The whole "confidence"/ "self-worth" thing

[Wayfara]

it's not that being with someone is ALL I want, nor am I saying that I can't have ANY happiness in other areas of my life.

 

If you found happiness in other areas in life then you wouldn't be unhappy, dissatisfied with your dating life and sometimes sad, yes, but not truly unhappy as your overall happiness would outweigh it. I get you have hobbies but you don't feel they are enough to give your life meaning. You want someone to want you so much more than you want anything else in life, like breadcrumbs compared to a meal. You have said your life isn't even worth living unless there are people wanting you, that means your life isn't worth anything on it's own (because if had value on it's own you wouldn't need other people to give you will to live). Who wants to be a part of a life that isn't even worth living to the one living it? Make your life worth something to you first and then you will have a much better chance attracting people to want part of it.

 

At least with this girl, there's still "something" for me to focus on.

 

The idea of actually letting go of this girl doesn't seem "freeing" to me, it just seems like I'd be getting dropped off in the middle of a wild jungle, with no supplies, and no sense of direction of how to get out, and that's just too "scary" to me

 

I'm also not saying that if I were with someone, that person would be my whole world.

 

Without this girl there is nothing to focus on you say. Without her you would be dropped in a jungle with no supplies or sense of direction you say. You are already making this girl who you are not in relationship with your whole world, how would it be in an actual relationship?

 

I'm just saying that I want to be with someone, I want to have friends, I want to have a romantic partner, and there's absolutely nothing anyone can say, therapist or not, that can make me stop wanting those things.

 

I not saying you shouldn't want it, I'm saying it shouldn't be the only thing that makes your life worth living, it's the later that makes you desperate and needy.

[MattW]

I don't know how to "make my life worth living", though. As far as career goes, my hands are kind of tied until I finish school, and even then, it'll take me a while to work my way up. What else can I really do to make my life worth something?

 

And again, regardless of any of that, I still can't see myself being 100% satisfied with anything if I'm going to be alone otherwise. I get why you interpret it that I'm putting all this above everything but I wouldn't necessarily put it that way. It's just a nagging thing that's extremely difficult to ignore, and it's getting harder and harder to ignore it. Again, regardless of whatever else, I just don't want to be alone. I can't "get over" it.

 

 

 

Again, it's just the simple fact that before her, I felt like I was just floating along aimlessly, with no sign of light, in terms of dating, and that really sucked. Things were so much better when I connected with her, and I just don't want to go back to that aimless, unknown feeling. I hated that.

 

Anyway, I'll be stuck with her and that other guy for 3-4 hours soon, so don't be surprised if I have another little freak out later tonight. v_v

[Wayfara]

I'm afraid that I'm reaching a breaking point, and that if I continue to fail as much as I have been in the past, it just might "break" me for good, and possibly lead to me doing something drastic, such as taking my own life.

 

By putting "being desired" as a need instead of a want you are perssuring yourself to perform results which makes you feel like a failure when you don't. This is why I think you should let go of the notion that you must to have someone to be happy, it would take off the pressure. Make efforts without needing to succed, see it an experiment which can go either way and be okay with that it can go either way.

 

What else can I really do to make my life worth something?

 

You make your life worth something by emotionally investing in what makes you happy. So what are your dreams (besides being wanted)? What do you want to achieve? What can make your hobbies more meaningful? You like digital media production, I think that is a good thing to start with if you don't come up with something. Shift focus from worrying about needing to find someone to get more involved in with preparations and ideas to digital media production, anything that can take your mind off. Creating meaning in your life is something that will take time but that is not a reason to not do it.

 

It's just a nagging thing that's extremely difficult to ignore

 

It's not just "just" if it's making you suicidal.

 

Again, it's just the simple fact that before her, I felt like I was just floating along aimlessly, with no sign of light, in terms of dating, and that really sucked. Things were so much better when I connected with her, and I just don't want to go back to that aimless, unknown feeling. I hated that.

 

What I meant, you are making her your world. So how can you be sure you wouldn't make a girl you are in an actual relationship with your whole world too?

 

Anyway floating around aimlessly when you don't have someone to focus on is a result from not being happy on your own in my opinion. And not moving on will pretty inevitable hurt your dating chances as you are stuck on someone unavailable. But that is just my view. The first step to change is realizing there is a problem they say, like alcoholics who have to recognize they are alcoholics before they can do something about it.

 

So, do you see not being able to move on from this girl and not being able to be happy on your own as a problem?

[Wonderstruck]

None of this is ANY of your business. They're entitled to act any way they want around each other, regardless of how it makes you feel. You act like they've personally wronged you by being flirtatious with each other and buddy-buddy at work - but they haven't.

 

Reality check: They probably don't spend even five minutes a day thinking about you, or how you feel about their interaction. They don't care how you feel about it. Meanwhile, you waste your time agonizing over things that you can't control, and getting so worked up over it that you can feel your "blood boiling". Really?

 

She's not your ex-girlfriend. He's not your friend. These two people don't have any obligation or reason to care how you feel or what you think, yet you still sit there acting like they're being callous, malicious and indecent by hanging off of each other at work. You're WAY too invested in their actions, which have absolutely nothing to do with you, and are, quite frankly, absolutely none of your business.

 

 

 

How many times do we have to explain to you that it doesn't work like that? If she's not physically and/or emotionally attracted to you now, there's no one magical thing you can do that's going to change her feelings towards you. SHE'S JUST NOT INTERESTED IN YOU. You can't convince her to be, no matter how hard you try, and to be honest, if you have to work that hard and constantly try and say or do the "right thing" that will make this girl's feelings towards you wildly shift, then your relationship would be doomed anyway. Because she's not naturally attracted to you or interested in you as you naturally are - you would have had to fight tooth and nail for it, and your entire relationship would be you fighting tooth and nail to keep her interested in you, and then fighting tooth and nail to keep her from breaking up with you, all the while trying to figure out what the "right thing" to say or do is that will make her like you. It's too forced, it's not natural, and it won't last.

 

Wouldn't you rather devote your time and energy to finding somebody who ACTUALLY likes you, just as you are, from the beginning, as opposed to a girl that has no interest in you at all, that you have to try to "convince" to be interested in you?

 

 

 

Wow...that's really sad that you willingly allow them to have that much power over how you feel. One shift with them can ruin your day, and you ALLOW them to make you feel that way.

 

You don't take responsibility for your emotions or feelings - you base your mood on how your co-workers behave, and then you feel sorry for yourself like "Why are they doing this to me?! Why are they torturing me this way?!".

 

Why don't YOU stop torturing YOURSELF, take back your power, and stop allowing your entire mood to be dictated by somebody else's actions. Happiness is a choice - it is NOT about everyone acting in a certain way to appease you.

[MattW]

Well, thankfully, I managed to get away from work today before I could see the two of them hanging on each other too much. Actually, I even got to spend a decent amount of time with just her, before he got to work later, and before the actual work started keeping us all busy. Anyway...

 

By putting "being desired" as a need instead of a want you are perssuring yourself to perform results which makes you feel like a failure when you don't. This is why I think you should let go of the notion that you must to have someone to be happy, it would take off the pressure. Make efforts without needing to succed, see it an experiment which can go either way and be okay with that it can go either way.

 

See, though, I would classify it as a "want" more than a "need", but it's something I want so, so very much, that I just can't ever say "If I'm alone the rest of my life, oh well". At the moment, there's really nothing else I "want" that I can attain any time soon. I mean, yeah, I want to get a better job and build a career, but I can't really do that until I finish school, and I don't finish school until next June. So, my hands are kind of tied, on that. Other than that, I can't really think of any high priority "wants" I can focus on. That's kinda why it's so easy to get caught up in the whole lack of a social/ dating life, because those things are things you should technically be able to do any time; with something like a career, you have to do a lot of waiting, waiting to finish your education, waiting while you do some entry level to work to build up experience, etc. But you don't (or at least, you shouldn't have to) jump through all those hoops to start finding friends, and to start dating.

 

So, it's hard not to wander to that place while I'm waiting around for the other aspects of my life to fall in place before I can proceed with them. As far as success vs failure, I'm not sure I'm the type of thinker that can look at efforts that way. If I make an effort to do something, it's because I'm hoping it will lead to a specific result that I desire; if it leads to that result, it's a success, but if it doesn't lead to that result, it's a failure. Again, I'm just tired of not getting the results I would like, whenever I make an effort for anything. I know life isn't easy and failing isn't exactly uncommon, but why is it always failure for me? Yeah, most people experience plenty of failures in their lives, but they also see a good bit of success where it counts, especially when they work for it. I work for it, myself, and I try as hard as I can with things, and yet, I always end up failing.

 

In a way, I think if I could just get one big "win" (regardless of what aspect of my life it occurs in) for once, that might be enough to turn things around for me, that might boost my spirits a lot, and get me on the right track. But I just can't seem to get that "win".

 

You make your life worth something by emotionally investing in what makes you happy. So what are your dreams (besides being wanted)? What do you want to achieve? What can make your hobbies more meaningful? You like digital media production, I think that is a good thing to start with if you don't come up with something. Shift focus from worrying about needing to find someone to get more involved in with preparations and ideas to digital media production, anything that can take your mind off. Creating meaning in your life is something that will take time but that is not a reason to not do it.

 

Honestly...? I really don't know what would make me genuinely happy to "invest" myself in. Yeah, there's the digital media thing. I really like doing that, and in the future, I want to make media, and hopefully, I want to make things that get seen by a large amount of people. There's a small, but very popular Internet video production company I'm a big fan of and want to work for some day (I'd even make the 1500~ mile move in a heartbeat if I thought I could work there), but the chances are pretty slim, considering how many people would actually like to work there. So, I'm trying not to get my hopes up too high about that.

 

Earlier this year, I decided to start doing a sort of Internet show of my own, investing in the equipment I needed, and everything. I ran my own YouTube channel, and I produced and uploaded over 100 videos in a pretty short span of time. It's been on a bit of a hiatus for now, though, because with work, school, and interning demanding so much of my time, I haven't really been able to make stuff on the side for my show. And while it feels kinda neat to be able to make my own show, it was kind of a depressing realization when I realized that absolutely no one was watching my stuff, no one was reading my accompanying blog, and listening to my own stuff, I realized how not-entertaining I am.

 

I really wish I could be entertaining, I wish I could be clever, I wish I could come up with great ideas and bring them to life, I wish I could make things that people would actually want to watch and tune into. Even on a basic level, I always hate how "uncreative" I am. For example, in class the last couple weeks, our major group project was to come up with an idea for and shoot a commercial. One of the groups had a really amazing, creative, funny idea (their execution was so-so, and I kinda wish I was in that group, because I feel like I could've executed it really well). The group I was in had an okay idea, but I didn't come up with it at all. I really want to be a creative, imaginative person, with good ideas, but for the life of me, I'm just don't have that type of mind.

 

What I meant, you are making her your world. So how can you be sure you wouldn't make a girl you are in an actual relationship with your whole world too?

 

Eh, I dunno. The thing I absolutely love about her is just how well she meshes with me. When she and I are together (and there's no ex for her to hang all over), there's just never a dull moment. We mess with each other, we play with each other, and we really get into it, there's a sort of "fire" there, a "passion". I mean, I know she obviously doesn't see it that way, but I absolutely cannot be unhappy when I'm around her (again, unless someone specific is around to come between us), and there's just this "electricity" there. I LOVE that dynamic, I LOVE being a part of that with someone, and to be honest, this is the first time I've ever really felt something like that with someone. I know it seems like I'm making her "my world", but the truth is, I'm just desperate to hold onto this feeling I have when I interact with her. That's exactly the kind of "feeling" I want to get from a girl who I'd be involved with romantically. And considering she's the only one I've ever felt it with, it's just hard to be open to the idea that I could feel it again with someone else. But that's what I want, and dear god, I want it bad.

 

The first step to change is realizing there is a problem they say, like alcoholics who have to recognize they are alcoholics before they can do something about it.

 

So, do you see not being able to move on from this girl and not being able to be happy on your own as a problem?

 

I've never denied that those things are a problem, really. I mean, the rational side of me knows that nothing will ever happen between me and this girl, and that continuing to have feelings for her is pointless. But it's my emotions that really cloud everything, and make it extremely difficult for me to make any kind of significant change or improvements to myself. With this girl, I got a little taste of something absolutely amazing, but I know that it's also extremely rare, and knowing that, my emotions have concluded that it's unlikely I'll ever encounter anything like it again. And that makes me extremely sad.

[MattW]

You're missing the point, though. I acknowledged that I realize it's none of my business, and aside from wondering why they can't do their thing outside of work, I wasn't trying to vilify them or anything like that. It's just... extremely difficult to have to sit back and watch unfold in front of you. When you care about someone and have feelings for someone the way I do about this girl, and when you know what a creep this guy is, and then have to sit back and watch the two of them be all... whatever it is they are. Again, it's just hard to watch, extremely hard, and it invokes emotions in me on a lot of different levels. Most of the things I say about it are just me venting, due to the frustration of it all.

 

I mean, imagine you've met your absolute ideal partner, and things seem like they could really work out, but then no, they're not attracted to you, and instead, they want to be with someone else that doesn't properly appreciate them at all. And not only do you have to accept that fact, but you have to watch it, for hours at a time, every couple of days. I don't deny that they're probably not thinking about me at all (although I still wonder if he has malicious intent towards me), but regardless, it still feels like torture to me. It's gut-wrenching, it's heartbreaking to have to sit by and watch.

 

 

 

And I acknowledged TWICE in the piece of text you quoted me from that I know it doesn't work that way. I've always been a bit of a "dreamer", a "hopeless romantic", and I just can't stop myself completely from having these little fantasies where things can work out in the end and all ends well. Again, I know it's silly, and stupid, but even still, there's a piece of me that just can't stop wishing.

 

 

 

Well, sure, but fat chance of that ever happening. I haven't found a girl that actually likes me once in my entire almost 25 years of life. If it was going to happen, it would've happened at least once by now. Besides, even if I were to meet a girl that actually likes me, it doesn't mean I'd be into her, it doesn't mean we'd have what I have with this girl now, and again, the dynamic I have with this girl is exactly what I want in a partner.

[Angler]

it doesn't mean we'd have what I have with this girl now

 

You don't have anything with this girl now. Remind yourself of this repeatedly.

[Wonderstruck]

Well, sure, but fat chance of that ever happening. I haven't found a girl that actually likes me once in my entire almost 25 years of life. If it was going to happen, it would've happened at least once by now. Besides, even if I were to meet a girl that actually likes me, it doesn't mean I'd be into her, it doesn't mean we'd have what I have with this girl now, and again, the dynamic I have with this girl is exactly what I want in a partner.

 

Like Angler said, you have nothing with this girl now, and you never did. She acted friendly and maybe slightly flirtatious with you at work for awhile for fun, then you took it seriously, she got bored and/or freaked out, and that was the end of it.

 

At the end of the day, she doesn't want you and she never did, so stubbornly refusing to accept that and move on from her doesn't make any sense.

[MattW]

You don't have anything with this girl now. Remind yourself of this repeatedly.

 

Like Angler said, you have nothing with this girl now, and you never did. She acted friendly and maybe slightly flirtatious with you at work for awhile for fun, then you took it seriously, she got bored and/or freaked out, and that was the end of it.

 

At the end of the day, she doesn't want you and she never did, so stubbornly refusing to accept that and move on from her doesn't make any sense.

 

Man, you guys really read a lot into certain words, don't you? When I was talking about what we "have/ had", I obviously wasn't talking about any kind of ACTUAL relationship. I'm simply referring to the dynamic we shared, and still share. Again, I love this dynamic so much. It's so uncanny, and it brings me so much enjoyment. That's what I want with someone, but also what I never really find with anyone.

[penelope13]

you will not find anything new with a different person as long as you are holding on to this person. it sounds as if you are describing a fix when you talk about interacting with her

[Angler]

I know how you wrote it, and I assure you, I read it the way you intended.

 

But you have nothing with this girl more than a friendly banter, perhaps it gets flirty at times, and you have some commonalities in sense of humour and wit.

 

These are not unique attributes to any one girl, and they are not the sole foundations of a potential meaningful relationship you might have with a girl you could meet in the future.

[blueidealist24]

you will not find anything new with a different person as long as you are holding on to this person. it sounds as if you are describing a fix when you talk about interacting with her

 

I get it because I had a feeling like that for a guy, but you CAN get over it. Unfortunately, it took me like five years, but it's gone now. I'm not sure if I would have got over it if I had kept seeing the person on a regular basis. If I see him, which I occasionally do, it will come back for a few days. Didn't you say she might quit the job you guys have after she graduates? Btw, one other thing I thought of.. if she's an assistant manager and he's a subordinate, they really shouldn't be messing around if they are, just by virtue of their relationship of superior and subordinate.

[Rosti87]

Matt,

 

How many more individuals do you need to interact here to open your eyes? You can go on and on on this forum creating thread after thread and you are going to get similar responses. Your myopic view of your situation is getting exhausting and none of us are in a relationship with you. Can you imagine how a woman will feel in a relationship with you? PLEASE make a change.

[Wayfara]

If I could somehow see into the future and know for a fact that I will be completely alone for the remainder of my life, I would give serious consideration to ending my life right now.

 

I would classify it as a "want" more than a "need"

 

You say that if you know you are going to end up alone you would give serious consideration to ending your life, then it's not just a want, it's a need. A want doesn't kill you if you don't get it. And not only would you give serious consideration to ending your life, you would give serious consideration to ending it right now, you wouldn't even wait until you start your career to see how it goes.

 

it's something I want so, so very much, that I just can't ever say "If I'm alone the rest of my life, oh well".

 

There is a middle ground between saying "oh well" and committing suicide.

 

As far as success vs failure, I'm not sure I'm the type of thinker that can look at efforts that way.

 

In my experience most people freak out and think they could never do that at first so you are not alone in that. It's a very useful skill though so learning to do it is helpful in many things, not just in dating but in work, when trying to be creative etc. Only those who aren't afraid of failing can win because every success is preceded by failures. An inventor fail, fail and fail until he eventually succeed inventing the thing he wanted. A painter fail, fail and fail until he eventually succeed painting his masterpiece. At the end of their careers they will have tons of failed inventions and failed paintings on their record. If they needed results every time they tried the constant failures would have destroyed them long before they ever got to their wins. And they don't necessarily have thicker skins than the rest of us but a different way of thinking, to them failures are not just failures, they are practice and experiments, necessary parts of every success.

 

I know you say that dating and making friends is pretty easy for other people but you are not them so you can't compare yourself to them and expect it to be easy because for you it's hard so you have to compare it with things that are hard.

 

In a way, I think if I could just get one big "win" (regardless of what aspect of my life it occurs in) for once, that might be enough to turn things around for me, that might boost my spirits a lot, and get me on the right track. But I just can't seem to get that "win".

 

I know you think that way but a win almost never come when you are desperate. For poker players, the more desperate they are, the more they lose. The more you need someone to like you, the more you are going to turn that someone off. Needing to win is almost a sure way to lose. Turn your life around first and then you can start winning.

 

I've never denied that those things are a problem

 

The second part of change is wanting to change, some alcoholics know they have a problem with alcohol but they don't want to change anyway because to them being drunk is too important, so there must be a will to change before a change is possible.

 

So, do you want to move on from this girl and find a more self sufficient way to be happy in life?

[Batya33]

"I acknowledged TWICE in the piece of text you quoted me from that I know it doesn't work that way. I've always been a bit of a "dreamer", a "hopeless romantic", and I just can't stop myself completely from having these little fantasies where things can work out in the end and all ends well. Again, I know it's silly, and stupid, but even still, there's a piece of me that just can't stop wishing."

 

Have all the fantasies you want just react to them differently. This doesn't have to do with dreaming or being a romantic. This has to do with making excuses whether it's based on "I must have this one person who doesn't want me" or your infinite varieties of "yes, but" [insert excuse]. As I've written to you before the more you sugarcoat the choices you're making (or refusing to make) with some kind of positive connotation the less motivation you'll have to take positive and productive actions to start to change your life. Especially the particular tautology/circular thinking of "I really wanted this girl and since I only want very few girls then it means I'll never find another girl I feel the same way about". All your posts contain a significant amount of passivity whether it's "I can't help how I feel" or "I always find myself [insert negative situation]. I dare you to write a post explaining what you plan to do without any passive language, negative language or disclaimers like "but" or "however".

[MattW]

But you have nothing with this girl more than a friendly banter, perhaps it gets flirty at times, and you have some commonalities in sense of humour and wit.

 

These are not unique attributes to any one girl, and they are not the sole foundations of a potential meaningful relationship you might have with a girl you could meet in the future.

 

See, though, she and I have both communicated to each other in the past that underneath all the banter and whatnot, we share a certain level of respect for each other, and we're both very dependable to each other. That's what's so great about it, because on the surface, there's never a dull moment between us, but underneath it, we both respect each other. Obviously, it doesn't go past that, on her end, but I just absolutely love the little bit I do have with her, even if it's not that much by comparison. I want to be with someone that I have this exact dynamic with, except, obviously with someone that wants to be with me. It's just extremely frustrating and depressing to never be able to find this same chemistry with another person.

 

Didn't you say she might quit the job you guys have after she graduates? Btw, one other thing I thought of.. if she's an assistant manager and he's a subordinate, they really shouldn't be messing around if they are, just by virtue of their relationship of superior and subordinate.

 

She graduated last December, and hasn't found a full time thing just yet. She did find an entry level part time job, teaching at a college, a couple months ago, but until that becomes full time (who knows when that will happen?), it doesn't seem like she'll be leaving. Yeah, their relationship would be questionable (not to mention, I believe he's a student at the college she teaches at, and even though I don't think he takes her class, isn't that still a "student/ teacher" kind of thing?), but at the same time, I'm sure there would also be a major sexual thrill there, too. Besides, this guy knows how to get exactly what he wants. If he wants to sleep with her, if he wants to have sex with her inside of work, he can absolutely talk her into it. That's just how he is. That fact that she's dated him in the past, to me, would indicate that she'd be more receptive of his advances than anything else.

 

Matt,

 

How many more individuals do you need to interact here to open your eyes? You can go on and on on this forum creating thread after thread and you are going to get similar responses. Your myopic view of your situation is getting exhausting and none of us are in a relationship with you. Can you imagine how a woman will feel in a relationship with you? PLEASE make a change.

 

I know, I know. You think I'm really happy being the way I am? Trust me, I'm not. Although, just for the sake of pointing it out, if I was in a relationship with a woman, I wouldn't exactly be lamenting to her about not being able to find someone to date, so I'm not really sure that would work the way you say...?

 

There is a middle ground between saying "oh well" and committing suicide.

 

Perhaps. Again, I can't visualize myself ever being able to "be okay" or "making peace" with being alone for the rest of my life. Call it a need or a want, classify it as whatever, it doesn't really matter. I do not want to spend the rest of my life alone, and there's nothing anyone can say, nothing a therapist can say, that can make me accept the possibility of spending the rest of my life alone.

 

I know you think that way but a win almost never come when you are desperate. For poker players, the more desperate they are, the more they lose. The more you need someone to like you, the more you are going to turn that someone off. Needing to win is almost a sure way to lose. Turn your life around first and then you can start winning.

 

I haven't really been "desperate" my whole life, though. Again, it's just a way I've been conditioned from repetitive failures. There was a time I used to at least try to be optimistic and believe good things would happen for me if I worked hard enough, and I don't know when exactly it happened, but after so many failures and no successes, I just became a more cynical pessimistic person. Hitting it off with this girl last year reminded me what it felt to believe something great could happen right there for me, and I loved that feeling, but when she turned me down, and now after everything else that's happened, this whole thing has reminded me of why I allowed myself to become a cynical pessimistic person. But I don't WANT to be that way, I really don't. I want to be optimistic and believe that good things will happen for me, but I can't convince myself of that when good things never happen for me. I can't get myself to believe in something that has no basis to it.

 

So, do you want to move on from this girl and find a more self sufficient way to be happy in life?

 

There's a part of me that does, but there's also a part of me that's still putting up a tremendous fight. I haven't figured out how to stop that other part of me from fighting it so much.

 

Have all the fantasies you want just react to them differently. This doesn't have to do with dreaming or being a romantic. This has to do with making excuses whether it's based on "I must have this one person who doesn't want me" or your infinite varieties of "yes, but" [insert excuse]. As I've written to you before the more you sugarcoat the choices you're making (or refusing to make) with some kind of positive connotation the less motivation you'll have to take positive and productive actions to start to change your life. Especially the particular tautology/circular thinking of "I really wanted this girl and since I only want very few girls then it means I'll never find another girl I feel the same way about". All your posts contain a significant amount of passivity whether it's "I can't help how I feel" or "I always find myself [insert negative situation]. I dare you to write a post explaining what you plan to do without any passive language, negative language or disclaimers like "but" or "however".

 

Again, I'm not happy being the way I am, and thinking the way I do, and as much as you guys must hate me and my posts, just imagine how I feel about myself, being trapped in the chaotic craziness that is inside my head. It's horrible, and I feel like a crazy person, locked away inside the padded cell that is my mind. I want to be different, better, and it frustrates me to no end that I can't let myself be those things.

[Batya33]

"Again, I'm not happy being the way I am, and thinking the way I do, and as much as you guys must hate me and my posts, just imagine how I feel about myself, being trapped in the chaotic craziness that is inside my head. It's horrible, and I feel like a crazy person, locked away inside the padded cell that is my mind. I want to be different, better, and it frustrates me to no end that I can't let myself be those things."

 

OK -so you're not going to take me up on my dare? So much passivity/victimhood/negativity -you're "trapped", you "can't let yourself" -if that is true then professional help is what you need. If it's not true then ask yourself what you get out of playing the victim? I do know that severe depression can do this to a person - and people with severe depression really should seek professional help. Then there are people who get lots of benefits out of making up excuses and playing the victim. Once again, I dare you to write a post where you can't use "but" or similar language or have any passivity/victimhood/negativity. Can you do it?

[MattW]

OK -so you're not going to take me up on my dare? So much passivity/victimhood/negativity -you're "trapped", you "can't let yourself" -if that is true then professional help is what you need. If it's not true then ask yourself what you get out of playing the victim? I do know that severe depression can do this to a person - and people with severe depression really should seek professional help. Then there are people who get lots of benefits out of making up excuses and playing the victim. Once again, I dare you to write a post where you can't use "but" or similar language or have any passivity/victimhood/negativity. Can you do it?

 

Can I do it? I... don't know. v_v I can only write how I feel.

 

I'm curious, though, what benefit am I really getting here from "playing the victim"? I mean, I admit, I like continuing to talk to all of you simply because it makes me feel slightly less lonely and worthless to know I always have you guys to talk to, but more and more, you guys just tell me how frustrating I am to deal with, which is understandable, but if anything, I just end up feeling worse for pissing all of you guys off.

[Batya33]

Can I do it? I... don't know. v_v I can only write how I feel.

 

I'm curious, though, what benefit am I really getting here from "playing the victim"? I mean, I admit, I like continuing to talk to all of you simply because it makes me feel slightly less lonely and worthless to know I always have you guys to talk to, but more and more, you guys just tell me how frustrating I am to deal with, which is understandable, but if anything, I just end up feeling worse for pissing all of you guys off.

 

No, my challenge is to write a reaction to how you feel without allowing yourself any of what I mentioned in my previous post. You're not writing just your feelings- you're writing your reactions which typically (if not always) are full of excuses/negativity/passivity/victimhood. Again, if you are suffering from severe depression that certainly is a symptom in my non-expert but vicariously knowledgeable opinion but if that's true then posting on a board is not going to help -but professional help likely will.

The benefit you get which I've written to you many times is the excuse to do nothing but to tell yourself that your venting/whining/complaining/analysis is "doing" something. It's far easier to stay in a negative comfort zone than to get out there and do something productive towards the goal of changing what makes you unhappy or dissatisfied. Especially when you get attention -even negative attention -for doing so. Like my 4-year old who will complain incessantly when I say no to candy before bed - like a broken record -and if you interact with him in a negative way he'll continue to do it because at least he's getting attention -but if you tell him "no" so that he understands that's the final answer, and then perhaps explain that you'll be ignoring any further requests/complaints, he stops in less than 5 minutes because he gets bored complaining to the air. And, bonus! -he respects/loves me even more for standing my ground. So too for you - if you stopped giving yourself reinforcement or getting reinforcement for your broken record stuff in a way that allows you to continue the broken record stuff - I bet you'd find a way to make a different choice. That is one reason I stopped posting on your threads and perhaps I should stop now -because I think it's far too enabling.

 

I think the "feeling worse" -that guilt stuff- again just reinforces your excuse to be negative instead of taking positive action. Thanks for the sentiment though.

[BrianH46]

You are a 25 year old man, not a teenager, not a boy. It is time to be an adult and assume responsibility and stop deflecting blame on anyone and everyone. Reading your posts you don't come off as someone who is a 25 year old man.

[Wayfara]

I do not want to spend the rest of my life alone, and there's nothing anyone can say, nothing a therapist can say, that can make me accept the possibility of spending the rest of my life alone.

 

If it happens it happens even if you don't like it and you not accepting it won't make it less probable, instead it makes the scenario more likely. By not making peace with the possibility you will just have to deal with it making you a less attractive choice of partner. Not only because it's unattractive in itself to be that dependent on other people but also because the mindset makes you an overall less positive person and too afraid to move from this girl.

 

Had I been in your situation where I really wanted friends and relationships I think I would rather give up the notion that I have to have someone to be happy than mess up my chances of getting what I want, but that is just me.

 

Anyway, you don't want to accept the possibility because it feels like giving up? Or are you say you can't because you don't know how?

 

No one can make you want something you don't want and vice verse and maybe you want to be unhappy in such scenario as protest against the world, that is your right but it will be at the cost of negatively impacting your dating chances. But if it's the later, you don’t think you can because you don't know how, I would give therapy a chance before making such statement because you can't really know until you try.

 

it's just a way I've been conditioned from repetitive failures.

 

You want to get better you just have to try anyway, no way around it, conditioned or not.

 

I want to be optimistic and believe that good things will happen for me, but I can't convince myself of that when good things never happen for me. I can't get myself to believe in something that has no basis to it.

 

It's a double blind, you can't believe until you have proof and you can't get proof until you believe.

 

Anyhow, in theory, one should be able to make efforts without believing, is that something you could consider doing?

 

Or you can choose to believe anyway without needing proof, would you be willing to do that?

 

If it's a no to both, well then I guess you just have to deal with being unhappy.

 

There's a part of me that does, but there's also a part of me that's still putting up a tremendous fight. I haven't figured out how to stop that other part of me from fighting it so much.

 

You could work on that in therapy. Things aren't going to change until you want to make changes, that is just how it is, so you will need to figure that out before doing anything else. Do you know why this part of you puts up a fight?

[MattW]

You are a 25 year old man, not a teenager, not a boy. It is time to be an adult and assume responsibility and stop deflecting blame on anyone and everyone. Reading your posts you don't come off as someone who is a 25 year old man.

 

What does that even mean? I DO blame myself. I might vent my frustrations a lot, and I can see how that can sound like I'm placing blame on other people and other things, but I absolutely blame (and hate) myself for everything that's wrong with me.

 

By not making peace with the possibility you will just have to deal with it making you a less attractive choice of partner. Not only because it's unattractive in itself to be that dependent on other people but also because the mindset makes you an overall less positive person and too afraid to move from this girl.

 

Anyway, you don't want to accept the possibility because it feels like giving up? Or are you say you can't because you don't know how?

 

No one can make you want something you don't want and vice verse and maybe you want to be unhappy in such scenario as protest against the world, that is your right but it will be at the cost of negatively impacting your dating chances. But if it's the later, you don’t think you can because you don't know how, I would give therapy a chance before making such statement because you can't really know until you try.

 

I guess you could say I don't know how, but it's also mainly because I just want people so much that the idea of being alone for the rest of my life seems too unpleasant to me.

 

Thing is, I think as far as this girl goes, it's just too much of a challenge to "move on" when I'm constantly seeing her and interacting with her, and having to see her and other guys. That makes it too hard.

 

Before her, I had basically "starved" myself on the notion of finding someone, being with someone, and having people in my life. It was dull, and it made my life feel a little hollow, but I was able to just drift along without getting worked up about this stuff. I pretty much accepted that I was alone in my own little bubble, and I was just trying to keep my head down and push through life. That was going just fine until I had to go and fall for this girl.

 

I think that once one (or both) of us move on to a new job, and I'm not seeing her anymore, I can probably start learning how to get back inside the "bubble" I was in before. It'll probably still take a bit of time after we part ways, because I'm sure I'll lament for a while about how much I miss her. But once we're gone, and a bit of time has passed, I think I can probably place myself back into that bubble.

 

It's a double blind, you can't believe until you have proof and you can't get proof until you believe.

 

Anyhow, in theory, one should be able to make efforts without believing, is that something you could consider doing?

 

Or you can choose to believe anyway without needing proof, would you be willing to do that?

 

If it's a no to both, well then I guess you just have to deal with being unhappy.

 

I mean... I'm not saying I NEED to believe to make an effort, but if I don't believe in something, my efforts tend to be half-assed (if that), because I don't really feel like I'm making an effort towards anything. Does that make sense?

 

You could work on that in therapy. Things aren't going to change until you want to make changes, that is just how it is, so you will need to figure that out before doing anything else. Do you know why this part of you puts up a fight?

 

Not really, no. On some level, I theorize that there's a part of me that is adamant to make myself miserable, now and forever. Just a "theory", anyway.

[BrianH46]

You may blame yourself but you do not take responsibility. An alcoholic may admit they have a problem but unless they get help, they have not taken responsibility.

[Rosti87]

I know, I know. You think I'm really happy being the way I am? Trust me, I'm not. Although, just for the sake of pointing it out, if I was in a relationship with a woman, I wouldn't exactly be lamenting to her about not being able to find someone to date, so I'm not really sure that would work the way you say...?

 

I believe you would lament about other issues that you are 'failing' in.

[MattW]

You may blame yourself but you do not take responsibility. An alcoholic may admit they have a problem but unless they get help, they have not taken responsibility.

 

So I take it you're saying that in order for me to "take responsibility", I need to "get help"? Look, I'm not necessarily trying to resist therapy, or whatever; as a matter of fact, I'm inching closer and closer to caving on that and going for it. But the big question I have, the one that nobody seems to have an answer to, is what if "getting help" doesn't work? What option do I have left then, if any? I don't want to hear "Don't assume it won't work, just try it!", or anything like that. I need reassurance that there's still something, some hope, if therapy does not work for me. But what?

 

I believe you would lament about other issues that you are 'failing' in.

 

Fair enough. But I really don't have much else to lament over. Everything else in my life is on the right track and going just fine. I'm just horribly lonely. I want to have friends, and a girlfriend, to go places with and do things with, to enjoy life with, to kick back and relax with, a girl to be intimate with. If I had that, my life would be relatively normal, I'd be at peace.