I think my best friend has BPD and I don’t know how to tell her

[undertheivy]

For the last several years I have watched my best friend suffer and spiral deeper due to her mental health. I’ve always thought she was over reacting to lots of things. Like the most minuscule problem or even just things that are very common bumps in the road that everyone deals with are like a full blown crisis to her. It wasn’t until a few months ago that I was talking with someone else about it and they said it sounded like borderline personality disorder (BPD). I had never heard of it so I did some research (I’ve continued to research it as well), and it is my best friend to a T. It seems like she is never in a good place for me to suggest this to her, I want to tell her that I think it’s worth bringing it up to her therapist and get her opinion but it’s never a good time. Please understand my best friend is hanging by a thread almost 24/7, she’s paranoid constantly that nobody is who they say they are and that all of her friends don’t actually like her. She usually isn’t this way with me but recently she was, she does it every now and then. I’m scared that if I tell her she should look into it and talk to her therapist that she’ll look it up and see the symptoms and her mind will go to thinking that I think all of this stuff about her. She’ll twist it somehow. I already walk on eggshells around her because she is so fragile. To be honest this has been very exhausting for me. Our friendship is exhausting. We have been best friends for over 20 years, we’re in our early 30’s now. I just want to see her be happy and enjoying life and be able to handle stress and conflict in a healthy way. I would love any and all suggestions for how to bring this up to her (BPD) without hurting her feelings or her thinking I’m the bad guy. I really am worried this is what she will do. 

[catfeeder]

1 hour ago, undertheivy said:

I just want to see her be happy and enjoying life and be able to handle stress and conflict in a healthy way.

Friend is lucky to have you for a friend, and if you opt to raise such a discussion, you may want to start with the above statement.

But first, you mention that friend has a therapist. Consider asking friend whether she might allow you to ask her some questions about this provider out of possible interest in pursuing therapy.

If so, you can find out the name of the provider, how long friend has been seeing this provider and whether friend has found her sessions to be helpful. Ask whether friend has been satisfied with her diagnosis and her course of treatment--see what you can learn.

If friend has been with this provider for years with no recall of a diagnosis (or one you view as inaccurate) along with noticeable recent deterioration, then the therapist might be a dud--OR, friend has been playing 'the good patient' (research this) just to stay involved with this therapist rather than actually work a treatment. (A good therapist should catch this, though, rather than milk a patient for years...)

However, if this is a new-ish therapist, you might have some hope of successful treatment.

While a therapist cannot speak with you about a patient, YOU can phone a provider's office and ask to disclose a concern about a friend who 'may' be a client of the practice.

The office can take IN information without confirming anything to you--even whether friend is a patient there. 

This way, you can skip trying to convince friend to self-diagnose, and instead, you can voice your notice of a recent deterioration and request that therapist consider a reassessment and accelerated treatment plan (should this person be receiving treatment with this provider).

Head high, and write more if it helps.

 

 

[undertheivy]

3 hours ago, catfeeder said:

Friend is lucky to have you for a friend, and if you opt to raise such a discussion, you may want to start with the above statement.

But first, you mention that friend has a therapist. Consider asking friend whether she might allow you to ask her some questions about this provider out of possible interest in pursuing therapy.

If so, you can find out the name of the provider, how long friend has been seeing this provider and whether friend has found her sessions to be helpful. Ask whether friend has been satisfied with her diagnosis and her course of treatment--see what you can learn.

If friend has been with this provider for years with no recall of a diagnosis (or one you view as inaccurate) along with noticeable recent deterioration, then the therapist might be a dud--OR, friend has been playing 'the good patient' (research this) just to stay involved with this therapist rather than actually work a treatment. (A good therapist should catch this, though, rather than milk a patient for years...)

However, if this is a new-ish therapist, you might have some hope of successful treatment.

While a therapist cannot speak with you about a patient, YOU can phone a provider's office and ask to disclose a concern about a friend who 'may' be a client of the practice.

The office can take IN information without confirming anything to you--even whether friend is a patient there. 

This way, you can skip trying to convince friend to self-diagnose, and instead, you can voice your notice of a recent deterioration and request that therapist consider a reassessment and accelerated treatment plan (should this person be receiving treatment with this provider).

Head high, and write more if it helps.

 

 

Thank you for this, it is very helpful. Unfortunately we live on opposite sides of the country right now, so it would be hard for me to show any interest in her therapist to her. I do wish I had more info on her therapist to find a way to contact her, I may try bringing it up. 
Unfortunately I think her therapist is a dud. She has been with her for years now. I’ve been wondering lately how in the world her therapist hasn’t diagnosed her with this. As far as I know my friend is very honest with her, but I could be wrong. As far as I know this therapist has never diagnosed her with anything at all. 
Thanks again for the reply, I may try to at least get the name of her therapist and see what I can do!

[Wiseman2]

6 hours ago, undertheivy said:

 I already walk on eggshells around her because she is so fragile. Our friendship is exhausting. We have been best friends for over 20 years, we’re in our early 30’s now

You need to step back from this burnout. You are much to invested in trying to fix her.

You're not a psychiatrist who can make a diagnosis by googling some symptoms.

She has friends and family and a therapist. It's also not your job to second guess a therapist because you googled some symptoms. It's not your job to find her a new therapist either.

The best thing you can do is stay in your own lane and reflect why you are getting so burned out from this.

Focus on why you are walking on eggshells and why you are overinvesting and overinvolved with someone you find "exhausting".

 

[Wiseman2]

You've been struggling with this for years. It's time to let go of trying to fix her:

 

[catfeeder]

7 hours ago, undertheivy said:

Thank you for this, it is very helpful. Unfortunately we live on opposite sides of the country right now, so it would be hard for me to show any interest in her therapist to her. I do wish I had more info on her therapist to find a way to contact her, I may try bringing it up. 
Unfortunately I think her therapist is a dud. She has been with her for years now. I’ve been wondering lately how in the world her therapist hasn’t diagnosed her with this. As far as I know my friend is very honest with her, but I could be wrong. As far as I know this therapist has never diagnosed her with anything at all. 
Thanks again for the reply, I may try to at least get the name of her therapist and see what I can do!

Maybe mention a coworker's mom lives in her area and is seeking a provider, would she recommend hers?

Otherwise, if you want to be frank with her, one tactic to thwart defensiveness is to 'sandwich' the tough stuff between 2 layers of complimentary comments.

That's why I highlighted your statement above as the perfect lead in.

Then you can mention you've noticed she's been stressed lately, and would she consider raising the term 'borderline' with her therapist.

I'd leave the term 'disorder' out, as that's a diagnostic term for people on the extreme of a spectrum.

Just as with narcissistic behaviors, a person can have a borderline personality without necessarily meeting criteria for a full blown disorder, and that word can set people off.

See whether she's interested in exploring symptoms of a borderlined personality to have her therapist conduct an assessment with her.

Unfortunately, borderline is a squirmy condition because it only presents under the same stresses that also bring the kind of paranoia and defensiveness that make one resistant to help.

I feel for you, as I needed to cut my ties with a lifelong friend who turned dangerously hostile. She would regret her behavior afterward and vow to control herself, but she could not. I feared a life changing incident could result if I did not exit.

Sometimes we need to opt for self protection, regardless of our love for another. We can point someone toward help, but the next step may need to be that we stop enabling them to mistreat us.

[SooSad33]

You have known her for a long time - so you also know her family?  Ever reach out to them about your concerns?

I second the mention of burn out.. she is draining you & that is 'toxic'.  We need to learn our limits!  I've done that a few times and I no longer deal with people who are like this.

IMO, she knows how off she is.  She is in therapy?  so, that is a good thing!  I wonder if she is also on any meds for her condition? ( I hit bottom a few yrs ago. for a while on anxiety meds.. weaned off them and now on a 'mood stablizer').  It has helped me quite a bit with being 'more able' to function & do some things now- although anxiety is always present- so I need to tread carefully & self care.

If you can't handle her, is best to just stop interacting.  I feel she will understand why.  She is having enough challenges dealing with self. ( instability) 😕 .

Good luck, always remember to think for yourself and do as YOU need to do.

[Cherylyn]

I agree with Wiseman2.

Years ago, my cousin whom I was close to ever since childhood was my best friend.  She had so many problems galore.  She felt entrapped in a very abusive marriage,  her parents were not good to her and her wretched life caused her to change her personality for the worse.  She was no longer the kind soul I once knew.  Her depression and mental illness caused her to act out in a very impulsively mean way.  Nonetheless,  I did everything I could to to help her.  I showered her with money, gift cards, store bought gifts, online gifts, home sewn gifts (quilts), visited her, invited her to my house, cooked a lot for her household and did the best I could all to no avail.  I was burnt out.

Moral of this story:  You can't fix people.  They have to be responsible for their own lives.  It's out of your capacity to be in hero mode nor do you have the super power ability to do it.  You have to let people live their lives and navigate it as they see fit.  It's out of your realm.   You need to back off.  Enforce healthy boundaries.

The biggest favor you can do for yourself in order to save your sanity is to take good care of yourself.  Never lose this focus.  You mean well and you have a good heart.  However, remain practical and realistic. 

Don't increase stress for yourself.  Decrease stress for yourself by not making other people's problems become your angst and problems.  Be kind to yourself. 

[undertheivy]

3 hours ago, SooSad33 said:

You have known her for a long time - so you also know her family?  Ever reach out to them about your concerns?

I second the mention of burn out.. she is draining you & that is 'toxic'.  We need to learn our limits!  I've done that a few times and I no longer deal with people who are like this.

IMO, she knows how off she is.  She is in therapy?  so, that is a good thing!  I wonder if she is also on any meds for her condition? ( I hit bottom a few yrs ago. for a while on anxiety meds.. weaned off them and now on a 'mood stablizer').  It has helped me quite a bit with being 'more able' to function & do some things now- although anxiety is always present- so I need to tread carefully & self care.

If you can't handle her, is best to just stop interacting.  I feel she will understand why.  She is having enough challenges dealing with self. ( instability) 😕 .

Good luck, always remember to think for yourself and do as YOU need to do.

Unfortunately her family is part of the problem. Her mother is extremely toxic and has caused my friend a lot of trauma over the years. If I were to reach out to her mom with this information she would take that and run with it and use it against my friend. 
She has never been prescribed any medication, although at this point I truly feel medication would work wonders for her. 
There’s really no way for me to stop interacting with her, but I could set some boundaries. It’s just hard, this girl is like my sister. We are family. We grew up together and are extremely close. I just know how bad she is struggling with her mental health and I honestly feel like a different kind of therapy or some medication would really benefit her. 
Thank you, I know I need to worry more about myself sometimes and not stress so much about her. 

[mylolita]

Evening undertheivy, 

 

(Nice username by the way!)

 

Your concern for your friend is very admirable. Depending on how she is, and what your relationship is like, I would proceed with caution with this one.
 

As I understand, she is already seeing a professional therapist? She may get uppity and think; what gives you the right or makes you qualified to diagnose or suggest this? She may take it fine and say thank you I have never heard of that before. It may go so many ways.

 

I had a similar experience once! I have been on both sides! 
 

When I was 15, one of my longest and oldest friends had a turbulent home life. Her parents were unstable and had a bad marriage. Her Dad worked away a lot but was aggressive and irritable when he came back. She was, obviously and painfully, anorexic. It bothered me, ached my heart, to be with her all day and see her just drink Diet Coke. I was only young, I didn’t really understand about these things. It was killing me seeing her that way. But part of anorexia is denial and lying about it. I confronted her one day, so sweetly. She was angry. She told me I didn’t know anything. She didn’t turn up to school for three days after that.

 

I got so desperate I turned to a teacher, who then spoke with her parents. By this point she was about 5 stone or, 70lbs roughly. It was deadly serious. It wasn’t just a little diet gone obsessive. She was hospitalised for a few months after that. She hardly spoke to me after that. Did I do the right thing? I think so, for sure. But she never forgave me for it.

 

On the flip side, I got to know a girl a few years back, another Mum. I’m 32 years old now with 3 kids and married. We would talk often, she would call me. I confided in her sometimes. I am open with anyone who will listen. Anyway, one day she talking to me and she suggested I had BiPolar disorder, and had anyone ever mentioned that too me? I was really taken aback. I briefly looked up the symptoms and I guess yes, I could tick off a decent amount. But I can tick off a decent amount of so many mental illnesses. I felt like I was functioning absolutely fine, just with regular ups and downs, more intense than most people but, anyway. 
 

Part of me was fine with her open suggestion, part of me felt taken aback. I didn’t like the idea we had been close but she had been thinking all these things about me being a fruit loop whilst we talked with open hearts. We didn’t fall out because of that, but I remember the feeling of being taken aback. She was, at the end of the day, saying, I think you are mentally unstable. I think you are mentally unwell. Ever thought about doing anything about it?

 

It‘s not the greatest to be confronted with. This was 5 years ago now. I have actually never been to a therapist, so I just wouldn’t know. God knows what they would slap me with? Maybe she was right! Maybe she was wrong!

 

If you feel like it is something that you know, that you can feel certain over your diagnosis, that you think is important that she knows and would help her - it is the job of a good friend to say what they think, be it hard, for their friends safety and health.
 

But! If you just suspect? I would maybe let it lie, and just be there to support her like you do, and leave the rest to her therapist. Or maybe, suggest a different therapist. That might be a more tactful way of saying, I don’t think your current therapy is working!

 

x

[SooSad33]

1 hour ago, undertheivy said:

There’s really no way for me to stop interacting with her, but I could set some boundaries. It’s just hard, this girl is like my sister. We are family. We grew up together and are extremely close. I just know how bad she is struggling with her mental health and I honestly feel like a different kind of therapy or some medication would really benefit her. 

Did you ever talk to HER about this?

If she is truly struggling & wants to get better, I'm sure she'd listen to you suggestion and try something else.

 

[Wonderstruck]

19 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

You're not a psychiatrist who can make a diagnosis by googling some symptoms.

She has friends and family and a therapist. It's also not your job to second guess a therapist because you googled some symptoms. It's not your job to find her a new therapist either.

THIS.

 

20 hours ago, undertheivy said:

I do wish I had more info on her therapist to find a way to contact her, I may try bringing it up. 

Thanks again for the reply, I may try to at least get the name of her therapist and see what I can do!

I find the idea of you trying to find out her therapist's contact information and ACTUALLY CONTACTING THE THERAPIST BEHIND YOUR FRIEND'S BACK to be completely horrifying. I can't believe you think that this is acceptable.

If I were your friend and I found out that you did this, I'd ice-cold cut you out of my life forever.

This is SUCH a breach of trust and privacy. Do NOT do this.

[catfeeder]

35 minutes ago, Wonderstruck said:

I find the idea of you trying to find out her therapist's contact information and ACTUALLY CONTACTING THE THERAPIST BEHIND YOUR FRIEND'S BACK to be completely horrifying. I can't believe you think that this is acceptable.

If I were your friend and I found out that you did this, I'd ice-cold cut you out of my life forever.

This is SUCH a breach of trust and privacy. Do NOT do this.

I can appreciate your views on this, but it's kind of like saying, "I can't believe you'd sacrifice my privacy to dial 911 or 988 for a threat of suicide..."

Sure, you might never speak to me again, but you'd also remain alive to reconsider that reaction for the remainder of your future.

Each instance of mental health concerns are unique, and it's not really useful to use blanket judgments across all of them.

Providers ARE able to accept inputs from concerned parties for consideration, especially when a loved one reaches a point of deterioration to the degree that they cannot respond to loving care without accusatory paranoia.

My nursing years were spent dealing with such souls, and I hope you will reconsider a moralistic position that might feel righteous but is far from practical or helpful in the real world of mental illness.

Thank you for hearing me out.

[Wonderstruck]

38 minutes ago, catfeeder said:

I can appreciate your views on this, but it's kind of like saying, "I can't believe you'd sacrifice my privacy to dial 911 or 988 for a threat of suicide..."

I understand what you're saying, but I consider this to be a false equivalency because, based on what the OP has described about her friend so far, it doesn't sound like her friend is at a crisis point where the OP NEEDS to get involved in order to prevent something tragic from happening.

What I've gathered from the OP's description is that her friend has anger management issues and paranoia. She is hyper-reactive and the OP finds it increasingly more and more exhausting to deal with.

But NONE of that warrants the OP overstepping her boundaries and breaching her friend's trust and privacy in order to contact her friend's therapist behind her back.

That is the kind of thing that would POSSIBLY only be acceptable if she genuinely believed that her friend was seriously considering suicide. The OP didn't indicate ANYTHING like this in any of her comments.

And if she DOES genuinely believe that her friend is seriously considering suicide, I STILL don't think that contacting her friend's therapist is the right route to take. That's when I WOULD suggest dialing 911 or 988.

[catfeeder]

1 minute ago, Wonderstruck said:

I understand what you're saying, but I consider this to be a false equivalency because, based on what the OP has described about her friend so far, it doesn't sound like her friend is at a crisis point where the OP NEEDS to get involved in order to prevent something tragic from happening.

What I've gathered from the OP's description is that her friend has anger management issues and paranoia. She is hyper-reactive and the OP finds it increasingly more and more exhausting to deal with.

But NONE of that warrants the OP overstepping her boundaries and breaching her friend's trust and privacy in order to contact her friend's therapist behind her back.

That is the kind of thing that would POSSIBLY only be acceptable if she genuinely believed that her  friend was seriously considering suicide. The OP didn't indicate ANYTHING like this in any of her comments.

And if she DOES genuinely believe that her friend is seriously considering suicide, I STILL don't think that contacting her friend's therapist is the right route to take. That's when I WOULD suggest dialing 911 or 988.

This option was not raised for consideration based on a single post, but rather a history.

We don't need to split hairs over imminent threat when a professional can decide whether an input is valid enough for consideration.

If not, then no harm is suffered by anyone, even while the caller is relieved to know that s/he offered information that was burdensome to carry at possible risk to a loved one's health. 

We are not discussing gossip between cronies, this is a discussion of options for a loved one's care--and the indignation of the individual involved is already a given.

This doesn't invalidate your opinion, it's an option that isn't widely known about a private assessment that only a loved one can make.

 

 

[undertheivy]

25 minutes ago, Wonderstruck said:

I understand what you're saying, but I consider this to be a false equivalency because, based on what the OP has described about her friend so far, it doesn't sound like her friend is at a crisis point where the OP NEEDS to get involved in order to prevent something tragic from happening.

What I've gathered from the OP's description is that her friend has anger management issues and paranoia. She is hyper-reactive and the OP finds it increasingly more and more exhausting to deal with.

But NONE of that warrants the OP overstepping her boundaries and breaching her friend's trust and privacy in order to contact her friend's therapist behind her back.

That is the kind of thing that would POSSIBLY only be acceptable if she genuinely believed that her friend was seriously considering suicide. The OP didn't indicate ANYTHING like this in any of her comments.

And if she DOES genuinely believe that her friend is seriously considering suicide, I STILL don't think that contacting her friend's therapist is the right route to take. That's when I WOULD suggest dialing 911 or 988.

I’m a little late replying as I’m just now kind of catching up with the ones I missed. I completely see where you’re coming from, I do.

My original few paragraphs I wrote don’t even scrape the surface. My friend is in crisis mode every other week. It’s highly concerning, and the main reason it’s exhausting is that I’ve tried to reason with her many times but her mental illness has her convinced to think one way and one way only. She’s very black and white with her thinking. I could write a novel here explaining how she behaves and how her mind works, but trust me - it’s not healthy and she is struggling horribly. I know I’m not a therapist but I have never been more confident with anything else when I say I am 99.9 percent sure she has BPD. I am scared to tell her this because I know how her mind works - she will assume I look at her and think she’s “too much” “too sensitive” “over reacts to things” and the list goes on. These are already things that other friends have told her and when they do, she cuts them off like it’s nothing. 
I feel like we’ve gotten REAL deep here in these comments but my main reason for coming here was to say I know she has BPD and I’m scared of losing our friendship by telling her this. I just really wanted advice on how I could bring this up to her. I care about her so much and I hate to see her struggling so bad. I myself struggle with anxiety and I’m just so anxious about this situation. I don’t want to say the wrong thing to her.

i don’t know, I guess I was hoping maybe someone else here who read this has BPD and could relate to my friend, or knows someone with it and could relate to this situation and how I could handle bringing it up to her. 

[undertheivy]

5 hours ago, SooSad33 said:

Did you ever talk to HER about this?

If she is truly struggling & wants to get better, I'm sure she'd listen to you suggestion and try something else.

 

Here’s the thing.. when she’s in crisis mode (I don’t know how else to say that - having a dilemma, an episode, NOT doing well), it’s usually because she’s upset with someone else. Someone in her life (a friend, boyfriend, etc). And she’s always in full blown “defense” mode, every time. Anytime she’s going through this - aka a time where I should be honest with her and tell her I think she needs better therapy and coping skills - if I were to do that she would think I’m taking the side of these other people she’s upset with. I’ve seen her do this to other people countless times. 
Don’t get me wrong I do always try to reason with her and tell her “I don’t think this person meant it the way you’re taking it” or something like that for example. But if I were to tell her anything more than that, anything that alludes to her needing to make a change, it won’t be pretty. She is very firm on her emotions and she often is in victim mentality. If someone tells her otherwise she cuts them off. 
i don’t know, it’s really hard to explain all of this without typing too much but I hope it makes sense. 

[Wonderstruck]

1 minute ago, undertheivy said:

I’m a little late replying as I’m just now kind of catching up with the ones I missed. I completely see where you’re coming from, I do.

My original few paragraphs I wrote don’t even scrape the surface. My friend is in crisis mode every other week. It’s highly concerning, and the main reason it’s exhausting is that I’ve tried to reason with her many times but her mental illness has her convinced to think one way and one way only. She’s very black and white with her thinking. I could write a novel here explaining how she behaves and how her mind works, but trust me - it’s not healthy and she is struggling horribly. I know I’m not a therapist but I have never been more confident with anything else when I say I am 99.9 percent sure she has BPD. I am scared to tell her this because I know how her mind works - she will assume I look at her and think she’s “too much” “too sensitive” “over reacts to things” and the list goes on. These are already things that other friends have told her and when they do, she cuts them off like it’s nothing. 
I feel like we’ve gotten REAL deep here in these comments but my main reason for coming here was to say I know she has BPD and I’m scared of losing our friendship by telling her this. I just really wanted advice on how I could bring this up to her. I care about her so much and I hate to see her struggling so bad. I myself struggle with anxiety and I’m just so anxious about this situation. I don’t want to say the wrong thing to her.

i don’t know, I guess I was hoping maybe someone else here who read this has BPD and could relate to my friend, or knows someone with it and could relate to this situation and how I could handle bringing it up to her. 

I completely understand where you're coming from and that you only have good intentions.

The thing is, if you actually DO believe that your friend has Borderline Personality Disorder, then contacting your friend's therapist behind her back is definitely the LAST thing that you should do.

If she's cutting friends out of her life simply for calling her "too sensitive" or telling her that she "over-reacts", and you're scared to even broach the subject of BPD with her for fear that she'll cut YOU out of her life too, doing something that even the most reasonable person would consider to be a HUGE breach of trust and privacy is GUARANTEED to make her completely shut down AND cut you out of her life forever.

And this time, she wouldn't even be over-reacting.

I know that you feel frustrated, helpless and like you're all out of options. But there's NO WAY that doing this will end well.

I would actually suggest approaching her about this over email, as opposed to in person, because I feel like that will give you a chance to sit down, collect, organize and refine your thoughts, and express them to her in the most gentle, loving, compassionate way that you can.

What I feel is SO important is that you stress how much you LOVE her and genuinely care about her mental and emotional well-being. That she's like a sister to you and that you consider her to be family. That you're approaching her from a place of genuine concern for her mental health BECAUSE you care about her so deeply and hate seeing her so constantly miserable.

Also, if you feel comfortable to actually bring up the possibility of Borderline Personality Disorder, you could frame it in a POSITIVE way, as in, a weight being lifted off of her shoulders, because it's an EXPLANATION of WHY she feels the way she feels and acts the way she acts.

I know A LOT of people have said that receiving an actual diagnosis of a mental or personality disorder was actually a HUGE RELIEF for them, because it suddenly illuminated so much of their thought processes and behaviour.

They had an explanation that was outside of themselves, and it was like the clouds had parted and a weight had been lifted off of their shoulders. They stopped blaming themselves and hating themselves for their own behaviour.

There is so much more that I could say, but I feel like this comment is getting too long, so I'll wrap it up for now.

[SooSad33]

21 minutes ago, undertheivy said:

when she’s in crisis mode (I don’t know how else to say that - having a dilemma, an episode, NOT doing well), it’s usually because she’s upset with someone else. Someone in her life (a friend, boyfriend, etc). And she’s always in full blown “defense” mode, every time. Anytime she’s going through this - aka a time where I should be honest with her and tell her I think she needs better therapy and coping skills - if I were to do that she would think I’m taking the side of these other people she’s upset with. I’ve seen her do this to other people countless times. 

Okay, but no, you don't do it then when she's losing it.  You talk to her other times, other than when she's having a moment, right?

That is when you can try & explain your 'concerns' for her and suggestions.

23 minutes ago, undertheivy said:

Don’t get me wrong I do always try to reason with her and tell her “I don’t think this person meant it the way you’re taking it” or something like that for example.

Yeah, sometimes they just really need to 'vent'.. so yah, just let her do it, I guess.

And no, they often can't be reasoned with- which is their mentality 😕 

I feel for you. I can imagine what you're experiencing.. and yeah, I've encountered this kind as well.  Not a lot we can do for them, until they  want to try & better things and/or themselves.

I have a friend who has his moments and it affects those around him too.. It took a good few yrs to get diagnosed & to be put on a proper medication mix to the point he was more manageable.  We're all wired differently.  I hope she is getting the help she needs.

 

[mylolita]

Morning undertheivy,

 

I have to say, on the confronting side of it - she is a fully grown woman? An adult? 
 

I would carry on supporting her through friendship. But these breakthroughs are hers to make herself, and diagnosis a job of her therapist.

 

I would still maybe, more tactfully suggest has she considered changing therapists, if you feel her current therapist isn’t up to snuff.

 

I sometimes feel the opposite with mental diagnosis. It gives the person relief because sometimes; it gives them an excuse! They can say oh well, I can’t help it, give me medication! And the trying and striving and responsibility for their actions can diminish. I am not completely against therapy and medication, I understand it helps millions, but what I am saying is, it isn’t a cure and fix all. The fact that, peoples therapists, often see a therapist themselves, or that someone can be in therapy for 20 years with not much gain on reflection, the fact it is costly, should maybe make people hold in the back of their mind this is a business as well as a potential aid. 
 

Great, honest friendship can be nearly as good as therapy for some people. It depends how bad she is. She already has a therapist, and a good friend. I think it’s wise to let her use her own tools and come to her own decisions now, she is fully grown!

 

I know you are coming at this from a caring and worried place but, sometimes, it can open up a can of worms.

 

x

 

 

[undertheivy]

8 minutes ago, Wonderstruck said:

I completely understand where you're coming from and that you only have good intentions.

The thing is, if you actually DO believe that your friend has Borderline Personality Disorder, then contacting your friend's therapist behind her back is definitely the LAST thing that you should do.

If she's cutting friends out of her life simply for calling her "too sensitive" or telling her that she "over-reacts", and you're scared to even broach the subject of BPD with her for fear that she'll cut YOU out of her life too, doing something that even the most reasonable person would consider to be a HUGE breach of trust and privacy is GUARANTEED to make her completely shut down AND cut you out of her life forever.

And this time, she wouldn't even be over-reacting.

I know that you feel frustrated, helpless and like you're all out of options. But there's NO WAY that doing this will end well.

I would actually suggest approaching her about this over email, as opposed to in person, because I feel like that will give you a chance to sit down, collect, organize and refine your thoughts, and express them to her in the most gentle, loving, compassionate way that you can.

What I feel is SO important is that you stress how much you LOVE her and genuinely care about her mental and emotional well-being. That she's like a sister to you and that you consider her to be family. That you're approaching her from a place of genuine concern for her mental health BECAUSE you care about her so deeply and hate seeing her so constantly miserable.

Also, if you feel comfortable to actually bring up the possibility of Borderline Personality Disorder, you could frame it in a POSITIVE way, as in, a weight being lifted off of her shoulders, because it's an EXPLANATION of WHY she feels the way she feels and acts the way she acts.

I know A LOT of people have said that receiving an actual diagnosis of a mental or personality disorder was actually a HUGE RELIEF for them, because it suddenly illuminated so much of their thought processes and behaviour.

They had an explanation that was outside of themselves, and it was like the clouds had parted and a weight had been lifted off of their shoulders. They stopped blaming themselves and hating themselves for their own behaviour.

There is so much more that I could say, but I feel like this comment is getting too long, so I'll wrap it up for now.

This is exactly what I was looking for, thank you for that. I had already thought that maybe I should approach it in a positive way. The whole reason I want her to get properly diagnosed is so that she can start living the life she so needs and deserves. Start coping with her stresses differently and in a healthy way. And most of all have an answer to why she feels the way she does and why life seems to be harder for her than other people she knows. 
I won’t contact her therapist. 

[undertheivy]

8 minutes ago, SooSad33 said:

Okay, but no, you don't do it then when she's losing it.  You talk to her other times, other than when she's having a moment, right?

That is when you can try & explain your 'concerns' for her and suggestions.

Yeah, sometimes they just really need to 'vent'.. so yah, just let her do it, I guess.

And no, they often can't be reasoned with- which is their mentality 😕 

I feel for you. I can imagine what you're experiencing.. and yeah, I've encountered this kind as well.  Not a lot we can do for them, until they  want to try & better things and/or themselves.

I have a friend who has his moments and it affects those around him too.. It took a good few yrs to get diagnosed & to be put on a proper medication mix to the point he was more manageable.  We're all wired differently.  I hope she is getting the help she needs.

 

Unfortunately with us living on opposite sides of the country the only time we talk is when something “big” is going on with her or when she’s struggling with something. I don’t mean for that to sound as bad as it does - we do text each other throughout the week little cute and funny things, interact on social media, etc. But, when we’re actually having a full conversation on the phone, there’s a lot going on in her life and she discusses that/those kinds of topics. We rarely have “small talk”.. very very rare. 
Thank you for being understanding, I appreciate it. I’ve received some good advice here. 

[Wiseman2]

You don't "know" what she has.

The best thing you can do is get to a physician for an evaluation of your physical and mental health. Get some tests done. Ask for a referral to a qualified therapist for ongoing support.

You need to figure out why you're doing this, not second guessing her mental health diagnosis is.

Fix yourself first. Leave her alone.

 

[undertheivy]

12 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

You don't "know" what she has.

The best thing you can do is get to a physician for an evaluation of your physical and mental health. Get some tests done. Ask for a referral to a qualified therapist for ongoing support.

You need to figure out why you're doing this, not second guessing her mental health diagnosis is.

Fix yourself first. Leave her alone.

 

Now I remember why I don’t like coming here to ask for advice.

[Wiseman2]

On 8/2/2022 at 2:30 AM, undertheivy said:

. I do wish I had more info on her therapist to find a way to contact her,  I think her therapist is a dud. . I’ve been wondering lately how in the world her therapist hasn’t diagnosed her with this. 

Contacting her therapist is wholly inappropriate. At least your friend has the insight and wherewithal to be in therapy.

Keep in mind that psychology and psychiatry are not hobbies. Your friend doesn't need to tell you what her diagnosis is or who her therapist is.

As licensed therapist, your friend's therapist is familiar with the DSM, and doesn't google symptoms as a hobby.