CrazyKing Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Post what you want, even if becoming a more attractive person for the opposite sex is damn easy but takes some time, those guys who are drowning in self-pity won't listen anyway... Such advice never worked for me when I was one of those guys of that kind, because I even liked being depressive and lonely - it's just like a drug... The only thing I'll be telling in the future is that NO GIRL is going to go to that kind of guys and tell: "I think I'm your soulmate and the love of your life, you've been waiting for me and with me you're going to become the man women dream about, first I'll satisfy you sexually, then I'll enourmously rise your confidence level..." Link to comment
Lowconfidence Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 So, no, I don't put much stock in studies of this kind. The useful bit of information disguised therein is that good looking, wealthy men who are open to having a family have lots of options... gee what a revelation. Yeah I was thinking that too. Good looks with money who wants to have kids? You aren't going to have limited options that's for sure. Link to comment
MD Geist Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Those are all great but I have seen men who fail at all those that you listed and they still are successful with women. I'm working on them all except the one with kids because I don't think its possible for me to have a child. And even then I don't think it will make any diffrence. I think if I woke up tomorrow with all those things and my life is going great that it would be even more difficult to find a woman who really loves you for you especially if you have a great paying job. I know it sounds ridiculous but is she really in love with you for who you are? or with how much you make?. Link to comment
somethngwrng Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 Just out of curiosity what do you mean by this? I mean I have some typical guesses but ofcourse why guess when I can ask exactly. As you may be able to guess I keep referring to how I can't seem to attract anyone (I realise it's my fault here too), not even ones I don't find attractive. I've had women I don't find attractive stalk me out a few times after I discontinued contact with them because I didn't feel comfortable with the way the relationship was going. Mostly times when I've had too much to drink and end up hooking up with a girl I'm not interested in. Link to comment
CrazyKing Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 Those are all great but I have seen men who fail at all those that you listed and they still are successful with women. (1) I'm working on them all except the one with kids because I don't think its possible for me to have a child. And even then I don't think it will make any diffrence. (2) I think if I woke up tomorrow with all those things and my life is going great that it would be even more difficult to find a woman who really loves you for you especially if you have a great paying job. I know it sounds ridiculous but is she really in love with you for who you are? or with how much you make?.(3) (1) - Nobody has told that women need ALL of those traits, this is just what the average person may want and look for... (2) - You're not impotent, and lack of sexual experience does not mean that someone will remain his whole life without having a family... Everything in our life is our own choice and I know what I'm talking about, you can't tell me anything new about your status and the way you feel, I've been there and nothing changed for a long time because I was too coward to stand up - luckily, I did, and not because of a miracle where the right girls showed up, but because life's like a war with yourself and as soon as you give up, your will to swim in the sea of self-pity will grow more and more... (3) - Women don't look that way at the money, but on the fact that a man has put enough effort in making it... If you have put much effort in making money, that's already one sign that the guy may put the same kind of effort in other things... And rememmber - you can't tell me anything new about your situation, I've been in the same boat... Link to comment
dr_styles Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 I don't see it as a negative view entirely, after all I gotta appreciate the fact that I have at least had some interest from the opposite sex which is better than none! heh this will sound stupid because it sort of is, but it's good to read people acknowledging this. Not to say they have to happy with it, but, yeah, I dunno. Feels nice to be counted . At least you can get some confidence from that. he said the one thing that actually helps is talking to someone about it. Everything else they say and advise is just commonsense you've already thought yourself at some point! I'm thinking the same. Admittedly I'd never pay for any like a professional psych so I was thinking of general ones like a chaplain/counsellor we have at work, but the "problem" is so petty in the end and all the advice I already know about, common sense and from eNA. Post what you want, even if becoming a more attractive person for the opposite sex is damn easy but takes some time, those guys who are drowning in self-pity won't listen anyway... Such advice never worked for me when I was one of those guys of that kind, because I even liked being depressive and lonely - it's just like a drug... You are right but I feel it's more a sense of a miracle rather than liking it. I will openly say right now that I do consider it a miracle, unfathomable, a dream (?), that a girl would show some interested in me and I approach and actually get a date. So yes, I'm basically throwing myself into that category of guy here. What's my point, I don't know anymore Link to comment
FortunateOne Posted March 15, 2009 Author Share Posted March 15, 2009 Post what you want, even if becoming a more attractive person for the opposite sex is damn easy but takes some time, those guys who are drowning in self-pity won't listen anyway... Such advice never worked for me when I was one of those guys of that kind, because I even liked being depressive and lonely - it's just like a drug... The only thing I'll be telling in the future is that NO GIRL is going to go to that kind of guys and tell: "I think I'm your soulmate and the love of your life, you've been waiting for me and with me you're going to become the man women dream about, first I'll satisfy you sexually, then I'll enourmously rise your confidence level..." This is why I tell men that confidence comes from impeaching the self-pity attitude and seeking some type of cognitive therapy to understand our point of view since we've been there and done that same self destructive behavior. Link to comment
somethngwrng Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 The whole depressive, self-pity thing is really bad. A woman I worked with once commented on it, I didn't think she realised I was like that. I thought I did a good job of hiding it. The truth is, you can't hide it. You're either one way or the other. Get out, do stuff, set goals, work toward your goals, feel great about yourself. It's the most basic thing ever, but I do know how HARD it can be to do that (or even grasp the idea) when you're throwing yourself a pity party. I've been there, worked my way out, slipped back into it, worked my way out, slipped back into it, worked my way out. Link to comment
Yanet Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Relationships are a result of the human desire for closeness, and so people get involved past initial physical attraction because they trick themselves into thinking some single person is so amazing. People are in fact broadly very similar. To the lonely guys out there, a girlfriend won't solve all your life problems or give your life sudden new found meaning. The relationship itself is pretty meaningless too. Either accept another person won't vanquish your unhappiness and won't be with your forever so stop caring about finding a girl and use prostitutes or lie to yourself that a special girl will come along and add genuine meaning to your life - she'll be your reason to live! Lies are nice though. Link to comment
CrazyKing Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 You are right but I feel it's more a sense of a miracle rather than liking it. I will openly say right now that I do consider it a miracle, unfathomable, a dream (?), that a girl would show some interested in me and I approach and actually get a date. So yes, I'm basically throwing myself into that category of guy here. What's my point, I don't know anymore I don't know why, but if I don't like something on TV I just switch the channel, but sometimes there are shows that you don't really like to watch, maybe you even hate them and yet you're watching them and just can't stop doing it, so it is with life - we get addicted to feelings of being in a miserable situation, we ignore the huge ammount of "miracles" that come in our way in everyday life, because we're too focused on feeling bad... It's like a wall you build around yourself and no one else but you has a big hammer to smash it... Link to comment
sti_2004 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 The study is silly imo. But I do understand its intended point. Link to comment
Rokuman Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 This is why I tell men that confidence comes from impeaching the self-pity attitude and seeking some type of cognitive therapy to understand our point of view since we've been there and done that same self destructive behavior. Or you could find a location where the culture isn't so screwed up. Meh, I'm having a hard time taking this topic very seriously. Link to comment
InBruges Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Scientific studies on mating and relationships tend to leave a bad taste in my mouth. Whether or not they're accurate, it's fairly depressing to think that "love" can be broken down into your genes and your wallet. Assuming this study was true, where's the heart-felt motivation to even try for a "better" mate? If I found her, she'd only be interested in me for my assets... which pretty much destroys any romantic notions I may have held about true love. Link to comment
My Advice Posted March 25, 2009 Share Posted March 25, 2009 Fortunate you forgot charm and game. Why does PUA have to be negative? Link to comment
Siriana Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 I just briefly went through the article and seems reasonable to print it: Info fort those who only noticed they're not attractive. There is a piece of information in the article which states that physically attractive men are less likely to preserve long term relationships (or something along these lines) - and that proved to be the truth in my life. I've dated some really hot guys and it never was a good relationship. So as a result I have prejudice and I avoid dating any men who are overly handsome. It also says how women choose to mix different factors and their importance in order to find a long term partner. I have a feeling you are missing the boat guys by just concentrating on the fact you're not really handsome. Or you just feel sorry you're not Brad Pit and wallow in self pity since you won't score drop dead gorgeous girl Link to comment
MattW Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 Well, looking at those four "qualities" listed in the original topic, I'd say that right about now, the only one I could say I have for sure is #4. When it comes to looks, I wouldn't say I'm bad-looking per se, but I'm shorter than nearly all girls I meet, and while I've come to actually like the idea of dating a taller girl, it seems like a big no-no to date a guy shorter than yourself, so I don't know where that leaves me; it doesn't help that I have this natural "boyish" look to me that I just can't seem to shake. As for career, I'm still in my first year of college, and while I have a general idea of what field I want to go into, I still haven't nailed down the specifics, so I don't really have any career ideas to really be "passionate" about. When it comes to kids, I'm not necessarily against having them, but at my age, having kids just seems like too big of a responsibility than I'm currently ready to handle; I'm sure that can change as I get older, and of course, if I ended up with the right girl, but right now, I'm just still really wary on the whole idea of having kids. My real problems, the way I see it, are 1) I'm a very quiet person, and 2) I'm fairly introverted. My "quietness" stems from my poor conversational skills; I mean, I speak when spoken to, and I can hold up a conversation alright if some one else starts it, but I can rarely think of anything witty or interesting to say, until after the moment has already passed. But I'm soooooo bad at actually starting conversations; and often times, I end up in situations where I should be trying to start a conversation, but I don't, and there's just a long period of awkward silence. And as for my introvertedness, it's weird, because while I DO want to find a girl and have a relationship with, etc., I'm generally not very outgoing; I don't go out of my way to socialize, I don't really go a lot of places I could meet girls, I'm much more comfortable just doing my own thing and keeping to myself. So I'm kinda stuck here, and I think my being introverted would be the hardest, most difficult thing to really change, because it's more a mindset than a bad quality. So, I just can't help but have doubts about my future "love life". I don't mean that in the depressed, "self-pity" kind of way; really, I'm just identifying my faults, which we all have, and better to do that than to try to convince myself that I'm "absolutely perfect", right? It's just that, overcoming my faults seems so daunting, I have a hard time imagining myself being able TO overcome them. I don't even know where to start, really. I'm just at a complete loss. Link to comment
dr_styles Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 Nice post MattW. Says a lot of things I've had trouble trying to say. And very similar too, from the starting/witty conversations to the quiet lifestyle. I do have that self-pity thing going incase you've seen my posts, but the basis of where it comes from is almost identical to your post. I don't see anything too "wrong" with the way I live (maybe a bit boring, not many deep passions/hobbies like you say), but just unfortunately this life is obviously not one which will get me a girl/love. Where the unhappiness and now sorta depression just how it deepens over time, is when accepting that "me" - looks, lifestyle, everything - has not been successful relationship wise (very painful thing to accept) but also that knowing what I need to change, whether it's an improvement or not is harder to judge, is proving very hard given how we've lived, quite contently, all our lives. Link to comment
CrazyKing Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 I don't know why people tend to talk about what they ARE and not about what they could BE... Sure I don't have much money now, but that does not mean that I'll spend my whole life without it... Also I know a guy who was not that attractive at school due to his size and looks, but for the last few months I discovered that his inside is dominating in conversations with girls... He's so confident about having a job (he's working very hard actually), singing in a choir, playing in an amateur theater, gosh, you won't ever have a boring conversation with that guy, and girls like him a lot because of that... Thanks to him I discovered that you should be proud about yourself, about every single thing you have in life... Link to comment
MattW Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 I don't know why people tend to talk about what they ARE and not about what they could BE... Sure I don't have much money now, but that does not mean that I'll spend my whole life without it... Well, to be honest, I know the kind of guy I'd LIKE to be, but for some reason, I just can't seem to get there. I don't know what my hang-up is, really. That's why I "dwell" so much on what I "am", because I'm trying to figure out why I can't get to where I want to "be". Obviously there's some kind of problem that I need to "fix", yanno? Also I know a guy who was not that attractive at school due to his size and looks, but for the last few months I discovered that his inside is dominating in conversations with girls... He's so confident about having a job (he's working very hard actually), singing in a choir, playing in an amateur theater, gosh, you won't ever have a boring conversation with that guy, and girls like him a lot because of that... Thanks to him I discovered that you should be proud about yourself, about every single thing you have in life... Right, and I don't deny that charisma and good (or at least decent) conversational skills can go along way to get girls to look past the more trivial things like looks, but like I said, I don't even seem to have that going for me. I don't have that natural charisma (er, if I do, I'm doing a good job of hiding it, apparently), nor am I very outgoing in social environments. It's a very weird state to be in; like, being the introvert that I am, I'm much more calm in quieter, peaceful environments that don't require me to do much socializing at all, yet at the same time, I have this sort of "loneliness", not in a "desperate" way, more in a "hopeless dreamer" kind of way. It just seems weird to me, because you'd think those two "mental states" should completely contradict each other. Like, how can some one be such a big introvert like myself, yet still crave that kind of companionship and affection? Link to comment
dr_styles Posted April 2, 2009 Share Posted April 2, 2009 Like, how can some one be such a big introvert like myself, yet still crave that kind of companionship and affection? Because you're human? (yes I realise that sounds lame) Link to comment
CrazyKing Posted April 2, 2009 Share Posted April 2, 2009 I was introvert too, even anti-social at a point in my life... There is no such thing as a state where there's no way out, face it, you're scared of trying, but the only thing to rememmber is to take the first step... Link to comment
coldplay. Posted April 2, 2009 Share Posted April 2, 2009 To be honest i didnt really find the PDF very useful, knowing whats attractive i dont think is a problem. You can just look at a successful guy and gauge his worth in those respects and get the same results. but i like what you yourself are saying OP. This is why I tell men that confidence comes from impeaching the self-pity attitude and seeking some type of cognitive therapy to understand our point of view since we've been there and done that same self destructive behavior. I have been debating whether to start going back to the therapist. Ive always been shy, but i know that this isnt the natural state of things, humans are social animals, so this leads me to believe that i can be 'fixed'. Ive really been looking for something to help me help myself. How i got to this point.... hmmm my mental state has been sliding and i cant really figure out why. When i was a child i was shy, alot of people were, then i became dominant in sports, most athletic in my school, it gave me social status and alot of pride, i was confident for that time. Then i received a devastating injury that ruined my senior year, no football, no wrestling, impaired track season. Being bed ridden for months, all while my hs sweetheart dumped me. Needless to say i was a little screwed up for a while after that. But even then i recovered, got into college, was confident, met many girls, was dating like 4 at one time, had friends, partied all the time. Life was good, I finally got involved with one of the girls and thats where i dont know what happened. I started smoking alot of weed, socially isolated myself, i tried to pull myself back together and retry my old passions, joined the college football team. But i was so intimidated by everyone, i had no confidence anymore, after a year and a half of that constant strain, i think i had a nervous breakdown, i didnt sleep for like two days shaking because i was so nervous about just practice, it was crazy. So i quit, but after i quit i was sad about quitting! I couldnt hold a job because i just had no energy. At this point i was living with my girl, she basically supported me and her while i just sat around in my own sorrow. She eventually left me, and now im just trying to pick up the pieces and figure out what happened to me. Separating, my mind from my body is difficult. I read so many things, and for a while i feel a real high from these things that i want to do, but when i get into that situation and i falter. I dont feel like im bipolar or anything, but it feels like ill something will make me extremely pumped up, ill really want to change my life. Then its accompanied sometime, whether it afterwards or a few days away that ill feel awful about my seemingly powerless position to change anything. I know its all in my head though, but i just cant seem to break the cycle and process what i really need to be doing, versus making decisions and living in fear. Link to comment
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