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Thread: Do women hold all the cards?

  1. #21
    Platinum Member imsuperman's Avatar
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    There are a lot of valid points, but like NAZ said, it's all perspective. It's human nature to take pride in our hardships and we always want to tell everyone we have it harder. I get that. And that is my disclaimer before everyone jumps on me.

    I don't know that there is a clear answer.

    Having said that, galaxy also makes a good point.

    Women decide who they want to go out with. They do the accepting and rejecting most of the time. Men are the pursuers. If a woman is of "average" looks to a knockout she is being approached a LOT by men, and she decides which ones she thinks she would like to date. Now certainly it can be argued that the man has to deem her attractive enough to pursue in the first place, but I get where he's coming from.

    I've seen some women on the forums saying, "If a man is interested enough, then he will approach." Now if a man were to say that about women, I'd go ahead and wish him well in his decision to be alone for the rest of his life. The attractive ones especially don't approach men because they get approached multiple times a day and have the ability to choose from the stream of men that try to chat them up. They know why men are talking to them.

    That's just the way it is. For men, you just have to accept your role as a man. There's no getting around it, though when I was younger I tried.

    If you try to be a "game changer," women will just shrug and go out with someone who pursued them.

    Again, all I've ever known is being a man, and I know my perspective is skewed, so please nobody be angry with me,

  2. #22
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    It all depends on attractiveness in my opinion. A shy girl will generally have an easier time getting a date because if shes decent looking and puts herself out there then there will likely be guys asking her out, and she can get dates without changing her shyness or taking that initial emotional risk. The shy guy's options are to either get over his shyness and take some risks or he can stay single and lonely until he changes. Now if the girl or guy makes no attempt at all to be social then there is little hope for either.


    Below average looking girls will have a tougher time due to not being approached or pursued as much if at all, while the below average guy will have trouble getting a date even if he is confident in himself, unless he specifically targets below average looking girls. Below average looking guys will also have more trouble gathering the needed level of confidence in themselves because there is realistically less to be confident about.

    I know everyone is different, and there are exceptions to everything I said above, but from my experience that is a quick overview of how I see the situation. Almost anyone, no matter their looks, can get dates but its a much tougher road for some people than others, but that's kind of how most things in life works.

  3. #23
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    From my experience, it isn't like I could really choose which girl to go out with.... while I have my core set of standards and have to be somewhat attracted to her, I can only take whatever comes my way.

    For example, I went out on a few dates with the only girl that ever showed interest/attraction to me. She wasn't exactly the type that I was into (average-looking but too much like a little girl, had nothing in common and zero motivation/direction in life), but I gave her a chance. Who knows if another girl will agree to go out past the first date with me again? I've pursued and asked out some girls over the years but they weren't interested.

    I've always had a tough time when it comes to even getting one date. I am an average-looking guy, but found that most decent single women (which I am attracted to) don't want to get to know me better or are already in relationships.

  4. #24
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    Women don't hold all the cards, but they hold the most important one--relative scarcity.

    Find a reasonably-attractive woman, and you'll find a ton of guys competing to be with her. She has to pick and choose. Find a reasonably-attractive man, and you won't find a ton of girls competing to be with him. Potential boyfriend candidates are a dime a dozen; hot women are pursued by men up and down the socioeconomic strata. If a woman wants the average guy, she's competing with...no one in particular. If a guy wants an attractive woman, he's competing with married doctors, college sweethearts, high-ranking co-workers, elite players and PUAs, etc. Finding a hot woman that isn't locked down or bombarded by superior options is virtually impossible.

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  6. #25
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    Originally Posted by givinggirl
    Just to clarify...this wasn't in reference to a relationship, but to the beginning stages of dating. I told him I didn't agree with him at all. If I held all the cards and had all the control, things would be sooo different.
    in the beginning stages of dating yes women have the most 'power' as men are still expected to approach most (90 % or maybe more) of the time or nothing happens

  7. #26
    Gold Member Iakasot's Avatar
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    This. I don't understand how people don't realize that men have it harder. Women do hold most of the cards in dating, and even in marriage and divorce.

  8. #27
    Platinum Member Deciduous's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Iakasot
    This. I don't understand how people don't realize that men have it harder. Women do hold most of the cards in dating, and even in marriage and divorce.
    That may be slighly true in dating.

    But if it is true through-out the marriage and subsequent divorce then you really aren't standing up for yourself or demonstrating healthy boundaries.

  9. #28
    Platinum Member ProtestTheHero's Avatar
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    Here's the thing: Women hold all the cards that you as a man choose to give them.

    Asking out a woman is not hard. Here's why:

    If she rejects me, I don't care.

    If she agrees to a first date, I don't go crazy inside with expectations -- I need to get to know her better before there's any degree of emotional investment.

    If, after a first date, she believes we're not compatible and isn't interested in a second date, I don't care.

    If I am in a situation where I am far more wealthy than a woman and marriage is something we're considering, she's signing a prenup. If she refuses then I bail.

    I don't care that women get hit on all the time. What does that have to do with me or my situation?

    If shy guys have it harder than shy women, then they need to realize that they must take a more proactive role to put themselves in better situations. If they can't do that, THEY HAVE NO ONE TO BLAME BUT THEMSELVES. Stop dodging accountability, stop blaming other people, and stop the competition about who has it harder. None of that means anything if you're perfectly content to forfeit all control over your life. If you're miserable, convincing other people that you have it harder is a pretty awful consolation prize. Don't be content with that.

  10. #29
    Gold Member Iakasot's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Deciduous
    That may be slighly true in dating.

    But if it is true through-out the marriage and subsequent divorce then you really aren't standing up for yourself or demonstrating healthy boundaries.
    It's difficult to stand up for oneself when men are presumed guilty in divorce court. A woman can call the police, hit herself and say you abused her, and the man is automatically arrested. How isn't that having most of the cards. Just because most women don't use this, doesn't mean they don't have most of the power. It's like how most women don't choose to have sex on the first date, but they have the power to, men don't. I don't think you understand the full dynamic of how men are disadvantaged in marriage. An average woman gains something like 20k in a divorce, and average man loses 60k, that obviously means that lawyers get on average 40k from a divorce, so they're the real winners.

  11. #30
    Platinum Member Deciduous's Avatar
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    Ikasot -

    If it behoves you to 'be a victim' 'think like a victim' and 'behave like a victim', then you have every right to do so. If it is proving a successful strategy in regards to forming healthy relationship with women, then stick with it. Why not? Go with what brings the results you are seeking.

    All the best to u. I'm sure we'll talk again.

    Deci xxx

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