Commitment-phobic men-only 2 ways out

[Luciana]

Everyone who has dated a commitment-phobic knows the pain it entails.

 

If a woman wants to get engaged after one year, or 2 years, or whatever her time frame is, and the guys stalls, she is going to be sad and depressed.

 

She usually tells him the first time what she wants in a civilized sweet way, and he pretends he is deaf or refuses to discuss it. Some time goes by, she brings it up again. This time he gets angry, or goes into his "cave". She cries and feel rejected, but soldiers on, because she loves him and has HOPE. V-day comes, b-days come, Xmas and NYE come, romantic vacations happen, and she always has hope he will surprise her and propose. But he won't, because he is having the milk for free without buying the cow.

 

A woman in this situation only has 2 options, because the picture I described above (the woman "talking" to him about her needs and him recoiling) will not work.

 

So here's what to do:

1) Reverse Psychology Technique:

NEVER talk about commitment with him. Never mention marriage. If he mentions it, pretend you have no interest in it. Make sarcastic remarks about marriage and make it clear you have NO intention of getting married. Because guys like challenge, he may be so intrigued by you that you will try to make up your mind. This strategy takes a kot of energy because it is the opposite of what you want. But that's why it's called reverse psychology.

 

2) Deadline Technique:

This one is after the damage has been done, or say, you have asked him about marriage and he has flaked out. Do not wait and wait until one day he wants to pay for the cow. Give yourself a deadline, and stick to it. Whatever you find appropriate (how long you're willing to wait). When that date arrives, leave the relationship. Be prepared for the end. Because you planned it, you will get used to loneliness for awhile if he doesn't come through. Stop taking his calls. Disappear. If he asks you why, tell him (by letter or email) that you decided you and him have different goals in life and that you want to get married and he doesn't, that is why you decided to find a man who thinks like you. Be nice about it, no accusations or tears. Be factual and practical. Beware he might never call again if he isn't really into you. It's not your loss baby, you will thank him one day for allowing you to meet the next nice guy who really wants you.

if he comes back, show him it's commitment or nothing. Do not sleep with him or be loving to him because he will fall into his old ways. Act confident like you don't miss him too much.

 

Anyhow, the second option worked for me. But I know of women who used the first option and it worked. What doesn't work it to be "patient" and wait for him to get over whatever he needs to get over. You will be angry, miserable, resentful, clingy, b***y. And if he finally proposes you will not feel happy, because it caused you so much pain.

Good luck all GF's of commitment-phobics!

And please, don't expect (or desire) commitment if you're 20 or have been dating for only 6 months!

[Duderanomi]

This post made me think of something. Is there such a thing as a woman being a commitment-phobic? I don't recall ever hearing about that.

[Beec]

Women can be committment phobic too.

 

I think this post shows to ways on can proceed, but I think that understanding what might be going on in his head and working on that would be better. Are what you suggest a way to do that? In some cases, yes. In others, they will never work. In many more they are only part of a plan.

 

If he is what you want, then getting in his head is the way to go.

[Caldus]

Yeah I agree. The best way in my opinion would be to just find out why he is afraid of committment. It's always best to address the source of the problem (which is what is going on in his head) I think.

[Gaz]

I really hope that wasn`t a serious post. I can just imagine it:

 

"Ok dear, you have 20 days to propose or Im leaving, got it?!"

 

Love should be unconditional, it is not about marraige or families or sex. Its about wanting to be with someone no matter what. No one should be pressured into marraige or anything else for that matter.

 

The time has to be right for both people in the relationship, that is the whole point IMO.

 

 

[Gaz]

Considering that half of all marraiges end in divorce anyway, it would be better people take longer to think about what they are doing then this figure would be much lower. Too many people these days jump into marraige without thinking about it. There is usually a reason why someone is getting cold feet, and that is his or her right.

[Beec]

I really hope that wasn`t a serious post. I can just imagine it:

 

"Ok dear, you have 20 days to propose or Im leaving, got it?!"

 

Love should be unconditional, it is not about marraige or families or sex. Its about wanting to be with someone no matter what. No one should be pressured into marraige or anything else for that matter.

 

The time has to be right for both people in the relationship, that is the whole point IMO.

 

 

 

But if you are the one who wants to get married, how long do you wait. If they are really going to committ to you, what's keeping them.

 

Sometimes the timing or even desire is not there for both, in which case they should move on.

 

You can love them, but if they won't marry nothing says you need to stay with them.

[Gaz]

But if you are the one who wants to get married, how long do you wait. If they are really going to committ to you, what's keeping them.

 

Sometimes the timing or even desire is not there for both, in which case they should move on.

 

You can love them, but if they won't marry nothing says you need to stay with them.

 

You can love someone and not want to marry them, it is the choice of the individual. Of course you are not going to want to commit to marraige at the same time because we all feel different to each other at different times.

 

I would wait forever for a girl I really loved, after all she is the most important thing in my life, not the marraige itself.

 

Just my opinion.

[Duderanomi]

I think what the original poster meant for the second option was that the girl waits until a set deadline she hasn't shared with her boyfriend to call it quits, and not the "you've got 20 days to marry me" scenario.

[CarterJonas]

Interesting post.

 

I think that if you are trully comitted to someone then you must show this by getting engaged, 1 - 2 years as Luciana said is reasonable, especially if you are way in your twenties. But also as Gaz said you have to be careful nowadays as a lot of marriages end in divorce.

 

My advice would be to engage after one to two years, and not marry until about two years after the engagement, which would give both of you time to get over the initial 'honeymoon' period and see whether you really are compatible. Possibly add that living together before marriage would be a good idea as well!

 

don't know what others think, are there any impulsive people here?

[Mr. Good Man]

I find this post rather interesting. Sometimes people forget that it takes two to get engaged and married. It's rare for individuals to want to do it at the same pace and time.

 

With that said, "Why put a deadline?" Who's to say that a man not wanting to commit means he is 'commitment-phobic?

 

If a woman wants to get engaged after one year, or 2 years, or whatever her time frame is, and the guys stalls, she is going to be sad and depressed.

 

I agree a woman will be in pain. But, if the man doesn't bring up getting engage and the woman constantly brings it up what does that tell you? The guy is not interestd in getting married no matter what you do. So, why give a deadline?

 

She cries and feel rejected, but soldiers on, because she loves him and has HOPE.

 

Ahhh...there's the culprit HOPE! Even after the deaf ear, silence, avoidance and everything else women hold on to HOPE. That hope is what causes the problems.

 

V-day comes, b-days come, Xmas and NYE come, romantic vacations happen, and she always has hope he will surprise her and propose. But he won't, because he is having the milk for free without buying the cow.

 

Okay, the milk is free. But he didn't take it. It was given. Sure, many men may say what you want to hear but after a while you can tell when someone is not as "serious" for you as you are for them.

 

Also, if a woman wants a man to buy the milk then state it upfront and stop playing games. If you want to get married let it be known upfront. Let him know the timeframes. That way he knows what he's getting himself into before he get involved.

 

I wrote the above for the "devil advocates." However, I do agree with the following. As I man, who is serious about life, I know the techniques below actually work. I've seen it in action and someone is using the first one on me...

 

However, keep in mind that no one can force you to do what you don't already want to do. The women are just motivating you to do it a little sooner than you would like too!

 

 

So here's what to do:

 

1) Reverse Psychology Technique:

NEVER talk about commitment with him. Never mention marriage. If he mentions it, pretend you have no interest in it. Make sarcastic remarks about marriage and make it clear you have NO intention of getting married. Because guys like challenge, he may be so intrigued by you that you will try to make up your mind. This strategy takes a kot of energy because it is the opposite of what you want. But that's why it's called reverse psychology.

 

2) Deadline Technique:

This one is after the damage has been done, or say, you have asked him about marriage and he has flaked out. Do not wait and wait until one day he wants to pay for the cow. Give yourself a deadline, and stick to it. Whatever you find appropriate (how long you're willing to wait). When that date arrives, leave the relationship. Be prepared for the end. Because you planned it, you will get used to loneliness for awhile if he doesn't come through. Stop taking his calls. Disappear. If he asks you why, tell him (by letter or email) that you decided you and him have different goals in life and that you want to get married and he doesn't, that is why you decided to find a man who thinks like you. Be nice about it, no accusations or tears. Be factual and practical. Beware he might never call again if he isn't really into you. It's not your loss baby, you will thank him one day for allowing you to meet the next nice guy who really wants you.

 

if he comes back, show him it's commitment or nothing. Do not sleep with him or be loving to him because he will fall into his old ways. Act confident like you don't miss him too much.

 

Anyhow, the second option worked for me. But I know of women who used the first option and it worked. What doesn't work it to be "patient" and wait for him to get over whatever he needs to get over. You will be angry, miserable, resentful, clingy, b***y. And if he finally proposes you will not feel happy, because it caused you so much pain.

Good luck all GF's of commitment-phobics!

 

And please, don't expect (or desire) commitment if you're 20 or have been dating for only 6 months!

[Gaz]

I agree ^^

[EatZ]

I do and don't agree with these tactics of reverse psychology and setting a deadline.

 

First of all, I totally agree with the idea that if what you're currently doing isn't working, then you need to do something different, or at least approach the situation from a slightly different angle. Hands down. No questions.

 

But going COMPLETELY the opposite way, however, is foolish in my opinion. Not to mention the fact that saying you don't want to get married when you REALLY REALLY do is just plain dishonest.

 

This isn't a game you're playing. This is a relationship with another human being. Step back and take a look what you're actually trying to do. You're trying to manipulate another person into wanting to marry you. Do you really think you should have to do that if you're made for each other? Do you really think you should have to play them to make them marry you?

 

And what if he (or she) takes it seriously? What if all it does is relieve any rush to get married? Do you really honestly think that going cold turkey on the idea of marriage will make them WANT to get married? I don't.

 

Second of all, the idea of setting a date for the end of a relationship is cruel, and I only say this from my own experience. I myself have been led on, unknowingly loving a person with all my heart and soul only to find out eventually that it was all in vain. It ruined me. Don't do this to someone. You either love them or you don't. Don't set an expiry date on your love.

 

Regardless of whether you tell them that you've set a date or not, finding out that a relationship's fate was predetermined by your partner is devastating.

1. You tell them - The thought of the marriage overshadows everything else and your partner feels this IMMENSE pressure, almost like an ultimatum. They can't help but be depressed by this.
   
2. You don't tell them - They're none the wiser. Things could very well go on as they are for the opposite reasons in A -- They feel no pressure! Then when the relationship ends they have an intense feeling of being lead on. I have no doubts that if you meant anything to them they will be utterly destroyed at the thought that you decided the relationship was over several weeks/months/years ago.

I hope I'm not in any way coming accross as insensitive to people that are absolutely DYING to get married to their loves, because I really don't mean to be! I myself want to get married some day, and I hope my future partner is as excited about the idea as I am when we're both ready to make that step.

 

But I really do think these strategies are only going to be hurtful to you if you employ them. Not to mention, hurtful to your lovers. I mean come on. Being totally cold to your partner about marriage? Setting a deadline to break up? These can only be seen as negative!

 

I think the best approach to a commitment-phobe is honesty. Don't nag, don't bring it up over every dinner or during every meaningful conversation you seem to have. Bring it up when you feel they're ready to hear it and talk constructively about it. Be supportive of them. Let them feel like they can tell you their reasons for not wanting to get married just yet and actually ACCEPT THEIR REASONS! Don't challenge them.

 

In the long run, if you love them, the time in which you get married shouldn't be the be-all and end-all for your relationship. It should only be if you love them or not.

[Duderanomi]

Eatz, that was one of the smartest posts I've read so far on this forum.

[Beec]

Well, I don't really agree with EatZ. I think if you really want someone and want to be married to them, then there is really not that much wrong if you get them to want the same thing. This is a story that's been going since before history was recorded. I also think that sooner or later someone has to invoke a "sell-by" date, or it will continue indefinitely. I have a relative who has been engaged for twenty years. How long should his fiance have waited? She is locked into a lifelong engagement now. There is a time and place for a sell-by date.

 

And I am saying all this as a guy in his late 30s who has never been engaged. Of course, I have not dated anyone woman continuously for a year-and-a-half in quite a long time. My last realtionship ended shortly after the one year mark. But the idea of there being a sell-by date is in my head as well.

[EatZ]

That's okay Beec! Like you said, this debate is as old as history itself, and I don't expect everyone to be of my opinion.

 

All the same, and despite my opinions, I don't think I disagree with anything you've actually said! I agree, if you're not getting the love you know you deserve, or the relationship isn't living up to the bare minimum you expect, by all means, it's time to move on.

 

It's this whole manipulative side to these "strategies" for getting someone to marry you that I don't agree with. The fact that someone will purposefully become cold and avoid the subject of marriage in order to get married... I can't help but see it as petty and -- quite frankly -- nonsensical. The way these "two steps to getting married" came accross initially was very devious. It didn't seem at all about love & compromise, or about listening to WHY your significant other is too scared to marry yet. It was simply about playing games.

 

I have a question for you Beec. Is your relative's fiancé unhappy in the relationship? I can only assume that if she hasn't left him already, then marriage can't be as important to her as the relationship must be... Sure, she's locked into a life-long engagement, but isn't that what marriage is? A life-long commitment?

 

I know people myself to whom marriage is EXTREMELY important. To tell you the truth, I'd probably even lump myself in that category. I want to get married some day. I don't want compromise on this when I finally meet my life partner, but I'm not exactly going to play games with her to make her marry me. I can say that much for sure, and I'm saying this as guy in his 20's.

 

There are many reasons not to force a marriage, and I'm not about to start quoting divorce statistics here.

 

The simple fact that you can't (or shouldn't) force a person to do something they don't want to do should be enough to avoid it altogether. If you do somehow manage to get them to marry you, I would be EXTREMELY fearful of how long it lasts before problems or doubts arise. I still stick by being honest and talking about it before rushing your partner into a decision they're not sure about. Finding out where their fears lie and seeing if there's any way to put them at ease.

 

Setting a secret date to end a relationship is pointless, and you're only setting yourself up for disappointment and heartache if you do this. Likewise for pretending to not want marriage in order to get marriage. Should it all really have to come to this? Ultimatums and playing games?

[Beec]

EatZ, we have a key philosophical difference of opinion. I have no problem or issue with one person trying to get the other person in a relationship to want what they want. Is that manipulative? Yes, it can well be.

 

I am all for manipulating someone into wanting what I want or wanting ME. I am all for protraying myself in a way, that is me but is a me that they want. I am all for looking at a relationship and knowing what I want and thinking about how to make them want that too. How to decide you want to take a certain vacation and how she will want to take the same vacation with you. How she will want to live in the same area I want to live? Go to dinner at the same place? Anything. Relationships are not always tit for tat. Or manipulation, sometimes they are about pleasing your partner.

 

I am all for pleasing your partner. But I am also all for pleasing yourself. You both need to get out of a relationship what you need and want. If you want things that are opposing, then something has to give. If I wanted something from ym partner, I'd try to please her til she did nothign but smile, then I'd threaten that. I'd threaten her being ever pelased like that again because I am the one who can deliver those feelings.

 

The person who sets a deadline for marriage or engagement, tell the other that I am not going to stay here forever waiting for you to make up your mind. Either you want me and want to committ to me, or you don't. I've waited this long and I am not waiting any longer. Make your choice, me now and forever, or me never. I see nothing wrong with that choice.

 

I also see nothing wrong with adopting differnet strategies to manipulate your partner. If you both end up happy what is the big problem? If you manipualte a person to marrying you by being someone you ae not, then I would have issues. Be yourself.

 

My criticism of the original poster was that there really was a limited understanding of why we go for who we go for and get married, date, engaged, etc. The original poster reminds me ot "The Rules" book which suggest a one-size fits all strategy for women to get the men they want. I have no issue with their aims, but take issue with their understanding and advocating such a limited strategy.

 

If I want a woman, then I should set out and go get her. If she is not interested, I can either give up or work to change her mind. I'd prefer to get what I want and not give up.

[EatZ]

A lot of what you said has struck a chord with me, but I guess we will just have to agree to disagree then.

[Beec]

Agreed that we disagree.

 

I think we probably disagree only in degree and how much of a conscious effort we make.

 

I am sure that. lijke most people, when you take a woman out on a first date you think about where to go so that she will want a second date. And you try to be nice to her, etc. To me, I see this as only being different in degree. You do this because you want a second date. Someone else may do something I see as being similar because they want to be married to them. How far you go depends on you?

[Luciana]

"The person who sets a deadline for marriage or engagement, tell the other that I am not going to stay here forever waiting for you to make up your mind. Either you want me and want to committ to me, or you don't. I've waited this long and I am not waiting any longer. Make your choice, me now and forever, or me never. I see nothing wrong with that choice."

 

I agree with Bec here and this is my point. Even though I do agree honesty is the best policy, sometimes the person you love just is so against marriage or so undecided whether you are the one that you must shake it! Or you will spend your best years hoping and your clock ticking away while for him it's confortable just to have a Saturday night GF.

Although it seems like manipulating (the first technique I agree is manipulative), the fact is that if you have talked to him nicely, have explained how you feel and still time goes by indefinetley and he avoids any conversation about marriage like the plague, you need to set yourself a deadline to leave. Just like leaving a job that is bad for you, or where you don't get a promotion.

I think a nice letter (the one I wrote to my fiance was nice, polite, sincere) telling him why you are moving on is the best way to handle it (since face to face conversations never worked).

Sometimes you need to lose something to value it. That's what happened to my BF after 5 years of dating (I was frustrated as hell). There was no visible reason why he couldn't marry me: he has enough money, stability, we are both mature, etc. The only reason was that he had been married before and it didn't work out-12 years ago-but hey, get over it and I am not going to pay the price if your ex was bad to you!

Now we are living together-with a ring-mind you, a moissanite ring (cheaper than a diamond, but I didn't care about that-I just wanted the symbolism).

 

Let me tell you this: we were going to LA on a plane. My BF sat next to a guy and started talking to him. Then he asked the guy what he was doing in LA, and the guy said: "I am going to my brother's wedding".

My BF responded: "Poor bastard".

I thought that was rude and out of place. And I told my BF and we had an argument. That day I really opened my eyes to the fact that he might never want to get married again.

The next day I wrote the letter...

[Luciana]

I watched this comedy from 1999 (pretty good!) last night on cable and it freaked me out. It's about a beautiful woman who wants to get married no matter what. And she freaks out her BF. The movie escalates to the point they hate each other. WHat a wake up call!! It's shame things have to get to that point.

The problem with men and women nowadays is timing. The timing for commitment seems very different for both sexes: women have a biological clock ticking;men no so.

Anyhow, I recommend all watching it.

Love Stinks, 1999, with French Stewart and Bridgette Wilson.