Here I go again...(Help)..

[Batya33]

9 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

Yeah, again - you are not wrong. When I say I was there for her "night and day" - I just mean I am present.  I am there for her when she needs me.  Which is - a lot.  I hate sounding cruel, because despite it all, I still can't turn off of being in love overnight...but she is very needy and has problems managing her own expectations.  Ugh.  This all is a huge let down.  I feel like I have worked so hard at this relationship - and for what?  A brutal Jekyll & Hyde-level assassination?

I'm too old for this type of stress.

No one is asking you to turn off feelings.  Your feelings are your feelings.  You get to choose the reaction.  Being there night and day for this person is a lot. It is not for other people.  Technically I am too for my son and husband but I also am very very careful not to martyr myself - which takes some doing and some reminding but it's so essential.  I think relationships take work.  But the kind of "work" you're referring to is not part of a healthful relationship.  

[dudelikewhoa]

11 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

No one is asking you to turn off feelings.  Your feelings are your feelings.  You get to choose the reaction.  Being there night and day for this person is a lot. It is not for other people.  Technically I am too for my son and husband but I also am very very careful not to martyr myself - which takes some doing and some reminding but it's so essential.  I think relationships take work.  But the kind of "work" you're referring to is not part of a healthful relationship.  

Yeah.  The 'martyr' comment is interesting because she has accused me of doing that in the past.  I try to be a helpful person.  Sometimes I almost feel like I am too helpful.  I always rationalized doing things like: making coffee in the morning, making breakfast for us, walking her to her car when she is at my house because it is street parking and I live in a metropolitan city, carrying her heavy overnight bags because she has back issues...etc etc.  Too me, those are just basic things and I am not doing them for a score.  

One time, we were having a disagreement about something or another, and in so many words she made me feel like I was a bad boyfriend for interjecting in the argument and I mistakingly was like :"Wow, I beg to differ!  I do my best!  I am there for you and I help with X, Y and Z.."...blah blah blah.  She went on to tell me I was a martyr and I don't need to do anything for because she has gotten by for 34 years without me.  I just felt that my caring for the "little things" is self evident.  She has never let me down about that comment and loves to bring it up only in an argument when it is convenient for her.  Otherwise, she has no problem accepting my love and help and shoulder on a day to basis lol.

[Starlight925]

I read through your post about her causing WWIII over a few Instagram likes.  
She will do this every few weeks or so, because this is who she is. 
  I happen to agree that it sounds very much like Borderline Personality Disorder, which I’ve researched a lot, because I grew up with it (mother). 
  Extremely charming, loving, attentive….until they decide it’s time to blow up, cancel a vacation, a party, at the last minute, while you walk on eggshells.  
  The only way for you, unfortunately, is out of the relationship. 
  I’m not internet-diagnosing her, but I’ll ask you:  Is this the way you want to live?  In love one minute, attached at the hip 80% (not healthy, BTW), or in a free, loving relationship with respect, honor, and trust?

[dudelikewhoa]

1 minute ago, Starlight925 said:

I read through your post about her causing WWIII over a few Instagram likes.  
She will do this every few weeks or so, because this is who she is. 
  I happen to agree that it sounds very much like Borderline Personality Disorder, which I’ve researched a lot, because I grew up with it (mother). 
  Extremely charming, loving, attentive….until they decide it’s time to blow up, cancel a vacation, a party, at the last minute, while you walk on eggshells.  
  The only way for you, unfortunately, is out of the relationship. 
  I’m not internet-diagnosing her, but I’ll ask you:  Is this the way you want to live?  In love one minute, attached at the hip 80% (not healthy, BTW), or in a free, loving relationship with respect, honor, and trust?

I hear you.  If that is the case...it breaks my heart even more.  I feel taken for granted and manipulated. 😞 

[Batya33]

37 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

I hear you.  If that is the case...it breaks my heart even more.  I feel taken for granted and manipulated. 😞 

What benefits did you get out of being at her beck and call?  Be honest with yourself even if you don’t share why in this thread. 

[rainbowsandroses]

OP, I've read this thread and your previous and here's my $.02 fwiw.

Since obviously you're intent on remaining in this relationship, next time she has one of her abusive blow-ups and starts insulting and berating you, DO NOT REACT. 

That is precisely what she's after, your reaction so she can continue her tirade and create drama.  Which at that point in time, she needs to do for whatever reason. 

Do NOT give it to her, do NOT feed the crazy.  Doing so, makes YOU crazy, sorry to say.  

If it's on text, immediately delete the text, or ignore it.

Do NOT respond in any way shape or form.  Whether it's to explain your position, defend yourself, apologize or "make nice," don't even acknowledge it.

If it's in person, LEAVE.  

Learn to DETACH during these times.  

Any sort of response even if it's to try and calm the waters, only keeps the drama going... and going and going.  

Just as you've experienced.

FACT:  Your girlfriend is disrespectful.  She is also verbally abusive. She can be mean and cruel.  She may have a mental illness or disorder but it does not matter. 

The fact is she's disrespectful and abusive to you, focus on that even if it's only occasionally.  It should NEVER happen.  Ever.

Google "silence and distance."  You're not going to resolve anything by attempting to verbally communicate with her. Not in this case.  Again, it only feeds the drama and crazy.

By going silent and distancing yourself when she's goes off on one of her endless tirades, you're sending her the message (silently).that YOU respect yourself and will NOT tolerate disrespect or abuse.

No words need be spoken, simply go silent.  Let her stew in her own juice, YOU are not going to participate.

Going silent also allows her to calm down on her own without YOU telling her to do so which only makes her even crazier and continues the drama.

Continue to be silent/distant until she reaches out aplogizing.

Let her believe she's lost you for good!  That would actually be a good thing in this situation.

IF she cares as much as she claims, once her emotions calm down, she will return with an apology.

YOU need to be strong here, otherwise your relationship doesn't have a snowballs chance in hell of working out happily and healthily long term, assuming that is what you want. 

Which if I'm honest not sure that IS what you want.  

No man I know who's seeking happy and healthy would ever remain in such a relationship and allow himself to be berated, insulted and verbally abused.  

They'd leave.  

Think about it. 

Good luck.

 

 

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, dudelikewhoa said:

  She asked me nicely to wake her up.  The classic - "Babe, please make sure I don't sleep in" thing.  But that is not my responsibility at the end of the day.  

This doesn't seem like an big favor to ask. No, it's not "your responsibility", it would just be a simple courtesy.

But overall you know who she is. There seems to be a lot of "who's right who's wrong, who's the demon here" type of sentiment in this writing. 

Perhaps she's just a volatile person, perhaps you take the bait and escalate too much. But it definitely seems like a pattern you're aware of. 

[rainbowsandroses]

To add OP, I have experienced this but it was with a female friend not a romantic relationship.

I won't get into the details but I fixed her up with one of my boyfriend's friends.  They dated for a bit, then suddenly out of NOWHERE she accused me of trying to steal him away from her.

I wasn't. I was happily dating my boyfriend at the time. 

Anyway, she went absolutely bonkers on me, began slamming me with insulting and berating texts.

I responded to the first two but then I realized my responses were only fueling the fire and her abuse began escalating. 

The texts kept coming, and coming and coming.  I didn't even read, I simply deleted each as they came in.

In total, she had sent around 25 texts in a 5-10 minute period.  One right after the other.  

What got me through and not react was my ability to DETACH.  

A couple of weeks later, she called and apologized and we talked it out then.  Calmly and rationally. 

Sadly our friendship was never the same and we eventually went separate ways. 

You can't communicate with crazy, not gonna happen. 

 

[Starlight925]

I agree with @rainbowsandroses advice.

If you choose to stay with her, then employ her techniques of complete disengagement when your girlfriend pulls her next stunt, which you know she will.

You’ll know from her reactions how to proceed further.

My guess is, her being ignored will not be pretty.    I’m reminded of Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction coming after Michael Douglas saying “I’m not gonna be ignored!” with that crazed look in her eyes.  No, I’m not saying your girlfriend is a true bunny boiler, but I am saying it seems like something is desperately wrong here.

[catfeeder]

10 hours ago, dudelikewhoa said:

... I really need to exclaim that 95% of the time she is a sweet, loving, calm, understanding person and is so well loved in our community of friends. 

... and so might have said 95% of the people who've been harmed in a life altering way (or a life ending way) by someone they have known and trusted, especially by those with whom they've been intimate. And this doesn't even mean actual, premeditated crimes. The danger is in the debris that flies from an explosive loss of self control. Accidental violence. Road rages. Domino effects. Stuff you can't predict, yet the odds are heightened by spending even ONE% of your time in the presence of one who, 'on occasion,' goes off the rails.

Incidents of turning mean are not a lightweight thing. Such problems don't tend to get 'better' over time, they get worse. Have you noticed?

Opting to stick around for it only to complain that your feelings are hurt is unwise, but nobody here can force you to see clearly.

Best of luck with that.

 

[dudelikewhoa]

On 12/3/2023 at 7:54 AM, Batya33 said:

What benefits did you get out of being at her beck and call?  Be honest with yourself even if you don’t share why in this thread. 

Hmm. I was not at her beck and call per say.  I was just on auto-pilot and trying to be a good, helpful partner.  I am not defending her by saying she is generally low maintenance on that front and fairly down to earth. She is a bit more of an arty, nerdy, shy type...not some entitled rich brat...she just has a mean streak when she has to deal with conflict...and it is cutting.

I think the benefits I got were a lot of not much.  Hugs, awws, thank you's and some reciprocation at times. But I think I also enabled her to be more accepting than giving - then she would take me for granted and if a basic, standard, run-of-the-mill argument happens - she resents me saying that I never have to do things for her again and that it won't buy her affection...which was never the intention...I just love her and LIKE her as a person (aside from this massive flaw).  So, I dunno.  I feel lost and confused over it.

[dudelikewhoa]

Thank you all for the responses!  I am left wondering if she will ever reach out and apologize for the way she left things.  Yes, she has had bad patches but she has almost always came back with a day or so to patch up what happened and talk.  This last streak of heartbreakingly mean messages were really hurtful.  I do not believe I deserved that level of verbal vitriol.  I know she wouldn't like to leave that in that manner.

I only ask this to the ether not because I necessarily want her back (I haven't had enough time to make a proper decision if the opportunity arises) but I think after a deeply loving year and a half relationship (aside from these bad hiccups) where we were so close to moving in with one another and even had marriage thoughts - one would expect a bit of closure?!  Am I crazy for thinking that?!  I truly think an apology is due but I will not hold my breathe on that one. 

I just feel like clarity and closure is not a lot to ask -- but I have no intention on reaching out to her.

Thoughts?

[Batya33]

7 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

Hmm. I was not at her beck and call per say.  I was just on auto-pilot and trying to be a good, helpful partner.  I am not defending her by saying she is generally low maintenance on that front and fairly down to earth. She is a bit more of an arty, nerdy, shy type...not some entitled rich brat...she just has a mean streak when she has to deal with conflict...and it is cutting.

I think the benefits I got were a lot of not much.  Hugs, awws, thank you's and some reciprocation at times. But I think I also enabled her to be more accepting than giving - then she would take me for granted and if a basic, standard, run-of-the-mill argument happens - she resents me saying that I never have to do things for her again and that it won't buy her affection...which was never the intention...I just love her and LIKE her as a person (aside from this massive flaw).  So, I dunno.  I feel lost and confused over it.

Did you benefit because you get to be her “hero” and also maybe to you it was better than being “alone?”  

[dudelikewhoa]

4 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Did you benefit because you get to be her “hero” and also maybe to you it was better than being “alone?”  

I am fine with being alone.  After my last long term relationship (she became an alcoholic after her father passed, caused hell and then left me for her co-worker), I chose to be (mostly) single for 3 years to focus on myself and make better decisions.  I have to clarify that everyone loved us together and aside from her mouth when she is angry and some double standards - otherwise - she is the healthiest person I have ever been with.  

I have no interest in being her "hero" but maybe it came off that way.  My therapist seems to think I want to help people too much.  So maybe subconsciously? I don't know. 

[Batya33]

3 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

I am fine with being alone.  After my last long term relationship (she became an alcoholic after her father passed, caused hell and then left me for her co-worker), I chose to be (mostly) single for 3 years to focus on myself and make better decisions.  I have to clarify that everyone loved us together and aside from her mouth when she is angry and some double standards - otherwise - she is the healthiest person I have ever been with.  

I have no interest in being her "hero" but maybe it came off that way.  My therapist seems to think I want to help people too much.  So maybe subconsciously? I don't know. 

I don’t think it needs to be subconscious. What’s your motivation in helping to the extent it compromises your values and boundaries? Do you think that makes you a better person ? Also have you ever noticed how hard it it is to say a simple no to a request for a favor - but how very often your simple no engenders true respect from the person ?

[dudelikewhoa]

10 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I don’t think it needs to be subconscious. What’s your motivation in helping to the extent it compromises your values and boundaries? Do you think that makes you a better person ? Also have you ever noticed how hard it it is to say a simple no to a request for a favor - but how very often your simple no engenders true respect from the person ?

It is a great question!  You make valid points.

I don't know, I just help people.  It's just knee-jerk.  I have never examined it.  When my friend was dying in the hospital of liver and kidney failure I just decided to help advocate with her partner and her mother for 10 months across 6 hospitals and it resulted in a life saving double transplant.  I wasn't thinking about why I did that - I just did.  It wasn't fun either.  Do I think it makes me a better person?  I don't know!  I hope so! I am more satisfied that someone did not die a slow death at the hands of a crappy hospital system.  But I cannot say that about myself - that I am a better person.  One can only hope they live this life as a good human.  

I do think respectful "no's" could be healthy when I am feeling overwhelmed, yes.  

[dudelikewhoa]

On 12/3/2023 at 8:47 AM, Wiseman2 said:

This doesn't seem like an big favor to ask. No, it's not "your responsibility", it would just be a simple courtesy.

But overall you know who she is. There seems to be a lot of "who's right who's wrong, who's the demon here" type of sentiment in this writing. 

Perhaps she's just a volatile person, perhaps you take the bait and escalate too much. But it definitely seems like a pattern you're aware of. 

I hear you.  I do not think anyone is a "demon".  She can be volatile when she is pushed in conflict, then she will character assassinate you as a defense mechanism.  I definitely take the bait and escalate because it gets under my skin when I am accused of something that I did not do.  It is something I am actively working on.

[MissCanuck]

40 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

we were so close to moving in with one another and even had marriage thoughts - one would expect a bit of closure?!  Am I crazy for thinking that?!

You're not crazy, but you're expecting maturity from an emotionally-immature, erratic and verbally abusive woman. 

You're going to have to find your own closure on this one. 

[dudelikewhoa]

On 12/3/2023 at 8:41 AM, rainbowsandroses said:

Since obviously you're intent on remaining in this relationship, next time she has one of her abusive blow-ups and starts insulting and berating you, DO NOT REACT. 

Thank you for this.  I had a chance to ingest your comment and found it encouraging.  In relation to this comment, I am not sure I want to remain.  I am struggling.  I don't even know if it is an option.  This all happened so suddenly and fast that I am genuinely flabbergasted. She dropped a bomb on us.  We'll see what happens.

On 12/3/2023 at 8:41 AM, rainbowsandroses said:

Google "silence and distance."  You're not going to resolve anything by attempting to verbally communicate with her. Not in this case.  Again, it only feeds the drama and crazy.

By going silent and distancing yourself when she's goes off on one of her endless tirades, you're sending her the message (silently).that YOU respect yourself and will NOT tolerate disrespect or abuse.

No words need be spoken, simply go silent.  Let her stew in her own juice, YOU are not going to participate.

Going silent also allows her to calm down on her own without YOU telling her to do so which only makes her even crazier and continues the drama.

Continue to be silent/distant until she reaches out aplogizing.

Yes, I agree and most always go silent in cases where someone is misbehaving or when a breakup occurs.  My mind is so blown by how she acted (yes, she has had her moments but this was particularly intense) that even though it has only been 2 days since it happened, it feels like 5 days and I am left thinking: "Is she going to even reach out to apologize or even just close it out?!".  Right now, it just feels depressing and that I will never hear from her about this.
 

On 12/3/2023 at 8:41 AM, rainbowsandroses said:

No man I know who's seeking happy and healthy would ever remain in such a relationship and allow himself to be berated, insulted and verbally abused.  

This is truthful - I did find that she was more pleasant when she was in therapy.  I feel like she spiraled.
 

On 12/3/2023 at 8:41 AM, rainbowsandroses said:

Let her believe she's lost you for good!  That would actually be a good thing in this situation.

I hope that resonates and marinates with her.  I truly do.  She has always been so very head over heels about me on our good days (which is most of the time).  I'm starting to think she hates me now...which is sad...because it is not like I did something worthy of that in the least bit.  Annoyed?  Yes.  Perhaps, over it?  Possibly.  The level of vitriol she spat at me even after I was not responding...was so hateful.  😕 

[Wiseman2]

21 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

 it has only been 2 days since it happened, it feels like 5 days and I am left thinking: "Is she going to even reach out to apologize or even just close it out?!".  Right now, it just feels depressing and that I will never hear from her about this.

Try to let the dust settle. You're away on a trip? That's a good time to reflect. Did she block you? Please don't await an apology. All you need to decide is if she reaches out, what to say and if you want to continue the fighting. 

[boltnrun]

Read the book "I Hate You, Don't Leave Me" and see if any of it resonates. 

[dudelikewhoa]

15 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Try to let the dust settle. You're away on a trip? That's a good time to reflect. Did she block you? Please don't await an apology. All you need to decide is if she reaches out, what to say and if you want to continue the fighting. 

I am on a trip and it is helpful for sure.  She did not block me on social media.  I don't know if she blocked my texts because I haven't messaged her since she was berating me over text during the incident and she wasn't respecting my wishes to stop messaging me.  So I don't know - I doubt it.  There has just been radio silence.  Our text message thread is just a wall of texts of her going off on me the other night.

[Batya33]

I relate to your knee jerk helping people.  I am the same.  You have a big heart and in this case you are being taken advantage of by a person who doesn't deserve to reap the rewards of your big heart.

[dudelikewhoa]

30 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I relate to your knee jerk helping people.  I am the same.  You have a big heart and in this case you are being taken advantage of by a person who doesn't deserve to reap the rewards of your big heart.

I appreciate that.  I know that I need to work on my listening and patience skills.  Devils advocate : Perhaps the interjecting comments over her venting is making her feel unheard in the relationship and she is reaching a breaking point.  It's our biggest communication hurdle.  We both love to talk and we both want to take the steering wheel during conflict.

[Batya33]

3 minutes ago, dudelikewhoa said:

I appreciate that.  I know that I need to work on my listening and patience skills.  Devils advocate : Perhaps the interjecting comments over her venting is making her feel unheard in the relationship and she is reaching a breaking point.  It's our biggest communication hurdle.  We both love to talk and we both want to take the steering wheel during conflict.

Would you rather be right or be close?  I'd practice -I do- literally shutting your mouth and listening to the other person without internally rehearsing your response or interjecting.  I've been practicing that even more for the last 10 years -why? Because when my mother in law was in hospice and dying my husband wasn't expressing himself about it often.  I didn't want to force him -he was by her side as much as possible, he was so close to her and such a wonderful son - but - he didn't express a lot to me. Or anyone.

  So when he did share with me, speak -whether about her or something else, I squelched my chatty ways and just listened,  With good eye contact- no eyes on a phone or device etc.  And I kept on doing this as much as possible after she died and for all these years.  He's more introverted and I want him to feel listened to as much as possible.  Practice it -it's worth it IMO.