My brain versus my heart are having a conflict, please help

[catfeeder]

3 hours ago, boltnrun said:

Jumping on to say, I find it discouraging that some people's criteria for determining if an elderly woman is worth dating is whether or not she "still looks good" or if she looks younger than her true age. To me that is awfully dismissive. Most elderly people look, well, elderly. Does that mean they're unworthy of romantic love? I guess if I make it to my 70s and I don't look like I'm in my 50s I should accept that I'm completely undateable and should resign myself to sitting at home alone watching Lawrence Welk reruns with my ten cats 😜

However, OP, that doesn't seem to be YOUR criteria. You seem to appreciate her joyful spirit and are not attracted to her based on her appearance. So I commend you for that. 

I agree. I've fallen into mad crushes on men who I wouldn't have given a second look on a subway. But I found them freakishly smart and funny. I learned that I don't have a 'physical type.' While that is liberating on one hand, one the other, it means that my attraction is pretty limited to the rarest of men. I can appreciate beauty in the same way that I can love art--without necessarily wanting it as my partner.

[ShySoul]

17 hours ago, AndyPandy said:

I had a so-called friend who sneered at me on a misogynistic level for being attracted to older women and recognising their worth as romantic choices

He's the one missing out then. There are many advantages to being with an older woman. 😉

13 hours ago, boltnrun said:

I find it discouraging that some people's criteria for determining if an elderly woman is worth dating is whether or not she "still looks good" or if she looks younger than her true age.

I've experienced the reverse. She was interested when she thought I was in my 20s based on looks. When she found out I was about to hit 40, she changed her tune pretty quick. So looking younger then your age doesn't always help you either.

People are going to look how they look. How good one looks is all subjective. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder afterall. Personally, I'd rather be with someone not fitting the sterotype of what looks good who is older but has a beautiful heart, then a hot, young supermodel with a poor attitude.

[rainbowsandroses]

Just wanted to clarify that I absolutely believe a woman in her 60s, 70s, 80s and beyond can find love and deserving of such love!

The only reason I mentioned appearance is because OP had said she was "older" and he was concerned about what other people would think of him dating a much older women.

So I asked if she actually looked older because not all 70ish women do. And that people probably wouldn't care regardless.

That's all I meant again to clarify. 

I feel badly that some took my comment to mean a women 70ish and beyond isn't deserving of love if she doesn't look young and beautiful.

Which I don't believe at all.

I also mentioned the importance of a woman's positive attitude and zest for life which OP confirmed she posseses which are important to him and the basis of his attraction.

No matter what her age.

[Batya33]

5 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

The only reason I mentioned appearance is because OP had said she was "older" and he was concerned about what other people would think of him dating a much older women.

To me the answer is simple -if a person is that focused on what others would think about their choice don't proceed.  I felt that way about dating men who looked or dressed a certain way where -unless they changed that - I'd feel uncomfortable bringing the person to a work event etc.  For 7 years I dated a man who was objectively not good looking and short.  I brought him proudly to a work event. 

A very pretty coworker saw us and had never met him and stared at me with a look that very clearly said "what are you thinking being with someone who looks like that" (yes I was objectively more attractive).  I gave her a look back of pride -pride in my partner. Cause that's how I felt.  If I had been ashamed to be seen with him or "OMG what will other people think" - it wouldn't have been fair of me to date him.

I am not judging someone who makes that decision - just giving my opinion on how to proceed if the level of discomfort is that much. 

[catfeeder]

3 hours ago, Batya33 said:

If I had been ashamed to be seen with him or "OMG what will other people think" - it wouldn't have been fair of me to date him.

This reminds me of times when I was on the fence about a guy, but I'd continue dating him to find clarity. Often, that came in the form of extreme discomfort during time spent with my family. One guy spent an evening grossly patronizing my mother, who is smart as a whip and was admirable in her attempts to avoid rolling her eyes. Another took a face plant on the way down the stairs to our dock, which, had I really been into him, would have inspired sympathy rather than embarrassment. Others just stood out as not a good match in other ways, but the point is, sometimes I just didn't know what I didn't know until 'what other people might think' came to the forefront as, in actuality, what ~I~ was thinking, myself.

[Batya33]

42 minutes ago, catfeeder said:

s I just didn't know what I didn't know until 'what other people might think' came to the forefront as, in actuality, what ~I~ was thinking, myself.

Yes that was true for me as well.  But if someone is that concerned about what others will think about their partner's physical features then that person should own that he values approval based on a notion of -sort of -"arm candy" and on the flip side if he's seen in an age gap situation where the woman looks "old" he'll be uncomfortable -then that sort of arrangement isn't for him.  Others don't care at all what others think of their partner's looks.  

(As an aside I was totally into a guy who was totally rude and patronizing to my father when they met -during a fancy lunch - and I was soooo embarrassed that my boyfriend would think poorly of my father -finally-later when I realized how arrogant he was I  realized that my bf's attitdue was a total red flag -oh and also my future husband obviously was into me even after I walked through a screen door at his cousin's house -first time we met....sigh)

[ShySoul]

5 hours ago, catfeeder said:

sometimes I just didn't know what I didn't know until 'what other people might think' came to the forefront as, in actuality, what ~I~ was thinking, myself.

I think the key is that your feelings still came from you, you just needed a little help from others before you could recognize it. As long as a person is making a decision on what they want, it's good. It's a problem when people make their choice based solely on what someone else will think or believe.

I was once the one being evaulated, where a friend got invited along for the purpose of seeing her opinion of me. And hearing that the evaulation was "you can do better" certainly doesn't make a guy feel good. I didn't even do anything wrong. I tried to be nice and polite. But I didn't fit her ideal as I was more shy and reserved then what she was used to. So I wasn't good enough. Luckily the girl I liked didn't listen.

In the end, it's really about what we believe is right for us. 

[catfeeder]

30 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

I think the key is that your feelings still came from you, you just needed a little help from others before you could recognize it. As long as a person is making a decision on what they want, it's good. It's a problem when people make their choice based solely on what someone else will think or believe.

True, and these experiences involved no input from my family beyond their kind interactions with the guys. The outcomes came from me seeing them in a more decisive light.

Quote

I was once the one being evaulated, where a friend got invited along for the purpose of seeing her opinion of me. And hearing that the evaulation was "you can do better" certainly doesn't make a guy feel good. I didn't even do anything wrong. I tried to be nice and polite. But I didn't fit her ideal as I was more shy and reserved then what she was used to. So I wasn't good enough. Luckily the girl I liked didn't listen.

In the end, it's really about what we believe is right for us. 

I'm so sorry you went through that. I've never spotlighted a guy I've dated that way. Meeting friends and family is enough of a milestone without a scorecard--and worse, reporting to him what another has said, or even worse, having him overhear such comments. That's rude, and it speaks more of that person than it says about you. I'm glad she disregarded the friend.

[Cherylyn]

On 5/23/2024 at 7:05 PM, rainbowsandroses said:

Respect your opinion @Cherylynbut she's 73 not 93.  I dunno maybe it's demographics but 73 is hardly considered "old" in my neck of the woods, and as I said many women look beautiful and are in incredible shape, healthy with a zest for life well into their 60s, 70s, and even 80s.

Anything can happen, he's younger but he could develop a serious illness or become injured and SHE would end up having to take care of HIM!!

He may age faster, I mean who the heck knows.

I also believe having 5-10-15 happy years together is better than NO years together.  Especially because one or both fear others/society will negatively judge them.

It's not often we meet someone "special" who makes our hearts skip a beat.  Not for me anyway or most people I know.  In fact, it's very rare.

And when it happens, again who the hell cares what anyone else thinks or what society thinks which is what the OP's main concern was.

For that reason, I personally think he should go for it, JMO as always.

 

I respect your opinion, too @rainbowsandroses.  73 is not far from 80's and beyond.  🥴  People seem to age at a faster clip from that point on if not sooner sometime during their 70's.  In my neck of the woods,  I've observed 10+ years age differences and at first,  it's wonderful.  My parents are 10+ years apart.  My relative and husband are 10+ years apart.  I've observed this transition with my own eyes.  👀 👁️👁️Then the inevitable sets in with illness,  various geriatric ailments,  slowing down,  aches 'n pains,  degenerative arthritis,  increased immobility so on and so forth.  Generally,  the younger partner or spouse ends up burdened with the bulk of the work carrying the load for two people which can break anyone.  Responsibilities for the younger person increases exponentially which isn't enjoyable.  😒

I'm all for happiness but one needs to think things through and envision the future.  No one in their right mind enjoys the reality of impending old age,  its debilitating health woes and usually the younger partner or spouse is saddled with this struggle,  hardship and responsibility.  If the younger person doesn't mind being in caretaker mode sooner than they'd like,  go for it.  If it's not the type of future this OP @Single Guy Needs Help wants,  then think long and hard and possibly reconsider. 

Just keep in mind physical limitations and how life isn't always wonderful when faced with this reality check.  😕

[ShySoul]

59 minutes ago, Cherylyn said:

Then the inevitable sets in with illness,  various geriatric ailments,  slowing down,  aches 'n pains,  degenerative arthritis,  increased immobility so on and so forth.  Generally,  the younger partner or spouse ends up burdened with the bulk of the work carrying the load for two people which can break anyone.  Responsibilities for the younger person increases exponentially which isn't enjoyable

I think thats why the traditional marriage vows include the part about in sickness and in health. When you love someone, you accept that things aren't always going to be perfect. You both know that it's possible one of you will develop a serious illnes or start to decline faster. You recognize the burden it will place on the other person. But you take the risk and are willing to accept the responsibilty. You do so because you care so much about the other, that the added weight is worth more then the emptiness you would feel without the person. You would rather they go through it with you to help them along, then to still experience the decline but do so alone. And you know the other person would do the same for you.

Of course it's something you should think about. Some people might not be able to handle it. But it's no reason to at least start something and see what happens. 

[Cherylyn]

On 5/25/2024 at 8:01 PM, ShySoul said:

I think thats why the traditional marriage vows include the part about in sickness and in health. When you love someone, you accept that things aren't always going to be perfect. You both know that it's possible one of you will develop a serious illnes or start to decline faster. You recognize the burden it will place on the other person. But you take the risk and are willing to accept the responsibilty. You do so because you care so much about the other, that the added weight is worth more then the emptiness you would feel without the person. You would rather they go through it with you to help them along, then to still experience the decline but do so alone. And you know the other person would do the same for you.

Of course it's something you should think about. Some people might not be able to handle it. But it's no reason to at least start something and see what happens. 

Vows are beautiful at the altar. ⛪ If there's 10+ years age difference,  just be prepared to eat your words later which isn't fun. 

I'm merely sharing what I've observed with my own parents,  extended family members and what they went through.  I've heard and seen it all. 

In the beginning,  age difference doesn't matter.  However,  as years creep on by,  age and inevitable age related maladies and illnesses catch up and the able bodied one is burdened with carrying the load for the two of them and the entire household; often times financially as well. 

Remain practical and pragmatic.  Unfortunately,  love does not conquer all.  Reality sets in which is not a picnic.  🤨

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, Cherylyn said:

In the beginning,  age difference doesn't matter.  However,  as years creep on by,  age and inevitable age related maladies and illnesses catch up and the able bodied one is burdened with carrying the load for the two of them and the entire household; often times financially as well. 

^^Not necessarily @Cherylyn.

In many cases, the younger person (man or woman) could acquire a terminal illness first which is precisely what happened with my late brother whose wife was almost ten years older and she ended up caring for him!!

He was in his 40s, she is in her 50s.

They had a beautiful 10 years together, the last two were hard but talking to her now, she wouldn't have traded it for anything or anyone. 

IMO when you find someone who shares your values with respect to love and commitment and who possesses integrity and a strong character, hang on to that person because it's very very rare.

Way more important than their chronological age IMO. 

Not to mention, people age differently, some faster, some slower which isn't even just my opinion, it's a scientific fact (their biological age).

I just recently read about this!  

 

 

 

[graphicdesigner]

On 5/23/2024 at 9:21 PM, ShySoul said:

Also, things can happen to anyone at anytime, regardless of age. My brother has a stroke at 50. My friend needed cataract surgery in her early 40s. My niece had a brain tumor and passed away at 5. Meanwhile there are people in their 80s and 90s running marathons. 

I agree with this completely, and I know firsthand how true this is. My husband was 52 years old when he was diagnosed with early onset Alzheimer's, and passed away at 58. He would have turned 61 this past January. I never ever thought I'd have to take care of my ailing husband at age 50. I thought we were going to grow old together. We talked about that all the time. I never in my wildest dreams expected this to happen so early on, at such a young age. And he was in tip-top shape. Played sports his entire life, was still playing rugby after 15+ years, and worked out at the gym every single morning at 5 am. He always had a runner's build and a six-pack stomach. Even until the day he died. 

I never ever want to go through that heartache again. Obviously, we were married for over 20 years when he was diagnosed, so of course, I took care of him. He was my husband. It's what you do. But now that I've been through that, I don't ever want to go through it again. Of course we can't see the future and see who will get sick, etc. But I know for a fact, that I'm cautious when I date, because the last thing I want is to date someone with health problems.

[Cherylyn]

1 hour ago, rainbowsandroses said:

^^Not necessarily @Cherylyn.

In many cases, the younger person (man or woman) could acquire a terminal illness first which is precisely what happened with my late brother whose wife was almost ten years older and she ended up caring for him!!

He was in his 40s, she is in her 50s.

They had a beautiful 10 years together, the last two were hard but talking to her now, she wouldn't have traded it for anything or anyone. 

IMO when you find someone who shares your values with respect to love and commitment and who possesses integrity and a strong character, hang on to that person because it's very very rare.

Way more important than their chronological age IMO. 

Not to mention, people age differently, some faster, some slower which isn't even just my opinion, it's a scientific fact (their biological age).

I just recently read about this!  

 

 

 

I respect your opinion, @rainbowsandroses and I too can say ^ ^ ^ ^  not necessarily either.  I'm happy that you have great experiences with age differences.  I was merely sharing what my parents and extended family's experiences were which wasn't rosy as the older spouse obviously aged faster with all sorts of debilitating ills which ailed them.   I watched my poor mother carry the load for my devastatingly sick father and household while raising 3 children.  She had to tough it out on her own and it was a very hard life. 😥 I felt sorry for my mother. 

Then there's my extended family member who initially had a good first few years with her husband and then it went all downhill from there to how it is today which is quite miserable to put it mildly.  🤬  It's not wonderful and unfortunately,  whenever struggle and hardship strikes,  suddenly a couple engages in cross words with one another.  It isn't pretty and happens all too frequently.

I too admire those who stick it out for better or for worse,  in sickness and in health just like the pastor requested a couple to repeat their vows at the altar.  While it all sounds so lovely,  reality can be quite cruel.  While it's a real testament and test of real love to the bitter end,  not everyone is cut out for it.  I admire those who promise for richer or poorer and in sickness and in health.  It is ideal.  However,  not everyone can tolerate nor endure very heavy impositions and burdens thrust upon one individual.  Outlook on the marriage isn't favorable.  Bitterness and resentment sets in and former gushing over one another is history.  This is what I had observed.  It isn't enjoyable.

Just know what you've signed up for, sweat and toil away later.  Some people don't mind its grueling reality check while others prefer to avoid strife and difficulty by obviously marrying within their age bracket.  To each his or her own. 😉 👍

[yogacat]

It's an interesting thought and someone just made me think of the taking care of someone much older than you at this stage in your life. Like, I am doing it for my father because he is my heart but I am single and I am not sure I can imagine doing this for someone who I am simply not blood related to.

If we were going out for a few years, absolutely, but it is a tall order to just start dating someone and within 3-5 years or so of being with them, you're taking care of them in their final years.

That's a valid concern.

I suppose if you meet that someone special when they are already in the later stages of life and you truly fall in love with them, then it may not feel as daunting. But it IS very taxing and it's something to consider when thinking about a potential future partner.

It may not be for everyone, and that's okay. It is definitely a selfless and challenging role to take on, but I believe if the love and connection are strong enough, it can also be incredibly rewarding and fulfilling. It just depends on the individual and their personal feelings and capabilities.

[Cherylyn]

@Single Guy Needs Help and @rainbowsandroses  Go for it.  See for yourself and good luck.  You will find out for yourself as experience is your best teacher.  👍 😉

[Andrina]

Single Guy, you say your brain and heart are at odds, but you only mentioned one con, so I don't know if you've considered more than just one. Your pro is a major one, so that is something that weighs heavily on the good side.

Perhaps you haven't known others with big age gap relationships, so perhaps you haven't considered other things which I have knowledge of. My in-laws had an 18 year age gap, with my mother-in-law, now deceased, being the older. (The man is my husband's step-father). 

Sometimes the older person retires many years before the younger. Sometimes that's not an issue, but sometimes it is if the retiree wants a companion all day instead of lesser time when the spouse works. 

Sometimes it effects the quality of sex. Sometimes it doesn't.

Sometimes the older person dies far sooner than the younger one, and either chooses to stay alone the remainder of their lives or chooses to eventually date again.

Sometimes the younger one ends up taking care of an elderly spouse, and if that's not exhausting enough, also might be taking care of elderly parents at the same time.

I also had a female friend who had that 18 year gap, with her being older, with a man. They couldn't even make it to 3 years before divorcing. He felt self conscious about how much younger he was when around her friend group. 

It is smart to consider all angles of a thing instead of having a rosy, one-dimensional view on something so important. But when you've examined everything fully, then you can feel confident in your decision. If the pros end up overpowering the cons, that's a good way to move ahead and throw all caution to the wind.

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, Cherylyn said:

@Single Guy Needs Help and @rainbowsandroses  Go for it.  See for yourself and good luck.  You will find out for yourself as experience is your best teacher.  👍 😉

Thanks but there's nothing for me to see or find out, not at the moment anyway. 

The man I'm dating now is approximately my age however IF I met a man significantly older who was healthy and fit, took good care of himself and there was a strong mutual attraction, yes I would go it.  

My grandad lived till 102, my grandma was 98 when she passed, both in good health and died in their sleep. 

Sadly, my brother developed cancer which can happen to anyone at any age. 

I was speaking mostly in the general sense. 

All that said, I am very sorry to hear about the unfortunate experiences you've had in your family and can understand why you feel as you do. 😞

[Batya33]

One of my relatives lost his wife to Alzheimers when he was close to 80 and she in her 70s.  His son introduced his  dad to a woman they knew from their community who was probably 20 years younger.  They fell madly in love -it was amazing to hear about.  They were married about 10 years -he developed alzheimers at the end.  She's written with love and fondness about their time together.  

When I was in my 30s/40s I likely would have avoided dating a man that much older as with the OP for the practical reason that I wanted the opportunity to have a family and the risks and downsides of starting a family with a man then in his 60s would have given me pause.  As older parents (42 when son was born) we experienced how hard it was to care for our aging parents while being newlywed parents of a newborn.  

[yogacat]

I belong to a caregivers support group for my father.

It's interesting, they are ALL WOMAN caring for their husbands/partners/family members.

Maybe men caring for their wives/partners/family members don't feel comfortable reaching out for support. 

I'm not sure.

 

[mylolita]

I apologise to the OP! 
 

This topic of age is so interesting to me, and concerns me too - as my husband is 9 years older than me (he’s 43, I’m 34). 
 

It never really crossed my mind much - I loved him instantly so. I would have been with him if he had a terminal illness the night I met him! He may make it to 90, I might go next year - we’ll never know, and thank goodness, who would want too? 
 

If it’s love, it’s love - you can’t deny. You just simply have to go with it, or else the bodily death you may have to contend with in the partner who is the love of your life will be nothing compared to the slow death of the heart and soul you may experience in love briefly found - but lost! 
 

x

[Cherylyn]

22 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Thanks but there's nothing for me to see or find out, not at the moment anyway. 

The man I'm dating now is approximately my age however IF I met a man significantly older who was healthy and fit, took good care of himself and there was a strong mutual attraction, yes I would go it.  

My grandad lived till 102, my grandma was 98 when she passed, both in good health and died in their sleep. 

Sadly, my brother developed cancer which can happen to anyone at any age. 

I was speaking mostly in the general sense. 

All that said, I am very sorry to hear about the unfortunate experiences you've had in your family and can understand why you feel as you do. 😞

Thank you for your kind words @rainbowsandroses.  You are appreciated. 

My condolences and I'm sorry about your beloved brother.  😢

[JayParker]

@Single Guy Needs Help   I've been in your shoes. I was 47 and met a woman that I presumed was in her mid 60's. She'd playfully say that a woman never reveals her age. After doing some internet searching, I discovered that she was 72. I was a bit surprised, but I didn't allow myself to be 'hostage' to status quo conventions.

If she's anything like my former lady friend, you already have an advantage. In public, and personally, she'll appreciate being admired by a much younger man. 

Like yourself, I find that a woman with substance can be more attractive than a superficial woman with better looks.

If she agrees to lunch, be sure to let your intentions be known. You do now want to create a pattern of having a "lunch pal." You could say something as subtle as "I really like the way that you carry yourself. I'd bet that the woman at your high school reunions are quite jealous of you."