Relationship With X

[John Bendix]

then the questions rises; Do these people ever see the light of day? Most therapist say that it is very rare UNLESS they accept their dysfunctional ways and retrain their thoughts and emotional patterns. Which usually means therapy, which they usually refuse. People in extreme denial will tell you that there is nothing wrong with them. Sound familiar? Drug addicts, alcoholics, gamblers, etc., all claim the same thing.

 

When you practice denial and other maladaptive coping mechanisms, you are ingraining them into your system of dealing with the world. It is what you have trained yourself to do. The dysfunction continues.

[John Bendix]

All of these lessons and knowledge I have gained started out by me trying to understand why my X was acting the way she was. I was trying to help her. But to no avail. The lessons and understanding of these mechanisms helped me to see the light in my own life, not hers. So, that may just be what I needed to learn. A hard but valuable lesson that still goes on within me everyday.

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Great insight John. Thanks. Like you, I may end up applying what I am learning about why my ex acted the way she did to my own life. Denial appears to be the opposite of acceptance. I know that the journey I am currently on has acceptance as a destination.

 

I realize I no longer have influence over my ex, so any efforts to "fix" her at this point are fruitless. We are not in communication over those topics anymore. And, the couple of times I did mention us, the wall went up anyway.

 

So, if I'm being honest, I guess I'm in a mild form of denial because I haven't yet fully accepted my current situation as my new, permanent reality. I've heard it stated here that the heart wants what it wants, even though the rational mind knows its highly unlikely (like reconciliation).

 

That's kind of where I find myself at times. Teetering between complete denial (and slipping into a mild depression, etc) and truly putting all this behind me and completely moving on (acceptance).

 

In a way, the wall my ex has built protects her from facing all the emotions and issues in her life. I am wearing my emotional issues on my sleeve, so to speak, by addressing them as they arise (via this forum, with my friends, etc.).

 

I assume my way is better for me emotionally than building a wall but man, it "appears" that I am struggling more! I suppose she may have an emotional blow up when she can no longer hide all her issues behind the wall, but I suppose she could go on forever hiding behind the wall. Interesting stuff.

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Hey guys. I was planning on having my girls last night for the usual 2 hour visitation & was miraculously able to get home by 5 PM. Knowing I had a shot at getting home from work unusually early, I texted my ex to see if I could pick them up at Grandma's at 5 & keep them until 8. I wanted to help my oldest with homework & I wanted to spend a little extra time with my youngest since she is recovering from her black eye.

 

I got a very happy text back with lots of smiley faces saying sure, that would be great (code for party time for her, I guess). Well, later in the eve, I texted her back asking if I could keep them a little later, knowing my ex lives 5 minutes from me & I could drop them off right before bedtime.

 

She texts back that I could even keep them overnight & she could come by my place & pick them up in the AM. Well, I have been contemplating this for awhile now & trying to figure it out in my head how I could make a scenario like this work. I have to get out the door no later than 6:30 AM to get to my Friday AM staff meeting. So, I went for it! We had a terrific night! All their homework was completed & checked, we went out to dinner, & even watched a movie before getting them to bed. This may end up working at least a couple of times a month. They wake up around 6:30 to get ready for school at their Moms anyway, so I let them sleep until I'm about to head out the door & their Mom should be waiting outside.

 

I also asked the girls if they would want to go to Church with me on the Sundays that Mom has them if I could arrange it. They both said YES!! Ideally, I could pick them up late on Sat PM because I don't think my ex wants to wake up super early on a Sun and to them ready. I'm hoping my willingness to get them Sun eve will increase the chances my ex will go along with this. Awhile back she was letting me get them on Sun AMs but then she stopped. The plan would be to get them back to their Mom's by 10:30 AM after our donut run. This is well before she wakes up on Sun so I'm hoping she goes for it.

 

Wish me luck!! Time to wake up my angels.

[lostandhurt]

Still,

 

Knowing all these things we are telling you and living them are two different animals. Give yourself time to learn this new life and in time it will be like breating for you, you won't have to even think, it will just happen. Think twice before you do anything, plan your time whe you have to be near your ex (entry and exit) and stay focused on the high road and your girls.

 

Working the schedule is a fine art form with a WAS. The more it seems to be her idea the better or if it benefits her in some way you will find her more receptive. Don't be surprised if you have the Sunday thing all worked out and going along fine and then bam! one day she shuts it down. This usually happens because someone makes a comment to her how happy you looked at church with the girls or you seem like you are enjoying it to much or she thinks the arrangement makes her look bad to other people somehow. The reason is often weak or vindictive but you just have to roll with it. If it does happen then just tell her "Your right, I am sure the girls will love going to church with you Sunday mornings" Always try and stay a few steps ahead. It is like hearding chickens really, you can't just charge right at them trying them to go where you want, you have to casually walk around them guiding them in the general direction you would like them to go.

Having the girls over night sounds like a great thing for all 3 of you. Make sure you don't turn into "DisneyLand Dad" but make sure the time you spend with your girls is fun and loving.

 

You are correct that acceptance is the key. The past is best left where it is as you have a bright future ahead of you. Trust me when I tell you this whole heart wrenching thing will make you into the best dad, man, brother, friend, son and person you could have ever imagined if you keep learning as we have...

 

Lost

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Man, that's some good stuff right there!

 

Son-of-a-B@#%! if she didn't react exactly as you warned! Initially she thought it was a great idea and said "That sounds great!" My guess is that she was thinking about all the additional freedom she would have on Saturday evenings. Then, later in the day, she texts back that she changed her mind a bit and wasn't really comfortable with every Saturday night (I never asked for every Sat night! My initial text made it clear that I would work with her & take them only when she didn't have plans either on Sat eve or Sun morns.).

 

I bet, just like you warned, she thought about it for awhile and figured it might not look so good to all her friends (the few that attend our church) that I am faithfully taking the girls & she is not. Well, I have news for her... they already know! We've been divorced for 10 months now & she has only taken them 1 time! I have not missed a single Sunday. Several of the couples from our old mansion community who we used to attend parties with see me there with my girls and they always smile nicely, ask me how I'm doing, etc.

 

I know for a fact that several of the church going wives do not invite her to their houses anymore & it drives her insane (I think it's widely known that our marriage ended because she got caught cheating). Now, the hardcore partiers who don't attend church still hang with her but that's it.

 

As for the Disneyland Dad, I hear you. I am very active with the girls & sometimes I do spend a little cash on higher end hotels, theme parks, etc. (hey, I admit that when I was rich, I used to enjoy dropping money on the finer things). But mainly we spend time together playing tennis, watching TV, reading Bible stories, or just talking to each other.

 

Thanks for the spot-on advice, as always!

[lostandhurt]

Well that is to bad she changed her mind but play it off when you talk to her. "Your right that I shouldn't have the girls every Saturday night, that wouldn't be fair to anyone. Let me know how often you want to take the girls to church and we can work out the details" Remember "hearding chickens" is the key.

 

Learn to see these things coming and get your ego well under control. It isn't a matter of just surpressing your ego, it is understanding it and the "why" behind many of our reactions to the things that are said or done around us. Notice how I said "around us" and not to us? The ego loves to make everything about us to we take it personally and react accordingly which often times turns out badly.

 

Take your time and keep working on what is best for you and your children. These things take time...

 

Lost

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Need some quick advice...

 

Ok, so today is Thurs & happens to be my oldest daughter's 12th bday. When I dropped the girls off at Grandmas last Sun after my wknd visitation, I had left a Starbucks coffee mug I had purchased awhile back & never used with my girls & told them to give it to their Mom (no card or anything). From time to time I would get little inexpensive gifts for her like this during the marriage and even afterwards (before going into LC). When I bought the mug, it was for myself but I forgot it was in my car until finding it when I grabbed my girls suitcases from the car at grandmas on Sun.

 

Well, I didn't expect her to acknowledge it by sending me a text (she didn't... until yesterday).

 

So here's the deal. She sent me a text thanking me for the mug & asking me if I was going to keep the girls overnight today like I did last week. She went on to say that she has completed 4 real estate modules & only has 2 remaining. She NEVER texts me about her life anymore. The last time she mentioned this was a few weeks back when I dropped off donuts at her house after church. I didn't respond much then (unlike what I used to, which was to go on & on about how proud I was of her, to encourage her, etc.). I know how much she craves my encouragement. She actually went out of her way to thank me for all the positive encouragement I was giving her 7+ mos ago shortly after our D back when I was pining over her like crazy.

 

So, now that I've gone into LC & don't say much of anything on the rare occasion we do speak to each other, it appears to me that she's craving the attention/ encouragement and is fishing for a compliment. What do y'all think?

 

Well, I ignored that part of her text & confirmed w/ her that I'd like to keep the girls tonight. Since its my oldest daughter's bday, I said it would be okay with me if she wanted to join us at a restaurant so we could celebrate it together (she invited me to do the same back in Sept for my yongest daughter's bday. We all had a very nice time, btw). So, did I make a mistake by inviting her? She immediately accepted the invitation.

 

It's probably not a big deal in any event, but I wanted to get advice from the experts here on whether I shouldn't have done that.

 

Also, I wonder if her continuing to try and keep me informed about her progress with her real estate class is what is called "breadcrumbs"?

 

I suppose my giving her a coffee mug & then inviting her out with us probably confirms in her mind I still am thinking about her. Sigh... she has to know I "still want her". It's kind of troubling that I am still subtly sending her signals when she could be getting engaged at any moment!! One step fwd, two steps back...

[lostandhurt]

Personally I wouldn't have done what you did but that doesn't make it wrong. The gift was not a good idea but not that big of a deal. Doing what is best for you is a big deal and these little things can hold you back. If you didn't "still want her" it wouldn't be an issue but since you are fragile you need to guard your heart and be careful.

 

What is done is done so make the best of it during this birthday dinner. It will be real easy to focus on your daughter anyways so do just that and be cordial to your ex...nothing more, nothing less.

 

I think it is important for you to ask yourself why you gave her the mug. I think deep down you wanted to something to happen. Nothing to beat yourself up over, just accept why you did it and figure out if it helps you heal or hinders it.

 

Idealy being cordial and getting along with your ex is good for the children so no one expects you to be a jerk, just be careful how friendly you are.

 

((HUGS)) and Happy Birthday to your daughter

 

Good luck tonight and have fun like no one is watching

 

Lost

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

We had a blast, just like back in September. I kept it platonic and focused on the girls. She brought up her real estate progress and I showed a little interest by asking her when she planned on finishing it. She is shooting for late March. I wished her luck.

 

Well, I dropped a bombshell on her when the girls got up to play video games.

 

I lost my job today! After being out of a high paying job for a year during/ after the divorce, I just started a new job just outside my field in Dec. I haven't really liked the job & I took over a 40% paycut and it looks like I won't last beyond my initial 90 days. Technically I will be fired but it wasn't working out for either of us. I really didn't see it coming though. I didn't realize I was under the microscope so much during the first 90 days. I'll find out officially in the next few days.

 

It's unbelievable what I've been through this past 15 months.

 

She was shocked but she remembered I had told her the job wouldn't be for me long term some time ago.

 

I was proud if how I handled myself. She actually cracked me up a few times when she was telling me about some of her quirks. She cracked up with me. It was cool but I didn't read anything into it. I'll give myself a B- for the entire night.

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Now I'm going back to job hunting in this awful economy. All prayers are welcomed.

[lostandhurt]

Sorry to hear you lost your job. That is a tough spot but I am sure you will come up with something soon. It sounds like you have a lot of skills, just finding a place for them is the hard part.

 

Coming away from these interactions and being okay is a great sign. Any one of these you can walk away from without a dazed look on your face and your mind spinning is a plus in my book. Well done!

 

Perhaps she will be more willing to let you have the girls more know that your schedule is open. Doesn't hurt to try right?

 

Good luck job hunting

Lost

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Technically I still haven't been told I'm fired, so I suppose there is still hope they may decide to keep me. Either way, it's time to update the resume.

 

Okay, what a bizarre couple of days!! One of the things I failed to mention about the bday dinner was that it was also our wedding anniversary. I said nothing and neither did she. Looking back on the evening, I was proud of myself for not saying anything and I wasn't surprised at all that she didn't mention it. What would be the point, right? Still though, it added to the strangeness.

 

So, I took the girls back to my place and we had our usual great time before bedtime. Ok, so on Fri I dropped the girls off at 6:30am and she wasn't there!! I get a panicked text at 6:35 stating she would be very late. I immediately call her and she is nearly in tears, saying she overslept & just woke up. Obviously she is at her BFs, 1.5 hrs away.

 

She sends over her GF to open the door & get the girls ready for school. Great parenting!! I received another text apologizing later in the day, which I ignored.

 

It gets weirder. At 7pm, I went to get gas and who do I see? My ex and her BF!! This is the first time I've ever physically seen her with another man. Beyond weird. Most divorced people go through it eventually I guess, but it was a shock not expecting it. She absolutely saw me drive by her & I saw him in the passenger seat. I went to the pump in the row beside them and I glanced over and stared at her. When she looked at me, I looked away. Very uncomfortable. I suppose it was weird for her too. I didn't expect her to wave me over &introduce me to him! I'm not sure if she would have said hi to me if I hadn't turned away when she looked up at me.

 

The girls were not with them. I found out later they were dropped off at a gymnastics place from 6-9. This has been her pattern, drop them off wherever she can, whenever she can so she can be with lover boy. I ended up going out to the big rodeo cookoff downtown. It was good to socialize after the couple of days I had.

 

I'm really interested to see how all this is going to affect me over the next few days. In the past, seeing her hasn't been good for me. I don't know how to define the way I feel. It was inevitable to see them together at some point. I guess I feel disgusted towards her. Not being responsible enough to get up in time to take care of the girls & constantly dumping them off places so she can go out shows her character and who she is as a person. And seeing these things about her really does help my healing. I am starting to see her in a new light. She is becoming trashy to me now. Beneath the attractive outer shell is a dysfunctional Narcassist. She really doesn't deserve someone like me. Most ppl would immediately change their feelings if there spouse cheated on them, destroyed them financially, etc. but I kept treating her like gold.

 

I think I may have finally turned a corner emotionally (I hope so). She's finally started to appear less attractive to me in many ways.

 

It's about time.

[benga]

Still - hang in there buddy.. Things seem to pile up together, but do know that there is a silver lining to every cloud. You might not be able to see it yet, but it is a promise that there is a good reason to hang on, be patient and wait it out. Something positive will come out of all of this for you..

[lostandhurt]

Still,

 

You nailed it when you said you saw her in a new light. It can be hard to accept that the person you wanted to spend your life with till you die is really like they are. It takes time for your vision to clear and for you to be able to see things clearly. You will find as you go through certain stages your vision will improve each time. This new vision isn't just apparent with regards to your ex but to everyone in your life. You will see your children differently, coworkers, family and friends. Use what has happened as a new start to the rest of your life.....a life that will be more real, more honest and more loving than it would have been if she hadn't become what she is and done what she has.

 

You won't find anyone here that is surprised by her actions. Dumping the girls off so she can do what ever she wants is common with the WAS. She dumped you, the family and now your precious children. Hard to believe a mother could do it but it happens all to often in these cases. She is actually making it easier for you to heal and see things you didn't want to see.

 

It would have been awesome if you would have walked up the bf and introduced yourself and ignored her. I basically did that with my ex'x bf. He isn't the guy she cheated on me with and it really isn't his fault so I don't hold any ill will towards him. I actually talk to him frequently when he picks my son up. Yes that is right he picks my son up and takes him to school pretty often too. I like the guy and feel better that he is around as I trust him way more than I trust her.

 

Good news about the job. Fingers crossed

 

Lost

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Lost, I remember reading earlier in the thread about how I was going to eventually see her differently. It truly happens.

 

Yeah, it would have been something to walk over there and talk to him but I'm glad I played it like I did. Staring at her & then looking away when she looked at me was pretty cool too. I wanted her to know I saw them but went out of my way in not engaging her. Just the night before we were laughing & carrying on at my oldest s bday dinner.

 

Well, bad news about the job. I got let go today for the first time in my life. I have been promoted, recruited away by other companies, and took a voluntary severance but never fired.

 

I am very hopeful that I will find a management position closer to what I did historically. This job was really not a good fit for me. I will be updating the resume tomorrow and hopefully find something before my money runs out. Kinda scary but I'm unusually calm. I have been through so much, I think I am better equipt to handle almost anything life throws at me.

 

I listened to an awesome sermon at church yesterday. I didn't hear anything from the ex about taking the girls to church (figures) and later learned that she took the girls to meet her BFs kids on Sun. This is a big step for them. The sermon talked about trusting God, lifting up problems and to stop worrying and trying to hold onto things or make things happen. I was floored! It was like he was speaking directly to me!! A new calm came over me and I finally realize that I am ready to take another step in my journey to acceptance. I feel better than I have in a long time.

 

I am going to relax tonight and wake up bright and early tomorrow and start on my résumé.

 

I think it's cool how you chat with your exes BF. I couldn't do it but its good that you are okay with him.

 

Tomorrow is another day...

[benga]

Still - hang in there on the job front.. Something will work out, but dont let the recent development motivate you. Keep your head up, and look forward to tomorrow..

You said "I didn't hear anything from the ex about taking the girls to church (figures) and later learned that she took the girls to meet her BFs kids on Sun".. You will simply have to tune off your ex wife.. What she is doing, with who she is doing what with - you will simply have to switch off.. Accept the reality of TODAY. It is what it is, and unfortunately a bitter truth, but for the sake of your sanity and mental peace, PLEASE accept it.

 

That said, you and your ex will have to reach an agreement on introducing kids to partners/GFs/BFs etc.. IT IS NOT HEALTHY for them and gets them really confused.

 

Cheers

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Thanks Benga. I really do get it and I really am beginning to accept things more than ever. The obsessing over what the ex is doing has to stop. I'm going to be laser focused on me and the girls.

 

As for my speaking w/ the ex about not introducing kids to our BFs/ GFs, I'm not sure about that. This is the first guy in the 10+ months we've been divorced that she's introduced them to. I'll give her credit for not introducing them to the 3-4 guys she dated immediately after the divorce. She waiting until she dated this guy for 7 months. I will not ask my girls about it and see if they bring it up to me. She won't listen to me anyway and she's already made the intro.

 

I do see how it might confuse them. They are old enough to understand we are divorced. They know their Mom has a BF and they met him a couple of months ago.

 

It's my feeling that she handled this fairly well.

 

Going back to your other advice about accepting it for what it is, I really do get it. From a mental health perspective, I think I'm better now than I've been in a long time. I feel I've taken some serious steps down the road to acceptance.

[John Bendix]

the meeting of the bf's kids. that's a weird one. When my X did have a boyfriend, she would bring him to all of the games that my youngest played. She hated going by herself because she sat there by herself. I think she thought that all the people who were there and knew her hated her for what she had done and would not really speak to them even though she knew them very well. My son hated it when she brought him along. They would monopolize his time after the game. The bf would hug all of my sons when he saw them. They are not ones to make someone feel bad so they just went along with it when he hugged them. It did not sit with me (I stormed off a couple of times) well as I stood on the side watching. She did not see them much so I let it go but my boys knew it was not something I liked to witness. Then again, caring about mine or kids feelings was never one of her considerations.

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

John, thanks for chiming in. I really don't know how to play this with my girls. I have them this wknd & they don't know that I know they went to his house for the first time to meet his 3 kids.

 

I think my ex is doing this because she is very serious about the guy & has hopes of marriage. She probably wants the kids to be familiar with one another. My ex stays overnight over his house on the wknds I have the girls as well as the Thurs nights that they stay with me. From what I gather, his kids are very used to my ex already. This next stage seems to be about my girls getting to know his kids. From what I am told, he doesn't spend the night at my exes when my girls are there but who really knows.

 

Should I ask them how the intro went? I really want them to be able to share their feelings with me. If I had to guess, my ex is encouraging positive comments from them because it suits her needs. She does this sort of thing frequently.

 

For example, she forced a couple of little girls on my kids. These girls are the daughters of my exes GFs and they used to hang out with my girls a few yrs ago. The problem is that my girls don't like these girls anymore. They've told my ex this but she still has the girls sleep over with them as a favor to their single Moms/ parents when they need somewhere to put their kids overnight. My ex does it so she can call in the favor if needed. She encourages our girls to get along with them even though they've told her they no longer like these girls. It's not surprising behavior from my ex, because after all, it's all about her, not our girls.

 

What are your feelings a out my ex taking our girls to her BFs house to meet his kids?

[John Bendix]

I do not know what the outcome will be. But it seems to me that sees this a benefit to her. My X did it to benefit herself so it would justify having a boyfriend that the kids would like.

She was "boyfriendizing" the kids with him and his kids and they would then accept it. My middle son ended having a one night stand with the boyfriend's daughter at a party that my son had (at X's house) and my X "invited" the bf's daughter.

[John Bendix]

I must add, that in my situation, that the boys were older enough to make their own determinations and choices of how much interaction they allowed there to be.

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Ok, apparently my ex was not with her BF when I saw them at the gas station. I had mentioned the encounter to her Mom (yeah, I know, big mistake) and I get a random text from my ex saying that when she saw me at the gas station the other day, that she was with her GF. I texted back (yeah, I know a mistake) to tell her GF that she is looking particularly masculine lately. I suppose it's possible that I mistook her for him. Whatever, no big deal either way.

 

Over the last 3 days, I have received 3 texts from her not related to the girls. Out of the blue she texts me about studying her real estate modules, and a couple of other random topics. She never does this. I'm not sure what all this attention is about. Some of my friends tell me that it's her way of keeping connected to me and to make sure that I'm still on the back burner if she ever wanted to get back together. Other friends tell me that she is worried about me since I lost my job. Others tell me that she feels guilty over her affair and all the aftermath to me & our family. On the outside, her life is going very well and she probably never dreamed how crushed I would be or all the bad luck I've had over the past year.

 

I think it's a combination of guilt over what she caused and sympathy over losing my job.

 

When she texted me about the details surrounding this wknds visitation with the girls, I texted her back that I would take them to school, etc. so she would be free to spend the entire wknd at the lake house (w/ her BF). I know, I know, I never should have texted that. She responded quickly back saying that she doesn't go there every wknd and that she really doesn't spend a lot of time there, actually. Wow, I didn't expect her to comment at all. Ive no idea why she felt the need to say that. The way she acts, it's as if we were still married and she's denying sneaking around or something, weird.

 

I also found out thru her Mom that the meeting between our girls and his kids went very well. He got my oldest a birthday cake and went to great lengths to roll out the red carpet. Sigh. It's tough knowing my girls are bonding with another father figure.

[calichick007]

I think gossiping about everything she does (or everything you think she does) with her mother needs to stop.

[ABetterLifeAwaits]

Calchick, you are absolutely correct. I have asked her a few times not to bring her up and usually she doesn't. Without being rude, I really need to insist. It's none of my business and it only hurts when stuff gets mentioned about her relationship, etc.

 

It's time to redicate myself to NC for all concerned.