annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Oh gradle..... you started your weekend off so well! *sigh* When he calls to say hi, your only job is to be light and breezy. He needs to miss you - when you start pushing him for more, he gets scared that this may not be the right relationship for him and he starts to back away. This is why you must, at this stage, let him do all the persuing and the one to bring up relationship issues. I want you to do some reading. I'm reading it right now as a refresher: "Mars and Venus on a Date" by John Gray, PhD. I think it's a really good book, and it talks about the stages of attraction and relationships that men and women go through. By breaking up, J pulled back into an earlier relationship stage, and you need to also. You tell him that you're sure that he's the one for you. He isn't sure that you're the one for him, he feels pressured, and is afraid to hurt you, so he pulls back. But, when you're not acting like you're sure he's right for you, he feels more comfortable with making advances towards you. Give him ALL the space in the world. Remember - you are the special one - he should be pursuing you, not the other way around. Read the book this week - I think you'll find it very insightful. Link to comment
gradle Posted June 20, 2005 Author Share Posted June 20, 2005 i think i will read it, i definitely need to do better when we do talk .... it's just weird, like i can tell he's tryign to get info out of me about hwat i've been up to... but i avoid it, i can tell he cares, when i ask him stuff, like don't you miss talking to me? (bad to ask i know) he says"i've prepaired myself for this" he says he thinks things shoudl just work, they shouldn't take work... i don't believe that, i believe that things take work, i believe that we have a chance, adn it just requires some work i believe he needs his space...and i believe that the way i acted tongiht might have severely screwed up my chances Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Yes yes yes. Read the book - it may give you a better insight as to what's going on in his head. When he asks you what you've been up to - just tell him you've been having loads of fun. Everything is wonderful and exciting! NO NO NO mentioning of the relationship, or if he misses you. From now on... you HAVE TO DO THIS!!! You may not speak to him on the phone for more than 10 minutes when he calls. You have to go and meet some friends, or you have somewhere you need to be or whatever. He has to miss you and know that you're not sitting around waiting for him. Trust me, that will only make you look more attractive. i don't believe that, i believe that things take work, i believe that we have a chance, adn it just requires some work Yes, you are right - relationships require work. The work on your part is that you have to make him miss you again, and remember that fun, independent woman he fell for. You must make him forget about the clingy gradle he broke up with. Honestly, yes, if you keep this up, you will push him away forever. That's why you have to stop. Link to comment
MtnBiker22 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Gradle, I have been following your posts for quite some time but have not posted anything as my advice was the same as all the others... However, tonight, I just wanted to reply to offer support as well as a little bit of advice. First off, I know what you are going through as I am going through the same thing right now. It's extremely difficult to accept a breakup when it's not what you want... when you know in your heart, this person could be right for you. All you want and desire is to make things right again - a second chance. However, that is out of your control right now. You have got to come to the realization that NOTHING you do right now is going to bring J back into your arms (and if it does, it won't have been his idea and will only end in complete failure FOR GOOD because it's not what he truly wanted). The only thing you can do right now is take care of yourself. By pressuring him and begging him, you are going to push him away forever. Please realize that your second chance is right now... you are living your second chance because if you keep pressuring him and not letting him leave or get off the phone, there will never be a second chance. When/if he calls next and you decide to answer the phone, make sure you are the one that needs to get off the phone. You know you need to end the conversation as soon as you start to ask him anything that has to do with "us" or his feelings or the relationship in general. I'm going through and struggling with same thing right now... trust me, I know how hard it is. I went to the extent of putting a pony tail holder on my wrist the first 2 weeks of NC and snapped it everytime I thought about calling, texting, or emailing my ex. It was a constant reminder to myself that if I really wanted the relationship to continue in the future that I had to let go of it for now... you have to do the same... Link to comment
gradle Posted June 20, 2005 Author Share Posted June 20, 2005 i know, i know, you guys are right... i need to not let my emotions get the best of me...i cant control how i feel, but i can control my actions... the best way to keep him in my life is patience, to make certain i'm growing as me, that i'm enjoying my life without him... it's just so difficult for me, knowing he's leaving so soon, to htink that he's going to be there and he's not going to keep me updated on how he's doing and what's going on in his life... ugh, i was doing so well....what's wrong with me? Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 there's nothing wrong with you. You're just still in love with him. I promise that when you read the book, you may have a better understanding of what is going on in his head. If you want to move on from him, or if you want him back, the thing you have to do is exactly the same: detach! Remember when we talked about how the guy you don't want was offering to install your A/C? See... you went off, had a fun weekend, that was when J called. That was a good beginning, but, you have to continue that! It's not over yet - he's not back to you. He'll only be back to you when or if he says the words, "Let's get back together." Until then, you have to keep being elusive, happy, busy. Either you will win him back, or you will move on, but being happy and busy will get you there. Yes, even though you dated for 2 years, you are back at square 1 with him. I know this all sounds like a game, because it partially is. You have to play hard to get. Make him wonder who you're hanging out with and how much fun you're having. Make him wonder if other guys are pursuing you. Ok, don't nobody bash me please. Gradle, have you read "The Rules?" I know, very strict, very old-fashioned, but I think it's what will help you the most in this case. The Venus and Mars books will explain the why, and the Rules will explain how to act. *sigh* good luck and have a good night! Link to comment
Mun Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 he says he thinks things shoudl just work, they shouldn't take work... In a way he is right. Who wants to be in a relationship that feels like work? You want to be in one that is fun and you are having a great time together. When things come up then you deal with them, but simply being with the other person shouldn't have to feel like you're pulling teeth..ugh Gradle, I'm sorry to tell you but you are pushing him away. Keep it up if thats what you want. Annie is right about the books ( I was reading over Mars and Venus this weekend) and if you do any sort of "rules" ( please do) it will help to save you from yourself and relax and just let things happen...which is what you need to do at this stage. In fact, I'd like to suggest another book -maybe if you're too busy reading you won't have time to obsess Doormat to Dreamgirl-A Woman's Guide to Holding Her Own in a Relationship[/url]. Chin up girl! Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Good morning! Wow, you've got quite the reading list compiled! Yes, read both the venus and mars books. The original one, and the "Mars and Venus on a date." I feel that the original one seems more directed at married couples, wheras the dating one is talking about the issues that unmarried couples face, you know, before they've made the committment to each other. I like how the book organizes the stages of dating: Attraction, uncertainty, exclusivity, intimacy, engagement. Remember, he broke up with you, so he's actually back at stage zero (as in, no relationship). But sometimes, when he calls you, he may be in stage 1, you know, like when you first meet someone, you call, talk on the phone, etc. But then, you're acting like you're in a later stage like exclusivity or engagement, and you scare him off! So he retreats back to stage 0 (as in, no relationship!) Here is an excerpt from Mars and Venus on a Date: Let's look at a more extreme example. If a woman is desperately in love with a man or hopelessly dependent on him, the man is obviously going to think something like this: She seems so sure that I am the one for her. Well, I don't know. If I get involved more, I could be leading her on by feeding her hopes. She would really be devestated. I like her too much to do that to her. I don't think this is the right relationship for me. I'm not ready for this." Compound this with the fact he's moving soon.... I can see why he would want to run away. Link to comment
Mun Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Annie, I was talking about "Mars and Venus On A Date" --sorry I didn't clarify . I think that one is good enough. Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Annie, I was talking about "Mars and Venus On A Date" --sorry I didn't clarify . I think that one is good enough. Ah yes, I agree the date one is the one to read. Link to comment
RainaBabe Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Muneca, are you sure you weren't referring to "Why Men Love *beeps*"? Because that's the one with the "from doormat to dreamgirl" tagline. At any rate, Gradle, I strongly suggest you read it. It's by Sherry Argov. Don't let the title mislead you. It's about finding out who you are and making sure you keep your self respect. I HIGHLY recommend both this book and the Mars/Venus on a Date and Mars/Venus (original recipe) books. Seriously, though, listen to the people on this board and don't assume that J will come back to you. He may, but he may not. If you cling, you'll drive him further away. Did you notice how much he was responding when you were just being friendly and casual? And even at THAT point he wasn't exactly leaping into your arms, so you still have a long way to go. I DID successfully get my ex back after he broke up with me. For the first week I cried to my best friends and my mom, but I didn't dare tell my ex what I was thinking or feeling. As soon as we started talking again, I started treating him as a friend. I was friendly, but I wouldn't chat for too long, and I never let him see my true emotions. I earned the nickname Ice while doing this, because I'd be crying one moment to a friend, and then he'd call, and my entire demeanor would instantly change. I refused to let him see that I was pining over him. After a few weeks I DID start feeling better, and I started focusing on my own life and being happy. We ended up getting back together about eight months ago, and have been together since. If I had cursed at him or started clinging again, it never would have worked out. You keep saying, "I know, I know, BUT...." No. There is no but. Take it from the people here who have gone through what you're going through, and learn from us. Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Wow, Ms. Ice! I am impressed!!! It seems like it took a lot of self-restraint, but it all worked out for the best! Cool! Thanks for sharing that inspiring story. Link to comment
gradle Posted June 20, 2005 Author Share Posted June 20, 2005 hi guys, looks like i'm gonna have to get a membership card to borders! i know you guys are right, and i know that when i give him more space he's more likely to come back, and when i'm friendly and not desperate he likes it a hell of a lot more (hmmm.... duh, why am i so dumb?)....i think i'm just having a tough time thinking about him moving to cali, and me to dc, i mean it's not like we're just going to run into each other, and he's going to see how awesome i am, i'm basically afraid that once he moves it's going to be more like outta sight, outta mind... i wish i could move to dc tomorrow, it was really helpful to be with all of my friends, very calming, instead wehn i'm here i feel like i'm running around like a chicken with her head cut off, just kind of crazy and all i want to do is run around and keep myself super busy.. i do feel like i've been a little out of my mind this past month,rarely have a i felt truly sane....just busy... Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 He won't forget about you, you're not easily forgotten But, if he does, do you really want to be with a man who can forget 2 years so easily? Well, if you don't push him away, I'm sure he'll e-mail you or call you once every few weeks from CA just to say hi. During those phone calls, you have to be as light and happy as possible. Still, 1 year is a long time to wait for him to fall for you again.... Link to comment
gradle Posted June 20, 2005 Author Share Posted June 20, 2005 yes, so i just went to the grocery store to grab a salad for lunch...and my purse got stolen...and what's worse, i had my ipod and digital camera in there b/c i had jsut flown in last night and not taken them out yet... when it rains it pours.... Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 OH NOOOOO!!!!!! *sigh* I hope you get the stuff back! Link to comment
Hope75 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 HI Gradle, WOW! I miss one night and one morning and look at all the activity on your thread! First of all, I am so sorry about your purse. I have an Ipod & expensive dig camera too and I'd be crushed if they got swiped. Where you in Boston when this happened? Did you report it to the police? Where did you fly to over the weekend? OK, as for J, it seems everyone has covered what I would have said regarding how you behaved... When I was trying to get my guy back I had to learn to back off. He needed room to breathe, and I was constantly asking him where the relationship was going and how he felt, and he was already contemplating getting back with me... this stalled him off for a quite a few months until our friends here at Enotalone got my head on straight, telling me to relax and enjoy the time we spent together, and stop asking and obsessing. My guy told me that when he was unsure he did not want to give me any false hope because he did care about my feelings and did not want to hurt me, but he was not sure he wanted me back. He felt trapped and backed off because of it. I'm not saying J wants you back, but if he is even thinking of it, and he sees you act like that he is going to be scared and even though he won't want to hurt your feelings, which may be why he was rear-ended by you into saying "maybe we can work on it", (after he hung up on you and you called him back 5 times!!!!). Taking you back will need to be a conscious choice on his part. Not something you harang him into. You may well have blown your chance with J last night, but as Annie said. no matter what your ultimate goal is, moving forward and being independent is the only way you are going to go anywhere from here. Muneca made a good point. Relationships are work in that when you have a conflict you both need to learn to compromise and you need to learn to stop being so darn clingy with him, those things are work. But just spending time together should not feel like work, and I think that's how he was starting to feel. Hang in there Gradle, this was a bad day, and there is no where to do but up! Link to comment
gradle Posted June 20, 2005 Author Share Posted June 20, 2005 news! good news! it was found, some one found it on the side of the road near the store and he things that everything is in there--oh relief....thank god, i didn't know what else could go wrong... i can't imagine being married and going through what i'm going through, a divorce, etc, i can't imagine it, i don't know if i could handle it....i feel for everyone who is in these complicated situations, especially if you're in a divorce and one person doesnt want it Link to comment
annie24 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Oh good!!!! I'm glad you got it back!!!! Yes, a breakup, especially that of a marriage, must be one of the most stressful things in life.... Link to comment
Hope75 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Thank God Gradle! I was thinking about that and how awful it must be to lose your purse on top of everything else. Hope your day gets better! Link to comment
fantasia2004 Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 you have been through a lot. gradle, I hope things get better than having your stuff returned. It will I promise. Link to comment
gradle Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 hi all, yes, i am so glad that all of my belongings have been found... i feel so lucky! i mean, an ipod and a digital camera? wow, i'm soo lucky... thanks for all of your support everyone once i have my wallet and uncancel all of my cards, i'm getting my butt to the local book store.. ok, some news, i know you guys are going to be angry with me, but it's not so bad... i took him the poster and card today, and he was home...i didn't think he'd be there, i called him and he was there, i figured he'd be at softball and i'd just leave it outside his door.... but he was there and it didn't go so badly... i actually feel a lot better about things...i mean, no, he didn't change his mind or anything, and for a while he was being an a$#, and i got annoyed and got up to leave and he admitted he was doing it b/c he didn't want to lead me on...i knew that... but i had mentioned the concert yesterday, and he said today that he might want to go...he said he might have a friend in town so i said oh well, that's fine, i'll just go with this other friend who i know likes them, and he said, no no, don't go with them, i'll go, and he bought the tickets, just two... so i think that's a good thing...and after he got over his acting like an a$# phase, thigns got so much better, and almost how they used to be, he was laughing again and so was i, i was quite calm the whole time and proud of myself...and then i left and went to my friends' house and hung out there for a bit... i know i can't expect much from the concert, and i know i will hope for more, but i'm doing my best to control myself and i'm doing ok... i think when i prepare myself for the situation i'm ok, it's just when he contacts me when i get flustered and upset--which is where the problem lies, b/c i want him to contact me more.. but he said he was happy to see me looking better and more confident..that he just needs to not be in a relationship right now, and that he can't guarantee that we'll work it out in the future...he just needed a change...that he was prepared to feel how he is feeling i just feel better being able to talk to him, and to see him...i realize that i will very likely never be ok with him replacing me, but for now, i feel a lot better... Link to comment
Hope75 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Good morning Gradle, First off let me say how happy I am that you got back all of your stuff!! It's truly amazing that your purse was on the street in a busy city with everything in it, you really are lucky! About J, well, we knew you would go and see him anyway....not such a good idea after the way you acted on the phone over the weekend. How was he acting like a jerk when you first got there? It really sounds to me like you manipulated him into going to the concert with you, another not so good thing. But, it sounds as though he isn't too mad at you. He really doesn't sound like he is interested in being with you anytime soon if at all, but more relieved that you were acting sane, and seemed to be doing OK without him. I think he feels alot of guilt still for having you follow him to Boston and then breaking it off, but it really doesn't seem like he's interested in reconciliation, at least not anytime soon. The more I think about it the more it sounds like he really wants to be single when he goes to California, and experience it in full, without worrying about his clingy girlfriend in DC. How are you feeling about him these days? Are you coming to terms with being single any better? When he goes to Cali, how will you feel about things then? Link to comment
PlayBrat Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Gradle.... Glad things turned out well with your things Small miracles huh?? I am with Hope about J. It sounds to ME like he is trying to delicately balance things and not "rock the boat"..by being nice to you and , and hope you don't get "psycho" on him. I don't like to be harsh, but I could sort of see why he would do that. I think he is feeling a LOT of guilt by breaking up with you, and part of him still feels obligated to be there for you, although another part of him might resent you for continually pressuring him. THink about this long and hard... Do you want to be with someone that is only there out of guilt?? What can come of this? He is afraid that any little thing will devastate you, and you can't hold it together. Could YOU imagine a future with a GUY that cried when he didn't get his way? Could you imagine him being a father to your children? How would he cope?? Do you see my point? These are things J is thinking about when it comes to YOUR emotional stability, and how you would react in the future. It probably scares the hell out of him. J is thinking into the future...not just the here and now. I may be wrong, but I doubt it. I hope you can pull yourself together and focus on yourself...if nothing else but to prove to YOURSELF you are capable of moving on with your life and KNOWING you will be fine with or without J. You can do it Gradle...we know you can. Link to comment
gradle Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 Hi guys, I hear what you're saying, I'm sure he is looking forward to being single in cali, I'm kind of looking forward to being single in dc…but I don't want him out of my life, I want the hope that we can work things out in the future… and things last night were calm, and for me to be emotional about such a big loss in my life is normal. I really don't think I manipulated him into going…I barely mentioned it yesterday, he was the one who brought it up, I told him it was okay if he didn't want to go, that I had other people to go with, or if he just wanted to bring his friend that was fine too…I didn't really mean to manipulate him if that's what I did, and he seemed so excited to go… I know I don't want someone who cries when things don't go there way, you're right play, but this is a pretty big thing that's not going my way, and I think it's normal to cry, it feels like a huge loss, almost like a death… As for acting like an a%$, I guess, I don't know, he was a little quiet after a few minutes and then he acted that way when I mentioned the relationship, like one word answers, etc, like he's sick of talking about it, because he probably is (bad of me yes, but we didn't hamper on it long) and he said things would be ok with us if I could quit bringing it up, that it made things awkward, he said he worried about hanging out with me because he was scared that I would act crazy, he did bring up that he didn't think I was crazy, but that I had acted crazy when we broke up..… So I stopped and things were okay again…but he really did seem to enjoy my company, I don't think this is all out of guilt..i mean I'm having a lot of fun right now without him, and he knows it, and he knows that I'm off to dc to be with all of my friends and he's off to cali where he really doesn't know anyone.. he's told me he doesn't regret me moving out to boston at all (although I'm sure he does feel guilt to an extent) I know I can't expect much from this concert, and I'm trying not to… I'm hoping I can have some plans afterwards so I can just go from one thing to the next… Link to comment
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