goes on about how great this condo is going to be, and how he has these fantastic stereo systems and he wants a new car (again) too. And blah blah blah. It's not so much the living at home thing. Honestly. It's the mentality that some people have. Man, I was so so turned off. And I got this impression like he looked down on ME - I don't have a lot of fancy stuff. But I've made my own way and worked hard at it. I'm not ashamed - no one has carried my load while I stood by and racked up credit cards!! Link to comment
StrawberryYogurt Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 You mean you're lazy? Oh, so it's lazy not to want to get 7-8 hrs a sleep which is benefical to your health? It's lazy to actually want to have time to enjoy life? That's what is wrong with America these days, too much emphasis on working long hours. Unbelievable attitude to say someone is lazy just b/c they don't want to work 100+ hrs a week! I say it's crazy to expect anyone to work near that amount of hours. Link to comment
Dubb Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 You mean you're lazy? Hardly.. I actually worked some pretty hardcore hours as a teen. 80+ hours per week at times while going to school. I speak from experience, that life is too short...I still get hammered once in a while in my current career b/c it's an unpredictable job. I love what I do so it's no big deal. Kudos for trying tho. I can see you're still a little sensitive from our earlier posts.. Link to comment
Dubb Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Everything was relative to the times......my God, are you really that unaware???! Was it? So it's just as easy for people to get by today as it was then? hmmm???? You and I really see the current economic situation totally different. I'm the one who is unaware tho? funny stuff lol! Link to comment
StrawberryYogurt Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 yeah, how so? I don't have time to list the ways, but let me ask you this: Compared to 20+years ago, is it harder or easier to get into an Ivy league school? Compared to 20+ years ago, is it harder or easier for someone with just a high school education to become middle class or higher? Compared to 20+ years ago, is it harder or easier for a college grad without one internship during college to land a full time job in his or her major? The answer is obvious. Link to comment
Luke Skywalker Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 And I got this impression like he looked down on ME - I don't have a lot of fancy stuff. But I've made my own way and worked hard at it. I'm not ashamed - no one has carried my load while I stood by and racked up credit cards!! That's a toughie, getting into "debt" verses avoiding it by living at home. Some people value remaining out of debt and being able to pay statement balances on time as being financially responsible. Did you pay down the debt on those cards? Link to comment
itsallgrand Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 That's a toughie, getting into "debt" verses avoiding it by living at home. Some people value remaining out of debt and being able to pay statement balances on time as being financially responsible. Did you pay down the debt on those cards? No, I didn't get debt at all. That's my point. If I couldn't afford something - I either worked harder, tried harder, or didn't get what I wanted. This guy I dated briefly was living at home, going to uni, and had credit card debt - - all at the same time as not even paying his folks his fair share of the housing costs etc. I thought that was really selfish, honestly. Link to comment
Luke Skywalker Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Well, after reading through this thread, I think I'm going to move out from home for at least 30 days if I break up with my girlfriend. If I don't die after moving out for 30 days, then I'll see how much longer I can survive away from home. Since I have a girlfriend, I don't need to move out of this home to try something that could potentially increase my stock value to attract women into my life. My girlfriend is thinking of getting a basement apartment so I can go over there and wants to give me money too. However, there is some issues with her, that I may want to just meet and attract more women into my life. One thing that has stook out on this thread is that women are a bit easier on guys who live at home, but at least tried moving out, and I've even got that question before. Given there are personal growth issues involved, and other things that could also indirectly increase my stock value - such as inner game, by developing more masculine or manl attributes -- or even a neglected right of passage....now it seems like somewhat of a good idea to try this out and take the plunge at least once in my life. I'll keep this thread in mind. Also, want to try the solo-vacation thing out. Link to comment
doyathink Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Well said, Grand! I left home at 17...with a child! I have no regrets, and I was able to teach myself what I needed to know. They were always there for me if I needed anything when I'd fall...but they admired the fact that I was wanting to do it on my own. I fell many times, but thats how you learn. I've seen a few men who've lived at home well into their 30's and older who struggle big time with relationships because they seem to equate their new SO with taking care of them like their mother did. They're immature, whiny, and childish, and they never seem to fully grow up. Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 You're mature beyond your years At the end of ones life, "fancy stuff" cannot be counted, but class and integrity can Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 I don't have time to list the ways, but let me ask you this: Compared to 20+years ago, is it harder or easier to get into an Ivy league school? Compared to 20+ years ago, is it harder or easier for someone with just a high school education to become middle class or higher? Compared to 20+ years ago, is it harder or easier for a college grad without one internship during college to land a full time job in his or her major? The answer is obvious. Let me explain it this way, it doesn't take a degree in an Ivy League school to created a profitable future. It takes ambition and will. Ambition and will is not taught at school, it comes from within. I know PHD's who pack groceries and I know high school drop outs who make 3 million a yr. I'll let you fill in the blanks there. Link to comment
summerpeach Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Well said, Grand! I left home at 17...with a child! I have no regrets, and I was able to teach myself what I needed to know. They were always there for me if I needed anything when I'd fall...but they admired the fact that I was wanting to do it on my own. I fell many times, but thats how you learn. I've seen a few men who've lived at home well into their 30's and older who struggle big time with relationships because they seem to equate their new SO with taking care of them like their mother did. They're immature, whiny, and childish, and they never seem to fully grow up. I admire your strength and wished I was as strong at 17 as you were. It took me a few more years to gain the same strengths. Link to comment
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