Male friends: Is it possible?

[CamGuy]

I think the trick is to goto into everything you do with an open mind, and not build up a defense that is inpenetrable.

 

My last ex was a very good friend of mine for over a year before we dated. We even were room=mates before we dated. I never once saw her in a romantic way while living with her, and Im pretty sure it was vice versa. However, things just happen.

 

At first I was scared to risk our friendship on such an inconclusive feeling. But we both started to fall for one another. So the way I saw it was simple. If I didnt go for it, and begin a romantic relationship with her, I would have most likely have put a kink in our friendship, and it would never be as strong, not to mention, I would always be wondering what could have been.

 

But, to me, that was proof enough that it's nearly impossible for two SINGLE attractive members of the opposite sex to be JUST FRIENDS. Especially if they hang out alot.

[monsieur]

Camguy: what did you do to make the transition? Did you slowly edge toward a physical move? Or did you tell her in words first then got it agreed to logically before you went for it?

 

It is so hard while you are still in friendzone to move it toward a physical thing, there are times I feel so much pull inside to put my head on her shoulder and cuddle her but I couldn't just be so forward as I think she would be shocked by the move.... how did you do it?

[CarnelianButterfly]

Monsieur are you trying to make these moves on the girl who was already told you repeatedly she doesn't want a relationship with you?

[monsieur]

not necessarily

 

I wanted the information more to store in my mind for future situations... I am the type that will always have to go the subtle, make friends with her approach first, I just can't be the aggressive forward type... so I will always be coming at potential relationships from a good friend basis, thereforeeee I wanted to hear Camguy's secret to success.. that's all

[OceanEyes]

If the girl has already told you that she's only interested in friendship, then busting a physical move will probably cause her to cut you completely out of her life (which is what I had to do ... I won't even have conversations with the guy or look him in the eye anymore). That's IF she's not interested and only sees you as a friend.

 

If she doesn't ... then making moves early on will be what saves you.

[monsieur]

Camguy said he did it after a whole year, that is what gives me hope.... I just wanted to hear how it transpired... we can all learn from others experiences, and believe me I know what you are saying, I have experienced the rejection after letting my friend know my feelings firsthand. I never did anything at all physical, but just telling her is what changed everything.

[monsieur]

and I am speaking from experience too, as I was good friends with a girl a few years back, but she was in a ltr with another friend of mine, but we got along great and did stuff together, probably a year later she dumped him and made a move on me and we ended up together for a year

 

so the waiting method does work in some cases

 

the bottom line is that will always be my only hope for relationships, is to go the friendship route first, it is just so against my passive nature to even consider making a move early

[ehm doubleyou]

Just so the ladies know.....I am a firm believer of the "spark"...

 

i just dont think a romantic relationship can develop without the spark in the beginning whether you were friends first or not.

 

For me, I have 3 ladders....

the first one is for friends only....spark not required

the second one is for friends with benifets...spark not required

and the third is for relationships...spark required

 

monsieur....I think cam has unintentially gave you some false hope there pal....Like the ladies here said....the girl you are interested in told you straight up ....she is not interested in you in that way....why cant you accept and respect that? You are totally putting this girl in a very uncomfortable situation and that is totally selfish on your part...What I predict will happen is she will distant herself from you and you lose even more and then feel more shy and resent women more....but I find that you wont accept the advice given here cause its not what you want to hear....and the only way you will learn is when she distance herself from you...cause thats how we all learn...not from advice but from mistakes we make. Everyone here fails more than they succeed... I can tell you there have been more women who turned me down then went for me ....by far...even a stud probably gets turned down more then he succeeds....but what makes him succeed is that he moves on to the next person he is interested in and does not let rejection get in his way. I feel for you, I really do cause I have been there personally, but YOU yourself have to come to grips with yourself and tell yourself that there ARE women out there that would love to be in a relationship with yourself....and thats the hope you should hang on to...not the false hope that one day this girl may want you more than just a friend....because you are probably more likely to win the lotto than for her to want you in a serious relationship ....sorry for being a bit harsh on you but I have seen many people here tell you like it is and yet you still seem to ignore everyones advice because your are thinking too much with your heart and not using your brain....You really need a guy friend to smack you a couple times in the head to help clear your mind

[CamGuy]

Camguy: what did you do to make the transition? Did you slowly edge toward a physical move? Or did you tell her in words first then got it agreed to logically before you went for it?

 

It is so hard while you are still in friendzone to move it toward a physical thing, there are times I feel so much pull inside to put my head on her shoulder and cuddle her but I couldn't just be so forward as I think she would be shocked by the move.... how did you do it?

 

Well, the important thing to note is neither one of us was SEARCHING for it. It just happened. Bascially, I started to notice that I was hanging with this "friend" of mine an awful lot. Most of the times, it was just me and her at bars, or eating at restauraunts, etc. When I moved from the apartment, we got a lot closer because I moved to a different city.

 

I came and saw her, and she came and saw me, and I was thinking how weird it was that I was investing so much time in this "friendship" and we were just friends. Honestly monsieur, when I first began to feel something MORE for her, I supressed it. She is actually the one that caved and told me how she felt. But it was me who made the first move.

 

To make sure what I felt was real. I was with her at a bar listening to band we both liked. We were both a little drunk, which is why I think I was able to do this. But when the band was done playing, I followed her to the restroom / rest area of the bar, and I grabed her and kissed her. I needed to make sure I felt this. I needed to make sure it was right. and it was. I dotn regret taking our friendship to the next level, because in all honesty, it was already at THE NEXT LEVEL. Infact, after we started dating, the only thing that changed was that we had a physical relationship in addition to an emotional one.

 

I would take strong notice of how you and this "friend" of yours act around one another. If you hang with her alot, and talk to her alot, and it is usually just the two of you doing thigns together. ASk yourself those very same questions. Why are we always doing things together? Why are neither of us dating anyone seriously? Why do we talk all the freakin time?

 

 

Chances are, if you guys are doing these things, there is a romantic connection.....but accepting it is the hard part. It sounds like you have, but has she?

[mystik]

 

Chances are, if you guys are doing these things, there is a romantic connection.....but accepting it is the hard part. It sounds like you have, but has she?

 

I would be wary about this. For Camguy, he already knew, because like he said, she said something first.

 

If a girl hasn't said anything, asking yourself all those questions doesn't mean anything. Girls just like having guy friends, specifically, platonic guy friends. It's just the way of life. I go out with a few of the same guy friends all the time, alone. We go shopping, we go see movies, go for lunch, run some random errands together, etc. It doesn't mean I have romantic feelings for any of them, it simply means I enjoy their company, just as I do with my female friends.

 

Just because people hang out together, it doesn't mean there is a "romantic connection." It is not a matter of you 'accepting' that idea, and waiting for her to 'accept' it. It doesn't work that way. She either feels it, or she doesn't, there may be nothing there for her to accept. Camguy didn't have a "secret to success" of making it work, she already told him she had feelings for him, she told him, and he acted on it.

 

P/S I guess I'm shallow too

[CarnelianButterfly]

P/S I guess I'm shallow too

 

I'll be shallow right along with you

[CamGuy]

This is true, she did tell me first. But I had feelings for her before she told me. And I wasnt sure to act on them or not. But my point is simple. I know for women it "SEEMS" normal and just fine to hang out, repeatedly, alone with a guy friend of theirs. Rather its shopping, or going to movies, or lunches, etc......women should not be freaked out or upset if this guy attempts a move, or tries to bring the relationship to a romantic level. Especially if the guy and the girl are both single. I think those a very good questions to ask.

[Omni-I]

..........

 

By the way, have you ever thought that the guy genuinly just like the girl and if she already taken at least he could learn from and teach some couple stuffs to her? I mean yes we can be charmed, but the difference between a "friend" and a "girlfriend" would be just having someone to talk to, confide yourself to on matters you wouldnt be able to talk to others guys. She is someone that could really enrich in a healthy way a man's life without the sex. Plus if she is the kind of woman hed want to be with, she could help him find one available. So its all in fun and growth.

 

Women really annoys the hell outta me, specially in occidental cultures. They suspect every men is a creap and just want to jump on them. Just mind you, WE got standards.

[mystik]

This is true, she did tell me first. But I had feelings for her before she told me. And I wasnt sure to act on them or not. But my point is simple. I know for women it "SEEMS" normal and just fine to hang out, repeatedly, alone with a guy friend of theirs. Rather its shopping, or going to movies, or lunches, etc......women should not be freaked out or upset if this guy attempts a move, or tries to bring the relationship to a romantic level. Especially if the guy and the girl are both single. I think those a very good questions to ask.

 

Every single guy friend of mine finds it normal too. None of them have tried to jump me in the last five years, in fact, all of them have a few female friends who they hang out with one on one too. Don't even give me that "you must unattractive" crap now.

 

I don't know why it is so difficult for some of you to comprehend that people can just be friends. Simple as that. You know, now that I look back on it, I've noticed a trend. The only times I have had guy friends ask me out romantically are the ones who a) only recently begun hanging out with (few weeks, few months) and more importantly b) guys who are quieter, shyer, have fewer friends in general, and definitely not alpha-males. Those few times I have not been interested and after telling them, they don't seem to get the hint. I'll continue hanging out just as friends and they will subtly or ouvertly push for more, and in the end I'll just give up their friendship altogether. Because frankly, why should I stay friends with someone who makes me feel uncomfortable because he won't accept and respect my decision? I did not freak out or get uncomfortable because they fell for me, I only felt that way after they were told "no" and still pursued.

 

I don't know, maybe more outgoing and confident guys are less likely to believe there is a "romantic connection" simply because a girl is being nice to him. Maybe the alpha male is able to understand that girls have plenty of guy friends, find it normal, and are cool with it. This may be a big generalization on my part but the only explanation I can come up withis this:

 

the non-alpha males, or males who are more outgoing, confident, louder in general, do not have as many female friends, and thereforeeee, when they do get one who is extraordinary nice to them (even if they act the same way with EVERYONE else) they are more likely to mistake it for more. This is a theory, let me know what you think?

 

Seriously though, if there's anything you've learned from this thread, it should be that girls just like having guy friends they feel nothing for. Give it up, accept that, and you'll end up with fewer heartaches of "what ifs." You cant change how it is, so why not go with that instead of hoping for me. Its your relentless persistence that's pissing women off, so maybe you should just stop it and go for someone who wants more than friendship.

[mystik]

..........

 

By the way, have you ever thought that the guy genuinly just like the girl and if she already taken at least he could learn from and teach some couple stuffs to her? I mean yes we can be charmed, but the difference between a "friend" and a "girlfriend" would be just having someone to talk to, confide yourself to on matters you wouldnt be able to talk to others guys. She is someone that could really enrich in a healthy way a man's life without the sex. Plus if she is the kind of woman hed want to be with, she could help him find one available. So its all in fun and growth.

 

Women really annoys the hell outta me, specially in occidental cultures. They suspect every men is a creap and just want to jump on them. Just mind you, WE got standards.

 

What? Yeah we DID consider that - we KNOW that a guy can just be friends and want nothing more - that was the whole POINT.

 

And really, you've got standards? From what I get from the other posters, any semi-attractive woman who has a nice personality will do. If not for a relationship, at least for a good screw.

[xprincessbugx]

I've been in the same situation. Every guy friend I've ever had has either liked me or I've dated lol. My boyfriend that I have now has stated that I just can't have guyfriends b.c. they all end up liking me and hitting on me which makes him uncomfortable and does nothing but makes him mad. It seems that when I do have guy friends it just complicates everything else... Just my experience though.

[Omni-I]

What? Yeah we DID consider that - we KNOW that a guy can just be friends and want nothing more - that was the whole POINT.

 

And really, you've got standards? From what I get from the other posters, any semi-attractive woman who has a nice personality will do. If not for a relationship, at least for a good screw.

 

 

And, sorry, but there was 170 post, i didnt look all of them hehe maybe forum went differently near the end.

 

Well there is a difference between jumping on women and being open to the opportunity. Afterall we are men. If she wants to do it, then we do it. (Its still standards, though lower for a screw like you said) Though most of us (well id like to think so) do not force this over women. If women liked sex as much as men do, they screw a guy who is semi-attractive also. But i think they would be too cold to that lol.

[Liam Weic]

AFTER all i've read through these so far 175 posts...

 

i've established that nothing is concrete.

 

theres always exceptions to every "rule" people have posted

 

yes its possible fora m/f JUST FRIENDS relationship

and yes it is also possible for either of em to want more.

 

in either case...i don't think its their FAULT for developing feelings, you really can't help it. Most of us would relish the idea of being able to turn off emotions at the flip of a switch. but its not that way.

 

friendships can and usually will be ruined if one party does come out with their feelings, and I would rather (and i did) chance it and "go for the gold" so to speak, as opposed to wonder the rest of my life and/or watch her just marry some other guy and never be with her.

 

I personally have just about as many guy friends as i do girl friends...and well...i do like what was described by someone before...i treat the girls just as equally as i do the guys...(ie name calling, not being polite most of the time, telling to "get **** themselves" lol)..

 

its when you do start acting nice that people start getting signals. because honestly flirting is different for most people.

 

People that aren't used to op-sex attention are bound to start feeling more for those that are nice to them.

[tmp0620]

Alright, I'm going to have to be honest here.

 

I just said relying on a "spark" is shallow because I'm bitter (I didn't realize it was because I was bitter when I wrote it but looking back...). Sometimes emotion just overwhelms my thought process.

 

Guys experience that spark too.

[Liam Weic]

oh definatley we do, iron lion...

 

most experience that same spark very well...

 

i could easily find myself not attracted to a good looking girl that didn't feel right to me. whether it be her personality, her beliefs...or what not.

[CamGuy]

Every single guy friend of mine finds it normal too. None of them have tried to jump me in the last five years, in fact, all of them have a few female friends who they hang out with one on one too. Don't even give me that "you must unattractive" crap now.

 

.

 

OK, I think you missed my point. I never said it was IMPOSSIBLE for two attractive members of the opposite sex to "Just be Friends". It is very possible. And trust, the advantage women get is having platonic male friends. Guys operate on a different wave length. If I am a single guy, and I meet a single attractive girl, chances are, I am not seeking friendship, but something more. Guys arent as dumb as you think we are. If the girl I am advancing towards is showing no receptive signs of mutual interest, then I will back off, because I know there are other fish in the sea who are willing to be with me. If the girl happens to be cool, and I like hanging with her....I may settle for being just friends, but I will make sure not to be VERY CLOSE TO HER, and have her be the center of my attention. (plenty of needy nice guys do this, hoping that the girl will eventually see them differently, and have a change of heart).

 

However, if I remain friends with an attractive girl....as long as I am single, and she is single....I most likely would always be willing to sleep with her. Thats just the way it is. That is why I tend to be friends with women I am not attracted to. So that there is no SEXUAL AGENDA between us, and I can be REAL friend.

 

Sure, many women have lots of guy friends, if you are a good lookin girl, and your guy friends ARE SINGLE, there is a good chance most of them, (if not all of them) would take it to another level if you propositioned them.

 

Again, I dont make the rules, i just play by them.

[monsieur]

Cam Guy I really appreciate your wisdom.

 

for an update on my situation, the 'friend' that I pissed off by telling her I was hoping for more called me and invited me over today where she cooked for me and we went for a long walk... it was her idea! I am more smitten than ever of course, this girl really really does it all in my heart... but I am still thinking she is just wanting to be good friends, but at least she doesn't hate me anymore.

[tmp0620]

Monsieur

 

I'm very happy for you, and I think you might have a chance with this girl. DON'T get your hopes up of course cause I don't know your situation, BUT she MIGHT be coming around. Best of luck to you, and if she's NOT coming aruond, then may you both have a long, good, close friendship.

[OceanEyes]

Well there is a difference between jumping on women and being open to the opportunity. Afterall we are men. If she wants to do it, then we do it. (Its still standards, though lower for a screw like you said) Though most of us (well id like to think so) do not force this over women. If women liked sex as much as men do, they screw a guy who is semi-attractive also. But i think they would be too cold to that lol.

 

If women liked sex as much as men? Wow. I wasn't aware that we didn't. In fact, I've been in relationships where I was more of the aggressor. Try not to generalize - it's never a good thing.

 

I can't speak for all women, but what I DO know about myself, is that this whole "we can't be friends because I might start liking you" stuff is borrrrrring. Moving on!

 

In any event, I have a plan: I am going to develop a totally hostile attitude with every man I meet except for ones that are wildly attractive. Total ball-buster. Just to avoid situations like this. I'm looking forward to my new role in society, wish me luck!

[CarnelianButterfly]

OceanEyes, I totally concur.

Men think its rough now, wonder how they'd like it knowing they only get talked to because we just want to do them. They might like it for a while, but it won't be so fun after the find out how lonely its going to be when the girls stop talking to them.