Is it just me or is this messed up?

[SlipperySammy]

As I posted earlier my girlfriend is out of town on business for three weeks. (We live togethor.)

 

She came home for the afternoon today after I hadn't seen her in 7 days (last sunday for the afternoon) and I hadn't seen her for the 7 days prior to that. I wanted our day to be special so I made sure the apartment was cleaned...I had been tanning working out etc...I also was wearing her favorite jeans/shirt, clean shavin etc....I was excited to see her and I missed her so I wanted our afternoon togethor to be special.

 

Any way she comes home and we kiss for a few minutes, and then she says she wants to get food, so we went and got dinner. We came home and laid in bed and watched tv etc...Becasue of our past problems I am not very quick to initiate I usaully wait fo some sort of 'sign' to start somthing sexually, well ofcourse no 'sign' and I started to kiss her her and touch her a little, but no reciprocation. Time came for her to go back and and I just felt baffled. Who does that? What kind of relationship am I in? Is it just me or does it make no sense to not see your boyfriend in two weeks and make no allussion, attempt, or any thing toward sex. I can't wrap my mind around it. It just makes no sense...I am speechless.

[nsbguy32169]

That's not how women think. I'm in a long distance relationship where me and my gf only see each other about once every 3 weeks. The first thing on my mind when i see her is ripping those tight little shorts off and screwing her brains out... Her first thought, however is just being in my arms and talking until we fall asleep. Women just work different... cause they're weird

[SlipperySammy]

Fair enough...so you saying in general most women wouldn't think about sex in this situation...the whole day? They havn't seen thier signifigant other in two weeks, and it wouldn't cross there mind laying togethor in bed?

 

I find it hard to believe and understand if this is true...but I can only look at the situation through my persepctive.

[onix88]

well im in a ldr too and whenever i get to see my g/f all she wants to do is have sex, then cuddle later. i think you need to have a talk with her, your communication is lacking

[cichlid]

As long she still shows she still loves you I wouldn't worry. Women do think differently than men. She probably wasn't in the mood. Sometimes I'm not in the mood to make out (still a virgin) and my BF just doesn't understand that sometimes I just don't want to. He'll kiss my neck, play with my tummy all the while I'm like k? It frustrates him. LOL! Maybe it's the same way with your GF.

[nsbguy32169]

Other than those lucky few women gifted with overly active sex drives I think I'm safe to assume that most women think that way. After not seeing their significant other for days, weeks or months they just want to spend time with them doing the simple things they miss, i.e. watching tv, eating out, talking, etc... It's the little things that they miss doing face to face...

 

I used to always bring that up about how can she go 3 days being around me after not seeing each other for 3 weeks and NOT want to have sex. It drove me crazy until I just accpeted th fact that women are weird (lol jk ladies) and they just work different.

[xmrth]

Is everything generally okay in the relationship? Does she usually act that way at all when she's trying to tell you something without words? How about the conversations over the phone during the time spent apart-- did it sound like things weren't right?

I always want to be intimate with my boyfriend no matter how long it's been-- but that's just me. Girl friends I know say all they want to do is cuddle or they hate it when their boyfriends want sex and things like that. I think there's a wide variety of what women may want, but it all really depends on what you gather from how SHE is. It could also be situational.

Try to fit this in with how she's acted prior to this... as in, is this typical when you've spent some time apart, even if this is the longest ever?

[apollocreed71]

Is she always that way. If she usually returns the sexuality, then i would be questioning it in my mind. but if she is not normally very sexual, then it is normal, and i would not worry too much about it.

[ShySoul]

Sex isn't what the relationsip is about, its the love. If you can't see each other much, what you miss isn't sex. Ok, you miss it but thats not what you miss most. What you miss is simple to be with the person. Just being together, holding each other, sweet and passionate kisses... that's what you want most. When you can't see the one you love, that is what you want... to see and be with them.

[nsbguy32169]

Sex isn't what the relationsip is about, its the love. If you can't see each other much, what you miss isn't sex. Ok, you miss it but thats not what you miss most. What you miss is simple to be with the person. Just being together, holding each other, sweet and passionate kisses... that's what you want most. When you can't see the one you love, that is what you want... to see and be with them.

 

Good way of putting it... I always miss the little things about my gf, but as soon as I see her I realize how lucky I am to have someone so beautiful and then the guy downstairs realizes it too...

[SlipperySammy]

I think I feel rejected more then any thing. It isn't that I wanted sex the most out of the day...of course I just wanted to see her, and kiss her and spend time with her, I love her. For me it was just that when it came time for her to leave and I thought about how she had no interest the whole day and that I imagine that in any other healthy loving relationship at some point during the day some sort of sexual activity would have taken place between the two....I get to thinking it is messed up.

 

To answer other questions: Yes we have a history of sex problems in terms of her having a low libido, and hang ups about sex but we have been doing alot better the last few months, but hte baggage of our problems is still with both of us.

[SlipperySammy]

A few months ago we were talking about our problems and it came up that she felt liek she really never knew what I wanted, and that impeded her ability to be a good lover. She explained since she was not very experienced when we met, and she never really paid much attention to what to do during sex she never had confidence during sex to be a good lover.

 

This made sense to me and made me feel a little better. Ofcourse I had told her things in the past like, "It would be nice if you would initiate" but she said that was to vague she needed specifics and that she really wan't sure how to initiate sex. We talked for a while more and I told her things that I migth specificaly like, or specific acts of initation. I explained coming up to me when I least expected it and kising me or touching me in sexual way was a way to initiate, and I also explained the difference beween sexual and non-sexual touches and that touching me more sexually would be a good way to initiate. After I explained these things she seemd happy...she told me it was kind og embaressing for her not to 'know' these things already, but she was excited to have every thing out in the open and that she wouldn't be nervouse. . Every thing felt really good afer that in that in teh terms that things would get better.

 

To this day (at least 8-9 weeks from that converstation) She has not done one of the things we talked about in the heart-heart converstation. THese are not strange or weird acts...the things I explained to her were, "Some time when I am not expecting it touch me sexually and kiss me." or maybe "come up behind me when I am in teh kitchen or somthing...and run your hands up in my shirt, and maybe down into my pants" Basic things like this...ways of initiating sex that make me feel like she might want me.

 

In the three years we have dated she has neve done such an act to me NEVER. Two months ago when I clearly defined these things to her specificaly she seemd relevied because now she knew what I meant when I was saying "why don't you initiate." But in the end she still does nothing.

[ShySoul]

SlipperySammy,

 

This incident was something that you should have expected as it's one example of a larger issue you have been struggling with. You have a high sex drive and are expecting her to have the same. However, she isn't like that. You are expecting her to be something she isn't. Then you get upset with her when she fails to be the person you wish she was.

 

You talked it over, yet things did not change. I'm wondering if you ever actually got to why she is this way. Does it have anything to do with how she was raised? She said she was embarrassed about her lack of experience and didn't have confidence in her abilities. Someone with a lack of confidence, even though you told her what you want her to do, isn't likely to do it. She's still going to be scared of messing up. If you want to work on it, you are going to have to take time with it. When things are intimate, suggest things she could try. Keep telling her how good of a lover she is. Find ways of letting her know how much you care for her and want her. She doesn't need someone to tell her to do more sexual things, she needs someone who will comfort her and let her know how good she is.

 

Her personality is not one that is going to be aggressive in starting sexual acts. You have to ask yourself, is your love strong enough that you are willing to accept who she is in this regard and love her still. Or is this that vital to you?

[SlipperySammy]

Shysoul I think that is a great post and I agree.

 

I have trouble coming to terms with what you refer to as 'aggressive in starting sexual acts'

 

When a girl NEVER iniates it sends a message that she doesn't enjoy sex...and that she doesn't want it. It makes any guy feel like crap. We were reading an artical in Cosmo about the how if a girl doesn't ever initiate how bad it makes the guy feel. I clearly explained this is how I felt among many other conversations, but this time she could read it in print and is still did nothing.

 

'aggressive in starting sexual acts' might be an over statement considering that in teh three years we have been together she has initiated twice. TWICE!

 

I agree with you on the rest of your post, and I am sure I am taking the wrong approach that is why I am posting here what am I supposed to do ask my guy friends? I need some where to talk. Imagine me at the bar..."yeah hey guys my girlfriend wont ever have sex with me what should I do?" Can you imagien that. I am left with no one to talk to.

[SlipperySammy]

I am also not sure that I agree that I have a 'high' libido. I am easily satisfied with reciprocating sex (both into it and decent passion,) 1.5 times a week. I say 1.5 because I don't like gettign into the one time a week routine...I like at least for the option for a second time to be there.

 

I don't think wanting sex 1.5 times a week at 23 as a healthy athletic male living with his healthy athletic 23 year old girlfrind is considered a high libido.

[Vert]

Good way of putting it... I always miss the little things about my gf, but as soon as I see her I realize how lucky I am to have someone so beautiful and then the guy downstairs realizes it too...

 

Zing!

[RayKay]

Hey Sammy,

 

Well, you already know for most part how I feel about this, but in relation to this particular post...

 

I would disagree that she was this way "just because she is female" and they think differently. If I have not seen my partner in two weeks, sure I have thought about sex, and yes, when I am reunited I would love to spend some time together talking and holding one another, but at some point, I also am looking forward to the sexual intimacy. And it is not even that SHE had to initiate - YOU initiated and she still rejected it.

 

I am most concerned that even after your talks...NOTHING has changed despite her apparent promises to work on these issues together. It's not in my opinion just about her "not being confident" in initiating, because even when YOU DO initiate, what happens? She seems to reject it, right? So what is the excuse then?

 

I DON'T think you have an unnaturally high sex drive, because the fact is right now you are VERY rarely even having any, so of course you want more than that right now!

 

I am sorry Sammy, but thinks do NOT seem to be resolving themselves, and you REALLY need to make a decision here. Either you determine this IS acceptable for you for the rest of your life (as at this point, with all this talking, etc, her non desire to seek help about this issue either medically or therapeutically, and so forth you need to operate on basis things are not going to change) and let it go. OR you determine this component IS important to you...not everything, but that it is not worth sacrificing an intimate, sexual relationship with the person you love for the rest of your life, and you make some big decisions.

 

It's not just about sex, it's not just about you wanting sex and being more aroused then she is, at this point it is about you feeling rejected, it's about that big part in your life together missing - and while sometimes sex changes, and there are medical reasons and so forth that things need to change - it is her lack of even seeming to realize how important this IS and working on it, that is the major issue here.

[Vert]

I have to agree with Raykay here... Too often men are guilted into believing they have an overkill of a sex drive, but in your case I'd say you're really getting the short end of the stick. A woman desires intimacy through feeling valuable, comforted, and secure with her man. A man desires intimacy through sexual means, and when both parties are meeting each other's desires/needs then things work out great. There are women that believe that sex isn't necessary to feel love in a relationship but that's because they are wired differently than men are. Many women want to have sex, but do not equate it with the desire to feel loved. Men, on the other hand, do equate it as such.

 

Anyway, as Raykay was saying, you need to make a choice here and now. If your gf is going to be witholding on you for physical intimacy at a time when you desire it (and it's not like you're desiring her every 5 minutes) claiming that it isn't necessary then you have to decide soon what you plan to do. As I've said before with other posts, people DO NOT change like that. This kind of behavior is always ingrained and mental especially with women when it comes to sexual desire. She is not going to change this pattern even if you two get married and live together one day. She will always view love and intimacy as something that doesn't require her to have sex, and in that she is being selfish and irresponsible to you.

[ShySoul]

When a girl NEVER iniates it sends a message that she doesn't enjoy sex...and that she doesn't want it. It makes any guy feel like crap.

 

Question: When you do have sex with you initiating, does she enjoy? Just because she is extremely uncomfortable starting it, doesn't mean she doesn't enjoy it or that she doesn't love you as much as you love her. Her personality is just vastly different in this regards. Again, I have to wonder how she was raised. Maybe she was taught that the man should initiate it. Or maybe she thinks its unladylike or something. Or maybe she is extremely shy and self conscious about her body. Or did something happen to her that makes her afriad of that kind of intimacy? Yes, she may not start sex or physical contact. But think of the rest of the relationship. I am certain she shows you how much she loves you in many other ways.

 

It's not in my opinion just about her "not being confident" in initiating, because even when YOU DO initiate, what happens? She seems to reject it, right? So what is the excuse then?

 

It could be anything. And it may not be an excuse, but a valid fear that she has. People often have very deep rooted fears and hangups that prevent them from doing something. That is why he needs to get over the initial hurt and sorrow of what he views as rejection (and I understand the feelings and know it must hurt deeply), and focus on the root of the issue. Getting upset with her over not having sex doesn't help. Instead he should seriously talk with her about it. If she hasn't tried yet after months, this may be a very deep rooted issue that she herself is unsure of or afraid of admitting to.

 

If asking for sex isn't working, have you turned up the romance? Have you worked with her to find out what makes HER aroused? Have you, probably while cuddling, found out what her fantasy is, what gets her going? Then make that fantasy a reality.

 

As for a guy feeling rejected, maybe she feels rejected. Maybe she feels like she has to be that girl from Cosmo even when she isn't like that or is afraid of being like that.

 

You do have to choose. Do you honestly love this women? Do you love her as she is? Are you willing to help her through these issues. Or do you need sex so much that you are willing to dump her? If you aren't willing to accept her and work with her, if this is such a huge problem for you, then its best she knows so that she can find someone who is willing to love the person she is and not let something small like sex get in the way.

[RayKay]

Shy - this has been an issue with them for many many months, and Sammy has talked with her about it on many times - honestly, compassionately and openly.

 

I really don't think it is fair to put it in such terms as "if you love her you will work through it without her" because honestly if she loves HIM, should she not also be held to those same standards? Why is HER needs instantly more important then his? She DOES know it is a problem for him, she promises changes, she promises working through them and then fails to meet those promises. He has asked her about fantasies about what she enjoys, she claims to have none, she claims to not be interested in sex.

 

It is not an issue of him "getting over his rejected feelings" - I think that is highly unfair too - is it not when we love a partner, we love them wholly - he does love her, he has been patient through months of this, but it is starting to make HIM feel less loved, less appreciated, less "loved wholly".

 

For the umpteenth time - it's not JUST about sex. And it is really unfair to insinuate that if he WERE to decide enough is enough, that he is being shallow and selfish for also realizing that he does see having an intimate, sexual relationship with the woman he loves is IMPORTANT to him.

[ShySoul]

What is it that we, as human beings, truly "need." We have all agreed that it isn't an issue of sex, it is an issue of feeling desired. If that can be fulfilled in other ways, then is it absolutely vital that she starts to initate sexual contact more? If two people are dedicated to making things work, if their love is that strong, then they can find ways around it.

 

I asked him to examine the rest of the relationship. Just because she doesn't do this thing, does not mean that she isn't showing that she desires him in other ways. Perhaps she is a very unsexual person who is better adapt at showing love and affection through other means. Both parties need to bend. Relationships are about compromise. I've never claimed that she is innocent or that she couldn't make more effort. But since she isn't posting, I can't really advise her on what to do. So I am suggesting ways in which he can bend. And one way to do that is to not put the focus on the bedroom being the place where she shows she loves him, but to look at the whole picture and find the times when she does she loves him.

 

If I was in a relationship, I wouldn't need her to initate sex to know how she desires me. I wouldn't need sex period. And it's not because I have a low sex drive, I have the same... ahem... "needs" as anyone else. But I recognize the higher need of being loved. And I know that this need can be fulfilled in so many other ways. If he looks at the relationship, he just may find more of these signs then he is aware of right now.

 

For the upteenth time.... of course its not about sex. As I have stated repeatedly, sex is but a physical act for something that goes to the very essense of ourselves and into our souls. If we agree that is true, then why focus on getting her to initate sex? She's demonstrated that for some reason that this is hard on her. So if we shift focus and look at how else to feel that deep connection that is what sex is about anyways, maybe it will help her to open up. Sometimes you need to get away from what you are looking at and shift focus. If you find another way of sharing that connection and feeling of desire, then you can gradually turn it up in the sex area as well should both sides be ready.

 

Also, we know that she admits to their being a problem, that she wants to change, that she says she doesn't have much interest in sex. So she knows there is a problem. But nothing can be done until we know why the problem exists. I can say that I have a drinking problem, but until I address the issue of why I go and drink, problem won't get better. Same here. That's why I said to look at her life. I don't know her so I can't say for sure. But did something happen to her in the past? Was she raised with strict views on sex? Is her porsonality one so that she is afraid or insecure about herself and trying new things?

 

Just saying that she has a problem and expecting her to fix it doesn't do any good. Getting upset with her and saying she needs to change doesn't do any good. It has to be a mutual effort that addresses what is really at play here. I see Sam concerned with how he feels rejected. He has that right. But she has feelings too and I'm trying to get Sam to see those feelings, to put himself in her shoes. Understand why she is like this instead of just being frustrated that she is and thinking about his "needs."

[SlipperySammy]

Here is an email I sent her today about the issue. And I would also like to thank any one responding here it is really theraputic for me (no matter what you opinion is.), like I said earlier I have no on to talk to about this, it isn't like I can ask my buddies at the bar what they think.

 

Email:

 

"When can you deal with fighting with me? If you were here you wouldn't do or say any thing but cry. Addressing this issue has been like dealing with a brick wall...it won't talk to me or budge an inch.

 

All of your body language and actions tell me that you don't want me... so what else am I to do or say? You said on Sunday "I screwed up." If Sunday was an isolated incident it would be normal and nothing would have happened, but all you do is send the message to me that you are not interested in me day in and day out. So it isn't a matter of 'screwing up' it is a matter of who you are...it is who you are so why should I expect you to change...but in turn why should I be happy?

 

Try and follow this analogy:

 

Our sex life is like forcing you to eat at Arbys with me, when you know I'll get mad if you say you don't like it or don't want to eat there. You would never volunteer to eat there but if I asked you to, you would grudgingly except...you also might avoid driving by there out of fear of me wanting to go there... or if I brought it up you might try and think of a better place to eat to get out of it. So even if I asked "do you like eating at arbys?" and you might say "yes," but I would still know you didn't like arbys Because you always avoided it...NEVER volunteered to go there and if we did go there you would only get a minimum amount of food and try and get it over with as quick as possible so that you could go on with your day. I mean you couldn't hide from me that you don't like arbys…you actions would be clear.

 

The messages you send about sex crush me to the point they make me cry just thinking about being stuck in a relationship for the rest of my life feeling so rejected and confused.

 

I have asked you to initiate with me since the fall of 2003 and we have fought countless times over this, yet you refuse to do it, try it, or even talk about it. *We tried discussing this a few weeks ago, (the discussion were you wanted specifics examples) We had to end the conversation early for some reason and I tried to keep bringing it up but you told me several times you didn't want to talk about, or you would talk about it later. I proposed the game where I tell you five things I might like and you would then tell me five things you would like…but that went no where and the few things I did tell you never did happen.

 

In the conversation we had I gave you some specific examples of things that might make me feel less rejected, and one of them was if you would take initiative in buying the spermicide and astroglide...I tried to explain how this might send a message to me that you were interested and cared about the issue. After the conversation I waited a week to see if you might buy this product or mention to me "hey lets go buy that stuff." You never did and I had to bring it up and almost twist your arm to go and buy it. Even that day you kept trying to put of using it until later...these are all messages that you send that you are avoiding sex and that you don't want me and they crush me a day at a time.

 

During that conversation I also told you a few other things, like touching me sexually, kissing me, wearing sexy underwear to initiate sex, and being more aggressive in the terms of just coming up to me and unbuttoning my pants and touching me or something along those lines. You never did any of those things...or even close to them. The closest thing to initiating was one night you came home from the bar and put my hand on you as a message you might be interested....(this was very nice but this 'positive message' is overshadowed by the dozens of negative messages.)

 

I fantasize about a girlfriend who will initiate sex, be sexual in nature, be playful and relaxed in the bedroom, one who will reciprocate sexually, spend time pleasing me and let me spend time pleasing her. A girlfriend who will surprise me with sex and be genuinely happy and satisfied with sex. But from your own admission you have no sexual fantasies and have a 'whatever' and play it cool attitude that sends nothing but the message to me you could care less about sex. And even after I have begged you a pleaded with you to try some of these things…or even talk about them… you absolutely refuse. I don't know if it is your selfishness, inexperience, lack of love for me, lack of libido, anxiety? Or god knows what…I can't guess any more.

 

Sunday was meaningless as an event by itself but among many others it was heartbreaking and crushing.

 

I resent our love life, and it makes it almost impossible to reciprocate my love back to you like you deserve. I am to the point where I see girls at school and I know there is some one out there who will make love to me and be interested in me in a sexual manner, but I think to myself I don't want any other girls…I want you to make love to me and be interested in me in a sexual manner…but I know this will never happen.

 

This all leaves me feeling hopeless and in a dark place."

[SlipperySammy]

PS I always claim that I am not asking for much...and re-reading the email I noticed I mentioned I wanted her to wear sexy underweaar or somthing...its not like I want her to even go out and buy any thing...she actually has several pairs of stuff from victoria secret she used to wear, but I havn't seen them in atleast a year.

[nsbguy32169]

That's prety damn straightforward and to the point... keep us posted on what happens

[ShySoul]

I fantasize about a girlfriend who will initiate sex, be sexual in nature, be playful and relaxed in the bedroom, one who will reciprocate sexually, spend time pleasing me and let me spend time pleasing her.

 

That's not here. It isn't fair to her to expect her to be that fantasy girl. Love her for who she is, not what you want her to be.

 

I don’t know if it is your selfishness, inexperience, lack of love for me, lack of libido, anxiety? Or god knows what…I can’t guess any more.

 

We already know that she has low confidence in this regard. Insinuating that she is selfish, bringing up her lack of experience (something she told you bothers her), insinuating that she doesn't love you.... none of this is going to make her feel any better or more comfortable sharing that part of her with you. It's going to make her more scared of opening up sexually and hurt her self esteem. At best she'll do it cause she is scared of losing you, and then she won't be enjoying it cause she'll feel forced into it. And ultimately you would feel guilty as well.

 

You've issued an ultimatum. And most people don't respond well to ultimatums.

 

When can you deal with fighting with me? If you were here you wouldn’t do or say any thing but cry.

 

From the very start you are engaging her in a confrontational tone. Most people aren't going to be receptive of that, particularly one with her personality.

 

In the conversation we had I gave you some specific examples of things that might make me feel less rejected, and one of them was if you would take initiative in buying the spermicide and astroglide

 

Sigh. You are basically saying there that you want her to do things she isn't comfortable of doing. When you said that, did you really expect her to do it? You are so focused on what you want, whatever the reason, that you aren't open to what she wants and needs. She could be saying she needs you in other ways, but you are so focused on this one issue that you would miss them. Honestly, I think it would be best to end things. She isn't living up to this fantasy girl image you want from her, so you aren't happy. And you don't understand what it is that she needs, so I don't think she is happy.