Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 It's exactly the same thing. You think you are entitled to install keyloggers and hire PI's to make YOU feel better. What gives you that right? People use computers now, as diaries, and sites like this like a therapists office. What makes you entitled to read the things that your partner chooses not to share? Just because they are in a relationship to you, and have made promises expressed or implied, does not grant you the right to track them like they are on probation...that's not a relationship... And people keep saying they're justified if they are right...what if you are not right? How do you justify that? Even if you are right, you've just violated their faith in you just as they've violated your faith in them... No. I disagree. It is not the same thing. You made reference to friends, etc. I am making reference to a significant other. You should know that is not the same. You are not sleeping with your friends. (well, unless you are). I'm not here to convince you or this forum. That's not my intent. I have communicated why I would snoop. You don't have to like it or agree with it. Obviously, we now come to the conclusion that we will agree to disagree. I simply do not see it in the same light that you do and you can refer back to my previous comments in this thread as to why. I, however, do respect your opinion in that you are entitled to it. Maverick Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Perhaps in your marriage but in mine we have privacy. It's called respect for your partner. HELL YES ! SNOOP AWAY that's how i caught my recent ex bf, and the douche had an excuse for everything.. AND then he ignored me for a few days and then dumped me. F it, good riddence. what i've learned from this is that when we have a gut feeling something isn't right, it's because it usually isn't. p.s. when you're married, there is no such thing as privacy. don't even fathom the idea. it's not going to happen. Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Some would classify that behaviour as stalking behaviour.... No. I disagree. It is not the same thing. You made reference to friends, etc. I am making reference to a significant other. You should know that is not the same. You are not sleeping with your friends. (well, unless you are). I'm not here to convince you or this forum. That's not my intent. I have communicated why I would snoop. You don't have to like it or agree with it. Obviously, we now come to the conclusion that we will agree to disagree. I simply do not see it in the same light that you do and you can refer back to my previous comments in this thread as to why. I, however, do respect your opinion in that you are entitled to it. Maverick Link to comment
tresqua Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 As the factors accumulate (distance, lack of sex, lack of communication, hostility, and a multitude we can all throw together), a person begins to doubt their relationship and can even feel, when they talk, that their partner is hiding or lying about things. For me, that reasonable doubt would put me in the gray area where I would snoop. I would agree with this. All of those factors are considerable cause for concern. If a partners actions are such that significant doubt has been created, all bets are off. When it comes down to it, you gotta watch out for #1. Although if it was me, and I was in a relationship with a woman who started showing no interest in sex, and who backed off and was hostile and anything else along those lines, I would just kick her to the curb rather than find out if she had something going on the side. I mean, what's the point? You think she's going to say "oh, you caught me, let's go have great sex and I will be nice to you again"?? Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I would agree with this. All of those factors are considerable cause for concern. If a partners actions are such that significant doubt has been created, all bets are off. When it comes down to it, you gotta watch out for #1. Although if it was me, and I was in a relationship with a woman who started showing no interest in sex, and who backed off and was hostile and anything else along those lines, I would just kick her to the curb rather than find out if she had something going on the side. I mean, what's the point? You think she's going to say "oh, you caught me, let's go have great sex and I will be nice to you again"?? But what if you were wrong about the partner in that case and reacted based on inaccurate assumptions? What if, for example as I have heard stories, your partner had cancer or something and chose to not reveal it for fear of the damage it would do to you emotionally? It makes no sense to me but I have heard it does happen. Maverick Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 If someone, like a partner, can't tell you something like they have cancer and may die, there is some serious communication or trust issues. But what if you were wrong about the partner in that case and reacted based on inaccurate assumptions? What if, for example as I have heard stories, your partner had cancer or something and chose to not reveal it for fear of the damage it would do to you emotionally? It makes no sense to me but I have heard it does happen. Maverick Link to comment
Seraphim Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 But what if you were wrong about the partner in that case and reacted based on inaccurate assumptions? What if, for example as I have heard stories, your partner had cancer or something and chose to not reveal it for fear of the damage it would do to you emotionally? It makes no sense to me but I have heard it does happen. Maverick Then you flipped the dice and lost. You think if the person you were spying on was innocent that they would care to kiss and make up and laugh it off? I know I wouldn't. Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 There is a fine line. You have to, at some point, let it go. To go overboard would be compulsive snooping and I suspect you could equate that with stalking. Stalking, as a verb definition is the following: stalked, past participle; stalked, past tense; stalking, present participle; stalks, 3rd person singular present Pursue or approach stealthily - a cat stalking a bird [*]Harass or persecute (someone) with unwanted and obsessive attention - for five years she was stalked by a man who would taunt and threaten her [*]Move silently or threateningly through (a place) - the tiger stalks the jungle - fear stalked the camp [*]Stride somewhere in a proud, stiff, or angry manner - without another word she turned and stalked out The definition that is usually considered as the stalking that is negative is #2. #1 is not usually placed in a negative connotation. To approach stealthily as you gather your information (i.e. snooping) is the #1 in the list. To continue to do that over 5 years seems a bit over the top to me and I would see that as being the stalking you are referencing. I mean - how long do you have to 'snoop' before you would be satisfied? Again, to do it compulsively to your partner would seem to be an issue a doctor should be seen for. Again - my opinion. Maverick Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 You don't tell them, Victoria. Just as if they were cheating - they don't tend to tell you. Better cover your tracks. You can look for the black / white answer and choose to live there. I choose not to. Maverick Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Used as an example and do a google search and find it. I think they should tell and it makes no sense to me either. Maverick Link to comment
Seraphim Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Firstly, I would not do it. You think people do not realise they are being spied on? People are not stupid. Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 What you don't understand is snooping IS obsessive. You do it once and you can't stop yourself because your insecure, paranoid brain thinks 'I didn't find anything this time, but what about next time?' and the cycle continues. So whether it's done every day for five years or one month every five years, it's an obsessive need. Once you snoop you can't stop in that relationship because in your head you have already deemed your partner untrustworthy. Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 You don't tell them, Victoria. Just as if they were cheating - they don't tend to tell you. Better cover your tracks. You can look for the black / white answer and choose to live there. I choose not to. Maverick IMO, that makes no better than the person that cheated really. If you aren't doing anything wrong by your standards there should be no need to cover it up. Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Firstly, I would not do it. You think people do not realise they are being spied on? People are not stupid. I'm not going to call people stupid and no disrespect but there are many instances of where exactly that has occurred. Maverick Link to comment
tresqua Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 But what if you were wrong about the partner in that case and reacted based on inaccurate assumptions? What if, for example as I have heard stories, your partner had cancer or something and chose to not reveal it for fear of the damage it would do to you emotionally? It makes no sense to me but I have heard it does happen. Maverick If the communication is that bad I don't want any part of the relationship. Besides, even if they came clean about the cancer or whatever else it was, if it's not something I can control, then the problems will persist. To be honest, and this may sound rather cruel, if I was in a relationship with a person with some sort of major incurable medical problem I'd probably bail. At this point in my life, my attitude is "Life is short, I don't need the problems". Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 What you don't understand is snooping IS obsessive. You do it once and you can't stop yourself because your insecure, paranoid brain thinks 'I didn't find anything this time, but what about next time?' and the cycle continues. So whether it's done every day for five years or one month every five years, it's an obsessive need. Once you snoop you can't stop in that relationship because in your head you have already deemed your partner untrustworthy. I disagree with this but I had indicated in an earlier comment the reasons why, etc.... I don't feel it is an obsessive need. Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I disagree with this but I had indicated in an earlier comment the reasons why, etc.... I don't feel it is an obsessive need. Which is exactly what alcoholics say. 'I'm not an alcoholic' as they guzzle beer every day. Link to comment
FarthestEdge Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 No. I disagree. It is not the same thing. You made reference to friends, etc. I am making reference to a significant other. You should know that is not the same. You are not sleeping with your friends. (well, unless you are). The point remains the same. We decide who we let into our lives, and how close they are. I could argue that I don't want to associate with people who take drugs, so why would my snooping in their bedside table to 'assure myself' that I'm not investing my time and energy into a friendship with a closet cokehead be any different? Either way, I am violating someone else's privacy to ensure that they are not violating my trust in them that they are who/what they claim to be (i.e. faithful/drug free/whatever) Nice, btw, the way you insinuate that because I don't agree with snooping that I must be sleeping around. Classic deflection. I just don't think a relationship of equals can truly exist if you treat your partner like a child, or a pet to be controlled and monitored. It's exhausting, and self-fulfilling in so many cases. Might that trust be violated some day ? Sure, anything can happen. But whether that day is 5-10 or 20 years away or never at all, I have no intention of turning my personal life into cycle of stress, suspicion and self-torture in the interim. I'll deal with it IF it ever comes to pass. Snooping won't prevent a betrayal or make it any less painful... I just hope that you tell your partners that you expect to have the right to snoop on them if your 'gut' tells you so. Because I suspect for most people, it is not assumed that it would be the case, and you'd be entering INTO the relationship on a lie if you told them otherwise...Now, how trustworthy is that? Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Which is exactly what alcoholics say. 'I'm not an alcoholic' as they guzzle beer every day. Perhaps OG that if you did snoop, you would be compelled to do exactly what you had indicated about compulsive snooping. I don't know that about you. However, and while everyone is different - some can snoop and not be obsessed in the manner you indicated. Maverick Link to comment
hexaemeron Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Perhaps OG that if you did snoop, you would be compelled to do exactly what you had indicated about compulsive snooping. I don't know that about you. However, and while everyone is different - some can snoop and not be obsessed in the manner you indicated. Maverick By that logic, maybe you could just cheat... a little. You don't have to be obsessed with abusing someone else's gonads, so then it's okay, right? Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Snooping makes the betrayal a bit less painful because of the idea that the person was lying to you. You have a gut feeling - they deny, deny, deny, etc..and you want to trust that person but items just don't add up and actually accumulate and they deny, deny, deny....so I'd explore it. Yes, I would. Again, people snoop and relationships can thrive and survive. You may not like to hear it or accept it but it does happen. I would say that you shouldn't let the other catch you snooping as I indicated earlier. Of course they won't be happy. I really do think we can go round and round in circles here and still not come to an agreement. BTW, with reference to the part about sleeping with your friends, I was contrasting, for me, how it is different. Obviously, as you have indicated it is not different for you so you were offended at that comment. I apologize. Maverick Link to comment
Maverick44 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 By that logic, maybe you could just cheat... a little. You don't have to be obsessed with abusing someone else's gonads, so then it's okay, right? Sorry, I don't see it in the same manner you do. No. However, I don't agree with cheating. Maverick Link to comment
Seraphim Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I am not getting how a relationship thrives with snooping. Not getting that at all. That is not a healthy relationship. Link to comment
OptomisticGirl Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Perhaps OG that if you did snoop, you would be compelled to do exactly what you had indicated about compulsive snooping. I don't know that about you. However, and while everyone is different - some can snoop and not be obsessed in the manner you indicated. Maverick I know because I AM an ex snooper. To snoop means you don't trust your partner. Without trust, there is no relationship. Link to comment
FarthestEdge Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 So, it's a valid thing to snoop, as long as it makes you feel good....just be careful to not get caught by your partner, that's what you're saying Maverick? How does that sound, when you replace the word " snoop" with " cheat"? In the end, you are doing something that would hurt and anger your partner and justifying it because it makes YOU feel good.... Link to comment
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