Women Making the Initial Moves

[dolcedolore]

This seems to be a big question that women have for men. On this site, when I come accross the answers to this question, I find that mostly women are the ones who answer this. For example, when asked if the woman should initiate things in the beginning, I've often read women saying that it throws men off and that it shouldn't be done.

 

It's fine if women answer this particular thread as well, but I'm really looking for the male perspective here. In the beginning of a relationship, is it a turn off when the woman is confident and makes some of the initial moves? I'm not even talking about striking up a date necessarily (although that doesn't seem that far-fetched to me either), I'm just talking about the follow up calls, initiating conversations, etc. Is it true that men love the thrill of chasing a woman around? That by showing less interest, he becomes more interested?

[grymoire]

Plz take a look at the following threads:

 

 

 

 

 

Really take the time to go through the threads. It will clearly show the differences between the male and female perspective on this issue.

 

I hope you make the right choice.

[dolcedolore]

Thanks. It's just that I keep getting all this advice from people... friends of mine telling me that I shouldn't make the moves at first. People on here telling me not to make the move first. And then I think about it and...

 

My brother and his girlfriend have been together for over a year and are madly in love. She made all of the moves. He was too shy and never would have done anything.

 

My roommate (who advised ME not to make first moves) casually asked out her then friend to lunch. She bluntly told him that she really liked him. They have spent almost every night together for the last four months.

 

And then I come on here, read all of this advice from people, and I started to realize that anything negative about asking men out came from "experienced women" who knew that this was a bad idea. I don't know if I've come accross a guy on this site saying anything negative about it to be honest.... Anyone else see a negative response?

[grymoire]

Yep that's right.

 

In those 2 threads you'll notice that LOT of men have clearly mentioned that they would love it if a woman asked them out and that in itself would not make them think less of the woman. The advice that was against the notion came primarily from women that are from a previous generation.

 

I really think you should ask out/make moves on a guy that you have a strong crush on. Just think about it - what is the worst thing that can possibly happen? He is going to tell you that he is not interested. That is 50% chance. There is a 50% chance that he will say yes. But if you just give up because women are not supposed to make a move then the possibility of you both getting together is 0%.

[Metallica Lightning]

Is it true that men love the thrill of chasing a woman around? That by showing less interest, he becomes more interested?

 

This is absolutely not at all true, in my case at least.

I certainly do not mind initiation, but if she does not show immediate interest, I drop it. I have no time for an insecure female who needs to play hard to get to better her self esteem at my expense. I don't put up with bs. I cannot stand it when a woman proclaims that it is the male's role to be dominant. We were all created as equal individuals, one was not meant to rule over the other.

[Buccaneer]

This is absolutely not at all true, in my case at least.

I certainly do not mind initiation, but if she does not show immediate interest, I drop it. I have no time for an insecure female who needs to play hard to get to better her self esteem at my expense. I don't put up with bs. I cannot stand it when a woman proclaims that it is the male's role to be dominant. We were all created as equal individuals, one was not meant to rule over the other.

 

Sorry sir, but I can already tell you you're about to be flamed.

[dolcedolore]

Who do you think he's going to be flamed by? Women or men?

 

I personally find that comment very helpful.

[Buccaneer]

Who do you think he's going to be flamed by? Women or men?

 

I personally find that comment very helpful.

 

Because alot of women have beliefs that contradict Lightning's opinion (to a degree). To imply that all women who enjoy playing hard to get are insecure, and not worth anyone's time is a dangerous thing. Also, proclaming that you are not a dominant male is just asking for female posters to label you as someone who is not a real "man."

[Metallica Lightning]

Because alot of women have beliefs that contradict Lightning's opinion (to a degree). To imply that all women who enjoy playing hard to get are insecure, and not worth anyone's time is a dangerous thing. Also, proclaming that you are not a dominant male is just asking for female posters to label you as someone who is not a real "man."

 

A woman who plays hard to get may not be totally insecure, but an extreme waste of time to an intelligent male. Why make yourself look like a damned fool pursuing a woman who is playing games, when you can have one who will show equal interest? It's much easier. Also, me not being dominant in a relationship does not mean I am a "sissy" by any means. I simply prefer equality, and confidence in a woman. There is nothing that I find more attractive than a woman displaying confidence in herself. Does this mean I want her to be the dominant one? Absolutely not. Men and women are not bound to any social roles. This is a fact, not an opinion.

That's what I'm trying to get accross.

[InBruges]

Yeah, a woman playing hard-to-get is a turn-off. But this is not to say she shouldn't have high standards.

[blinx]

Ok, I'm female but I do want to answer this post.

 

Go for it. Current guy I'm with, I initiated it. And it's great. I knew what I wanted, and he knew what he wanted. I just made it clear for him because I know guys sometimes are afraid to move too fast if they think it might offend the girl. But I knew he liked me and so I just basically said (not in words as much as action), Hey, I know you like me and I feel the same, so let's hang.

 

I'm also often the one who initiates breakups. And I've had one guy once tell me straight out that he just wanted to be friends. I was totally cool with it. The way I see it, you might have only one life to live, so just go for what you want. And if someone says no, well at least you know.

 

I have not had ONE bad experience when I initiated anything with a guy. If he likes you, he wouldn't be turned off if you initiate. If he didn't like you to begin with, then yeah, if you ask him out, he'd say no. It's not some game... he just doesn't like you. Maybe those "experienced women" you got advice from just didn't realize the reality of things -- He's just not that into them.

[Tarkan]

I think more women should ask men out ! I've asked this same question to alot of female friends because I wanted to know their opinion on this. Most of them were turned off by the idea of a man that wouldn't do the asking. Their argument: Men are hunters and should act like such. According to them, it's also very hot to get chased ( I agree on that ). In the end, it's a bit of a boost to our ego, no ? Knowing that you have someone running behind you !

 

However, I think that society pushes both men and women into a role. A role that you might not want. For each gender you have "comon behaviour" but I'm pretty sure that not every guy is 100% male or every women 100% female. Some of us have tendencies that lean in the direction of the other gender.

 

Now, you have no idea how much pressure men sometimes have when it comes to asking out people. Sure, those who are good at it will claim it's all fine and that you have to work on your confidence. However, sometimes it's just your personality. You are a shy person and you want to be accepted like that. It isn't BAD to be shy so why would you change ?

 

I'll take myself as an example: I have a hard time when it comes to making a first move. But once I can make a step past first contact I become at ease. It's a matter of trust.

 

Example: I remember being at a party with a friend and there was that girl I really liked. Normally, I never try for someone at a party, because I rather talk with the person in order to know her. I really ain't the kind of guy that is into hookups in bars and stuff. Well long things short, I was dancing next to her but without doing a thing, even when there was alot of eye contact.

 

I think the girl understood: She grabbed my hand, took me to the dancefloor and we started dancing together. At the end of night we kissed and I got her number. It was a fun experience but honestly ... it isn't the best way to meet people.

 

What I was trying to say ? There can be a very confident guy hiding behind a shy person. If you judge someone who isn't asking you out to quickly, you might miss a great chance. As a guy I really love women who make the asking because it's so uncommon !

 

Let's share the social pressure

[ycmanvs]

I am a woman and as you know, I have no problem asking guys out. I am actually quite shy, so it takes A LOT to get me to tell someone that I want to be with them. It has always been a positive experience.

[absinthe]

I weighed in, in your other thread but will expand on this a bit more, about personality types, from your perspective.

 

Your personality:

• If you're the type of woman who's uncomfortable about asking men out, don't do it. Discomfort comes accross very clearly.
  
• If you're okay with asking men out, then go for it!
  

 

Also, what do you need in a man? Do you need the more aggressive man, assertive man, laid back man, shy man, what do you NEED?

 

What do you think would happen if you pursue the first and second kind of man? What if you don't pursue the third and fourth kind of man?

 

No offense to ENA male posters but many guys, even if they say they'd be flattered by a woman pursuing, when the real thing happens, it's quite the polar opposite. Most men are hunters by nature.

[Metallica Lightning]

No offense to ENA male posters but many guys, even if they say they'd be flattered by a woman pursuing, when the real thing happens, it's quite the polar opposite. Most men are hunters by nature.

 

Just wanted to comment here.

 

I happen to be an avid hunter. I hunt Dove, Quail, and Pheasant throughout the fall and winter seasons. If I see a good, clean, open shot I will most certainly take it. If the bird flys away, it isn't worth it to pursue it because other birds will come around.

 

Make sense?

[abitbroken]

I am not a dude - but I think that male/female initiation is different. I have always went with the principle that the guy should make the first move as far as asking out etc. But in truth, the woman makes it. She gives a guy the green light signal. It is not about saying "hey, i want to date you" but a smile, returning interest, etc works. Acting receptive. She can green light a guy, or she can red light him by avoiding his eyes, brushing him off, and giving other rejection signals. Unless a guy is extremely bold, he usually doesn't ask a girl out if he doesn't think he has a chance and she somehow lets him know that he does.

 

Maybe that is psychological mumbo jumbo but for the average person who doesn't always randomly ask people out, that's how I see it. It is up to both of them if they continue dating, and the line blurs, but I think it is most successful when a woman doesn't "chase" a man, but lets him make the first actual move (ask out, call after the first date, ask for her number, whatever)

[absinthe]

Just wanted to comment here.

 

I happen to be an avid hunter. I hunt Dove, Quail, and Pheasant throughout the fall and winter seasons. If I see a good, clean, open shot I will most certainly take it. If the bird flys away, it isn't worth it to pursue it because other birds will come around.

 

Make sense?

So if bird after bird walked up to you and said "shoot me", would you shoot all these birds, having a great time, or would you hunt other birds who presented a reasonable level of challenge?

 

Make sense?

[penelope13]

I have already mentioned it in previous threads, that I have no problem initiating.

 

I am all for getting rid of stereotypical gender behavior and all for adjusting ones behavior according to the person I am dealing with. If the guy in front of me is shy, then I don't mind making the first step(s). If he is an alpha male, and wants to initiate, it's fine with me as long as he doesn't do it because he thinks it's his duty or that I am an oldfashioned damsel that is incapable of making up my own mind

[waveseer]

I learned the hard way (more than once) that the only way to tell if a man truly wants to be with you is to make sure he's making an equal investment into the relationship.

[dolcedolore]

cannot stand it when a woman proclaims that it is the male's role to be dominant. We were all created as equal individuals, one was not meant to rule over the other.

 

Thank you.

 

I think it's really interesting that you brought up the idea of personality types absinthe. I happened to speak to my roommate and her boyfriend (who is always over here, lol) about how he wasn't put off at all by her initiation. He responded by saying that it is alright if the guy has a B personality. That it just makes sense. And it was true because my roommate is completely type A. At the same time though, I don't find her boyfriend to be that shy, maybe laid back, but not effeminate at all. Their relationship is definitely the long term type, and they put equal effort into it.

[SarahRose]

I think it is best for guys to make the first moves.

 

If you do, you don't know if he is just going along with it for the sex until he finds someone he really likes.

 

Any relationship where I made the first move, it seems they weren't as invested in it as I was. I felt I was doing everything and he was just going along for the ride.

 

I also think it depends how you look. If you aren't attractive then no a guy wouldn't want you to make the first move.

 

If you're hot, he would think it is great.

[BriarRose]

In my experience, men lose interest fast when a woman makes the moves (calls, emails, suggests getting together, etc).

 

With that being said, I don't think a woman should play coy if she wants to be with someone, either - we all want to feel wanted. But I don't think she should ever chase.

[Metallica Lightning]

So if bird after bird walked up to you and said "shoot me", would you shoot all these birds, having a great time, or would you hunt other birds who presented a reasonable level of challenge?

 

Make sense?

 

You're missing my point. Finding a bird itself is a challenge. If you shoot once, or twice and it flies away, it isn't worth pursuing, because (as I have stated) other birds will come that you may have a closer shot at. My point being, there are alot of birds out there. Why bother going after one you've shot at and missed, when there are always other that you can shoot easier?

 

Does it make sense NOW?

[Metallica Lightning]

I also think it depends how you look. If you aren't attractive then no a guy wouldn't want you to make the first move.

 

If you're hot, he would think it is great.

 

Your statement is a double standard. Do you not realize that this applies to men as well? I don't understand why women think that Men are obligated to put themselves out there like fools while women reap the emotional rewards of being 'pursued'. It's really quite tasteless.

[HeartBrokn]

This is absolutely not at all true, in my case at least.

I certainly do not mind initiation, but if she does not show immediate interest, I drop it. I have no time for an insecure female who needs to play hard to get to better her self esteem at my expense. I don't put up with bs. I cannot stand it when a woman proclaims that it is the male's role to be dominant. We were all created as equal individuals, one was not meant to rule over the other.

 

Amen! My brother, a little cat and mouse games is good but when it gets to be overboard, IE you buy the girl a drink you chat with her then out of the blue she gets up to talk to some guy, then leaves you there to watch her drink, then decides after she has had a long meaningful conversation with the guy to come back to see if her drink is still there. I say negatory!

 

I think both sexes should initiate the conversation. Bottom line there is no way I am going to chase after a chicka if she doesn’t reciprocate the attention.