Do I give up?

[Runningman21]

Hi, I've got myself into a hole and I need some advice please. My friends tell me to move on and get over it so I've ended up here.

There's a long back story dating back many years which involes a lot of hurt on both parts, mainly her. We've both had partners and marriages, was never the right time etc. It's caused a lot of scarring for her and she's tried her hardest to let go of it. However, the connection between us is pretty powerful.

We got together as an official couple in June 2021, has been absolute heaven at times. Both confessed it's the happiest we've ever been. But we also clash, she's argumentative where I'd rather chat. I'd get sucked into arguing, I'd be provoked and an ugly, angry side of me appears. We both said some awful, unforgiveable things, mainly me. Her reaction to any disagreement is always to end the relationship, I can't live like that. 

We moved in together in May this year, I struggled to adapt, her daughter is very needy and also struggled, we didn't bond. She has massive trust issues and questioned me constantly, always brought up the past during arguments. We had numerous flare ups over nothing, we tried to hide these things from our children, mine are 8 and 10 and her daughter is also 10. One occasion it did get a little heated and spill over which was the catalyst for the split at the beginning of August after her daughter told her father that she's scared of living at home, understandable but I think she's playing a game to get her mother back to herself. 

Here's where I need some help.
I was happy at first after the split, I started looking for a new home. She was sobbing every night and I ended up looking after her. I moved out, we still had contact and slept together on three occasions. She had terrible anxiety and couldn't sleep, resulting in her needing counselling. I was enjoying the single life, I reconnected with friends and was going out more. She started showing some remorse for her actions and she suggested couples counselling, which got my attention. I went out for drinks just over 5 weeks ago, she questioned my whereabouts and then decided to fully end the relationship the next day. I was initially ok but things crept up on me quickly. After a week of no contact, I reached out and was shut down, I ended up pleading with her for a week or so and she told me to move on, go on some dates. Again we went into no contact, I asked her to block me on WhatsApp which she found difficult. A few days later I'm unblocked and I reached out to find it's because she was 'struggling emotionally' and nothing has changed. A few days back and forth again to no avail, she refused to talk but said it's OK to say how I feel by email, I sent it but days later she said she couldn't read it, I still don't know if she has. On Saturday she said we will never get back together and she's feeling great about herself again, so I cut contact for my own benefit on Sunday.
Question is, what do I do now? Although it's toxic at times, I do feel it's fixable. I literally can't cope with being away from her, I can't eat or sleep. I'm working on myself though, I'm in the gym, I've begun counselling for my anger issues. I have also been referred because it's possible I have adult ADHD.
Do I accept her decision as final and respect her wishes? Will some space and no contact make her think about things? I know I've probably pushed her away further by pleading. Is the no contact rule a myth and should I reach out next month some time? Obviously by then I might feel differently but am I just prolonging the agony? Will she reach a point where she questions her decision or does it seem she's come out the other end? It's also her birthday tomorrow, I don't plan on reaching out but I feel awful.
I know the obvious answer is to move on but I'm really struggling to process that, particularly with the help I'm now getting. The thought of bumping into her with someone else is soul destroying.

[bluecastle]

Sorry about all this. 

I can't help but think that, if you give yourself some more time and space, you may come to look at all this through a pretty simple—if also painful—lens. Namely as two people who really don't work well together. 

Yes, I get it, there have been some good times. But there are good times in the middle of wars as well, which does not mean the war should continue, and it seems that your baseline—the thing you two create when together—is much closer to war than to peace.

Remove blame from that—blame of her, blame of yourself—and think of it more as a fact, what's been revealed by the experiment of romance over the past year. If I was in a laboratory, pouring one liquid into another and constantly creating explosions that nearly burned down the building, would you advise me to continue with my experiment? Think of your situation like that, and take the advice you'd give me. 

In addition to the damage already wrought on both your spirits, it sounds like it has bled over into the lives of your children. That right there should be the biggest alarm bell here, and it's concerning, to put it charitably, that your instinct is to think her 10-year-old daughter is playing a game rather than feeling something very real and unacceptable. 

All of which is a lot of words to say that when someone says this...

15 minutes ago, Runningman21 said:

we will never get back together

...you listen to that as someone's truth, not something to see about changing to fit your truth. It's not what you want to hear, I know, but listening to it will bring you one step closer to the person I think you want to be, deep down. The pain of that step being in a direction away from her, and this war, is a temporary feeling that you can feel your way through. 

[Kwothe28]

I dont think there is nothing you can do. She made her choice and that is final.

Also, I am sorry, but you sound like a horrible match overall. Lots of drama, kids involved in a sense that one or more not accept step-parent thing etc. Its just not something that could move forward in a healthy way. And if you give yourself more time, you will see it too. Sometimes we see the other person as something that is meant to be. Unfortunately, in a lots of those cases, they are just not that. Because as you can  see, it didnt worked out.

I think you are on the right track. Go "no contact", work on yourself, go to gym, go to counseling(anger issues are something you need to fix) and in time you will get over this. And possibly find somebody else that is a better match.

[Runningman21]

Thanks for the replies. I think I know deep down that I need to let go, we both agree that it'll be the hardest thing we'll ever have to do. It's made even harder when my children are pleading with me to make amends with her, they were besotted with her and the feeling was mutual.

My anger issues have only ever appeared with her, my last partner would sit and talk through any problems and we never argued, it's pretty frustrating! It's not the person I want to be and I guess the fact she brings out a side of me I didn't know existed then that also is a red flag. I think this is why she suggested the couples counselling so we dealt with things better. 

One day at a time I guess... 

[MissCanuck]

You two really should not be together, OP. 

You bring out the worst in each other. When you need couples' counselling so early into a relationship, you're trying to shove a square peg into a round hole. It is going to be better for everyone that you accept this is over, and work on healing. 

She sounds completely done, anyway. When a woman is telling you to go on dates and that it's never going to work, it's because she has lost all desire to make it work. Emotionally, she is long-gone. It's healthier that you move forward without her. 

[DarkCh0c0]

10 minutes ago, Runningman21 said:

My anger issues have only ever appeared with her, my last partner would sit and talk through any problems and we never argued, it's pretty frustrating!

So sadly, she brings out the worst in you.

Well, at least you tried. Can't beat a dead horse anymore.

As you said, no contact and one day at a time. Process the grief of this relationship, build new hobbies, make new friends and focus on slowly being happy. You deserve better than this and you can find a person with whom the dynamic is healthy and love is deep and safe.

[Runningman21]

Thank you, all makes sense and I hope in time I'll see things for what they are. 

Just kicking myself a bit, we had it all and blew it. I'm 45 and never had feelings like this! Why is it so hard?! 

[moodindigo91]

3 hours ago, Runningman21 said:

Question is, what do I do now? Although it's toxic at times, I do feel it's fixable.

Sorry but toxic relationships are not fixable. And they do make you feel like you can't cope without that person, because part of what makes a relationship toxic is the co-dependency that forms between the two partners. Block her, and do everything you can to move on. It gets easier with time and you'll start to feel better about it soon. Do more of what you were doing before, that is, reconnecting with friends, etc. 

BTW, you didn't "blow" anything and you never "had it all" - it was a toxic relationship from the get-go and was never going to work. You'll find someone better. 

[SooSad33]

On 10/18/2022 at 1:44 PM, Runningman21 said:

Question is, what do I do now? Although it's toxic at times, I do feel it's fixable. I literally can't cope with being away from her, I can't eat or sleep.

Oh yeah, it's toxic and that is not something you want.

IMO, you two moved things way toooo fast!  You only began dating last year & moved in together this year.. is there a reason for the rush?  you barely knew each other,,,right?

Yes, you can 'cope'.  What you have at this time is anxiety. It will improve once you dis engage fully from her.

 

On 10/18/2022 at 1:44 PM, Runningman21 said:

Do I accept her decision as final and respect her wishes? Will some space and no contact make her think about things?

Yes.  leave all alone now.  Accept no head games, the push & pull, etc.  No more contact, no need for emails ..nothing.

Also, even if she were to 'think on things', doesn't mean anything will change.  You two are still toxic to each other... you already know this.

 

On 10/18/2022 at 1:44 PM, Runningman21 said:

Is the no contact rule a myth and should I reach out next month some time? Obviously by then I might feel differently but am I just prolonging the agony?

Nah, don't play this game... trying to get the other to 'miss you'.

Is time to just work on accepting & healing.

 

And yeah, the less we know the better - so don't try to follow or contact anymore.  Is best for you both! ( Hey I have an ex across the road, I had to see him move on and yah it hurt- but I was done with his head games... no longer my problem 😉 ).

As mentioned, keep on with what you were doing... hang with friends & enjoy your life again. Believe me, someday you'll see for real how rough this was on you.

 

[Runningman21]

Just thought I'd follow up to my initial post with an update.

Firstly, thank you for all the replies and advice. 

I continued with what I was doing in terms of working on myself, gained a lot of self confidence and I'm a lot more socialble. I'm in a very good place.

I met the most amazing girl in November, she's absolutely stunning and I made it clear from the start that it was too soon for anything romantically but we enjoyed each others company. Will spare all the details but my ex and her family stalked her online, all her stories, videos etc so she questioned me about it, obviously I had no answers but I also questioned things myself... If she's moved on why look obsessively? Eventually in early December I told her my history with my ex which left her in tears. Her response was to get her back at all costs but she confessed that she had also fallen for me. It opened up a can of worms for me and made me realise that the things we fell out over were so trivial. They just didn't matter, it was just poor communication and a lack of trust on her part which in my opinion can be worked on. 

Christmas was fine but there was periods where I missed her more than ever. I sent my ex flowers on new years eve as a kind gesture, nothing more. Wished her all the best for 2023 and seen it as a new start for me too. However, the stalking continue with the new girl, viewing her online for a few days, blocking her, unblocking and viewing again and so on. Her telling me these tales didn't help me one bit so I've cut contact with her for her own benefit, she's too kind to mess around too. 

 

There is absolutely no anger or resentment from me at all now, more regret and wondering what's going through her mind.  I've come to the conclusion that I'd rather work on things and get it right providing she has also made changes. It's not a case of not being able to let go anymore, it's more about what I want. Having taken the step back I see things a lot more clearly now. 

I know this goes against all the advice given but I reached out and put a note through her door a week ago. I've booked us a table at our favourite restaurant for next month, told her where and when. Although we've had absolutely no contact, I'd like to think if she wasn't going to show then she'd at least let me know rather than let me turn up. Obviously if that happens I'll know she's still the same person. 

Will update soon. 

 

 

 

 

[Kwothe28]

So she practically sabotaged your new relationship? Because she has done a common thing "toxic" people do. And that is that when you get on with somebody new, they get jealous because they cant have you. That is the only reason she did that. So you took that toxic jealousy, somehow replaced it for love, and ran with it. Blocked something that was potentially good for you, and decided to go win your ex back?

You do know that now when your last girlfriend isnt in the picture, your ex wouldnt want you anymore? That is the kind of games you get with the people like your ex. Because you cant expect a normal functioning relationship out of people like her. And quite frankly, from you too. Because you refuse to block your ex and move on from her toxic arse. Which makes you toxic as well. 

Block her on everything. And enroll into therapy to work on yourself. Because the way things are going, you wont get far with your thinking. Especially when you are deliberately choosing something that is bad for you instead of cutting it off and moving onto something new and better. Because that is all you have done here. Made an obvious bad choice that anyone but yourself see its bad. 

[bluecastle]

48 minutes ago, Runningman21 said:

I've come to the conclusion that I'd rather work on things and get it right providing she has also made changes. It's not a case of not being able to let go anymore, it's more about what I want.

I hear you when you say this, and have no doubt you mean this sincerely. Yet from the outside, if I'm being honest? This sounds a lot more like a compulsion to something toxic than clarity about a connection. 

Look at how this present moment came about. Your ex, a volatile, jealous personality who brought out a volatile side in yourself when you were together, engaged in just about the most immature activity an adult can engage in: stalking the social media of someone you're dating after she (your ex) breaks things off. That is not an impulse driven by love and kindness, but insecurity and control.

It is distressing that, to you, it doesn't seem to register this way. Rather than be angry at her throwing a wrench into your healing and a new relationship, you're response is to end this relationship and send your ex flowers. Think of the messaging there. You have essentially told her that if she acts like wounded, vindictive, controlling baby you will respond by uprooting your life and giving her gifts and affection. You can't really ask for less secure foundation on which to build something, and make no mistake: that foundation, built by both of you, is what you have. 

48 minutes ago, Runningman21 said:

It opened up a can of worms for me and made me realise that the things we fell out over were so trivial. They just didn't matter, it was just poor communication and a lack of trust on her part which in my opinion can be worked on. 

What I want to say to you here is: Just these things? Really? Communication and trust are basic cornerstones of a relationship. Building them, working on them—this should not require a ton of "work," especially early. Think of it a bit like other key cornerstones, like sexual chemistry. You don't work on this in the early days of a relationship; you enjoy it, surrender to it. And when it's not there to be enjoyed? Typically you accept the relationship isn't the right one.

I bring up sexual chemistry because I can't help but feel it's the real glue here—that heat, that fire, a dance of sweat and egos. Any truth to this? As in: Do you think you'd be considering a reunion if you didn't want more of that? Answer that honestly and I think you'll have some real clarity here. The key is understanding that you can have that without all this whiplash, which I don't think is an achievable state with this woman. 

[boltnrun]

Just don't be surprised when it all comes crashing down again. She has given you all the information you need to know how this will go. 

And please don't date someone else after the next fight. Don't bring innocent people into this toxic situation. 

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, Runningman21 said:

 I reached out and put a note through her door a week ago. I've booked us a table at our favourite restaurant for next month, 

Did she block you?  Be careful of gestures that could be misconstrued as stalking. 

[Runningman21]

Thank you for your replies. 

She didn't sabotage anything with the new girl. I see you point totally but it was just friendship for me, it's way too soon for me to be thinking about anything else and I made that clear when we met. Unfortunately, it didn't quite work out like that for her and she deserves better than to be hoping I'll suddenly be ready for something or to be my rebound. I also told her to block my ex and the family but instead she played up to it. She posted a photo of us against my wishes (I got a text off my ex's sister an hour later saying about my new partner, shows the level of stalking, no shame either). I asked her countless times to stop telling me who was looking at what but it fell on deaf ears. Both immature and noise that I didn't need.

I've taken on board all her criticisms of me and I know I have made enough changes, I have worked on myself religiously for my own benefit, not hers. 

She is a great girl, the arguments were minimal and looking back quite pathetic. She has been betrayed in the past and I think she was terrified I'd do that to her, no matter what I said or done it would have made no difference. This is something she needs to work on herself. She's been having counselling and if she has also made changes then who knows. Obviously, if she's still the same person then I I'm not interested in the slightest. It's back to basics, dates, getting to know each other again and not rushing into anything. 

This is if she turns up of course. 

 

Yes I am blocked on social media and whatsapp, again I see your point but I haven't once called her or knocked her door. Not that it makes it OK, just a note with a few sentences felt less intrusive. 

[Wiseman2]

12 minutes ago, Runningman21 said:

  I am blocked on social media and whatsapp, again I see your point but I haven't once called her or knocked her door. Not that it makes it OK, just a note with a few sentences felt less intrusive. 

Be careful about circumventing blocks and showing up at her home. The last thing anyone needs is a restraining order on their record. If she's not contacting you let it go.

[bluecastle]

3 minutes ago, Runningman21 said:

She didn't sabotage anything with the new girl.

Subtract the social media stalking and where would things be right now? You'd be making a new a friend, figuring out what was what, healing. Add in the stalking and you have drama and a burgeoning friendship that is no more. Your ex isn't 100 percent responsible, no, as your new friend and yourself could have made different choices in how you handled that infringement, but it's still kind of textbook sabotage/messing with business that isn't yours. 

Being that you're not done exploring this for the time being, I would set yourself some very real guidelines. You've left a note in the door from someone who has you blocked and is "communicating" with you solely by stirring the pot through pixels, with her sister acting as henchman. You've made a reservation—and, I assume, are hoping she shows up at said date and time. If that doesn't come to happen, are you ready to close up shop and consider that there may be a healthier and more rewarding union? 

None of this is looking very promising from the bleacher seats, I have to say—but, hey, I've slipped on all sorts of ice myself in getting back on my feet. 

 

[Runningman21]

Very good point which I have already thought about and you're absolutely right, maybe there was potential there further down the line but who knows when that would be. She has a very unfortunate and troubled past, I didn't want to add to that too. 

 

If she doesn't show up then as far as I'm concerned, that's it...especially as it takes seconds to send a text or even get one of her family members to say she won't be there. Maybe she shouldn't have to, I know. 

I shall continue on my journey of healing and self improvement, enjoy being on my own and see where that takes me. I already have a lot to look forward to already this year. 

[savignon]

15 hours ago, Runningman21 said:

If she doesn't show up then as far as I'm concerned, that's it...especially as it takes seconds to send a text or even get one of her family members to say she won't be there. Maybe she shouldn't have to, I know. 

 

I'm going to echo the people who have suggested you should be careful not to come off as disregarding and violating her no-contact wishes.  You are right- she should not have to tell you she doesn't want to see you when she has already told you several times and blocked you.

It is a shame that your collective toxicity ruined a potentially healthy friendship.  Perhaps it would have served as a good model for how to have healthier exchanges with people.

 

[Wiseman2]

15 hours ago, Runningman21 said:

 it takes seconds to send a text or even get one of her family members to say she won't be there. 

She doesn't owe you an RSVP. Just back away. Keep in mind she can take the note to the police as evidence of harassment and stalking. Let it go. 

[Runningman21]

Plot twist. 

I don't know how it came about but I had a call from the new friend I made. I'm not totally sure what she means but basically someone came up on her Facebook messenger suggestions but this guy has blocked her. She thought it weird, turns out he's blocked me too, also friends with my ex. No idea who he is. 

Doesn't take a genius! So that's that, we move on.

[bluecastle]

4 hours ago, Runningman21 said:

Plot twist. 

What’s the twist? Sounds more like a continuation of the same story, if I’m understanding right.

Your ex and/or her tribe is continuing to use the internet to meddle in your life, correct? Last time she did this she was highly rewarded by you, so it’s somewhat understandable. Now you get to choose if you want to keep engaging and rewarding, or not. 

[Runningman21]

They haven't meddled no. It's something that's been stumbled upon. I'm wondering how long it's been going on but I'll never know. 

There's no engagement from me, it's time to completely let go of the little hope that I had. In all honesty, it's probably done me a favour.