The whole "confidence"/ "self-worth" thing

[MattW]

The words don't make it sound like anything. You are choosing to interpret it that way. I did not say you think you are better then anyone else. I said that you consider yourself different than everyone else (which is what unique means) and you are agreeing with that.

 

I didn't mean that's what you were implying, I just meant that I tend to stick away from using words like that to describe myself and the way I feel because that's how I associate terms like that.

 

I don't get this whole "eh" thing you throw in every once in a while when you're getting ready to disagree with someone, either.

 

*shrug* It's just a filler word I throw out a lot.

 

They are rare because you have created a situation in which there are no opportunities. And the last thing you should even be thinking about is entering into a romantic relationship with this girl or anyone else, if you truly feel that it will be the only thing that allows you to feel that you fit in. Total recipe for dysfunction and disaster.

 

Is it really, though? I mean, ideally, I want a partner that understands me and "gets" me better than anyone else, someone I can completely be myself around, someone I can relate to better than anyone else. That's all I really mean by "belonging" or "fitting in". Isn't that what most people want out of their romantic partner?

 

Honestly, I just feel like I'm never around people that even kinda "get" me. Perhaps it can simply be attributed to "bad luck", but I feel like for the most part, I have views and perspectives that are very different from the people around me, a very different kind of sense of humor, quirks and odd little behaviors that people don't understand. Maybe there are more people like me out there somewhere, but I can't even find them, let alone make them want to be with me. I constantly feel like a fish out of water, so it hurts a lot more to finally feel like I "belong" somewhere, only to get rejected and pushed away by that person.

[Batya33]

"Is it really, though? I mean, ideally, I want a partner that understands me and "gets" me better than anyone else, someone I can completely be myself around, someone I can relate to better than anyone else. That's all I really mean by "belonging" or "fitting in". Isn't that what most people want out of their romantic partner?"

 

Yes and those people who, like you, are too often negative/complaining and who claim that there are very few people they are ever attracted to need to realize that either it's going to be much more difficult to find a long term romantic partner or they need to do what it takes to change their behaviors and stop getting in their own way. And no you are unfortunately not unique in that way or in your current situation of feeling like it's so difficult to find a good match.

[bulletproof]

For the most part, there is no such thing as "bad luck."

 

If you feel that the people around you don't share your views, humor, etc., all that means is that you need to change the people you surround yourself with. It's actually just simple math/logic. Not nearly the melodrama you have made it.

[jonny15]

You are suffering from terminal uniqueness. Basically you are telling yourself a story, a false story, that you are so "different" that the regular life rules don't apply in your situation.

 

I'm sure it's a lot easier to tell yourself that you're inherently odd, because then you don't have to fix anything. Unfortunately, there are lots of people like you.

 

If I recall, he's said he's like 5 foot 2. Which means that he isn't being delusional when he says his dating pool is smaller.

[MattW]

For the most part, there is no such thing as "bad luck."

 

If you feel that the people around you don't share your views, humor, etc., all that means is that you need to change the people you surround yourself with. It's actually just simple math/logic. Not nearly the melodrama you have made it.

 

Well, no, but as I've said before, I've encountered tons of people and have been a part of many different "groups" (high school, work, the 40-ish different classes I took in community college, the school I'm at now, interning, etc.) over the last 8-9 years, and I've yet to really meet more than a very sporadic handful of people that I felt understood/ shared my views, humor, and all that. When you look at numbers like that, it becomes a bit more of an issue, to me.

 

And more than that, even on the rare occasion I do meet someone that I connect with in some way, I still tend to not be able to actually be more than an "activity partner" with them. For instance, if I thought one of my classmates was kinda cool and wanted to be their friend, I always find myself unable to make that happen; rather than being a friend (someone I see, talk to, and spend time with outside of the activity I know them from), they're just "that person I know from ". And once said activity ends, that person is just gone.

 

That tends to be how things go for me. I do these "activities", I occasionally meet someone I'd like to be more involved with, but can't quite figure out how to make that happen, and in the process of trying to make that happen, I might weird them out or otherwise push them away, then I feel bad, then the "activity" comes to an end and that person is gone, and I feel worse because I lost someone I could've been friends with.

 

That's basically the cycle I'm going through with this girl right now. I met her at work, I found someone I really felt connected to, but I weirded her out/ pushed her away, now she's just "the girl I know at work" (rather than "a friend I can talk to and hang out with"), and once she finds a new job, she'll be gone, and I'll be back at the beginning of my cycle. I've never really stressed that hard about it, probably because I've never felt such a strong connection with someone before her, but I REALLY wanted this to be the time I finally got it right. Knowing that it wasn't, and more than that, knowing that it'll probably be ages before I even get another chance, that's just really depressing.

 

Yes and those people who, like you, are too often negative/complaining and who claim that there are very few people they are ever attracted to need to realize that either it's going to be much more difficult to find a long term romantic partner or they need to do what it takes to change their behaviors and stop getting in their own way. And no you are unfortunately not unique in that way or in your current situation of feeling like it's so difficult to find a good match.

 

I'm not talking about my issues, though. Even if I overcame my various problems, I imagine I'd still have the same peculiar perspectives, outlooks, sense of humor, quirks and odd traits, etc. That part of it is just my personality, and THAT'S why I feel "different" to the vast majority of people I encounter.

[bulletproof]

Well, no, but as I've said before, I've encountered tons of people and have been a part of many different "groups" (high school, work, the 40-ish different classes I took in community college, the school I'm at now, interning, etc.) over the last 8-9 years, and I've yet to really meet more than a very sporadic handful of people that I felt understood/ shared my views, humor, and all that. When you look at numbers like that, it becomes a bit more of an issue, to me.

 

No offense, but you're 24. You haven't encountered "tons of people" in your life yet. Have you traveled? Seen different cultures? Explored anything outside of mainstream America? You've been an adult for all of 6 years.

 

That tends to be how things go for me. I do these "activities", I occasionally meet someone I'd like to be more involved with, but can't quite figure out how to make that happen.

 

This isn't how "things go" for you. Life isn't just happening to you. Stop being so passive. If you are meeting people and it's not going further into friendship, then your problem is that you don't know how to do that, and you're socially awkward. There are ways to learn how to be better at socializing. Research it and figure it out.

[Rosti87]

If I recall, he's said he's like 5 foot 2. Which means that he isn't being delusional when he says his dating pool is smaller.

 

Dustin Hoffman and Daniel Radcliffe are examples of 'short' men who made something out of their lives. And yes, you will say, 'Oh it is because they are famous.' To which I say they were not famous when they first embarked on their careers. They took risks and they disciplined themselves to achieve. Nothing was handed to them. There are others like Seth Green.. the list is practically endless.

[MattW]

No offense, but you're 24. You haven't encountered "tons of people" in your life yet. Have you traveled? Seen different cultures? Explored anything outside of mainstream America? You've been an adult for all of 6 years.

 

Again, though, it's all about how I compare to the standards of "normal". Like I rattled off before, I've been through high school, tons of classes at community college, a part time job for the last five years where I'm constantly dealing with people, now I'm at a new school, I'm doing internships... I've been meeting people for years now. In my situation, the average person should already have tons of friends, been on plenty of dates, had at least one serious girlfriend, etc. Most people don't have to travel, and explore the world in order to find these things. I understand the whole "You're young and you've only seen one teeny tiny section of the entire planet" message, here, but again, that shouldn't matter that much in terms of having a social life and love life.

 

This isn't how "things go" for you. Life isn't just happening to you. Stop being so passive. If you are meeting people and it's not going further into friendship, then your problem is that you don't know how to do that, and you're socially awkward. There are ways to learn how to be better at socializing. Research it and figure it out.

 

Well, that's pretty much what I meant, I just didn't know how else to express it. I've been saying forever now that I don't know how to create relationships with people beyond being activity partners. I've read plenty of stuff on the Internet about socializing, heck, I even took at least one or two classes on the subject matter at community college, it's just... not something that sinks in with me. For whatever reason, I can't apply any of it to my own life. I can't get it to work for myself the way it works for everyone else.

[bulletproof]

In my situation, the average person should already have tons of friends, been on plenty of dates, had at least one serious girlfriend, etc.

 

You're contradicting yourself. You said you are odd and not normal and have a very unusual personality. Therefore, you are not the average person. According to you. I would say you are not the average person, based on the fact that you do not know how to socialize and have some psychological issues that you refuse to address.

 

For whatever reason, I can't apply any of it to my own life. I can't get it to work for myself the way it works for everyone else.

 

Because you won't, not because you can't. There is a difference.

 

Bottom line is, you're not happy. You're not getting what you want out of life. So you have to change. Going around in circles with strangers on the internet is getting you nowhere.

[jonny15]

Dustin Hoffman and Daniel Radcliffe are examples of 'short' men who made something out of their lives. And yes, you will say, 'Oh it is because they are famous.' To which I say they were not famous when they first embarked on their careers. They took risks and they disciplined themselves to achieve. Nothing was handed to them. There are others like Seth Green.. the list is practically endless.

 

Seth Green and Daniel Radcliffe started their careers are a young age. So their small size was actually good then.

 

And Hoffman is only 5'6. Which isn't super short. So I don't think they count in what your saying.

[Rosti87]

Again, though, it's all about how I compare to the standards of "normal". Like I rattled off before, I've been through high school, tons of classes at community college, a part time job for the last five years where I'm constantly dealing with people, now I'm at a new school, I'm doing internships... I've been meeting people for years now. In my situation, the average person should already have tons of friends, been on plenty of dates, had at least one serious girlfriend, etc. Most people don't have to travel, and explore the world in order to find these things. I understand the whole "You're young and you've only seen one teeny tiny section of the entire planet" message, here, but again, that shouldn't matter that much in terms of having a social life and love life.

 

 

 

 

 

I have no idea where you live. If you live in the middle of the United States and/or live in a medium town or smaller 'normal' is much narrow than say living in a larger metro area or living in coastal cities such as Los Angeles or New York. 'Normal' is a much larger range than in more provincial areas.

 

I have lived in many cities, regions of the States and normal changes from place to place. When I started traveling abroad normal is is different from country to country. What some of the posters here are trying to tell you is that if you don't expand beyond the little world in which you live, then you will never discover that you could 'belong' in another category of 'normal.' Los Angeles and New York in particular has many 'different' people who live full lives and are understood by others who are just like them.

 

That is why I asked you a million pages ago have you ever traveled anywhere or explored other cultures or subcultures. This is the cynic coming out in me but 'middle America' can be a very narrow range of normal. As I said earlier I have lived an many different parts of America and I presently live in the middle of the States. It is highly provincial where I live. I am not provincial by any means, so it took me a few years to find people who think and view life the same as me. Mind you, it takes skills to zero in on the people that are like minded (a therapist can help you with that) but you learn to economize your energy and spend it on people who are worth your time and less on those who are not.

 

When you learn more about yourself you will know what YOUR standards are and will recognize it in others and know whom to associate with. Stop comparing yourself to a limited pool or demographic and know that there is a demographic for you. You may not be living in an area where your kind are prevalent.

[Rosti87]

Seth Green and Daniel Radcliffe started their careers are a young age. So their small size was actually good then.

 

And Hoffman is only 5'6. Which isn't super short. So I don't think they count in what your saying.

 

To the typical American woman 5'6 is very short. I think men under 5'7 no matter how short experience challenges. Seth Green and Daniel Radcliffe are grown men. They no longer play child parts. They are still succeeding despite the odds.

[bulletproof]

To the typical American woman 5'6 is very short. I think men under 5'7 no matter how short experience challenges. Seth Green and Daniel Radcliffe are grown men. They no longer play child parts. They are still succeeding despite the odds.

 

The poster's height is the least of his problems, I think. Pointless to focus on it.

[Rosti87]

The poster's height is the least of his problems, I think. Pointless to focus on it.

 

Agreed. There are plenty of shorter men that date.

[MattW]

See, as far as the whole "seeing more of the world" thing goes, couldn't that be more of a challenge than anything? I mean, having studied business, let's think of me as a product that I'm trying to sell to women. I live in a place where the standards for attractiveness is generally pretty low. If I were to start exploring major cities, the competition would be WAY bigger, because the standards for attractiveness are much higher. And if I can't sell my product in a smaller market with lower standards, what hope do I have in a bigger market with higher standards?

 

Anyway, as I get ready for my appointment on Monday, this is where I'm at... I've pretty much out myself in an impossible situation. Finding love is one of my biggest goals in life. But I really don't believe finding mutual love is a possibility for me. Even if therapy helps me resolve my personal problems in the long run, I still think I'll find myself alone, and I just don't think I'll ever be able to accept that.

 

If I get through therapy after however long it takes me, and I still can't find anyone, I'll most likely "relapse", become sad and frustrated and lonely again, and probably need to go back to therapy all over again.

 

So, yeah, like I said, I've placed myself in a no-win situation. I want to experience mutual love so badly, but I genuinely don't believe that's possible. In essence, I'm wanting something that I know I can't have, and boy, do I want it badly.

[bulletproof]

See, as far as the whole "seeing more of the world" thing goes, couldn't that be more of a challenge than anything? I mean, having studied business, let's think of me as a product that I'm trying to sell to women. I live in a place where the standards for attractiveness is generally pretty low. If I were to start exploring major cities, the competition would be WAY bigger, because the standards for attractiveness are much higher. And if I can't sell my product in a smaller market with lower standards, what hope do I have in a bigger market with higher standards?

 

That is so illogical I don't know where to start.

 

All I can say is excuses, excuses, excuses, and negativity, negativity, negativity.

 

You're wallowing. Only you can stop it.

[Rosti87]

LOL! I have to laugh here. You are making assumptions about places that you have never been. Let me spell something out to you as an example.

 

In America, black women as a rule are not as desirable as other women in many single markets. In Scandinavia and other Nordic cultures (German, Dutch, Flemish) they are highly desirable.

 

The above is a simple example of how countries, regions, cities differ. Until you TRAVEL and explore for yourself, you will never find your niche. This is big world out there and you have a very limited view of it. Also when you travel you learn new things that when you share with others make you automatically more interesting. The more you grow both inwardly and outwardly, the more interesting you become to others. Just by your statement above, you make yourself less interesting and more narrow-minded, thus less appealing to others.

[MattW]

Okay, but let's not jump so far ahead; I need time, money, and presumably some other resources to go off traveling, none of which I have right now, or in the foreseeable future. And let's say I do some traveling, and I come accross some people that seem pretty cool; what then? Am I supposed to just uproot my entire life and move just to be closer to those people I met once during my travels? That doesn't seem very feasible to me.

 

I mean, I can see how having gone places can make you more interesting to the people you know, but generally, if you're not a good storyteller, it doesn't really mean much. If someone says to me "Hey, how was your trip to ?", I'd probably just say "It was really nice, I enjoyed it", and if they ask me questions, I'll answer. I've just never been the type that would go "Oh, man, it was great, this happened, and then there was this, and that, etc. etc.". In other words, stuff like this only really makes you a more interesting person to other people if said other people actually know about it. I'm an extremely modest person, to the outside world, and more often than not, I tend to downplay the things I've done.

 

Also, can I ask why, exactly, my notion of "wanting what I can't have (mutual love)" is necessarily "negative"? Is it not simply just me being realistic? I mean, come on. Even if therapy can help me work through some of my issues, at the end of the day, I'm still going to be an extremely short guy that looks and sounds like a child, and has a quirky, overly humble personality, but can't even feel personal attraction to 98% of women, himself. Maybe some day, I'll have feelings for someone again, but even without my personal issues, I really can't imagine a girl ever wanting to be with me. Hell, my experiences with this last girl have shown me that it doesn't matter how well you connect with someone. I mean, I understand that the nature of this topic isn't exactly bright and cheery, but how am I being anything but realistic? I want to find mutual love so, so badly, but that's not a possibility for me; therefore, I want what I can't have. You guys can't REALLY believe I'll ever find mutual love, do you? I see no good reason to believe so. What do you guys see that I don't?

[Batya33]

Others may disagree but I think you should take voice and/or acting lessons to work on how you modulate your voice and how you sound. The rest of what you wrote is just more of your negativity. Your actual goal is positive but phrasing it as "wanting what I can't have" when you know that the "can't" is really "choose not to" is setting yourself up for failure.

[Rosti87]

Others may disagree but I think you should take voice and/or acting lessons to work on how you modulate your voice and how you sound. The rest of what you wrote is just more of your negativity. Your actual goal is positive but phrasing it as "wanting what I can't have" when you know that the "can't" is really "choose not to" is setting yourself up for failure.

 

I agree about the voice lessons. I don't know all the details, but would imagine a speech language pathologist might help.

[Wayfara]

Also, can I ask why, exactly, my notion of "wanting what I can't have (mutual love)" is necessarily "negative"? Is it not simply just me being realistic?

 

Well it is both, by being negative you are making this outcome very realistic.

 

my experiences with this last girl have shown me that it doesn't matter how well you connect with someone.

 

If there is no attraction. When there is attraction it matters very much. You think because one girl you connected with wasn't attracted to you that is proof that all girls you ever going to connect with are all going to be not attracted to you? Why? Because of your issues and not wanting to work on them? In that case maybe. Having someone you connect with but isn't attracted to you is normal though and not sign of anything.

 

I understand that the nature of this topic isn't exactly bright and cheery, but how am I being anything but realistic? I want to find mutual love so, so badly, but that's not a possibility for me; therefore, I want what I can't have.

 

When you say it’s impossible it is going to be (pretty much) impossible, which makes your statement true for however long you stand by it. What I mean, if I state that becoming a doctor is not a possibility for me it's very unlikely that I will become one because becoming a doctor isn't something that can happen accidentally without me actively making myself become this doctor. Telling myself it's not going to happen is me choosing not to make it happen.

 

This is not me saying that you can always make things happen or that you are guaranteed results just be trying. A motivated free man in good health could still end up alone, but I don't see a motivated free man in good health as hard-coded to end up alone, the possibility for love is there as long he has the door open for it. I don't believe in fate so I don't think you are fated to anything. I believe that sometimes people are unlucky and never find someone (sometimes even mathematically unlikely things happen, like rolling a dice and getting a one ten times a row, no fate, pure randomness). And I believe in free will and that you can make yourself end up alone with things you control, like inaction, constant negativity, desperation etc. Right now I see you doing many things that are hurting your chances, but they are things you can change, if you choose to.

 

You guys can't REALLY believe I'll ever find mutual love, do you?

 

Well it depends, do you think you can? If you say yes I believe you can, and if you say no well then I don't for now.

[MattW]

If there is no attraction. When there is attraction it matters very much. You think because one girl you connected with wasn't attracted to you that is proof that all girls you ever going to connect with are all going to be not attracted to you? Why? Because of your issues and not wanting to work on them? In that case maybe. Having someone you connect with but isn't attracted to you is normal though and not sign of anything.

 

I just think that, issues or not, I'm generally "unattractive". I don't believe I have much chance of attracting a woman, period, much less one that I actually like, myself. Hence why I've said in the past that "settling" is probably the best I can possibly hope for (and even that might not be a reasonable possibility). I don't want to "settle", and I REALLY want to experience "mutual attraction" at least once in my life, even if I end up having to settle for someone else later down the line.

 

Well it depends, do you think you can? If you say yes I believe you can, and if you say no well then I don't for now.

 

I want to believe I can, but given the past several years of my life, I just don't see any reason to believe in it. It seems to me that all the evidence is pointing to me "wanting something I can't ever have". I tend to prefer having low expectations and being pleasantly surprised if things turn out better, than having faith in something only to be greatly disappointed when I can't ever attain it. I've faced such disappointment in the past, enough to know that I don't feel like I can handle more of it.

[Batya33]

"I tend to prefer having low expectations and being pleasantly surprised if things turn out better, than having faith in something only to be greatly disappointed when I can't ever attain it. I've faced such disappointment in the past, enough to know that I don't feel like I can handle more of it."

 

It's fine to have low expectations. It's not fine to have low effort in trying to accomplish the goals you have.