FWB never compliments me but always tells me when a woman is hot or sexy.

[Batya33]

I'm glad you trust him to tell you if he is going to have intercourse with someone else.  I'm glad you're mindful of your physical health.

Put together these two parts- he thinks it's impressive that you can separate sex from feelings -so you told him anyway- and he thinks it's ok to blab and overshare and make tacky comments about how sexy and hot other women are including a woman he had intercourse with.

So ..... does he really have to spell out that he likes having sex and it brings up sexual thoughts about having sex with women he finds sexy and beautiful? I mean it's not like someone who is allergic to cheesecake and says about your dessert -that looks soooo good - I wish I could have some.  He is really into having sex with women he finds sexy and beautiful.  So assume he's thinking along those lines when he makes comments like that to you.  

And please  read and reread what Lotus Black wrote -it is awful what she went through. Awful.  But -at least now she can share it with someone like you who is struggling and  grasping at straws to justify having sex with this person.

 

[yogacat]

Ever hear the expression @graphicdesigner?

"Don't choose the better man/person. Choose the man/person THAT MAKES YOU A BETTER PERSON."

[graphicdesigner]

1 hour ago, LotusBlack said:

Can I be frank, OP, I don’t think anything has been blown out of proportion at all. I think you are deeply unhappy with the status [quo] of your situationship and it has propelled you to seek out guidance, reassurance, and comfort from others, which is completely understandable.

You are so desperate to resolve the situation due to how unfulfilled it makes you feel, but when that guidance is given to you, reality sets in and you panic. You panic because you feel like you’ve finally found yourself - after years of grief from the loss of your life partner - in something reliable despite the instability of it. As hurtful as it is and leaves you feeling bereft, it is still there in some form, which, to your broken heart, is better than there being nothing there at all.

I know how it feels to be in such a state. My ex-husband was so damaging to me with his quietly calm but cruel words that it would drive me away so violently - the urge to feel released from the pain was so overwhelming I’d just want to scream at the injustice of it all, and sometimes I did. I hated my situation. But, in the next breath, I’d feel a crippling panic set in because if I didn’t belong with him, where did I belong? I would be alone again, just as I had always been, but this time with an infant. I didn’t want a broken family and just wished each day that if he just treated me with love, kindness, and respect - as I did him - then we could be happy and I wouldn’t be in this position, a position my own values and morals raged against with such indignation as to spur me on to call out his wrongdoings. And he would look at me with such indifference because I really didn’t matter in his life. And that made me panic even more. To not matter at all and end up empty handed when I had wanted so much and hoped for so much was often more than I could bare. And so, like this, the cycle would continue - I’d hate my situation but panic when the chance to change it was within reach.

But, no matter how much you want something, if it involves another person, then they need to want it too. Anything short of equal interest leads to the only inevitable outcome, a seperate one. Our situations were/are vastly different, but the desire to have something happy and fulfilling, and the fear of it changing to nothing at all, is very much the same.

Nothing has been blown out of proportion. This thread went in this direction because you were abiding by your own sense of integrity, justice, and morality. But when things got too close to potential change, panic set in and you gaslit yourself and justified this man’s behaviours to the point that you are now willing to accept what you intrinsically don’t want just so you can remain reliably unstable in your relations. Because, hey, something is better than nothing, even if that nothing is toxic sh*t.

I'm so sorry for what you went through. I can't imagine, especially with an infant. I assume you're out of that situation now? I surely hope so. My God, your situation compared to mine seems so ridiculous. Thank you for sharing your experience with us. I know it must have been difficult.

Maybe you're right. Maybe I just don't want to be alone. Maybe that's why I'm still dating other men, hoping to find that one special person so I can end this with the FWB. But with him, I still am alone, aren't I? We really don't spend time together, we don't have dinner together, we don't even wake up together. When he comes over, we make out, have sex, talk for about an hour, and then he leaves. That's pretty much it. I don't consider that companionship at all—which is really what I want right now. Yes, the sex is wonderful and I enjoy being with him, I even enjoy talking to him on the phone. Even when he sends me a text, my heart just flutters with anticipation. I feel like a teenager with this man. When I get a text, I always hope it'll be from him. Most of the time, it isn't, but I hope and anticipate regardless.

It's sad really, that I have gotten to this point in my life over this man who lets face it, I'm not in a relationship with. I had been celibate for over 6 years, and now that I have a man to have sex with, it feels so good and I am completely satisfied. But am I? Not really. I only wish there was more.

46 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I'm glad you trust him to tell you if he is going to have intercourse with someone else.  I'm glad you're mindful of your physical health.

Put together these two parts- he thinks it's impressive that you can separate sex from feelings -so you told him anyway- and he thinks it's ok to blab and overshare and make tacky comments about how sexy and hot other women are including a woman he had intercourse with.

So ..... does he really have to spell out that he likes having sex and it brings up sexual thoughts about having sex with women he finds sexy and beautiful? I mean it's not like someone who is allergic to cheesecake and says about your dessert -that looks soooo good - I wish I could have some.  He is really into having sex with women he finds sexy and beautiful.  So assume he's thinking along those lines when he makes comments like that to you.  

And please  read and reread what Lotus Black wrote -it is awful what she went through. Awful.  But -at least now she can share it with someone like you who is struggling and  grasping at straws to justify having sex with this person.

 

Again, he has never brought up sexual thoughts that he has had about other women. He wouldn't do that, because he knows it's disrespectful. There's a difference between saying someone is sexy than saying he wants to have sex with them. I'm sure he's thinking it, but he has never voiced it to me. And he has told me many times that he "can't keep up with me sexually" and that "my libido is in a different place than his." He claimed that after he and his wife split up, he was celibate for 8 years and then celibate for 11 months after he broke up with that woman. Not sure if it's all true, but why bring it up? I didn't ask him. Maybe he's right? I do believe him, he seems like such an honest man. Yes, he's technically cheating on his wife since they're not legally separated or divorced, but she is cheating on him as well. Apparently she knows about me, and so does his son. She knew about the woman he dated as well. Is it actually true? Obviously, I don't know. I only know what he tells me.

 

[Batya33]

But you are alone if by alone you mean not in a romantic relationship.  To me that is not "alone" -do you have friends? Family? 

LOL so it's not disrespectful to tell a woman he had sex with what he thinks of the looks of other women including specific women he's been sexual with?

Whether his wife is cheating or not doesn't make his actions right.  Like I said it's a gray area - he' and his wife have some sort of arrangement it seems - what isn't gray is that you are cheating yourself.  And lying to yourself.

[graphicdesigner]

38 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

But you are alone if by alone you mean not in a romantic relationship.  To me that is not "alone" -do you have friends? Family? 

LOL so it's not disrespectful to tell a woman he had sex with what he thinks of the looks of other women including specific women he's been sexual with?

Whether his wife is cheating or not doesn't make his actions right.  Like I said it's a gray area - he' and his wife have some sort of arrangement it seems - what isn't gray is that you are cheating yourself.  And lying to yourself.

You are correct, they do have an arrangement. It's twisted, I know. I personally couldn't do it but apparently there are lots of assets involved which makes them getting a divorce difficult. So apparently they agreed to do it like this for now, and see what happens. He always tells me he likes his alone time, but he's mainly either with his son or his siblings (he also has a twin brother that he's very close with), or by himself. 

Yes I do have friends, and right now, the only family that I have is my daughter, and she has her own social life and school, that also keeps her busy. I don't expect her to drop everything to come spend time with me, we raised her to have a lot of friends because she was an only child, so now she has tons of them, and she's always surrounded by them, which I'm glad. As far as other family? Not really anymore. I have my brother-in-law and sister-in-law, but since my husband died, I don't see them anymore. His family was always odd anyway, so I honestly didn't expect them to stay in touch with us after he died.

[Batya33]

6 minutes ago, graphicdesigner said:

You are correct, they do have an arrangement. It's twisted, I know. I personally couldn't do it but apparently there are lots of assets involved which makes them getting a divorce difficult. So apparently they agreed to do it like this for now, and see what happens. He always tells me he likes his alone time, but he's mainly either with his son or his siblings (he also has a twin brother that he's very close with), or by himself. 

Yes I do have friends, and right now, the only family that I have is my daughter, and she has her own social life and school, that also keeps her busy. I don't expect her to drop everything to come spend time with me, we raised her to have a lot of friends because she was an only child, so now she has tons of them, and she's always surrounded by them, which I'm glad. As far as other family? Not really anymore. I have my brother-in-law and sister-in-law, but since my husband died, I don't see them anymore. His family was always odd anyway, so I honestly didn't expect them to stay in touch with us after he died.

So again we're the same age.  What will you do today so you don't feel like you'll be alone just because you're not having intercourse with some guy? Can you get involved more in your community? A hiking group? volunteer work? A book club? That's great that your daughter is on her own! Our son is 15. I'm glad you have friends, too.  

People who don't divorce because of money are not divorcing -because they do not want  to- people who want to get things done do it even if it's difficult especially if it involves marital status.  If he wanted to be single he would be.  He makes his bed so to speak.  If he wanted to be with you in a relationship he'd have put the wheels in motion already so he could be with you as a single person with a potential future whether marriage or long term commitment.  If you wanted to respect yourself and stop lying to yourself you would do so despite how difficult it would be not to get to speak to this person anymore.

Please stop assuming what he tells you is accurate -he lives a distance from you, and assume that what is true is when he comes to visit you it's because he feels like having sex with you- that is true.  I leave it to you to trust him that he's not having sex with others as far as exposure to STDs -at least there he knows if he did that you could do that and expose him too.

His motive is to make sure you're available when he feels like having sex with you so be cautious in the level of trust you put in how he describes his life and activities when he is not with you. If you were with a man who wanted to be with you in a relationship with potential commitment the trust would increase since both of you would want to have a level of trust consistent with a romantic dating or committed relationship.  He might be a trustworthy person outside of the disonesty he chose in his marriage but with respect to you that begins and ends with not exposing you to an STD.  Otherwise it's none of your business what he does in his life when he's not visiting you.

[graphicdesigner]

6 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

So again we're the same age.  What will you do today so you don't feel like you'll be alone just because you're not having intercourse with some guy? Can you get involved more in your community? A hiking group? volunteer work? A book club? That's great that your daughter is on her own! Our son is 15. I'm glad you have friends, too.  

People who don't divorce because of money are not divorcing -because they do not want  to- people who want to get things done do it even if it's difficult especially if it involves marital status.  If he wanted to be single he would be.  He makes his bed so to speak.  If he wanted to be with you in a relationship he'd have put the wheels in motion already so he could be with you as a single person with a potential future whether marriage or long term commitment.  If you wanted to respect yourself and stop lying to yourself you would do so despite how difficult it would be not to get to speak to this person anymore.

Please stop assuming what he tells you is accurate -he lives a distance from you, and assume that what is true is when he comes to visit you it's because he feels like having sex with you- that is true.  I leave it to you to trust him that he's not having sex with others as far as exposure to STDs -at least there he knows if he did that you could do that and expose him too.

His motive is to make sure you're available when he feels like having sex with you so be cautious in the level of trust you put in how he describes his life and activities when he is not with you. If you were with a man who wanted to be with you in a relationship with potential commitment the trust would increase since both of you would want to have a level of trust consistent with a romantic dating or committed relationship.  He might be a trustworthy person outside of the disonesty he chose in his marriage but with respect to you that begins and ends with not exposing you to an STD.  Otherwise it's none of your business what he does in his life when he's not visiting you.

I just started playing tennis again after a 15 year hiatus. I played on leagues, tournaments, etc. for 10 years, and then had to quit once my daughter got into soccer and other sports (at 5 years old), and they always conflicted with my matches, so I stopped. I knew I'd be able to get back into it again once she was done playing sports. Well, now that she's 24 and has been out of the house for 5 years, it's time I get back into it. I have missed it so much! I'm also an avid skier and have a ski pass at a few of the mountains here where I live. The spring season just ended, so now it's onto summer activities, like tennis. Once I start getting into that again (I play for the first time tomorrow morning), it will keep me very busy, like it did before. Plus I work full time, so there's that, and I have other hobbies that I enjoy as well. I don't want to sit here and pine for this man any longer. A woman can only take so much rejection.

Please, can we stop discussing STDs? We use protection and there's no chance for that. At least it's very rare. I'm not sleeping with anyone else, and I know he isn't either.

[Batya33]

27 minutes ago, graphicdesigner said:

I just started playing tennis again after a 15 year hiatus.

How wonderful about tennis!!! (And yes skiing -I do neither and know many who do -great outlets and fun for you).  We can agree to disagree on STDs.  

[graphicdesigner]

21 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

How wonderful about tennis!!! (And yes skiing -I do neither and know many who do -great outlets and fun for you).  We can agree to disagree on STDs.  

Thank you, I am definitely looking forward to playing again. It has been too long. My girlfriend and I saw that movie Challengers last night (we used to play tennis together years ago), and watching all the tennis scenes really made me miss it even more, same with her. We were dying! 

I've come to a decision. After reading everybody's advice and recommendations with this FWB situation, I've decided that I am going to talk to him (face to face hopefully) and let him know how I feel, and that I want something more from him. Not necessarily a full blown bf/gf situation, but definitely more than what we have. I want to be able to go out with him and spend time with him outside of the bedroom. I love having conversations with him, and he really does make me laugh. I love his sense of humor and I want to experience more of that from him. Obviously I can't just from solely being in the bedroom. Even to go to a movie with him would be wonderful. I feel like we know so much about each other, but I want to know more. Maybe meet his son and/or him meeting my daughter. I'm sure once I tell him all of this, he will end it. I know it. But I think, for my sanity, it's the chance I have to take.

[Batya33]

I would be as specific as possible with your expectations and as simple and direct as possible -no huge back story.  Like "I'm no longer comfortable meeting up and having sex.  I want to go on proper dates we plan in advance and only if that's something that sounds great to you."  And if he plays tennis maybe ask to do that or some activity like going on a hike? Be ready to walk away/hang up the phone.

[graphicdesigner]

3 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I would be as specific as possible with your expectations and as simple and direct as possible -no huge back story.  Like "I'm no longer comfortable meeting up and having sex.  I want to go on proper dates we plan in advance and only if that's something that sounds great to you."  And if he plays tennis maybe ask to do that or some activity like going on a hike? Be ready to walk away/hang up the phone.

He doesn't play tennis, but ironically he's also an avid skier. Even though the season has just ended, he never asked me to go skiing with him, and his profile even suggested "meeting a new friend" to go ski with. I thought that was funny because we're both advanced skiers and he never asked me to join him.

[yogacat]

2 hours ago, graphicdesigner said:

Thank you, I am definitely looking forward to playing again. It has been too long. My girlfriend and I saw that movie Challengers last night (we used to play tennis together years ago), and watching all the tennis scenes really made me miss it even more, same with her. We were dying! 

I've come to a decision. After reading everybody's advice and recommendations with this FWB situation, I've decided that I am going to talk to him (face to face hopefully) and let him know how I feel, and that I want something more from him. Not necessarily a full blown bf/gf situation, but definitely more than what we have. I want to be able to go out with him and spend time with him outside of the bedroom. I love having conversations with him, and he really does make me laugh. I love his sense of humor and I want to experience more of that from him. Obviously I can't just from solely being in the bedroom. Even to go to a movie with him would be wonderful. I feel like we know so much about each other, but I want to know more. Maybe meet his son and/or him meeting my daughter. I'm sure once I tell him all of this, he will end it. I know it. But I think, for my sanity, it's the chance I have to take.

My take, or shall I say experience, is when a man wants to spend time with you outside of the bedroom, want to know more about you, and wants to introduce you to his significant persons (kids, parents, friends), he is going to do those things without being prompted by you. He wants to be doing all those things with the lady whom he is interested in being with, in a relationship.

But I think for your own peace of mind, what you're suggesting is perfect.

It will give you clarity one way or the other. I think your readiness shines off the page- just make sure you're able to hear things you may not want to, or, that he may not want to rematch, so plan your exit strategy if things don't go your way.

[Batya33]

1 minute ago, yogacat said:

My take, or shall I say experience, is when a man wants to spend time with you outside of the bedroom, want to know more about you, and wants to introduce you to his significant persons (kids, parents, friends), he is going to do those things without being prompted by you. He wants to be doing all those things with the lady whom he is interested in being with, in a relationship.

But I think for your own peace of mind, what you're suggesting is perfect.

It will give you clarity one way or the other. I think your readiness shines off the page- just make sure you're able to hear things you may not want to, or, that he may not want to rematch, so plan your exit strategy if things don't go your way.

I agree but she didn't ask if she should.  

[graphicdesigner]

7 minutes ago, yogacat said:

My take, or shall I say experience, is when a man wants to spend time with you outside of the bedroom, want to know more about you, and wants to introduce you to his significant persons (kids, parents, friends), he is going to do those things without being prompted by you. He wants to be doing all those things with the lady whom he is interested in being with, in a relationship.

But I think for your own peace of mind, what you're suggesting is perfect.

It will give you clarity one way or the other. I think your readiness shines off the page- just make sure you're able to hear things you may not want to, or, that he may not want to rematch, so plan your exit strategy if things don't go your way.

I know, I am planning on him ending it once I bring it up. Which is why I'd much rather tell him in person, than on the phone, and especially via text. I need to see his reaction and have him look into my eyes and tell me he wants to end it. It's different. I want to be able to explain myself and why I'm feeling this way towards him, but also reiterate that I am not falling in love with him, but I enjoy spending time with him and want to see him outside of just a FWB. 

Like I said, because he has made it very clear that he does not want a relationship, I anticipate he will end it right away. 

[yogacat]

6 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I agree but she didn't ask if she should.  

So, what's your point? Are we not allowed to offer our own opinions and thoughts? I'm not sure I understand your comment.

[Batya33]

1 minute ago, yogacat said:

So, what's your point? Are we not allowed to offer our own opinions and thoughts? I'm not sure I understand your comment.

Sure you can I am sharing why I didn't offer the opinion you did -she didn't ask so apparently she knows full well what the answer is likely to be - she's posted a lot about how he's praised her for handling sex with no strings attached and how he is lackadaisacal about even meeting up for sex.  So - to me personally when "should I" is not asked in that situation I personally avoid giving unsolicited advice -what she's choosing to do isn't dangerous, etc. and might help her more easily cut ties. I didn't understand your comment either in context so I'm so glad we cleared it up!

[Batya33]

5 minutes ago, graphicdesigner said:

I know, I am planning on him ending it once I bring it up. Which is why I'd much rather tell him in person, than on the phone, and especially via text. I need to see his reaction and have him look into my eyes and tell me he wants to end it. It's different. I want to be able to explain myself and why I'm feeling this way towards him, but also reiterate that I am not falling in love with him, but I enjoy spending time with him and want to see him outside of just a FWB. 

Like I said, because he has made it very clear that he does not want a relationship, I anticipate he will end it right away. 

What is there to end -don't you just meet up when you both feel like having sex? To end it simply stop taking his calls or take a call and say "thanks and I'm too busy to meet up again - take care!" I would agree with you that he likely will stop calling you to meet up for sex once you tell him you don't want to meet up for sex anymore.  If you want to clarify why you don't want to meet up for sex anymore what you've decided to share with him of course is fine.

[yogacat]

7 minutes ago, graphicdesigner said:

I know, I am planning on him ending it once I bring it up. Which is why I'd much rather tell him in person, than on the phone, and especially via text. I need to see his reaction and have him look into my eyes and tell me he wants to end it. It's different. I want to be able to explain myself and why I'm feeling this way towards him, but also reiterate that I am not falling in love with him, but I enjoy spending time with him and want to see him outside of just a FWB. 

Like I said, because he has made it very clear that he does not want a relationship, I anticipate he will end it right away. 

I hope it goes well for you. But what plan if it doesn't go as you are hoping? Do you have a strategy for yourself if he follows through and ends it? I totally get needing to get things off our chest and making clear things clear to ourselves.

If that's what you need to do to move forward -- where he is the one that ends it, then that's what you should do.

Sometimes it forces the other person's hand to do something which needs to be done anyway. But people can surprise us. I hope one way or the other that you get what you need. It takes guts to do what you are talking about, so make the decision and go ahead. 

[graphicdesigner]

14 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

What is there to end -don't you just meet up when you both feel like having sex? To end it simply stop taking his calls or take a call and say "thanks and I'm too busy to meet up again - take care!" I would agree with you that he likely will stop calling you to meet up for sex once you tell him you don't want to meet up for sex anymore.  If you want to clarify why you don't want to meet up for sex anymore what you've decided to share with him of course is fine.

With us, we both agreed that we wouldn't just ghost each other, we would tell each other if either of us wanted to end it. So in theory, yes, since it's just a FWB then there's nothing to end, per se. However, with us, it's just what we agreed to early on. As I said before, I tried to end it 3 times, and he tried to end it once. What brought us back to each other, I have no idea. We just did. 

14 minutes ago, yogacat said:

I hope it goes well for you. But what plan if it doesn't go as you are hoping? Do you have a strategy for yourself if he follows through and ends it? I totally get needing to get things off our chest and making clear things clear to ourselves.

If that's what you need to do to move forward -- where he is the one that ends it, then that's what you should do.

Sometimes it forces the other person's hand to do something which needs to be done anyway. But people can surprise us. I hope one way or the other that you get what you need. It takes guts to do what you are talking about, so make the decision and go ahead. 

I hope it goes well, too, but I don't anticipate that it will. For my sanity that will allow me to move forward with my life, I think this is the best way to go. I'm not satisfied with just a FWB anymore because I want more from him. I wouldn't be asking for a commitment or a serious relationship, just something that will allow us to get together from time to time and maybe hang out, go to dinner/lunch, watch a movie, sleepover, whatever—it's what I want with him. I want traditional companionship.

[yogacat]

29 minutes ago, graphicdesigner said:

I hope it goes well, too, but I don't anticipate that it will. For my sanity that will allow me to move forward with my life, I think this is the best way to go. I'm not satisfied with just a FWB anymore because I want more from him. I wouldn't be asking for a commitment or a serious relationship, just something that will allow us to get together from time to time and maybe hang out, go to dinner/lunch, watch a movie, sleepover, whatever—it's what I want with him. I want traditional companionship.

Sometimes these FWB relationships serve as a purpose, it's what you need at the time. And, through it you do find something more meaningful, or you find something that you can't do without. You sort of wing it and go along with what's being told to you, and hope that the fairy tale story of “friends-to-lovers” comes true. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.

I dated a man in my early twenties that only wanted casual initially, I walked away, we bumped into each other a year later, and we had a LTR that was 5 years long. He was an amazing boyfriend and the connection was so ridiculously strong. We seamlessly finished one another's sentences and always knew what the other was thinking, we laughed, we cried, we talked, we shared so many things. it was so natural for us, and not forced. We were on similar levels and got along, our chemistry was undeniable and it was one of the happiest times of my life.

He was also there for me through a very painful period in my life, so I'll always be grateful to have had him in my life even if it wasn't a forever thing.

I feel through this thread you've gained some valuable insight and it has propelled you to take action to sort things out and make the changes that you need to make for yourself. TBH I think despite the heartache you sound pretty strong and confident in your decisions, and realize you can't control how he reacts toward you.

[rainbowsandroses]

2 hours ago, yogacat said:

So, what's your point? Are we not allowed to offer our own opinions and thoughts? I'm not sure I understand your comment.

^^Of course you are yoga, it's what we all do here every single day whether the OP specifically asks or not.

Just like that poster did in her response:

2 hours ago, Batya33 said:

To end it simply stop taking his calls or take a call and say "thanks and I'm too busy to meet up again - take care!"

@graphicdesigner did not ask for opinions, she simply told us what she was planning to do - to talk to him and share her thoughts and feelings.  

Yet that poster took it upon herself to offer her unsolicited opinion about it anyway. 

Which was fine, again it's what we all do every single day!

So I'm with you, I didn't understand the comment either.  

And BTW I agree with what you posted quoted below:

2 hours ago, yogacat said:

If that's what you need to do to move forward -- [ ] then that's what you should do.

We should all do what we need to do to find closure and a sense of peace.

In graphic's case, given they've been "involved" for 3.5 months, ghosting would be disrespectful and rude imo. 

Ghosting may be acceptable after a couple of dates but not a 3.5 month involvement that includes sex unless he was harassing her or something which he's not.   

Common courtesy if nothing else. 

@graphicdesigner this has been an interesting thread!  Lots of twists and turns that ultimately brought you to this place...and clarity.  

I think talking to him is a great idea and you never know.  He may NOT end it.  

He may possibly gain a new respect for you for having the courage to speak your truth knowing there could be negative consequences.

It reflects high self-worth and self-love which are attractive qualities for anyone to possess.

I wouldn't expect it but remain open to all possibilities because as the saying goes "you never know, anything can happen, there are never 'absolutes' only 'possibilities."

 

 

 

[LotusBlack]

6 hours ago, graphicdesigner said:

I'm so sorry for what you went through. I can't imagine, especially with an infant. I assume you're out of that situation now? I surely hope so. My God, your situation compared to mine seems so ridiculous. Thank you for sharing your experience with us. I know it must have been difficult.

It was at the time, but I eventually packed up my baby and flew across the world and started again. My point is not for anyone to feel badly for me but to say that people often settle for situations that are not good for them because they are afraid of something they perceive to be worse than what they’re in happening to them should they leave the situation. 

What you are doing is not [in your subconscious mind] a friends with benefits situation. You are biding time in a toxic situationship and hoping that he will eventually want what you want if you stay the course long enough, even if it is to the detriment of yourself. Case in point by the very fact that you were upset enough that some of your dissatisfaction leaked out of the tight hold you have on yourself and compelled you to seek advice on the situation. Every single person in your world has told you this is not good for you, including the licensed, experienced psychologist. And yet, you gravitate to that which is bad for you as you try to bargain your way into a commitment this man doesn’t want. That is where you and I were the same. And the more history you create with him that is based on this dynamic, the further and further away you get from ever being the woman he chooses for his life (he already has one of those anyway - his wife). 

I’m sorry to say, that this relationship cannot, in my opinion, transform into a genuine, loving relationship because the dynamic has already been established and allowed to develop poorly for so long. You and he cannot unlearn the dynamic you and he created with each other.

I’d cut my losses and end things so you can heal and be open to finding a real and loving relationship with someone who is emotionally (and legally) available and wants what you want. 

[graphicdesigner]

1 hour ago, yogacat said:

Sometimes these FWB relationships serve as a purpose, it's what you need at the time. And, through it you do find something more meaningful, or you find something that you can't do without. You sort of wing it and go along with what's being told to you, and hope that the fairy tale story of “friends-to-lovers” comes true. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.

I dated a man in my early twenties that only wanted casual initially, I walked away, we bumped into each other a year later, and we had a LTR that was 5 years long. He was an amazing boyfriend and the connection was so ridiculously strong. We seamlessly finished one another's sentences and always knew what the other was thinking, we laughed, we cried, we talked, we shared so many things. it was so natural for us, and not forced. We were on similar levels and got along, our chemistry was undeniable and it was one of the happiest times of my life.

He was also there for me through a very painful period in my life, so I'll always be grateful to have had him in my life even if it wasn't a forever thing.

I feel through this thread you've gained some valuable insight and it has propelled you to take action to sort things out and make the changes that you need to make for yourself. TBH I think despite the heartache you sound pretty strong and confident in your decisions, and realize you can't control how he reacts toward you.

What a great situation that you met your FWB a year later and you ended up being in a LTR with each other for 5 years! That's awesome. I never asked him if that woman met his brothers/sisters (especially his twin brother), but I know she's met his son on multiple occasions.

1 hour ago, rainbowsandroses said:

^^Of course you are yoga, it's what we all do here every single day whether the OP specifically asks or not.

Just like that poster did in her response:

@graphicdesigner did not ask for opinions, she simply told us what she was planning to do - to talk to him and share her thoughts and feelings.  

Yet that poster took it upon herself to offer her unsolicited opinion about it anyway. 

Which was fine, again it's what we all do every single day!

So I'm with you, I didn't understand the comment either.  

And BTW I agree with what you posted quoted below:

We should all do what we need to do to find closure and a sense of peace.

In graphic's case, given they've been "involved" for 3.5 months, ghosting would be disrespectful and rude imo. 

Ghosting may be acceptable after a couple of dates but not a 3.5 month involvement that includes sex unless he was harassing her or something which he's not.   

Common courtesy if nothing else. 

@graphicdesigner this has been an interesting thread!  Lots of twists and turns that ultimately brought you to this place...and clarity.  

I think talking to him is a great idea and you never know.  He may NOT end it.  

He may possibly gain a new respect for you for having the courage to speak your truth knowing there could be negative consequences.

It reflects high self-worth and self-love which are attractive qualities for anyone to possess.

I wouldn't expect it but remain open to all possibilities because as the saying goes "you never know, anything can happen, there are never 'absolutes' only 'possibilities."

Maybe he will end it, maybe he won't. My heart is hoping he won't, but my head is telling me he will. It's the chance I have to take because knowing how I feel about him, I honestly don't think I can go on any longer with just a simple FWB. It started out great honestly, he gave me what I needed sexually at the time. It had been so many years and he was such a gentleman about it, making sure that I was ready and that I was satisfied. I'm lucky that he was like that because not many men would have been so patient. He really is a good guy, regardless of what you all might believe. Which is fine because that doesn't change how I feel towards him either way.

But you're right, you never know as I'm sure stranger things have happened.

14 minutes ago, LotusBlack said:

It was at the time, but I eventually packed up my baby and flew across the world and started again. My point is not for anyone to feel badly for me but to say that people often settle for situations that are not good for them because they are afraid of something they perceive to be worse than what they’re in happening to them should they leave the situation. 

What you are doing is not [in your subconscious mind] a friends with benefits situation. You are biding time in a toxic situationship and hoping that he will eventually want what you want if you stay the course long enough, even if it is to the detriment of yourself. Case in point by the very fact that you were upset enough that some of your dissatisfaction leaked out of the tight hold you have on yourself and compelled you to seek advice on the situation. Every single person in your world has told you this is not good for you, including the licensed, experienced psychologist. And yet, you gravitate to that which is bad for you as you try to bargain your way into a commitment this man doesn’t want. That is where you and I were the same. And the more history you create with him that is based on this dynamic, the further and further away you get from ever being the woman he chooses for his life (he already has one of those anyway - his wife). 

I know, I think about his wife every single day. It eats at me and consumes me everyday. I look at pictures of her and I am so withdrawn, that it hurts. I really do wish I knew what that other woman he dated looked like. Just so I can get a picture of her and put a face to her name. He has mentioned her and her situation several times, which doesn't bother me really, but what does bother me is he told me they started out casually in the beginning (not sure if it was a FWB though), and then he said he did fall in love with her. I can't tell you how that made me so jealous, but even after he said he loved her, he still broke it off with her because she said he wasn't a traditional boyfriend and she wanted more of his time/attention. He told her he couldn't give that to her so they agreed to break up. So what would I be in his eyes? Definitely not someone he has fallen in love with. We don't see each other very often—and apparently they saw each other a lot because she lives 4 miles from him—so how could he even come close to feel the same about me? He met her kids, she met his, she has even been to his house and apparently they had sleepovers together (at her house). I would love to have all of that with him, but I don't think it'll ever happen.

[Batya33]

lol too many pronouns where I was quoted above and OP I didn’t see where anyone suggested ghosting. I wouldn’t but also totally fine to opt for declining to meet up for sex the next time he offers and confirming you won’t be planning on it. Or do if the way you decided in the previous posts. I really liked Lotus’s take on it. How she evaluated your interactions with him. So spot on. 
Shortly after 9-11 I met a total hottie through a dating site. He was all about sex and I made it clear no intercourse unless we were exclusive and committed etc. he - tolerated - that for a few months - until he didn’t. 
About 1.5 years later he contacted me. Wanted to date me again. Told him I still felt the same about casual sex - nope. He was good with it. Then he wasn’t 4 dates later. So I’m not sorry I gave it another chance and totally not surprised his attitude hadmt changed. And or he realized he wasn’t that into me. 
ironically he met his future wife a year or so later - invited me to the engagement party and I went. Told me I looked hot and also told me a few years later after they had their son he cheated on her. And complained to me via IM about the 6 weeks post birth where they couldn’t have sex. Sigh. 
I don’t think all people who have casual sex also cheat - not by a long shot. But I do think that it’s most often a bad idea to give another chance when the core values and standards about sexual activity are so diametrically opposed.  He never lied to me or cheated on me - I mean we’d only gone out a handful of times - but I let his hotness and charm and brilliance overtake me to an extent I’m not happy with. 

[graphicdesigner]

1 hour ago, Batya33 said:

lol too many pronouns where I was quoted above and OP I didn’t see where anyone suggested ghosting. I wouldn’t but also totally fine to opt for declining to meet up for sex the next time he offers and confirming you won’t be planning on it. Or do if the way you decided in the previous posts. I really liked Lotus’s take on it. How she evaluated your interactions with him. So spot on. 
Shortly after 9-11 I met a total hottie through a dating site. He was all about sex and I made it clear no intercourse unless we were exclusive and committed etc. he - tolerated - that for a few months - until he didn’t. 
About 1.5 years later he contacted me. Wanted to date me again. Told him I still felt the same about casual sex - nope. He was good with it. Then he wasn’t 4 dates later. So I’m not sorry I gave it another chance and totally not surprised his attitude hadmt changed. And or he realized he wasn’t that into me. 
ironically he met his future wife a year or so later - invited me to the engagement party and I went. Told me I looked hot and also told me a few years later after they had their son he cheated on her. And complained to me via IM about the 6 weeks post birth where they couldn’t have sex. Sigh. 
I don’t think all people who have casual sex also cheat - not by a long shot. But I do think that it’s most often a bad idea to give another chance when the core values and standards about sexual activity are so diametrically opposed.  He never lied to me or cheated on me - I mean we’d only gone out a handful of times - but I let his hotness and charm and brilliance overtake me to an extent I’m not happy with. 

I can see that. It's so difficult to walk away from someone you really find attractive. It's how I feel about him. I find him attractive in so many ways—not just looks, but everything. Well, aside from his marital situation of course. But I do want everyone to know, that it's NEVER him that contacts me to have sex, it's always ME who contacts him to have sex. I honestly don't think he has contacted me for sex one time. Definitely the tides are turned lol.