Not connecting

[Fretful]

My wife and I have been together for going on 13 years. We have a lot of things in common and never get tired of spending time together, she is my best friend. We enjoy watching things together, playing video games, and just working on things in the same space. Lately I feel like I’m walking on eggshells around her. There are topics I can’t bring up without causing her to get upset and shut down, and even when I ask if there’s another time we could talk about it, she won’t commit. She doesn’t like to make promises because she thinks I’ll get upset. 

It’s been several years since we’ve had a sex life. In the past 5 or so years, we’ve had sex maybe a handful of times. My love language is a lot more physical affection based than hers, which I’ve always understood about her, and I’ve done my best to be patient with her. In the past year or so we’ve talked about taking things slow and building back up to it since we’re so out of practice. However, it’s been about 6 months and she has trouble even kissing me for an extended period, pulling away almost immediately every time. 

I try my best to be patient and understanding, I know we both have our issues, but I really miss that closeness. She feels so closed off from me. I know she has body image and anxiety issues, and I’ve been nothing but supportive of her. Tonight she got upset because she thought I was staring at her, because I’m tired and was thinking while looking at her. I like to look at her, I love her and she brings me comfort. I’m sad. I wish I knew what to do.

[LootieTootie]

She sounds extremely insecure or she doesn't seem in to you like you are in to her.

What are the topics you would like to bring up but she keeps shutting down?

[Fretful]

One is about writing, we used to do a lot of writing together but I was too enthusiastic about it and overwhelmed her. Another is about being intimate. If I want to talk about anything stressful basically. It’s been improving a bit lately but still not much progress and she doesn’t bring up any of it on her own so I usually end up waiting until I can’t anymore then asking about it. I’ve tried setting a particular time period for talking about stressful things like after dinner and it seems to help a bit.

[Batya33]

Do you two take brisk walks together outside or even a hike?

[Lambert]

Hi @Fretful

Is your wife in therapy or doing anything about her issues?  How about you?  

You can't really fix things with a person that is not willing to fix them.  I learned that the hard way a couple of times.  You can only work on yourself and grow as person for yourself.  If she is happy with the way things are, what's the motivation to change?  

It is awful to have to walk on eggshells with someone, especially someone you consider your best friend.  What's her side of this story? I think you're right, there is a big disconnect.  If you working on it and she's working on avoiding it-- I am sorry.  that can't fix anything, but it can damage you more.

[Fretful]

12 minutes ago, Lambert said:

Hi @Fretful

Is your wife in therapy or doing anything about her issues?  How about you?  

You can't really fix things with a person that is not willing to fix them.  I learned that the hard way a couple of times.  You can only work on yourself and grow as person for yourself.  If she is happy with the way things are, what's the motivation to change?  

It is awful to have to walk on eggshells with someone, especially someone you consider your best friend.  What's her side of this story? I think you're right, there is a big disconnect.  If you working on it and she's working on avoiding it-- I am sorry.  that can't fix anything, but it can damage you more.

I’m in therapy. I’ve talked to her about going into therapy but she’s afraid to, she doesn’t like talking about private things with people. She did recently start taking anxiety medication. I really wish she would talk to someone because I think she has a lot to work on that I can’t help her with. I want to stay together for our lives but I don’t know what else I can do. She seems to believe she is content with how things are. I should be happy with it too, but I can’t help but think of the things that aren’t happening between us. I miss that connection, but I can’t compare how things are now to the past.

[Fretful]

59 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Do you two take brisk walks together outside or even a hike?

We occasionally walk together but it’s pretty rare. It’s difficult to get her to go outside, she’s not very outdoorsy and has body image issues. She doesn’t like to be seen.

[Lambert]

6 minutes ago, Fretful said:

I’m in therapy. I’ve talked to her about going into therapy but she’s afraid to, she doesn’t like talking about private things with people. She did recently start taking anxiety medication. I really wish she would talk to someone because I think she has a lot to work on that I can’t help her with. I want to stay together for our lives but I don’t know what else I can do. She seems to believe she is content with how things are. I should be happy with it too, but I can’t help but think of the things that aren’t happening between us. I miss that connection, but I can’t compare how things are now to the past.

I am sorry.  But you're right a person on prescription medication should be seeing a doctor and in therapy.  It amazes me how people can think a pill alone can solve mental illness.  But don't get me started on that soap box.

As long as you accept this behavior.  It won't change.  

 

[Batya33]

39 minutes ago, Fretful said:

We occasionally walk together but it’s pretty rare. It’s difficult to get her to go outside, she’s not very outdoorsy and has body image issues. She doesn’t like to be seen.

Does she feel seen by you ? In the right ways ?

[Andrina]

What are your lives like outside of interacting with one another. You both work? Do you each have a support system with family and friends? Do you have any hobbies you do separately besides gaming? Have you ever asked what improvements she'd like in your relationship?

Sounds like you used to be intimate more often, but that her libido was much lower than yours from the get-go. Is this correct?

In your shoes, I'd say: I'm not willing to live life like this for the rest of my life. For now, if you're not willing to attend marital counseling with me, I want for us to read some couples' communication books together, and see if we can start there.

There are plenty in the library or bookstore. If she agrees, take turns reading aloud a chapter per day, and then practice the skills given.

You can also ask, without sex as a goal, to give each other foot rubs or back rubs just to reestablish some physical connection.

What do you mean she doesn't like to be seen because of body image issues? Does she go to the grocery store? Do you have children? If so, how do they get to school? Just trying to picture what your daily life is like.

Sometimes doing volunteer work with those less fortunate will make a person realize how silly they've been making their own mole hills into mountains, and the volunteer work will make them forget about their own problems. Helping others also can't help but make one happier.

If your suggestions fall on flat ears, I, myself, don't believe in sacrificing your own happiness because of a partner who could care less that her partner isn't happy. What you're asking for is reasonable, and it's on her to communicate what she wants improve and to tell you what she wants or doesn't want from you. If she refuses to help herself resolve her mental issues, then there is nothing more you can do.

I know I felt good that I pulled out all the stops with my ex-husband as far as those communication books and marital counseling. In the end, it didn't work because he wasn't willing to use those skills to improve, and he stopped taking his antidepressants and stopped going to the psychiatrist. I could then leave the marriage guilt-free, knowing I'd fully tried.

This allowed me to be free to date again, and I eventually found a happier life with present husband. Loving someone is irrelevant if you can't be happy in that partnership. If she refuses to evolve with you, you either stay and continue to be miserable, or free yourself so you can search for a compatible partner after a good year solo to mourn and heal. Good luck and keep us updated. 

[smackie9]

Does she have body issues because she is over weight? 

[SooSad33]

Sadly, we cannot make anyone do what they don't want to. But it may help ( try) to explain to her how these therapists are different.  They are trained for these kinds of things.  They're 'neutral', so won't judge you, plus they are outside the family dwelling.  I have always found them helpful, to help me 'work through my issues'.

As for how she is, sorry she's pulled away so much 😕 . No, that's not easy on anyone , especially your partner.

It has already been some time ( 5 yrs?) of this.  And I get the feeling you can't wait forever to see IF she'll turn around.  Heck, to even get a kiss from her.

This may just be the coming end to this relationship, as a good, healthy one is where a couple can be themselves, communicate and have what's deserved within one. ( Intimacy, feeling wanted, respected, etc). And yours sounds a lot like giving with no take.

If she can't, then she can't.  She's withdrawn a lot now and nothing much you can do if she doesn't want to 'work on this' with you.

 

[Fretful]

On 2/11/2023 at 9:46 AM, Andrina said:

What are your lives like outside of interacting with one another. You both work? Do you each have a support system with family and friends? Do you have any hobbies you do separately besides gaming? Have you ever asked what improvements she'd like in your relationship?

Sounds like you used to be intimate more often, but that her libido was much lower than yours from the get-go. Is this correct?

In your shoes, I'd say: I'm not willing to live life like this for the rest of my life. For now, if you're not willing to attend marital counseling with me, I want for us to read some couples' communication books together, and see if we can start there.

There are plenty in the library or bookstore. If she agrees, take turns reading aloud a chapter per day, and then practice the skills given.

You can also ask, without sex as a goal, to give each other foot rubs or back rubs just to reestablish some physical connection.

What do you mean she doesn't like to be seen because of body image issues? Does she go to the grocery store? Do you have children? If so, how do they get to school? Just trying to picture what your daily life is like.

Sometimes doing volunteer work with those less fortunate will make a person realize how silly they've been making their own mole hills into mountains, and the volunteer work will make them forget about their own problems. Helping others also can't help but make one happier.

If your suggestions fall on flat ears, I, myself, don't believe in sacrificing your own happiness because of a partner who could care less that her partner isn't happy. What you're asking for is reasonable, and it's on her to communicate what she wants improve and to tell you what she wants or doesn't want from you. If she refuses to help herself resolve her mental issues, then there is nothing more you can do.

I know I felt good that I pulled out all the stops with my ex-husband as far as those communication books and marital counseling. In the end, it didn't work because he wasn't willing to use those skills to improve, and he stopped taking his antidepressants and stopped going to the psychiatrist. I could then leave the marriage guilt-free, knowing I'd fully tried.

This allowed me to be free to date again, and I eventually found a happier life with present husband. Loving someone is irrelevant if you can't be happy in that partnership. If she refuses to evolve with you, you either stay and continue to be miserable, or free yourself so you can search for a compatible partner after a good year solo to mourn and heal. Good luck and keep us updated. 

She works and I have grad school. Her main hobby is video games but she also collects figures. I do art. We both have supportive family members and friends. She is more introverted and tends not to hang out with other people as much as I do.

That’s right, though when we first started dating it was the other way around.

She’s open to doing workbooks together so I’m going to look for some. 

Most of my suggestions for physical intimacy she just says she needs to think about it and panics sometimes if I bring it up. She says she’s thinking about my suggestions, like mindfulness when making contact with each other, focusing on the touch. But she won’t move beyond thinking about it.

We don’t have children. She is overweight and feels embarrassed when out and about, she doesn’t like eyes on her. I guess she feels judged. She goes out and does errands just fine.

She says she is content with how things are. Her main issue with me in the past was that I get too enthusiastic or pushy, but I’ve been actively working on that for years and attending therapy on my own. She is taking anxiety meds now too. In the past it was a bad combination of my eagerness and her anxiety. She puts a lot of blame on me for how she reacts when I bring up intimacy or writing though. 

I really don’t want to date anyone else. We’ve been together a long time and I cherish our time together. That’s what’s so frustrating, it’s just one or two things that I need to change and things would be so much better. But she’s not willing to do therapy, says it wouldn’t help her, and that she doesn’t appreciate me pushing it on her when she knows herself better. I’m so stuck. I don’t think what I’m asking for or trying to work towards is unreasonable and it shouldn’t have to be difficult.

[Fretful]

On 2/11/2023 at 7:05 PM, SooSad33 said:

Sadly, we cannot make anyone do what they don't want to. But it may help ( try) to explain to her how these therapists are different.  They are trained for these kinds of things.  They're 'neutral', so won't judge you, plus they are outside the family dwelling.  I have always found them helpful, to help me 'work through my issues'.

As for how she is, sorry she's pulled away so much 😕 . No, that's not easy on anyone , especially your partner.

It has already been some time ( 5 yrs?) of this.  And I get the feeling you can't wait forever to see IF she'll turn around.  Heck, to even get a kiss from her.

This may just be the coming end to this relationship, as a good, healthy one is where a couple can be themselves, communicate and have what's deserved within one. ( Intimacy, feeling wanted, respected, etc). And yours sounds a lot like giving with no take.

If she can't, then she can't.  She's withdrawn a lot now and nothing much you can do if she doesn't want to 'work on this' with you.

 

I’ve explained every which way that therapy would help her, but she’s not willing, even though she believes in its merits for other people. It’s so frustrating and I really don’t get it but I can’t push. 

I don’t want this to be the end. I feel so stuck. 

[Batya33]

What does her doctor say about her weight and general health ?

[Fretful]

1 hour ago, Batya33 said:

What does her doctor say about her weight and general health ?

Usually the doctor tells her she should lose weight but it seems an excuse. She has pcos so it isn’t so simple.

[Batya33]

4 hours ago, Fretful said:

Usually the doctor tells her she should lose weight but it seems an excuse. She has pcos so it isn’t so simple.

Yes.  I have friends who have PCOS. One lost weight with one of those ridiculous diet drink plans but ultimately got the lap band. Which was far more successful 

[Andrina]

For the last five years, about once a year being intimate is quite egregious. As a woman, no matter the issue--low libido because of antidepressants, self-conscious about my body, or being annoyed at my partner, if I loved him and wanted the marriage to continue, I'd want my partner to be happy. I'd take the awkward step of talking to a therapist. (And I did. Believe me, I did cry in front of that stranger, which was not fun. But I was making a last ditch effort with who would become my ex). If

With a bad body image, I'd try on various lingerie to hide what I perceived to be my less attractive traits and highlight the best. I'd try a different depressant or take it a different time of day, to see if that made a difference.

Try the workbooks if you wish, and anything else she's agreed to. But in your shoes, I'd give a deadline, meaning if there is no improvement in a year, or whatever date you've set, I'd divorce. Because she is showing you she doesn't care by her inaction. Maybe she's too cowardly to end things. The marriage is one-sided. That's no way to live.

Perhaps you should start spending more time with friends and give her a taste of what life would be like without you. Sometimes a person needs a wake-up call.

Before ending things, tell her the seriousness of the matter. She might be shoving your concerns under a rug, since you've put up with this for at least 5 years. She's expecting you to do the same for a lifetime. I'd show her this isn't the case.

The best way to change someone else's behavior is to change your own. When you behave the opposite or differently than you have responded in the past, a person will look at you through new eyes. Give it a try! You might be pleasantly surprised.