Well, thats it

[confusedashell]

I think if I called her brother it would just make matters worse. She use that to say I'm pressuring her. I'm just going to leave it all alone. Do what she wants, but she cant expect me to be reasonable when she wants to sit down and talk or needs a favour.

[confusedashell]

I dont know. I dont want to be hard on her. She is a great person, I wouldnt have loved her that much or given that much to her if she wasnt. Its just lately shes had some kind of personality change. Maybe just relaised that this wasnt the life she wanted, felt getting old too fast, felt like her life was too hard and didnt have to be, that our relationship was too hard and didnt have to be. I dont know. But i think what counts is not always what happens in a relationship but what you do when the problems start. How do you deal with it! Thats what makes marriages work and fail.

[boiler55126]

Going out getting drunk. Coming home late. Not being responsible. Denying everything (denial is the first sign of alcoholism) repeated arguing and quarelling, especially when she's been drinking. Let me guess, she's always right too. Can't admit to anything. It's like deja vu for me. My ex did that too. I do know she wasn't cheating on me. She worked at a bar part time and would get off early and sit there and drink with her co-workers and I've been there with her so I do know that's what was going on. Problem was she couldn't just have a few drinks. She had to drink as much as she could before the bar closed, and then drive home. I'm pretty much done with all the partying and since she's always been in relationships she wanted to experience the party life. She said she wanted to re-live her youth. I told her she was nuts. Then I told her she's not 21, and that she's a 41 year old mother of 2 and needs to start acting like it. Sounds to me like your wife may have a drinking problem. Probably a way to escape her feeling of guilt. Or just thinks it's the fun thing to do and may have never experienced that before. This happens to a lot of women. More so to women than to men. Reason being that a lot of women have a hard time being alone and spend most of their life in relationships and then 1 day decide they don't want it anymore and need to "find themselves" or whatever other smokescreen excuse they may have. She doesn't want to be the responsible type person anymore. At this point she is not trustworthy at all. Sounds like she needs help. You can try to explain that too her but I'm sure she would only get angry. My ex would come home drunk as hell and then I would get upset at her for at least not calling for a ride. It didn't matter what I tried to do or what I said, she was too drunk to comprehend it anyway. I was too normal for her and going out and partying and being completely irresponsible was more normal to her. She tried to bring me down with her and did to some degree. I was a much happier and much better person before I met her. Her problems wore off on me. I believe I was also trying to be more of a father to her than a boyfriend. Sounds to me that you might be in the same boat. It is very rude and disrespectful for anyone to treat someone this way after they stuck their neck out for them. Sounds to me like she is digging her own grave. Don't be surprised when she wakes up and realizes where all her FUN is leading her that she comes crying back to you. Don't trust her if she does, it would only happen again. Not trying to discourage you but it's a cycle that would repeat itself. It's not worth putting yourself through. Take it from me. I put myself through it 3 times in 2.5 years with my ex and at this point I'm surprised it hasn't killed me.

[Demond34]

Its tough as hell, I know. Your situation is similar to mine. I asked my girl a few weeks ago if this was the real you ( cuz she was just totally different) and her replie was no, and i hate myself for being this way. Don't pressure her, just let her do her thing right now and let her blow off some steam. You'll be more desirable to her if you just walk away with a smile and say nothing and get your life together while you're at it.

 

But you have a son, so that makes the situation different. Do not bring up the US anymore to her, if you ever talk to her, make sure its only about your son. When you're around her, be confident, happy, and polite. Don't question her motives, her love for you, why she is doing this, none of that.

 

She doesnt want to hear it right now and anything you say like that will come as threat of you trying to control her and her life. Even though its not the case, thats how she'll view it. About her leaving the door open, don't let her. Its only for her sake, not yours. You'll be left hanging and waiting until she either comes back to you or has found someone else.

 

Feel whatever it is you need to feel right now, its fine, just dont do it around her. She fell in love with you for a reason, and you might of lost that trait with getting comfortable in the relationship. Be mysterious again, get your swagger back, make yourself less available (only when it comes to your son). She'll notice and she'll be curious about you. Six years is along time and you were married. She'll always have feelings for you. The problem now is that her interest in you has dropped. You wont get it back up by trying to fix the relationship when she's unwilling to do so now. It'll come accross as needy and weak. You gotta drive it back up with the reasons above.

 

She is being extremely selfish right now, but as us men trying to get them to stay and fix this, is also a form of being selfish. Don't let her dictate your life, be strong. Do whats best for you and your son without her.

 

And again say NOTHING about the relationship or the future. DOn't ask her what shes been up too, she'll let you know if she wants too. You'll be amazed at what this does. Don't give into temptation either with her. This will only string you along and give her the comfort of knowing she can have you whenever she wants. Make her want you, its all you got left to do!

[BellaDonna]

She doesnt want to hear it right now and anything you say like that will come as threat of you trying to control her and her life.

 

I agree. Even though you're her HUSBAND and you deserve an explanation, anything you say or do right now will be held against you. She'll say you're "pressuring" her. She's in a cloud beyond reason. She's somehow created this monster in her mind that her marriage with you is supressing her. She'll interpert any of your behavior negatively, and use it to feed into her beliefs.

 

She may only realize this is a huge mistake AFTER she loses you.

And again say NOTHING about the relationship or the future. DOn't ask her what shes been up too, she'll let you know if she wants too. You'll be amazed at what this does. Don't give into temptation either with her. This will only string you along and give her the comfort of knowing she can have you whenever she wants. Make her want you, its all you got left to do!

 

I agree with that also. Distancing yourself- from her, not your child, is all you can do to hope that she somehow comes to her senses. You tried reasoning, and talking like a mature adult, and it didn't work. Time for Plan B.

 

 

BellaDonna

[confusedashell]

Thanks for all your words! Its indeed a great help!!

 

I dont want to make her sound like an alcholic, shes not. But she loves to go out and have fun at nightclubs and stuff. For the last seven years I've known her, shes only been like this for less than a year! I dont have a clue what it is. She was always the "wine, nice food and video" person. Yeah we liked to go out but we both thought that it was more fun to go out get drunk once a month or every two months, its more enjoyable. Now, this month shes been out getting drunk and spending a heep of cash five times. She goes out early "for a coffee" and comes back 5/6am drunk as hell. I guess shes just seeing this as a way of making up for those years when her mates were out and she was at home with a young baby and a husband.Not that we ever stopped her going out, but she didnt want to.

 

A month ago we went out together for the first time in ages. She told me shed rather go out with me than ANYONE else, inc her best friend and brother because I'm so much fun to be out with. Who knows what the hell she is talking about!

 

Honestly, shes totally paranoid about me! Ok I was angry and down for months, demoralised thinking my future was bleek, but the last four weeks, she even said herself, I was coming out of it. But now shes saying that I make her feel really bad, make her stressed, shes nervous around me. Shes always asking if I'm angry with her, for no reason whatsoever! That she has to do everything around the apartment and with our son. Thats totally untrue! I cleaned this place top to bottom when she was gone so she could come home to a nice clean place and not feel any stress. I know shes easily stressed, I tired everything. I got a load of candles, buddle bath and made her a nice hot bath when she got home and told her to get in it while I made her some supper..you know what she said: "too little too late, you're pressuring me to stay with you, I'm going to my fathers". Well ok. I'll jusst let the water out then. jissus...

 

I dont want her back now. Thats the truth. It'll be hard to get over her. I loved her and still love her. But shes treated me with ZERO respect and shown NO dedication to our marriage. Its like going out is just a way for her to avoid the consquences of what she has done by ending our marriage. She doesnt want to have to deal with them. What we will do with our son, how she will cope alone with him, her studies, her part time job...

 

Its like for the last month, I cant do anything right. If me and my son come into her when shes sleeping to cuddle her and be around her and be whatever, she says why cant you let me sleep!! Iäm so tired!! You make me so tired and stressed!! Shes just blaming me for everything thats wrong. Yes, I've been a jerk, yes I've been short tempered, but she should understand that! The very mention of her moving to the Uk sends shivers up her spine and she freaks out that her life will be over. Hey! you speak fluent english! You have a second language! Your studies are numbers.. 2 is still two in english as it is in swedish. The idea of moving scares her to death and she cant seem to understand how I feel being here for 4 years and in as black a situiation as the day I came here..but that just stresses her if I mention it. She doesnt want to be with me because I worry about the future too much.

 

No, your sbolsutly right. I'm not going to even mention her and me anymore. Its not even on the table now. And she can forget about us getting back later too. I want to move on to the next part of my life. I'm sure that she will find someone else. Shes probably going to end up sleeping with someone tonight. And I'm sure that for a long long time she'll always see me as someone who mentally abused her, kept her down, stressed her, held her back, was angry with her all the time. So be it.

 

I just KNOW that when it comes to the day that she FINALLY wants to sit down and talk about what to do with our son, that it'll all get ugly as hell. No matter how reasonable I try to be. She wants her cake and eat it too. She wants to have the family thing somewhere in the bg but she wants to live life as a 23 year old too.

[boiler55126]

Unfortunately people change for better or for worse. It appears she has changed for the worse. Her going out and having the time of her life or making up for lost time is only her trying to cover up and suffocate her own guilt of this whole situation. Too bad for her that it probably won't work but only compound things and make any problems she may have even worse. At least you're still young enough and you can start over. If she has changed this much it's best to let time run its course. You can't say enough things, buy enough things or do enough nice things to get her to come back to you. If she ever did it would have to be her to decide that. I wouldn't be 1 bit surprised if after a few months she comes to her senses and apologizes to you. That's how it usually happens. I've not only had it happen to me many times but have seen it several times as well. Don't let her know your feelings anymore, it won't do any good. I know you tried to help her and be there for her and do all sorts of nice things, but some people you just can't reach. You need to find someone who cares about you and your feelings and wants the best for you. Not just for herself. It's a 2 way street and it takes both parties for it to work and both parties for it not to work. Your kid should be the only thing on your mind. Make that your priority. Not her, she's already gone. Take it EZ.

[confusedashell]

You're totally right about all this! I honestly half expected her to walk in the door tonight and apologise for being such an idiot and wanting to talk about our son, but nope. Not surprised but just starting to wake up to how she sees all this now. I honestly hardly recognise the person she is now. She just doesnt want to deal with all this now obviously and well that shows me shes got NO respect for me. You know she called me today and was like "i dont want to hurt you, after our son, you're the person I care most for in the world..I didn think I could care for anyone more than my little brother, but with you I do". If she cares about me that much and is acting like this, I feel sorry for her brother.

 

Even if she does happen to think toherself later "damn, that was stupid", she would never ever own up to it or admit it. She is too stubborn and in all honesty shes too self involved to ever see it like that. I'm the bad guy in all this. Thats how she sees it or how she wants to see it. Nothing will change that.

[confusedashell]

shes lost it.

 

she called me up twice tonight. both times she seems depressed. i said are you ok? seem like youre gonna start crying. she said yeah im ok, so confused though. says she needs to come back and wash tomorrow..theres a washing machine where you're at missy. stay at your fathers. why? coz i think its best. I'm looking at tickets home now. ok. i call tomorrow and come by later. why didnt you go out? didnt feel like it. im not feeling good.

 

someone pass the shotgun.

[jng92130]

Gosh, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I've lived now through such a huge change in mate -- my ex just flipped suddenly and couldn't stand the sight of me. It's very difficult, but everyone says that time will heal.

[confusedashell]

shes gone totally loppy. Four calls in less than an hour. crying. not saying really anything. I didnt mention us once. was all postive, happy, normal. Didnt ask about us or what she thought about us. Told her I was looking forward to going home and getting myself together finally.

[confusedashell]

Gosh, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I've lived now through such a huge change in mate -- my ex just flipped suddenly and couldn't stand the sight of me. It's very difficult, but everyone says that time will heal.

 

women are insane. esp women who have children early. they get two mid life crisis. one before they reach 30 and another at 40. Who wants to deal with that kind of emotional torture?

[Demond34]

Let her be depressed, right now at this moment, shes not your concern. She made it clear to you, she doesnt want to be with you. She is confused and that is on her to figure out. Stay clear from the situation for now, unless it has to do with your son. She's confused on staying with you or breaking this off.

 

Seems now her side that wants to be with you could be creeping out. Whatever you do, keep your distance. Don't let her wheel you back in for a nite, only to let you down again. Keep the convo light, be happy and confident. No arguing or bringing up pointless relationship stuff. If she does stop by tom., make sure the house is spotless, everything is organized, the place smells great. Not to impress her, but to show her you can take care of yourself, keep the place looking great. While shes there, do things to keep you busy around the house and keep the convo limited. Show her how responsible you are and what she'll miss, without saying it. Smile alot too.

 

If for some reason the relationship does come up and she starts to cry or get angry. Relax, smile, give her a wink and tell her, Hey go do what you gotta do and make yourself happy. ANd end it there. It may be hard too, but think to yourself, I'll make her happier if I just let her go and I'll take pride in that. Act that way, and you'll feel better about the situation and she may have a change of heart sooner than later, as opposed to the constant questioning.

 

Cool, calm, and collected

Be that GUY!!

[boiler55126]

You're definitely doing the right thing. Don't show her you are having such a hard time with it. Reverse psychology is rather childish but in a situation like this it's best to not talk to her about your marriage and future together or not together. From what you said about the phone calls it seems as though she is starting to feel remorseful. She wants to talk to you but don't know how. She will eventually give you some answers if she has any conscious at all. If she don't, well then you'll be like me, just eternally wondering. Hopefully she don't do that to you. I think she owes you at least an honest explanation. She's just too guilt ridden and confused right now to do that. It gets better though. It's been 2.5 months for me now and I'm starting to come to grips with things. You will too. Things will get better, not so easy, but better.

 

Pass the shotgun?????? C'mon, you have to stop thinking that way. Have I thought about suicide? Yes....every day. You know what stops me? I've had 3 very close friends and 1 college budy commit suicide. I seen what it did to me and what it did to their families. It's a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Bottom line. You have more going for you than you think. I know it's hard to keep your chin up and keep your head above water at a time like this but you will eventually look back on things and realize that you only live once. Make the best of it. Hang in there mate. It will get better.

[confusedashell]

hehe I was being sacrastic about the shotgun. Like she is just giving me a headache now.

 

Honestly, I dont want her back. Thats all done for me. We're over. Its going to be tough for me to get through it, move past it and go home. And I dont think she will really want to get back together. I think she went back to an empty apartment and even though she thought (actually DEMANDED) that she wanted time alone, she feels lonely and strange. She doesnt know what she wants. But I know what I want.

 

When she asked what i was doing, I said I was chatting on MSN. Shes asking "who?? who are you talking to??" I said, "Really, what does that matter?". She seemed a little taken back by it. hah. I'm not trying to punish her for this, but I just wanther to see I'm no doormat for her. She's feeling down now and wants someone to talk to. I Listened to her and told her that shed be fine so just get your head together and focus on what you have to do. I think she was surprised I didnt ask her about us or say"I love you" when i hung up. I just said "talk to you later..bye".

 

When shes comes tomorrow I'm just gonna almost ignore her. I'll talk to her about mundane crap, just do my own thing otherwise. This is finished. It took me a week of dealing with all this to get to the point I'm at now with it all. I'm not going backwards

[boiler55126]

I'm glad to hear that you have gained your composure. I told you earlier that she would eventually break down. She don't know what she wants, let her figure that out. If she calls anymore and starts crying and weeping I'd tell her 1 thing. "Your pain is self chosen". It's easy to be blinded by love. Some people are very undecided and confused as to what they want out of life. Unfortunately it always seems to be the good guys that get wrapped up with these sort of people. I'm to the point now where I have set higher standards, much higher. If I don't find the one I'm looking for at least I won't get hurt like this and like you have.

 

I have a story I'd like to share with you. Not just you but anyone who has read and responded to this post. This is from a movie so some of you may have heard this, but it makes sense.

 

There's a frog and a scorpion sitting on the side of a river and the scorpion asks the frog if he will give him a ride accross the river. The frog tells him NO. The scorpion asks why and the frog says "because you'll sting me". The scorpion replies "why would I do that? we'd both drown" After some more talking and the scorpion convincing the frog that he won't sting him he agrees to give him a ride on his back accross the river. They get about halfway accross and the scorpion stings the frog. As they're both going down the frog looks at the scorpion and asks "Why did you sting me? You promised you wouldn't". The scorpion replies "Because it's my nature".

 

So you see, it all comes down to trust. Trust someone until they give you a reason not to. Sometimes it's a valuable lesson to better yourself for your future so that you're more careful about situations. Learn from all this. Hopefully you won't make the mistakes I have and keep taking her back over and over again only to do nothing more than put yourself in a very vulnerable situation to be hurt all over again. Love will do crazy things to people. That's for sure.

[confusedashell]

Thats excatly why I wouldnt and just couldnt get back with her now - trust. In the back of my mind I'd be thinking that she just came back because it felt too "werid" for her not o have me around, or that she had a weak moment and decided maybe i dont know what I'm feeling. I couldnt walk around feeling like that. Had she done this for a day or two then ok, I could take her back and not think about it, but she has been going on for a little too long with this so I think this probably is really what she wants. Maybe she did feel bad for a little bit, I dont know and frnakly, I dont care. It's all destroyed now. Before this she was the one person I felt like I could trust 200%. She'd never lie to me, mislead me or mess me around. How wrong I was!

 

Well she is coming here today to wash. I dont understand that. She can wash her clothes where she is now. She is too stubborn to admit she was wrong so I really dont think she would express some remorse and want us to get back together, but still...after those calls last night, it's going to be an interesting experience. I'll let you know what happens!

[TiredMan]

Is anger driving you at all with this? Obviously, every relationship is different. In my situation, I trained my mind to not be able to think of a life without each other. That is how we did it. We truly were the best friends in that we basically only confided most things in each other.

[confusedashell]

No I'm not at all angry with her. I'm disappointed that instead of sorting out how we would deal with our son she went out to drink with her mates. I'm disappointed that she is deciding where and when we talk about it. She ended it without a fight and now when I want to sort out the details (not a detail but our son) she wont deal with it.

 

It doesnt matter how much YOU or I want it, it only matters what they want. And right now, my wife just doesnt want it. So I cant do anything. I refuse to be a doormat for her. For her to call me when she is down and lonely, for her to use me like that. When she ended this I made the decision that i would fight for us and when all my efforts were met with a blank face or when she gave nothing back I just feel like I cant do anymore. She has to want it too and she onviously doesnt. In a situation like that you have to think about YOU. Because you cant sit around, not moving on, thinking you'll get back together, reading too much into their words and actions. If they come back they come back on their own and without any bullying. She knows I love her and knows I wanted to work on this. Its not any anger or resentment from my behalf, but in the end I have to think about ME here. Shes thinking about her. Its the healthiest way to approach this. If its meant to be then it will. No amount of begging, pleading, reasoning or whatever will change her mind unless she herself wants to.

[TiredMan]

I think in my case, it's a bit different. Because when I used to cut off from her, she would do anything/everything out of desperation. And it would always make me realize what was important (love) than things like anger. I have an enormous heart and always have. I wish I could be "harder" but that is just not me. I have met so many people in my life and not one like her. Not even close and I am over 30 now. I just feel like when I was distant, she did what she had to do but for the first time, it's the other way around, and I keep holding back out of fear. I feel like I was set up to be crushed.

[confusedashell]

I think that when you just totally back off from a person they get to view the whole situation with a clearer mind and a clearer heart too. You will too. I read through your posts and in a lot of ways, its the same story as me. everything paramounted to where neither her nor me could take it. The only difference was I could see we could fix this and she couldnt. The more distance I get from it, the clearer I see it. And judging by her latest actions, so is she. Let her know you love her, care for her, want to be with her. I dont think there is any point in telling someone how much you changed or whatever, the point is to show them. That woman stayed wirh you for eight years! There obviously was a strong connection and its still there. its just lost and buried by a lot of stress and heartache. Both you should take a step back. Looks to me like she would come around eventually. Just stay strong mate! Be the man she fell in love with!

[boiler55126]

She's dictating everyting. She's controlling you right now. Deciding when and where you talk, or if you talk. I wouldn't put up with it. Stand up for yourself. It's a little thing called human dignity. If I were you, I would tell her not to come over unless she is willing to reason with you and finally come clean. Otherwise tell her not to waste your time. She's taking advantage of the fact that you're hurt and vulnerable and figures she can get anything out of you and get you to do anything she wants you to. Just remember, she chose this, not you. Don't be a heel.

[confusedashell]

I told asked her if she was going to stay here tonight and she said yes. I said "well, actually, i think its best you stay at your fathers again". I think she was pretty taken back by it all. The fact that i just dont appear to be giving a monkies about the whole thing. She can come here, do her washing and if she doesnt start to talk then its nothing but to go back to your fathers until you're willing to sort this mess with our son out.

I know I shouldnt, but I do enjoy this to some degree. Guess it just feels good not to be feeling sorry for myself. I didnt do anything wrong, I tired to fix it. I dont owe her anything now. But I dont want this to get mean either. We still have to talk about our son, so i need her calm and clear and I need to be that too.

[TiredMan]

Her mind, when given time to think, can come up with crazy scenarios. It always has. She is like me, in that she doesn't trust people because she feels she is different from them. Just like me. I am the most caring person I have ever seen. I am the most unselfish person. Everyone who has met me known this. I always think of others first and it gets me in trouble with connecting to regular people and friends. When I hear someone in trouble, I would literally drop everything and anything to break my back for them even when they wouldn't do it for me. When they don't, I get hurt or mad and act the way I acted.

 

People say to think about myself, find someone who fits the criteria of how I think completely etc. Problem with that is, when you have lived your entire life NOT thinking about yourself, you just can't start. I can try and it's fake. Just how I am. And I have never met one person (guy or girl) who was like me in the overcaring department. Never. Not even close. SHE is the closest by far in that she isn't as much as me, but those same traits and thoughts are in her. I know for a fact, that if I was more selfish and not so caring, she wouldn't be the type for me at all.

 

I think I should just push my way into seeing her. She hasn't seen my face in weeks and I think that just emotionally detaches her talking to a phone.

[confusedashell]

well, she came. And we still havent talked.

 

She came back ate and sat around like all was normal. I didnt bring anything up. Eventually she said that she wanted to stay here tonight. I said no, thats its best she goes back to her fathers and stays there. She said she didnt want to. I said stay here if we can talk about whats going on, but more so about our son. She didnt want to talk, she was going to meet her friend and would be back later. I said dont bother coming back. Well, she of course said I was pressuring her again and stressing her out. That she doesnt know anything.

 

I told her that when my son gets back, we're gone two days later. Thats in about five days, so she had better get back here and talk about this. I told her I'm not going to sit down and talk just when she feels like it. I said we'd be leaving by wednesday latest. Then she said how confused she was about it all, that she doesnt know. She doesnt want to do this, doesnt want a relationship, but shes confused. I said its not a confusion thing to ask yourself. Its plain and simple. She said yeah but she doesnt feel the same way she did three years ago. I said who the hell does after this long. She said she doesnt want anyone else, just me. She doesnt want to sleep with anyone but me. Hasnt been interested in another guy since the day she met me.

 

I told her if thats how she feels then stay in this. But either way, figure out what you're doing before I book our tickets. She said she needed time and I said I dont have time. I'm here now, wanting a relationship, want to work on our problems. If you want to fix them then fine. If not I'm leaving on wednesday and that is it.

 

She is meeting her friend and her boyfriend for dinner on friday at their new house. I said cancel that and TALK to me. She said she couldnt. What the hell can I do? I can tie her up and if I ask her to stay home and talk this out she gives me a heap of crap about how confused she is and that she doesnt know how to answer any questions I'll have to ask her because she doesnt know herself the answers. She made this mess and didnt want to fix it, now when it comes down to taking care of the details of it, she doesnt want to. Its as if I was the one who finished it and shes going out to escape dealing with it all.