Employers suck, and aren't "fair" at all.

[CluelessGuy321]

I'd have to see your interviewing skills too.

 

The way you present yourself and the confidence you exude is a major influence on if you're hired.

 

 

You're being a bit too down too...When I was your age, I did a lot of lowend jobs too.

 

My first job was as a canvaseer for the Republican Party. 2nd job was as an arcade attendent. 3rd job was Loss Prevention/Security. 4th job was Data Entry.

 

And on and on.

 

Now I'm a Project Manager for IBM, and part-time real estate appraiser. When I first started working, I was making a few hundred a month. I make well over six figures now, but it took 7 years to get where I am. I picked up life experience, interview experience, and work experience along the way.

 

In the end, it's all up to you. I'll just throw you some suggestions:

 

1.) Learn how to write up a resume.

2.) Learn how to dress for an interview.

3.) Practice public speaking skills.

4.) List what you're good at.

 

Try applying to temp agencies. They'll help you out in a few ways that I listed, and they're good entry level starting jobs.

Look up the following companies: Manpower, Apex Systems Inc, Apple One, Adecco, etc.

Look up a staffing agency, and try your hand.

 

I'd help ya out, but you gotta be so negative and defensive. You won't learn anything otherwise.

 

Perk up, kid.

[FortunateOne]

Well I understand your frustrations, but if you exhibit the kind of attitude that is coming accross in your post (I don't care, I hate myself, The world is going to end) then I can see why your interviews probably are not going very well.

 

If you aren't necessarily in need of money, but your parents are wanting you to be working - then how about an internship? The pay might not be good (or even zero) but the experience will give you that leg up you'll need to land your next job.

 

well - as one who hires - I gotta agree with Avman here. If you come in with attitude, you won't go very far. And if you HAVE or GET the job and don't take pride in what you do, you won't last.

 

If its just a matter of GETTING that first job - hang in there. There's BOUND to be something.

 

Do you drive? Could you deliver pizzas? What about stocking shelves? Anything to get you some experience and get yourself a good reference right??

 

I also agree with Avman....and you can hate me but your attitude needs to go.

 

I am an employer. I ALSO work on the floor and do the "employees" job.

I respect everything my employees do and tell them every chance I get.

 

You are complaining about your age and getting hired. I hired a young man in high school in October as a receptionist for us on weekends. He's NOT

exactly stylish....in fact he's a bit on the geeky side..BUT he has a drive to do well...and he has shown he's dependable, reliable and trustworthy. Those are extremely IMPORTANT traits.He also has a VERY positive attitude..and believe me.....that goes much further than even experience sometimes.

Maybe you are knocking on the wrong doors....but whatever the case is....

keep your chin up and remain POSITIVE!!! I promise it will do wonders.

 

 

These posts are so dead on. I too wouldn't hire someone so negative into my company. People this neagative are a cancer on other employees' morale and I'd suggest you make a healthy paradigm shift if you plan to enter a career. All I can suggest is to get some help to over come this attitude and accept the reality of the world. You can only control what's in your actions, not others actions you assume.

[srvcrow]

Well, I realize I'm a bit late on this thing (as well as this being my first post), but here goes:

 

Y'all can criticize the young man all you wish for his "bad attitude." The problem is this: He's absolutely correct is his observations. Now it's equally as true that none of us can do one thing to change any of everything that's wrong with corporate America, period.

 

But with all due respect, that's not what he's hoping for.

 

He's not asking or expecting employers to "change" to suit himself. He knows better than that. Y'all are just all sideways because here's a young man (I've got socks older than him) that sees the situation for what it is: A working environment in which employees are called "human resources." A computer is a "resource." An ink pen is a "resource." But a person? Give ME a damned break!

 

He sees, senses, intuitively knows that his "humanity" is coming in a far distant second-place to his perceived "value" as a "resource." And nearly everyone of you here is encouraging him to "play" that silly game, to continue to perpetuate the myth of a "work ethic" that died long ago when we began to equate intelligence with a college degree.

 

In essense, you're telling him that "character" and "attiude" matter when, in the final analysis, employers prefer college educations, period. Subtract that from the equation, and you're left exactly three qualities that will forever define your success, or lack of it, in today's work world: Compromise, conformity, and capitulation.

 

This young man sees all too well the double-standards, the hypocrisies, and the lies. Each of you here would insist, for example, that if he was working and planning on leaving that he give a two-week notice, correct? And yet most of you would simultaneously defend the employer who tells him, "Oh, sorry. But in order to 'maximize profits,' I'm moving my facility overseas. You're fired! Now get the hell out of my building!"

 

I've been working for about 41 years. I just recently started job #51. And you can argue, quote experts, speak from your positions as a "human resource" manager, CEO, and all the rest, and I'm telling you that no matter how "positive" of an attitude you have, how "dedicated" and "loyal" you might be to the "company," it's a pathetic "brave new world" out there and the days of any reciprocity from employer to employee in the matter of "ethics" are dead and gone.

 

It's like this: Of those 51 jobs, 16 of those places no longer exist. So no matter how "dedicated" and "loyal" and "positive" I may have been, that's sixteen times I'd have been out on my butt through no fault of my own. But we're oh so quick to defend "corporations" and blame everyday people.

 

So, to the young man who started the post:

 

You WILL find something. Trust me. And as others have so correctly said, don't look at these things as being something that might give you a sense of "fulfillment" or "satisfaction." If you do, you'll be sadly mistaken. It's a job, period, a way to earn and paycheck and you "mature" and have a more clear understanding of what you might want to do with yourself. (I NEVER use the phrase "grow up" because as YOU know already all that ever means is "give up." And please, NEVER "give up" your youthful dreams and visions of a world that damned well should and could be a whole bunch better if people would get their heads out of their butts and stop focusing on money and career! "He who dies with the most toys" is the biggest loser of all, period!)

 

Randy

[JadedStar]

I suggest you take some interviewing courses, and make sure you are not unintentionally BLOWING your interview by the way you are representing yourself.

 

I have to say anyone who thinks working fast food is beneath them and they will "commitsuicide" if they do sounds as spoiled and irrational ignaramuses you are screaming about.

 

 

Whew. Can you tell us all WHY they should be willing to take you on without any experience? Even McD's gives you SOME experience managing money and customers....

[srvcrow]

Can you tell us all WHY they should be willing to take you on without any experience? Even McD's gives you SOME experience managing money and customers....

 

But right there is this young man's dilemma and it's one we ALL know but like to forget, don't you think?

 

How does one get a job without experience, but how does one get experience until someone "gives you a break," is willing to take a "chance" on you?

 

You can't buy stuff on credit unless you have credit, but how can you get credit until someone let's you buy something with credit?

 

It's these double-standards that's driving this chap insane. That and nothing more.

 

He lives in a country that tells him he's "free" and has all these wonderful "opportunities," yet to get a job he must, oh, pee in a bottle (good-bye presumption of innocence and hello presumption of guilt), agree to investigations to his credit history (like THAT matters), tell everyone if he's white, black, purple, male, female, or anywhere in between, and all the rest.

 

Y'all should be more concerned about WHY he's so "stressed" and back way off on the defense of a status quo that is, in one way or the other, surely driving us all insane.

 

The difference between him (and me!) is we're not willing to accept that the way it IS is the way it has to "be" and that one's life consists of far greater things than simply working and making lots of money in order to buy lots of stay to distract us from the utter stupidity of it all.

 

HE really IS going to be just fine. It's the rest of the people who don't share and express similar sentiments that scare the hell out of me!

 

Randy

[JadedStar]

THERE IS NO DOUBLE STANDARD HERE. You start out in fast food or at the Dollar Tree. that is HOW you get the experience and THEN You can get an entry level corporate job. THAT is the message I am conveying to him. My son is 18 and works at Wendy's so I am not going to give this guy any different advice then I did my own son.

 

Jesus I did it and countless others. I didn't whine about not getting the good jobs until I got my experience on the GRUNT WORK.

 

If one doesn't want to get ones hands dirty then one can't complain when they keep getting turned down for the entry level corp jobs. I feel I am giving him solid advice because I WAS A RECRUITER for a long time. I would never hire a kid wtih ZERO experience even for a file clerk job in the corporate world. There had to be SOME experience and someone I could call for a reference before I would take a chance on that person for one of my hiring mangers' jobs.

[Batya33]

I started in fast food 25 years ago. After college I made very little money for the first few years, then I went to grad school for three years and after that was when my career took off. Trade off was three years with no income and paying tuition/going into debt. It was all worth it. There are some employers who aren't fair and I've met employees who aren't fair in the way they do their jobs/interact with others. I have trained and mentored many people over the last 10 years, including college student interns. I've given references to the people I trained who showed real motivation even if they made a number of mistakes as long as they learned from them.

 

I think it's relatively fair to expect people to pay their dues and to reward those who are motivated to master the skills required and work well with others and also those who go to school to improve their skills/training/knowledge. I think it's unfair to have the entitlement perspective - that it's all coming to you without having to do grunt work.

[Sweet Buttabean Jellayroll]

its called life and thats how it works......they'll hire a retarded person over you sometimes (no offense to retarded people) but its life and its not fair...not by any means.......

[JadedStar]

its called life and thats how it works......they'll hire a retarded person over you sometimes (no offense to retarded people) but its life and its not fair...not by any means.......

 

Yup and one of the first things we learn as an adult is "life is not always fair". Even so we have to perservere and go full steam ahead.

[srvcrow]

QUOTE=JadedStar;1612353

 

THERE IS NO DOUBLE STANDARD HERE.

 

Yes, there is. You said it yourself:

 

You start out in fast food or at the Dollar Tree.

 

But at the same time:

 

I would never hire a kid wtih ZERO experience even for a file clerk job in the corporate world.

 

You're starting with the presumption that a fast-food place will and does hire anyone and everyone who walks off the street. That's simply not true.

 

And then there's the expected and obvious arrogance--which is exactly what makes the young man who started this thread--and men like me--so angry we could spit nails.

 

Y'all spent all this time telling him he should feel "no shame" and so forth regarding these "menial" jobs (a sentiment with which I agree completely!), but then the truth slaps him right in the face and serves only to reinforce his frustration. I.E.:

 

that is HOW you get the experience and THEN You can get an entry level corporate job.

 

That's a polite and acceptable corporate way of saying people who work in offices and wear shirt and ties and so forth are better than the rest of us. I've been hearing that crap for all my life and I don't care how you try to say it or justify, it comes out the same old tired way: There are certain "professions" and, by extension, certain types of "employees" who are "better" than the rest. And THAT is the heart of of the matter.

 

THAT is the message I am conveying to him.

 

I agree completely! He's young. As us old people still call it: He has to pay his dues.

 

But he is NOT wrong for seeing the folly and madness involved with working in this country. All he's wondering is this:

 

Why in the hell is that I can't be accepted for who I am? Instead, there's this entire litany of rules I'm expected to obey, capricious and arbitrary standards to which I'm expected to conform, very few of which have anything at all with my ability to perform the duties of the job?

 

My son is 18 and works at Wendy's so I am not going to give this guy any different advice then I did my own son.

 

Yep. My daughters have heard the same thing!

 

Jesus I did it and countless others.

 

Yep. That's why I'm up to #51.

 

I didn't whine about not getting the good jobs until I got my experience on the GRUNT WORK.

 

Again, I think that's not the major thrust of his frustration. I think he understands that part of it perfectly--he might not like it, but I do think he "gets it."

 

If one doesn't want to get ones hands dirty then one can't complain when they keep getting turned down for the entry level corp jobs. I feel I am giving him solid advice because I WAS A RECRUITER for a long time.

 

Yes, and a few years from now he's going to be running into a whole new breed of double-speak and lies. And then you can answer questions he'll be asking, questions like:

 

"How the hell can I have a 'stable work history' AND a 'wide diversity of experience'"?

 

Yes, an actual ad here recently stated they wanted a "stable work history AND wide diversity of experience"!

 

Tell someone like you that I've had 10 jobs, and as far as you're concerned, that means I'm "unstable." If I document just one job, I haven't the "experience" you want.

 

The problem in American companies these days is NOT the employees, period. It's the silliness of the whole hiring process which, when all is said and done, comes to down to just one thing:

 

Given a dozen "cadidates," each with identical qualifications and backgrounds, each one being that "perfect" candidate, the one who gets hired is the one the company/interviewer likes the most, or dislikes the least.

 

When I'm sitting in an interview in response to ad I submitted via email, resume attached, and the lady asks "Are you comfortable using email and attachments," you will never live long enough to get me to find fault with the young people today who are seeing corporate America for the pathetic joke that it really is.

 

Me? Yes. I'm old, bitter, and cynical because a lifetime of working in this country and that "wide diversity" of fields and occupations has proven that companies and employers don't give a damn about anything or anyone except their corporate profits. Yes, there are really good "people" within these organizations. But that's NOT the issue here, now is it?

 

There had to be SOME experience and someone I could call for a reference before I would take a chance on that person for one of my hiring mangers' jobs.

 

Why? Do you so lack confidence in your own perception of people, your own sensibilities and intuitions, that you'd rather "trust" someone else's? That's doing yourself and potential applicants a huge disservice! They're talking TO YOU and to rely on information being passed behind their back is relying on hearsay! Hell, even in a court of law you're entitled to confront your accusers. And if you're trying to tell me that employers can not be petty, spiteful, and vindictive and will LIE like hell about previous employers, then the only thing I can say is your experience and mine has been completely opposite. And if that's the case, I'm very happy that your experience has been so great.

 

But please don't tell the rest of us--especially the young folks just starting out, those watching corporate America sell us out for the sake of increasing profits--that the "American dream" is still alive and well. It's not!

 

Young people are, I admit, sometime incredibly naive about the "real world." But never think for one minute that makes them stupid about the reality of it.

 

Randy

[srvcrow]

QUOTE=Jay Houston;1612468

 

they'll hire a retarded person over you sometimes (no offense to retarded people)

 

You're exactly correct. Care to tell us WHY they do this?

 

Randy

[JadedStar]

THERE IS NO DOUBLE STANDARD HERE.

 

Yes, there is. You said it yourself:

 

You start out in fast food or at the Dollar Tree.

 

But at the same time:

 

I would never hire a kid wtih ZERO experience even for a file clerk job in the corporate world.

 

 

You did not read it right. NO there is not a double standard. I said i would never hire a kid without experience IN THE CORPORATE WORLD!! i did not recruit for the dollar tree or fast food, if I did then I WOULD hire them.

 

POint is that you dont get corporate jobs wtihout experience. You get experience at places that typically hire people WIHTOUT experience, i.e. Wendy's, the Dollar Tree, Etc.

[JadedStar]

Why? Do you so lack confidence in your own perception of people, your own sensibilities and intuitions, that you'd rather "trust" someone else's? That's doing yourself and potential applicants a huge disservice! They're talking TO YOU and to rely on information being passed behind their back is relying on hearsay! Hell, even in a court of law you're entitled to confront your accusers. And if you're trying to tell me that employers can not be petty, spiteful, and vindictive and will LIE like hell about previous employers, then the only thing I can say is your experience and mine has been completely opposite. And if that's the case, I'm very happy that your experience has been so great.

 

Because there are certain jobs that REQUIRE experience and you or me thinking it is not fair is not going to change it.

 

I started out in a convenience store JUST for the experience. Did i like working there? NO! But it was necessary to get my foot in the door somewhere else because showing up to a corporation with a blank resume was not cutting it.

 

You can argue with me or realize that there is truth to what I am saying. Either/or, it does not matter to me. All the griping in the world is not going to get this kid employed into his dream job until he puts together an action plan to get there.

 

People who do less griping and put more effort in always get farther. I will bet my gut instincts are accurate enough when I say that when he interviews he is probably not putting his best foot forward and taht entitlement attitude that we can see thru the computer screen is more than likely VERY obvious to a face to face recruiter.

[srvcrow]

QUOTE=JadedStar;1612820

 

You did not read it right. NO there is not a double standard. I said i would never hire a kid without experience IN THE CORPORATE WORLD!!

 

Okay. Agreed. But can you not thereforeeee understand what this young man meant about his embarrassment and so forth that would come about by working at fast-food, etc, that he was concerned about what his friends would think and say?

 

He knows as well as you and I do that there is a, well, "stigma" attached to such employment. Yes, HE needs to get over it, no doubt about it. Ah, but so does the rest of the world, right?

 

My point, at least, is that the whole damned country has simply got to get over this whole "class-thing" based upon college degrees and titles and how one occupation is "better" and requires "better" people than the next. It's no more complicated than that.

 

i did not recruit for the dollar tree or fast food, if I did then I WOULD hire them.

 

Worse part is that they can be as "pickey" as for the corporate positions you're talking about! And here again, young or old, people DO stop and think, and FEEL "What the hell is THIS about? You want me to pee in a bottle, do this, do that, blah blah blah, for barely more than minimum wage?"

 

And then we all sit back and wonder why there are so many folks--as one previous poster mentioned--with that "entitlement" mentality.

 

It's just a sad state of affairs, that's all.

 

But about not getting corporate jobs without experience? Yes, with that precious college degree you can, right? And then what happens? Some poor slob who's been there for twenty years still has to train the guy in the ways the employer wants things done. And that same employer will express amazement that the man who's been there all those years seems "unhappy."

 

Oh, it's all so unnecessary. Agreed that's the way it "is," but still unnecessary.

[srvcrow]

QUOTE=JadedStar;1612826][i

 

[/b]You can argue with me or realize that there is truth to what I am saying. [/b]

 

 

Not arguing with you one bit. I'm far more painfully aware of the truth and reality of the thing than is the "average" person.

 

I am, however, plain old sick and tired of everyone insisting that the way it "is" is the way it "has" to be and that the "only" thing all of us can do is bow down and continue to play by the capricious and arbitrary rules of folks who don't give one damn about you or me or anyone else.

 

And I rarely, rarely encounter anyone who has the courage to engage in THAT discussion!

 

...until he puts together an action plan to get there.

 

Agreed, of course. But like I said, where is it written, and WHY, is it always, always, always up to "us" to conform to what "they" want? It's a simple question.

 

People who do less griping and put more effort in always get farther.

 

In this case, and in context, "put more effort" is an polite and acceptable way to say compromise, conform, and capitulate. Certainly you haven't forgotten how "rebellious" you were at that age? Have you forgotten how difficult is it to accept the painful reality that you and I are discussing? It sucks, period. You may have to do it, of course. But to tell people to NOT complain about it? That's tantamount to saying "get on your knees and kiss his a** because HE 'gave' you a 'job' and in return you owe him your soul."

 

Jesus, are we trying to even take away a person's perogative to express displeasure at working for a bunch of greedy jerks in this country? Are we THAT afraid we might not be able to find and keep a job?

 

(All these are questions I ask myself all the time, far more rhetorical than truly inquisitive. Just think of it as me thinking out loud.)

 

I will bet my gut instincts are accurate enough when I say that when he interviews he is probably not putting his best foot forward and taht entitlement attitude that we can see thru the computer screen is more than likely VERY obvious to a face to face recruiter.

 

Oh, no doubt. And all that means his biggest crime is not being able to pretend to be something and someone he's not. Contrary to all popular belief, employers do NOT want honesty of character and integrity, they want people who are easily molded into "good" employees. They don't necessarily have to actually "do" anything; just don't cause problems.

 

In my experience, and from my days of hiring and firing, give me a grumpy-a**ed bitter person any day of the week who accepts that working is indeed a necessary evil and who hates every minute of it because THAT'S the person who will ALWAYS give you that "honest day's work for an honest day's pay." The rest are too damned busy playing "office politics" and schmoozing and all the rest that goes along with being "successful" under the new "business model."

 

In short, "does not play well with others" almost always translates into "more focused on accomplishing something than pleasing others."

 

Regrettably, most bosses these days are bullies who mistake authority with superiority and sycophants are the only ones rewarded while those who actually do the work are unappreicated and left behind.

 

Again, I'm not arguing with you one little bit about the reality of it.

 

I do, however, and as you can tell, get angry that people choose to summarily dismiss it out of hand and continue to place ALL the blame on PEOPLE instead of where the real problem is: Employers and corporate America.

[JadedStar]

I do not believe you when you say those places are as picky as others. My daughter got a job at dollar tree at 16 with zero experience. My son got a job at wendys with zero experience. They put in three apps and both were employed.

 

that is why i specifically mentioned those two places. My first job was a convenience store and i had no experience. That is three people right off the bat who all got employment never having worked a day in their lives.

 

Of course there is a stigma associated with it. We all had to have some stigma on the job before we could climb the ladder. You have to find the ladder first before you can even put your foot on it.

 

I say pride is getting in his way. And you know what? Since life is all about learning how to be strong no better time than the present for this young man to stop worrying about what his friends think. Over and over in his life he is going to have to do things and not worry so much aobut someone else's opinion. Why on earth would we want to remove every obstacle facing a person when it is those OBSTACLES and having overcome them that will define who he is as a person one day?

 

You can never appreciate a really GOOD job until you have had a few bad ones.

[JadedStar]

Corporate america is all about money. Without it, and without making a lot of it, there would BE NO corporate america. You say why place the blame on the people instead of the corporations. I say why not stop finding something or someone to blame and just do the best you can.

 

Even people with education and experience are going thru work stigmas..How many people are laid off and have to work far beneath their level of education and experience? yet they complain a lot less many times than the kids who dont want to flip burgers.

 

Economy is what it is. IF employers don't figure out how to make the most money there will BE NO companies to work for. We live in a very competitive workforce right now and it is not just the fault of the corporations. They are tyring to stay competitive in a marketplace that is unstable and ever changing. They do what they can for their employees but at the end of the day if the bottom line is NOT MET there will be NO employees and ALL of us will be working for $3 an hour.

 

People get ticked at working hard so companies can get fat. I say i dont mind helping a company grow becuase that is the only thing I CAN DO to help keep my slot stable.

[efftheworld]

 

People get ticked at working hard so companies can get fat. I say i dont mind helping a company grow becuase that is the only thing I CAN DO to help keep my slot stable.

 

Pardon my previous post, I should have edited it but it was exactly what I was thinking at the time.

 

But anyway,

 

See the above snip. Why is this? Why is it so bad to be angry at the fact that I don't want to work my fingers to the bone to pay for someone else's yacht while I can barely afford my piece of junk in the parking lot? And why is it that I am a "failure" for not assimilating to what every one else does?

[srvcrow]

Corporate america is all about money.

 

You are so cool! You're one of the very vew people just to have the courage to come right out and say it! Bravo!

 

Without it, and without making a lot of it, there would BE NO corporate america.

 

And I, for one, think that would be a GREAT thing! (By now, you've grasped I'm comparing the old "ma/pa" to that new "business model" thing.) I guess it takes the form of a question: How much is enough, for God's sake?

 

You say why place the blame on the people instead of the corporations. I say why not stop finding something or someone to blame and just do the best you can.

 

Oh, again I couldn't agree more, with just this one relatively minor qualification: When "corporate America" lets go of that lingering "it's your fault for not pulling up those damned boot-straps" thing, I'll shut-up and fade away into the night.

 

It's the business world that has changed, not people. And yet this "new" business world would have you and me believe that "we" are the problem. And we're not. (Except to the degree that grumpy old men like me refuse to play by their rules. And after all these years, it's become a game I enjoy very much. )

 

yet they complain a lot less many times than the kids who dont want to flip burgers.

 

True. But in my experience, if one can find just a small degree of commonality (in this case, just a small bit of agreement with the young man), people will always, always meet you halfway. And I'm convinced if he really came to grasp that all of us "older" folks understood how he felt, why he felt that way, he'd acknowledge that it really is time for him to "mature" and get on with things.

 

IF employers don't figure out how to make the most money there will BE NO companies to work for.

 

Of course that's true, but you're talking about an era in which those at the top are often pulling down six-figures or more while those at the bottom are making just above minimum wage and it's a really difficult sell to convince the "common man" that there's just no money for a "raise" under those conditions. I.E., if it's a matter of "sacrifices" to be made for the good of all, how about those who are supposed to be "leaders" doing a wee-bit of "leading by example"? Again, it's these sorts of hypocrisies that people see, that's all.

 

We live in a very competitive workforce right now and it is not just the fault of the corporations.

 

Well of course it is. Whom else would you blame? The governments? Hell, they're in bed with corporations the world over. If anything, it's "corporate warfare" that's going on, a struggle to see not only who can be "successful," but who can dominate and exterminate all the competititon.

 

People get ticked at working hard so companies can get fat. I say i dont mind helping a company grow becuase that is the only thing I CAN DO to help keep my slot stable.

 

Than this is where you and I are are completely different. You have no problems with being viewed as nothing more than a serf, a peasant, a "resource." I do. For the sake of mere material things and monetary gain, you're willing to, for lack of a better word, "obey" without question. I'll live and die in a cardboard box before I do that.

 

But here's the rub:

 

I have no gripe with people who live by the values and standards such as yours.

 

Inevitably, the hositility comes from people like you who just can't, and won't even try, to understand people like me. There are those among us, believe it or not, who do place other considerations in life ahead of money and stuff.

 

We agree to disagree. I like that. A happy ending!

[RelaxByWater84]

My first job wasn't glamorous by any means. My first job was mowing lawns for elderly people in my nieghborhood. It let me get the experience I needed to form a work ethic. I learned to schedule my work when they needed it done. I made descent money for it, heck I was glad to have a job and the chance to earn some money. I learned in high school how to balance my job and my school work, I did take college classes while in high school so I had some tough courses. From there I was able to obtain employment at another place where I learned how to deal with nasty people.

[JadedStar]

My first job wasn't glamorous by any means. My first job was mowing lawns for elderly people in my nieghborhood. It let me get the experience I needed to form a work ethic. I learned to schedule my work when they needed it done. I made descent money for it, heck I was glad to have a job and the chance to earn some money. I learned in high school how to balance my job and my school work, I did take college classes while in high school so I had some tough courses. From there I was able to obtain employment at another place where I learned how to deal with nasty people.

 

Thank you coffeegirl for using a term that I failed to use earlier in this thread and should have. "WORK ETHIC".

 

That is the key. Corporations ONLY have references to go on when they hire. Someone who has NEVER worked cannot prove work ethic. Someone who worked blood, sweat and tears at McD's for a year as an associate and then was promoted to shift lead can PROVE work ethic by their references. Who would YOU hire? A 19 year old who has never worked or a 19 year old who worked at McDs for a year and was promoted twice? Come on, you KNOW that if they interviewed EQUALLY WELL you would rather take your chance on the one with some evidence that they can do it.

 

I told a mechanic a long time ago who touted that he did not need any certifications or licensing because HE KNEW he could do a good job (Screw the system he said!) that those certs may NOT make you a better mechanic, but it will SET YOU APART from the other people applying for that steady job becuase you have some concrete PROOF. If he is up for a promotion and so is his peer and the peer has an AC cert and state inspection license, but their work ethic and skill is equal, his buddy IS getting it.

 

This cracks me up how people hollar corporate america is "evil" for not hiring people with NO experience. When you interview you are SELLING YOURSELF. DO you really think an employer SHOULD hire a 19 year old kid who has zero references, never has worked before over someone who has a degree and has several references?

 

That does not mean that having a degree and references is PROOF that they are a better risk than the one without it, but it is ALL an employer has to go on. That and how well they interview.

 

I don't care if a kid at 19 is a GENIUS. There is NO substitute for good old fashioned work experience. I know young people way smarter than I am but they do NOT HAVE MY BUSINESS SAVVY and will likely never get it until they have gone thru several years of REAL WORLD BUSINESS experience.

 

I don't buy that embarrassment factor because if you want to succeed in life you will do ANY Job you have very well regardless of your title.

Those of you who envy OR hate the CEO with the yacht - they worked their butts off to get to where they are and a lot of times they STOOD OUT FROM THE PACK by making sacrifices (unless they were born into it and we can throw a tantrum about it but that iS CALLED LIFE, some have it easier SO WHAT work harder!), burning the midnight oil, sacrificing their own vacation time to climb the ladder. So when they reach it yes they should be able to spend their yield. Why would ANYONE be a CEO of a company to make 60K a year? They wouldn't bother taking on all of that headache. Why would they sacrifice so much of their life to make what someone else makes who punches in from 9 to 5 and goes home? It would be like thinking a doctor will go thru all of those years of schooling if they thought that doctors only earned 30K in their prime. IT IS CALLED PAYOFF. Some doctors do it for altruism but about 80% do it so that they can live in the right neighborhood, drive the right car, and send their kids to the right schools. They would not spend that many years of their lives and that much money on college to make 35K a year. AND i dont blame them. They earn it. I could never be a doctor because I couldn't be that disciplined. I work hard but no way could I go thru medschool .. I like to sleep! LOL

 

If you hate progress that is fine. But some of us believe in working hard and getting our due without whining. I don't envy the CEO's of companies because I have worked alongside them and i made the choice to not sacrifice quality family time, so I knew i would make less. It is commonsense. I cant make what they do and want to still be home with my family evenings and weekends. If they want to sacrifice their family time, it is their perogative.

 

But to Srvcrow, yes we can agree to disagree and there are no hard feelings. I am just posting this for any young person (or old) who might want a different take on the job market.

[JadedStar]

LOL Dako. It is an internet forum. It is okay to whine here. bWAAAHHH

 

I don't expect everyone to AGREE with my statements, I just post them for those people WHO MIGHT get something out of it.

 

I am quite okay with being a renegade and a different ball of wax. I know not everyone agrees with my sentiments....

[Dako]

I'm unemployed, so I lack the insight of the gainfully involved workforce.

 

When I'm raking in the bucks and kissing the boss's sweet hindquarters, I feel more in tune with a fair and just job market, but after 6 months of jobhunting and retraining, my "objectivity" is far from it.

 

I've interviewed and hired, fired and all that stuff in the past, and often hope I was fair to people like myself.

Now I just want to pay my bills until I fall off my perch.

[JadedStar]

I'm unemployed, so I lack the insight of the gainfully involved workforce.

 

When I'm raking in the bucks and kissing the boss's sweet hindquarters, I feel more in tune with a fair and just job market, but after 6 months of jobhunting and retraining, my "objectivity" is far from it.

 

I've interviewed and hired, fired and all that stuff.

Now I just want to pay my bills until I fall off my perch.

 

To be honest where you are is where anyone can be. And i hope you find something soon. For as much as I am realistic about the job force i still know that it is a very unstable economy. I have not gone without my share of layoffs and jobhunting.

 

It is depressing, but I try to realize that it is what it is.

 

What bothers me is the outsourcing of american jobs overseas. That is not just about corporations making money it is about sheer greed.

 

But there will eventually come a time when that comes full circle because if americans are laid off for offshore counterparts, they won't be shopping, and spending money, thereforeeee the need for credit cards, retailers and the like will wane, and they will be FORCED to bring jobs back here.

 

I don't even know if you live in america or elsewhere, but if i had to say i have a pet peeve about corp america it is the offshore project.

[Dako]

I was left confused by an Indian fellow in customer support this morning.

Right now I'm sweating healthcare, because I'm 54.

 

I'm in the US, and wonder what happened to my country.