Please friends, I need your help!!! It's Danimal....

[danimal77]

Hi LoveyDovey,

 

Yeah, I haven't called her since I saw her yesterday morning at her place. We have plans for tomorrow night as you know. Beer at her place.

 

I was going to call her a little while ago to check in on her and her baby, seeing there was a Thunder and Lightning storm on our street, but I didn't.

 

I am waiting it out 2 full days, to show her I have SOME restraint. Hopefully, she will firstly answer the phone tomorrow and secondly, want to keep the plans. We'll see what happens. If she still keeps the plans with me then she may still be interested. Not sure after she spent the day with her bro yesterday. He's her only family in town and they are very close. Seeing I haven't heard from her since yesterday morning and seeing she called me 4 times on Sunday, well, it doesn't look great, but then again, she could be testing me too, to see when and if I call her now.

 

Thanks for your concern Lovey Dovey,

 

Danimal

[DN]

Think about this: everything you do about this situation is a decision that you are making. Whether you think about it for a long time or merely an instant - it is still a decision. And because of that you can control what you do.

 

You may not be able to entirely control what you feel or what you think although you can make decisions there as well. But what you do is entirely within your control.

 

If you pick up the phone and call her - it is because you decided to do that. If you resist - that is a decision as well. So, before you make those decisions, make sure you have properly thought out why you are doing whatever it is you are about to do.

[brando]

It isnt just about not calling her..it is about getting yourself together to have a conversation with her. If your still feeling a little hurt by her, a little insecure, then it is best not to call her and bring this stuff up.

 

I say call her tomorrow and see what time you guys are meeting up..you can also change the original time or place, just so you feel you have something more to convey other than just meeting up.

[danimal77]

The time is up for debate, but the place will ultimately be her place, seeing she has the baby and has not hired a sitter.

 

In any case, even though I wanted to call her today, I didn't and now my buddy is coming over in a few minutes. Haven't seen him in months. It will be good times.

 

I don't think me not having called her today hurt my chances. If anything it may have improved them.

 

Remember friends, this is not NC. NC is something entirely different. This is playing a bit hard to get right? Trying to redeem some of that craziness I exhibited less than 2 days ago.

 

Danimal

[danimal77]

Well, I got through the second night now and will be calling her tomorrow. I will try her around lunch I guess and I think that I will call her from a number she may not recognize, just so that I will reach her on the phone.

 

Just the fact that she hasn't called once since yesterday morning to say hi, kind of implies that she has backed off to a LARGE extent.

 

Will keep you all updated tomorrow, as to what happens.

 

Thanks again,

 

Dan

[benevolent]

I think that if you agree that you are far from healing, then perhaps this current relationship and any other for that matter should not be happening.

 

Unfortunately, this is exactly a reflection of where you are currently at because of how you reacted so wildly to something that hasn't even established itself into a mature relationship. The behavior you expressed can't be something that can just be written off as a tiny little misunderstanding. Rather, it was a warning sign that was shouting out "you are not ready for this yet". And you know what? That is perfectly okay, because there shouldn't be a time limit for when you should be.

 

I don't think anyone can truly establish a solid rapport and foundation with someone in only 5 dates. You are aware that there are phases to a relationship and that you are in this lust phase, correct? I think you just got caught up in a moment of passion, nay lust, and let that suck you into an emotional turmoil.

 

I tend to disagree somewhat on the confidence aspect because moving on and dating someone without healing yourself first is not a complete sign of confidence. It could very well mean that you are unable to deal with being alone and need to fill a void. If it were a truel lasting confidence one would've shrugged off this whole incident.

 

My concern is that I see warning signs that you may be oblivious to, as well as some key variables that are going to press on the relationship. I also think I'm seeing a reverting back to procedural methods and practices (i.e. games) that have no place here.

 

You say she "seems" exceptionally special so with that, have you asked yourself "do I really know her?" To say "seems" just triggers something in me that doesn't sit well.

 

Like I mentioned in my REMOVED post, her drug-induced past (present? future?) and your positive morals/values are always going to be in conflict with hers. Unless there is some compromise, which I highly doubt (and please don't give in to drugs), this is always going to be a sensitive subject on how she chooses to live her lifestyle versus how you want her to live it.

 

Her son is going to be the major component and all the baggage and factors from her limited freedom, single parenting, dealing with her ex, shared custody, visitation, the endless work and fatigue, etc. will affect you in so many different ways. Trust me on this one, I've been in similar relationships and it is not as easy as saying "oh I can handle this".

 

Many people want to final product and not the while it's still in the process of being produced.

 

Translation: a lot of time and patience is required for this and I think this where you are lacking.

 

Finally, while you're advice may have helped others, there are many on here who have helped countless people, countless times. And it is a great thing that you are going through a learning process via trial and error. Keep in mind, however, that there are many others that have already gone through and lived this and perhaps have a greater wisdom than you think. I know I have my share of experience and the people that I've helped, supported and motivated can attest to that.

[kate111]

First of all D'animal, congrats on giving up on your exgirlfriend. Good for you.

 

Re Drugs issue:

 

You have different opinions on drugs. This may or may not be an issue in the future. She says she hasn't even taken them lately so they may not even BE an issue. But please don't think that by screaming and yelling that you will CHANGE her opinion. Because it is unlikely that you will change this aspect of her, so you will just have to learn to live with it or else find somebody else who shares your opinion.

 

In other words...perhaps you should take this difference in opinion as a potential mismatch or clash in personalities.

 

5 dates is not alot. You don't even know this woman yet. You cannot begin to understand somebody until you have experienced a number of situations and time with them. So I think you should try to hold back your feelings until you know that you guys even have a future together.

 

Her "psycho alert" has no doubt flashed at your behaviour. To be honest I am very surprised that she is even giving you a second chance.

 

I think you should be more than happy at the "friends" situation for the time being. What this girl means when she says "friends" is that she wants to get some distance from you as she is suspicious of you now. She is not sure you are somebody she wants as a boyfriend.

 

No amount of calling her or obsessing is going to convince her that you are boyfriend material. What WILL convince her is respecting the boundaries she has set you and being a loyal and trustworthy person. Be stable and nice and kind. Do not call her constantly. Once a week meeting for NOT MORE THAN 3 HOURS is the amount of time you should be spending with her at this stage.

 

Do not buy the kid a toy or she will be totally suspicious of you and the "psycho alert" will no doubt be chiming in her mind.

 

Good luck danimal.

[danimal77]

I recognize that I want to love again and have not been afraid of being alone these last 3+ months. In all actuality, I was just as alone while even with my ex. She deprived me of love and affection for so long and so I learned to nurture myself and have continued to be very independent with the women I have been dating since her and even with this new girl. I remained independent up until I exhibited an old pattern that had a lot to do with the way she had been treating me prior to the argument. She had not just been paying attention to me, but actually wanted to get to know the person behind the eyes. She was captivated by me and my past, but she didn't realize just how scarred it was.

 

I believe that she noticed in me that I was not ready for a relationship just yet either. She looked deep into my eyes last Friday and Saturday night and saw hurt, pain and anger. She saw fear. She verbalized all of this to me. She said that she saw strength, yet frailty all at the same time. She is very wise and deep and I am drawn to her mind and it doesn't hurt that she is a knock out too. When she gave me this healing body massage and told me that she was here to take away the pain and heal me, I just let go, plain and simple.

 

Now that her and I know how I can potentially react if she gives me emotional fulfillment of a very deep kind and then pulls away, is a sign that we can't jump into this blindly. She is intelligent and perceptive enough and strong enough for the both of us to slow it down, if not stop it. I do believe that she likes me and that WAS obvious, and so, would like to still see me as a friend and maybe that's just what I need. There is a connection there. I have no problems with taking it slowly. It may even be therapeutic. I have to learn to trust again, bottom line and yes, NO MORE games. I want to just be me and want to feel like I can, without fearing that I will be rejected in the process.

 

She doesn't seem to be special. She is special and it took me only a few minutes to feel this quite deeply. She has been off the drugs in over 27 months now and as I mentioned, there is NO ex. It was a one night stand and she has been raising her son completely on her own for the last year and a half. She has an older brother in the city and apparently 3 other friends (men) who help out every now and then. One being an ex of hers who she is still friends with and another an old friend and the third guy being someone she just met and then there's ME.

 

What's wrong with being patient and giving this time. We're neighbors after all.

 

I will admit that it felt good to let go again. It's been so long.

 

Wish me good luck for today everybody. Lets hope she still wants to get together tonight!

 

Danimal

[danimal77]

Hey Kate,

 

Nice to see you on here dear! So, you're advice was amazing and I have re-read it several times already. Your female perspective is as usual right on the money!

 

So, we can all hope that she will still want to see me tonight as she said she would. I have NOT called since Tuesday morning, so, I hope that helped alleviate the psycho warning she received, along with how I acted with her when we did have a chance to talk at her place on Tuesday morning. I just feel really comfortable with her. It's hard to explain...

 

Anyways, as it stands, I will be applying your advice to a tee!!! One phone call a week! I will try and keep our get together between 2-3 hours.

 

I wish I can erase what I did on Monday-Tuesday. Will be focussing more on those events, or the ones who lead her to be initially interested in me?

 

Thanks again,

 

Danimal

[kate111]

Good on you d'animal!

 

Relationships can not be rushed and this one will be healthier for both of you if you take your time.

 

If you are meant to be then you will end up together. Just because you find her physically attractive doesn't necessarily mean that you are a good match. You must give the relationship time to develop to work out whether you have any attraction other than physical lust.

 

I think a relationship with a lady with a strong friendship base rather than an intense passion base could be excellent for you.

 

I am currently in a relationship with a man and we are friends before we are anything else. We can talk to each other about anything, even embarrassing topics. We do not need to play so many games with each other. As I get older this type of relationship (rather than one of jealousy and intense highs and lows) is more important to me.

 

So take it easy. Be friends and play things by ear. Be yourself. After all you want her to love you for you. You also want to get to know here and find out how you feel about her as well.

 

If there is an attraction between you too then being frineds will not extinguish it but will make it stronger.

 

Sometimes it is good to wait.

 

Good luck

[danimal77]

Kate, it's important that I clarify this. This connection is not at all related to physical attraction. The physical aspect came second to the mental/spiritual one. As I wrote to another poster on here is that she also seemed to like me, being dark and deep and all. That didn't turn her off. In fact, she mentioned how it turned her on, how smart/serious/intellectual I am and even told her brother this on Sunday and invited me to meet him, however unfortunately she let him also know what happened on Monday/Tuesday and when they had plans on Tuesday afternoon, I wasn't invited that time I hope she didn't show him my note too. That was personal.

 

Anyways, she sensed that I have not fully recovered. She sensed that I was strong, yet frail at the same time. Well, the weak side was on full display on Monday late afternoon until Tuesday morning. I am not proud of how I reduced myself to that, especially after I thought THAT was out of my system, having had NO problem blowing off girls these last few months since the FINAL breakup.

 

She touched a chord in me last weekend. I seemed to touch one in her as well. I wouldn't call it lust persay. It was not that of a sexual nature, even though it was quite sensual. We just seemed to have an understanding, which was drawing her to me, BUT, after my stunt, she woke up from that hypnosis and saw her own warning sign I guess. Why she still wants to get together, I have NO idea??? Lets see if she really follows through with that.

 

Danimal

[kate111]

Hi Danimal,

 

Let me say this to you:

 

Perhaps I wasn't being as articulate as I could have been in my last post.

 

When I wrote "physical attraction" I meant "initial attraction".

 

When we first meet somebody sometimes there is a spark or connection. This is not just a physical attraction but is a kind of curiosity and excitement about finding out about the other person. A feeling that you are FULLY ALIVE when you are with them. A yearning when they are not there. A craving for more of them.

 

I am guessing you are feeling these things for this girl now.

 

These feelings are very intense at the very beginning of a relationship. They are the "initial attraction" feelings.

 

But the feelings do NOT mean you are necessarily destined to be together or that the feelings will last. I know this because I have experienced these "initial feelings" for people in the past and they have ended up being incompatible with me and I have "gone off them". The feelings have faded as I learned more about them.

 

You do not KNOW this girl. You do not know if you are compatible. Take things slow and you will let things develop and your true feelings about her (and hers for you) will emerge.

[danimal77]

Question for you Kate:

 

I stimulated her initially. She may have also found me attractive as well, and acted on those feelings. Now, after what she saw and what she didn't like, did this turn her off to the point that she no longer can see it progressing into more than friends? I mean, we kissed and the like, but if she said well, he will only be a friend from now on, because I don't like that other side of him and I don't think I am that compatible with that side in a relationship aspect, well, can she change her mind back, as fast as she changed it before? Does it take another positive incident to do that or a series of them? Also, how can we go from kissing to now just being buddies? Won't that set the precedence for the direction we will be going in and how she will ultimately end up seeing me: as only a friend, when she initially saw me as potentially more and acted on it, but is now singing a different tune and seems to be steadfast in her new found conviction?

 

This is confusing. I want to be myself tomorrow night, as I was on our first few dates. Is that even what tomorrow night is, a date?

 

Danimal

[benevolent]

These feelings are very intense at the very beginning of a relationship. They are the "initial attraction" feelings.

 

But the feelings do NOT mean you are necessarily destined to be together or that the feelings will last. I know this because I have experienced these "initial feelings" for people in the past and they have ended up being incompatible with me and I have "gone off them". The feelings have faded as I learned more about them.

 

Like I said in my previous post...the LUST phase.

[Mun]

Who's Victoria? And why are you not worrying about seeing her on Friday?

[danimal77]

Benevolent, do you feel good when you are proven right? I still believe that you get satisfaction in proving others wrong. The more I read your advice and the more pessimistic I realize it is, the more I see through to your own personality. You CANNOT see the good. You see a catch in EVERYTHING and try and find fault in everything and everyone....

 

I am just waiting for you to say HAAAAAAAA, I told you SO!!!!!!!!

 

Try and look at things a bit more on the positive note. There is one thing being realistic and another thing about only seeing the glass as half empty. As I stated in my PM to you, I am trying to look for some positive in your posts, but there is NONE to be found. With your attitude, I would have given up on relationships a long time ago, if not life in itself.

 

Sorry, but you are more a thorn in my side than anything else and have been since the beginning of 2004. Please man, lighten up!!!!!

 

Danimal

[danimal77]

Victoria is a girl I met a little while ago online. We are supposed to meet up for a drink on Friday night. I had been meeting many different women as of late (the last 2 months), but have only connected with one so far and that being the girl I have been talking about on here....

 

Yes, she left that great of an impression on me!

 

Danimal

[Mun]

Part of it is attraction and the connection you feel... but do you think maybe her being a bit out of reach has made her more desirable to you now?

 

Just wondering....

[danimal77]

She was desirable to me before she was out of reach... In fact, after I had seen her last Friday night, I had plans on Saturday night to see this other girl by the name of Tammy, but cancelled on her and called up this girl (I am not revealing her name) and told her how I would like to see her. She invited me over right away. I just knew that I wanted to see more of her and she felt it too, until Monday that is....

 

Well, it's 2:50am Thursday morning now. I should stop overthinking this. She let me in for crying out loud on Tuesday morning. She didn't answer her phone prior to that because she was pissed. Can you blame her?

 

I'm going in confident and I want to have fun and just be me!

 

Danimal

[kate111]

Danimal,

 

in answer to your question about whether you have been relegated to the "friends forever" category:

 

No.

 

Basically when you first meet somebody you only have very limited experience of what somebody is like. You only have so much to go by. If the things you know do not impress you or offend you then you tend to dislike the other person. On the other hand if you like what you see then you like them. If you think that you like them but there are certain warning signs or you feel unsure than YOU PUT SOME DISTANCE IN BETWEEN UNTIL YOU DECIDE.

 

When you know somebody very little your feelings for them are less stable as you have less to go by. One little thing you know about them can make a big difference to your overall opinion. Whereas if you have known somebody a long time, your opinion is more stable. You have already formed a picture of the other person and you don't think about it anymore.

 

This girl doesn't really know you so she only has so much to go by. Your behaviour the other night has probably impacted unfavourably on her.

 

Also, you have had no time to develop TRUST for one another. Once this forms she will make more of a COMMITMENT to you. Until she trusts you she is unlikely to want to commit anything deeper with you. You must earn her trust. This takes time.

 

When she says she wants to be friends what she really means is that she has put you on probation. She has suspicions you may be a psycho or that you are incompatible and so she feels she doesn't want to commit any further at this stage.

[danimal77]

Kate,

 

Point taken, however, she willingly was entering into that very comfortable zone with me almost right away, after we had spoken for many hours and she liked what she heard and saw and hence, the physical aspect ensued, however, now I am where I am with her. Where is that exactly though? Did I mention I like this girl? lol..

 

Danimal

[danimal77]

Also, she mentioned how she was interested in me quite a bit, but wasn't sure if I was ready for a relationship and now may feel that I am not and so, she may want to get to know me a little better first. She also mentioned that after the incident, she wasn't sure if the connection was still there and was no longer in the mood to be in a relationship, but thought that friendship would be much more suitable. Not sure if she was just scared as one of my very close friends told me she may have been. Who knows what kind of advice her brother had given her too.

 

She also mentioned that she tends to look at only the good in a person initially and when what happened on Monday, she was forced to see the bad in me too and it kind of balanced itself out...

 

Anyways, she still wants to get to know me supposedly. God, if only I knew she still intended to keep plans with me for tonight. It's the not know that is killing me. Anyways, she is only a 30 seconds walk away from me.

 

I think our talk on Tuesday morning and us not having spoken for 2 days may have made this situation a little better.

 

We'll see.

[frozenblaze]

Hey Danimal... hang in there... I'm still amazed to see how much people are posting when you request help. I guess you have made enough wise comments to deserve all that attention. But then I think that what I read about your whole story and what follows is somewhat obsessive. Can you apply any of those good ideas you brought on these boards ? Your hope lies in trying to detach yourself from all those negative feelings and all this obsession that will, eventually, drive you insane. Trust me on this one, passion is as creative as it is a destructive force. There is something in your whole story(ies) that creeps me out, you insist too much while you did gave the advice of "letting go" to many people around (including me). Truth is you can act and make a mess out of action, or wait and see how things will turn out. Did you ever thought that a lady may not react positively to someone who obsesses about her ? If love comes out of the whole situation there is no reason for you to be the only one doing something about it. She may talk to you about it. Running after someone is the best way to loose that person... Relax, take a deep breath and try not to worry too much about it (I know it's hard). You can continue to post here and talk about it but then dont you think you just turn the blade in the wound by trying to apply logic to the situation ?

 

By the way sleep medicine helped me a lot, there is no reason for you not to sleep and in fact it's the worst thing to do for your mental health... Psychiatry may be helpful if your obsession is driving you insane... Over-thinking is worst than not thinking at all...

[danimal77]

Frozen Blaze,

 

While I appreciate all of you advice, I would like to mention that "letting go" was me implying to let go of a lost love and to apply NC to help regain ones self-respect and dignity and to emotionally detach yourself so to become confident once again. I still advocate that to those people who's ex has left them and do not want to have contact with them anylonger.

 

My story, as much as it may creep you out, is not me having to move on from this girl, but me merely messing up early on, by showing her something that I carried over from my recent past with my ex. She seems to be open and understanding and is willing to still get to know me as friends and I think that it's for the better that way, for now at least.

 

In any case, I'm supposed to be seeing her tonight and willl be calling her shortly. I am nervous, which is only natural.

 

Also, I am not an insomniac and do not need sleeping pills. I am merely a night owl who enjoys boucing ideas back and forth with people of like minds.

 

Thanks,

 

PS: It says in your profile that you are from Canada. There is something about your writing that makes me conclude that you are from the French speaking part of Canada: Quebec. Am I right?

 

Danimal

[frozenblaze]

Well by letting go i also meant giving that special someone the time to think about what she REALLY wants...

 

And about your question you are right... i'm a frog... Never thought my english was that bad...

 

Take good care...hope things will turn out to your advantage...