Something suspicious is going on yet AGAIN... Young girls, etc. (Clean version!)

[Hope75]

Oh My God, Engaged Kitty. I cannot believe that you are with this man and plan on marrying him.

 

Honey- this relationship is absolutely toxic.

 

 

He's been arrested 35 times for petty crimes and been to jail a few times. Nothing major like murder, of course, or violence towards anyone, or anything dealing with minor girls (though quite frankly, I am surprised.). He hasn't been arrested in 5 years or so, he did straighten himself out, but that would explain the arrests.

 

35 times???? is not an accident- this is not a mistake. 35 times. and not 35 times that he broke the law- 35 times that he got caught. For what???

Once I went with my best friend to the store to get a simple beer and went to the park so we could chat, girl to girl, like friends need to do sometime, and he called her cellphone 35 times. Yes, 35 times. At first I answered and he kept saying "what are you doing? When are you coming back??? I don't understand why you had to go.." and blah blah, eventually I stopped answering. Everytime I would return he'd be worried. Once I got mad at him and spent the night at a friend's house, and he called a million times. He told me that the entire time he sat on the couch and cried (in between calling my friend's house a million times!)

 

he definitely has the history of relationship instability, with me and also the estranged wife, domestic violence galore

 

What the heck are you doing with him? You keep saying that he would never hit you- but he is violent and has a history of domestic violence. Trust me when I say that you are wrong about this. He is already controlling you.

 

Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger, frequent displays of temper

 

a nice/sweet gentle guy with a good heart can go from loving to raging psychotic.

 

He acts hugely distressed if I go ANYWHERE with any of my friends, so I rarely ever do.

 

These are the biggest and worst red flags I have seen. You have already altered your lifestyle by not going out with friends anymore so you will not upset him.

 

why else does he not want me to get on the pill but doesn't want to wear a condom

Because if you get pregnant by him you will be even more trapped than you are now... and he will have even more control over you.

 

Honey- I think like the above poster said- you KNOW deep down that he is NOT someone that you should be with, and NOT someone that you should marry.

 

I am terrified for you.

 

Do you parents know about all this? About his criminal record? The abuse? The way he controls and manipulates you?

 

Good grief, Engaged Kitty. What will it take for you to wake up?

[bigheart09]

I agree with Hope75.

[Batya33]

Me too, but she has to be motivated to leave and to feel like she is worthy on her own and does not need "a man" to have some sort of "status" or "worth." He may be controlling but she is passive. And perhaps to her the million phone calls are a sign that he cares as opposed to a sign of mental instability - some people just need attention, whether positive or negative doesn't really matter.

 

In my teens and early 20s I was all hung up on who had a boyfriend, a fiancee, a spouse - I referred to "my boyfriend" frequently so that people would know I was worthy. That all changed when I went to graduate school. Suddenly, I was accomplishing a 10 year old goal and dream all by myself and it had nothing to do with whether I had a boyfriend. All of a sudden I started making better choices in friends and who I dated because of my increased self-esteem.

 

For me it was school, for others it might be a skill they learn, a job they excel at, a house they fix up, a marathon they run, something that reflects your talents, that is a challenge, requires you to stretch yourself and has nothing to do with your status as girlfriend, fiancee, spouse (or even sibling or daughter). Then you see what you are worth, you are less afraid of being alone and no longer will you put up with less than respectful treatment.

[Dako]

Why analyze the guy when you should be attempting to forget him?

Unless you are attracted to drama, find yourself a guy who's decent to you.

Drama gets so old.

 

What's the deal with the number 35?

[Hope75]

This is a very good post, Batya. It was very similar for me- I was with a man to whom I was engaged to and lived with who was terribly abusive to me from ages 17-23, and it was all about him and what he thought of me because I had no self esteem or maturity/feelings of self worth yet. It was only when I left him (after over 5 years!) and went to college and excelled that I realized my own potential was not determined by my relationship status, or by him, or my ability to stand by such a volitile man and try to support and 'rescue' him, and what he thought of me. I mistakenly thought that by standing by someone so terrible that I was showing extreme strength... when in reality it showed extreme weakness and passivity on my part. I thought I was being some sort of hero by loving and supporting the impossible to love and support. I have seen some very intelligent women fall into a similar trap.

 

Kitty, I know that you put up a strong front- but deep down I think you are very afraid and very concerned and don't have alot of self esteem... because if you did you would be running for the hills, and would have done so long before things got to this point.

 

 

My only hope is that as you awaken that this will become more and more apparent to you and that you will realize how much control YOU have over how you allow someone to treat you and how when you allow someone like this to be an 'important' part of your life, that you devalue yourself and that is a choice that you continue to make and subject yourself to... every day that you wake up and stay with him.

 

Please come back and continue to post with us- we are here for you and are very worried about you.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Oh My God, Engaged Kitty. I cannot believe that you are with this man and plan on marrying him.

 

Honey- this relationship is absolutely toxic.

 

 

 

 

35 times???? is not an accident- this is not a mistake. 35 times. and not 35 times that he broke the law- 35 times that he got caught. For what???

 

 

Stuff like harassing phone calls (he and his buddies did it, he took the entire rap), parole violations, other various stuff, weed/drug paraphenalia, trespassing, just misdeamnors and stuff. One felony for attempting to sell but it was dismissed. He doesn't do any kind of drug now, nor does he drink, at all. This was about 7 years ago though, I was mistaken if I said 5, I looked it up online. When he was still at teen. He's not been in trouble in a very long time.

 

What the heck are you doing with him? You keep saying that he would never hit you- but he is violent and has a history of domestic violence. Trust me when I say that you are wrong about this. He is already controlling you.

 

When I said domestic violence, what I meant was there was domestic violence going on between he and his wife- which she was arrested for, for punching him and other various things. Perhaps to stop his rages and show him who's boss, but that's just speculation (and certainly not an excuse for any sort of violence.) He didn't do anything to her, he wasn't arrested for it or anything. And she was quite proud of it, (she's psychotic), everyone in this little hick county knows about it. But yes I agree, he is controlling me, or attempting to anyway. I rebel.

 

 

 

 

These are the biggest and worst red flags I have seen. You have already altered your lifestyle by not going out with friends anymore so you will not upset him.

 

Because if you get pregnant by him you will be even more trapped than you are now... and he will have even more control over you.

 

Honey- I think like the above poster said- you KNOW deep down that he is NOT someone that you should be with, and NOT someone that you should marry.

 

I was thinking along the same lines about why he wants so badly to get me pregnant. To make sure I can't leave, because I'll be very dependent on him. And like you said, to be trapped.

 

I am terrified for you.

 

Do you parents know about all this? About his criminal record? The abuse? The way he controls and manipulates you?

 

Good grief, Engaged Kitty. What will it take for you to wake up?

 

My parents don't know and they wouldn't care. They are divorced, and barely talk to me, let alone have tried to get to know him, let alone have tried to find anything about his background to see if he's good enough for their daughter. They're too selfish and busy with their own S.O's, who require their partner to put them first over their children. Plus I'm 21, so I'm pretty much on my own with this situation anyway. If I was a minor, I suppose there was something they could do, but they probably wouldn't anyway.

 

I don't know what it will take for me to wake up.

 

I wish I could sleep.

 

If my posts sound a little off, it's because sadly, my friends & I have been drinking all night, and I was violently ill around 6:30am, and drank a lot of water and stuff, and now I can't go to sleep. At all.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

It is a good theory, but I'm not entirely sure it applies to me. I don't feel I need a man to have status or worth. And I'm not the type to go around slipping in the words, "my boyfriend," just to let people know I have one. Heh, girls like that annoy me.

 

I don't feel that the million phone calls are a sign he cares, really. I do agree that it seems more like mental instability, (and it really is annoying, as well.)

[Batya33]

If you don't leave him for yourself, leave him because it would be a horrible role model - if not downright dangerous - for any children you might have. And understand that if he gets in trouble with the law again - with his record 5 years "straight" is nothing - as his wife you could be in trouble too.

 

There really are many men of character and integrity who you can have a healthy relationship with - aren't you and your future family worth at least that?

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Why analyze the guy when you should be attempting to forget him?

Unless you are attracted to drama, find yourself a guy who's decent to you.

Drama gets so old.

 

What's the deal with the number 35?

 

Well, that one day he called a gazillion times, we counted, and it was actually 34, but I rounded it to 35 for consistency's sake.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

That is an inspiring story above, thanks for sharing, Hope75. I'm glad you got away from that situation, no one deserves that. I know I don't either.

 

I am concerned definitely, and I don't have much self esteem sometimes. I don't know why, there's nothing wrong with me, I'm not stupid, or ugly, or trashy, or anything like that.. but I still have low self esteem. My friend said she thinks my low self esteem comes from my childhood. I would definitely agree. I don't know what else to say, I know all that you are saying is true. I don't know why I don't just pick up and leave. I mean, I do, but it would be hard to do so.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

If you don't leave him for yourself, leave him because it would be a horrible role model - if not downright dangerous - for any children you might have. And understand that if he gets in trouble with the law again - with his record 5 years "straight" is nothing - as his wife you could be in trouble too.

 

There really are many men of character and integrity who you can have a healthy relationship with - aren't you and your future family worth at least that?

 

Yes. I don't know about being a horrible role model though, he is ashamed of his past and has stayed clean and out of trouble for 7 years (my mistake, I looked it up, it's been 7 years not 5.) I'd say in that way he is rehabilitated.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Well, I do kinda know Hope 75. It's more like I don't really want to, though sometimes I do, then other times I don't, because I want to work things out and help him out with his issues. If that makes any sense at all. It sounds stupid but, I don't know.

[Batya33]

Well, I do kinda know Hope 75. It's more like I don't really want to, though sometimes I do, then other times I don't, because I want to work things out and help him out with his issues. If that makes any sense at all. It sounds stupid but, I don't know.

 

If you want to help him with his issues, break things off and offer to help him find a good therapist or psychiatrist - or some kind of objective third party who can work with his issues. If you want to be passive and claim it's "too hard" to leave him then stay with him.

 

You can only work things out if both people are committed to doing so. In this relationship there is only one - you.

 

My guess is if you won the lottery tomorrow and became a millionaire, you would leave or at least spend part of the money getting therapy and then leave.

 

The daughter of a close friend is 19 and a half and is very vulnerable to this same sort of situation - it scares me. She was with a so-called rehabilitated criminal like your fiancee last year - and luckily she knew it was time to leave when he left the country for a week, didn't call her and then got himself arrested. She now has a decent job (but is not going to college) and is making ends meet (barely) so that has raised her self esteem some but I can see her falling for a bad man again like your fiancee. I just pray that she uses birth control.

[Dako]

Sadly, many young women find a role "rescuing" guys who lack the self-respect to fix themselves.

It's so sad to see, and is a theme with some of my family members.

A shame to spend years being used until drama gets so bad you end up at the curb with kids. My niece did it twice.

Couldn't tell her a thing.

 

Now she hates men, works two jobs and raises three kids.

[Hope75]

Well, I do kinda know Hope 75. It's more like I don't really want to, though sometimes I do, then other times I don't, because I want to work things out and help him out with his issues. If that makes any sense at all. It sounds stupid but, I don't know.

 

 

Once again Batya is right on the money. This only works if he wants help with his problems. He doesn't think he has any problems right now, his only problem is you policing him at the store because you don't trust him.

 

Just for giggles.... Imagine you life if you left him. What would it be like? Where would you live? Would you have good friends to lean on for support? How would you take care of yourself? Would you be lonely?

[annie24]

Looking back at my own experiences, I would be in some relationships, and some of my friends would be, "You should leave, he treats you like crap." I'd say, "no he doesn't, he's just stressed" or "that's just how he is... he's not a bad guy...." And I didn't really get it, not during the relationship, or after we broke up or whatever. It wasn't until I had a new relationship where the guy treated me really well that I realized, "oh, this is what if feels like to be in a good relationship. why did I stay with that other loser for so long???"

 

I think this kind of might be the case with you kitty. I think because you really haven't had other serious relationships, you don't see how messed up this is. I sure didn't. It wasn't until I had a better boyfriend and saw my friends in very happy relationships that I realized that people in love are good and kind to each other. no hitting, throwing, mean words, temper tantrums, etc.... Yes, they have problems also, but they settle their problems by talking openly about it, talking to a therapist or a priest, etc....

 

Kitty - your fiance SCARES me! 35 arrests is NOT normal. Ok, sure, most people have a bit of something in their past. I've dated some guys who got arrested for a small prank in high school (running onto a baseball field during an inning). Or some people have gotten an MIP (minor in possession of alcohol.) But that is tiny, not 35 arrests! And breaking your christmas presents and flirting with teens? no, that is not normal. I've dated many guys, and they do not blatantly flirt with other women in front of me, especially not teens.

 

Anyway, I hope we are kind of making sense to you. think of it this way - would you want your best friend to be in a relationship like yours? or would you want her to be with a guy who doesn't break her stuff and have a bad temper and flirt with younger teens? If you would want better for your best friend, wouldn't you want better for you?

[Hope75]

Not to mention that people do not get arrested for making 'harassing' phone calls, unless he was violating a restraining order or threatening someone, which makes it all the more scary.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

You are in a classic co-dependent relationship, where he is the bad boy, and you are constantly dancing to his tune and letting your thoughts and actions revolve around him... this is NOT a good relationship, and will never be because of the way you two interact together, bringing out the worst in each other...

 

but you say he has been arrested 35 times?? why on earth are you with this person, and even for one second think he will ever be a good guy that brings you happiness, or a content and peaceful life? you both are addicted to drama, and i think that you are best off now seeking some psychological counseling to understand why you are obsessing about him, and why you would put up with this behavior from him, or this behavior from yourself...

 

you are young, please don't throw your life away spending your time and thoughts like this... go get help for yourself, and find a way to free yourself from this cycle of obsession and co-dependency, and become able to find someone who will truly appreciate you and love you like you deserve.

 

otherwise, all you will get for the rest of your life drama, and drama that gets worse and worse, not better.

[caro33]

Hey kitty, how are you doing?

 

Your confusion seems normal for the type of situation you are in, but it's not something that has to be that way any longer than you will allow it.

 

Let's have a look at how you felt when you wrote that upbeat PM to me and ask what had changed for you when you wrote that. What has just happened? What had been your thought processes?

 

I guess I think that the only way to resolve this situation is for you to change your own perceptions through making a plan, something like:

 

(a) Commit to change - accept unequivocally that this is not an acceptable state of affairs, whatever that means. You don't need to believe this 100% of the time, but take a minute to write it down. Write it down now. The rest of the plan is about what change actually means, and how to implement it. If you don't believe you need to change this state of affairs, read (e) below, or read some of your own posts. That is your fuel for change.

 

(b) Build your kitty portfolio, follow up the sorts of things we have discussed before: let's all help you, however we can, to plot your individual plans:

- how you are going to travel: where, when, to see anything in particular?

- how you are going to further your writing: what sort of writing? Are there courses, magazines?

- how are you going to build on your community work: are there certificates, travel opportunities, people who inspire you?

- anything else?

 

© Work on your self-talk, you need to build your self-esteem within your own mind. You need to tell yourself that you are as special as anyone else. I have probably said this before, but it is fact that if you repeat something to yourself you can eventually believe it. You are reinforcing the synaptic pathways in your brain, and you can make your own feelings improve. The magic is that you truly can be sceptical, but it still works. Remember:

- You are smarter than many, you have the benefit of youth on your side. You are an accomplished young lady.

- Your parents were just flawed people like anyone else. They made their mistakes. Perhaps they are selfish, in their own worlds. Whatever their failings, they do not reflect on you, and they are not indicative of what the world in general has in store for you. Your parents made their choices, within whatever flawed and human decision-making frameworks they had at their disposal. Yes, it was hurtful that they couldn't be the parents you needed them to be, but it's just life. Look at your fiance's daughter - would you want her to assume she's unloveable or will not find happiness in life just because her dad is limited? Just because he doesn't treat her as you know he should? What a tragedy if she goes on to pick men who are unworthy of her because she's just grateful that someone needs her. Kitty you have been granted the power and the capability to transcend your childhood - you need not be trapped by it.

- You are as worthy as any of us in this world for a meaningful and fulfilling relationship. One that does not involve self-delusion to stay in it. Many troubled, objectively unattractive, unintelligent and socially limited people find fulfilling relationships. Genuinely fulfilling ones, where they do not have any of the worries you do. There is no reason whatsoever why you have to settle.

 

(d) Seek professional help, someone with whom to talk this through in person. A counsellor. Please. And Please Again.

 

(e) If you are up for it, and if you can make every effort to not let it affect your self-worth, let's be clear about the relationship you have currently chosen. I am working from memory of past posts here so please be kind if I get it wrong:

- He has been in jail, and in his past, had an almost pathalogical need to get in trouble. He has 35 arrests. This is not normal. It is bad. It says a lot about him as a person, and it doesn't matter that it was before you met him.

- He has had a child, and has shown you he is not capable of being a full-time father. He leaves his daughter with his mother and is unreliable. This shows you that having children with him is a bad idea. He is not up to it. He is not up to it RIGHT NOW, this is not something you can blame on his past.

- He has been led by an acquaintance into saying lewd and inappropriate things to a young girl. He did this to 'keep up appearances' with some loser he wanted to impress. He did this while you were very near, this is not the past. It shows you that he is nowhere near getting his act together and being responsible for himself. He cannot be left with anyone with dubious morals.

- You also have doubts about his attitude to teenagers, full stop. Well that's a problem, you know it's a problem. So what if he's not as bad as some of the nasty cases you may have come accross in your community work. Do not let that be your justification for staying with him.

- He is violent and aggressive, to the point where you have no glassware in the house. This is NOT normal, it is very, very bad. You have the other thread where we all went on, with some reasonable horror, about you staying in that environment.

- He is obsessive, and calls you and your friends continually when you are out of the house. He is controlling, and wants to trap you in the house with babies. He is paranoid. You have seen for yourself that he has a personality disorder, a potentially serious one. He is dangerous because he has no insight into his own behaviour, no apparent desire to stop. He sucks up to you to keep you, rather than getting the help he needs. He is trying to entrap you in his world of confusion and fear, rather than step out of his world and live with you in a brighter place.

 

My god kitty, this is your wakeup call. You have said in the past that you are staying for love, in case he changes; that if he cheats he's out, or if he hurts your cats, but otherwise you want to give him 'a chance'.

 

Let there be no doubt: the man is unbalanced, he is unhinged and has little self-control. He loves you out of need; his love is not coming from a self-actualised man but from a very damaged child. You are not going to be able to repair him, your only chance is to distance yourself before you get sucked into his vortex. People like him exist; it is sad, and they are not all bad, but you do not have to marry them. You may be interested in criminology and victimhood but you do not have to get that close.

 

What crime can you possibly have committed to be worthy of this?

 

Of course leaving is going to be hard. But you are a capable person, you know this! You will have moments of doubt and fear, but you can do this. Let this be your great challenge, a chance to be the person you know you are. Get away, book a trip, get some space. Please! Pull beers in a pub somewhere, get some material for the Great Kitty Novel. It's all doable, you just have to 'man up' ('woman up' sounds weird) and make the first small step.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Just my opinion, not fact of course I think someone who's stayed out of trouble for 7 years isn't going to do the same things as they did as a dumb, immature teenager. I don't think it's a rule that someone who's been arrested in their past is bound to absolutely be arrested again in their future. My dad did a lot of horrible stuff when he was young, too. He was arrested for drugs & bar fights and stuff, but when he met my mother at age 29 he had been straightened up for years and hasn't been arrested since. He's 50 now. Just an example, of course that too isn't a rule.

 

Good luck to your friend's daughter.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Sadly, many young women find a role "rescuing" guys who lack the self-respect to fix themselves.

It's so sad to see, and is a theme with some of my family members.

A shame to spend years being used until drama gets so bad you end up at the curb with kids. My niece did it twice.

Couldn't tell her a thing.

 

Now she hates men, works two jobs and raises three kids.

 

I hope that doesn't end up being me. It sounds like my mother.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Once again Batya is right on the money. This only works if he wants help with his problems. He doesn't think he has any problems right now, his only problem is you policing him at the store because you don't trust him.

 

Just for giggles.... Imagine you life if you left him. What would it be like? Where would you live? Would you have good friends to lean on for support? How would you take care of yourself? Would you be lonely?

 

 

Nah, I wouldn't be lonely & I'd have my friends & siblings (I consider them friends as well) for support..

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Thanks for the reply Annie. Not to be rude and corrective, but although I'm only 21, I have had a few long relationships. Some brief but I've had some long ones too. The last one I had (a year and a half) was a million times worse. I was with one guy when I was 14 for 3 years, on and off. That too was a bad relationship (this guy had a definite thing for young girls, I was one of them and he also couldn't "keep himself" from cheating. In other words, a pathological liar/habitual cheater who loved to seek out impressionable younger teenage girls.) That relationship was also worse than the one I am in now. And when I was 17-18, I had a pretty good relationship, but it ended (he was going away to college in another place, it just wouldn't have worked.) And then I've had quite a few brief relationships, not all bad but none really fulfilling or anything.

 

I would love to settle our problems by talking about it or talking to a counselor. I am 100% open to the idea. But it seems when we ourselves talk it out, sometimes we come to brief 'resolutions' but the other half of time it's like going around in circles.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

Not to mention that people do not get arrested for making 'harassing' phone calls, unless he was violating a restraining order or threatening someone, which makes it all the more scary.

 

This is a quote from the website record, "PROF/HARRSS/THREAT LANG PHONE (PRINCIPAL)". Not sure what they mean by prof unless it means profane. You're right. I didn't mean to minimalize it or anything.

[pregnantkitty_1985]

I don't know that I'm 'addicted to drama' or in a co-dependent relationship but it's something to think about. Not to mention something I'm going to look up because I'm not 100% sure what such a relationship entails. You're probably right though. But I don't think I'm obessesed, though.