The New Normal

[bungalo]

I have a good life, fairly happy marriage, (I'm Male 50+) good relationships (for the most part) with my family, but other than an old friend from grade school who lives 7 hours away, I have no close friends anymore.  I really try to cultivate new friendships (people from work, organizations I'm a member of, fellow musicians) and it seems I always wind up being the initiator, the organizer, the planner, the maintenance person.  I really think a huge part of the problem is electronic communication, and yes, I'm conscious of the irony of my position on this as I key in this topic! People have grown used to ignoring texts, IM's, voicemail until they're good and ready to respond.  And actually talking on the phone is just beyond the pale for way too many folks now. 

I will keep trying, but it just gets so frustrating.  This past Friday, I heard from one of my nephews who lives in CA-2000 miles away from me.  It had been four months since we had interacted.  I was really happy to hear from him, and responded to his text the same day I received it, and I got nothing back. I understand that people have lives, etc..but come on, I've seen the stats.  People carry their smart phones around all day long, checking them dozens of times per day,  and it's even socially acceptable to respond to a text while you're in the company of other people at a social gathering. To me, it's "more is less."  We can all communicate and reach our intended party in milliseconds, but instead of bringing us closer, it often demonstrates how isolated we all are, when people can't be bothered to respond-even in the slightest.  

[Seraphim]

I think it is normal for younger generations to assume not answering is ok. I see this in all facets of society from the same age group of people . I don’t understand it. I find it annoying as well. 

[bungalo]

Sadly, I also see this lack of reciprocity among older folks as well.

[Seraphim]

10 minutes ago, bungalo said:

Sadly, I also see this lack of reciprocity among older folks as well.

I don’t see that much because I don’t have a lot of older folks in my life as they have passed away unfortunately. I have my mom who is always responsive unless she is sleeping or visiting with someone . I have my mother-in-law and you can only see her in person or on a regular phone. 
 

So I find it a predominately younger person issue . 

[Batya33]

I hear you but what I do is simply keep to my standards of reliability/following up/having real conversations. 

I am 56 and recently reconnected with a friend my age who actually "ghosted" me years ago.  We've seen each other twice in person since then in the last 4-6 weeks (unfortunately she is moving away next month!).  We texted a few times -that was all it took -to find a good time to meet for a walk or coffee, and we met on that day and time and each time spent around an hour-1.5 hours together in person chatting/walking/even doing some shopping.  We each participated in making the plan, we chose a place convenient to both of us, etc.  It felt so normal/great. 

When we used to meet years ago it was just as easy/smooth.  

I caught up with a high school friend a few days ago.  We'd reconnected on FB but hadn't spoken by phone in over 40 years and we marveled at how we made an appointment to speak LOL unlike in the 80s. But she kept the appointment as did I.  I wish it were like that the majority of the time -I agree that ironically with more technology there is less reliability.  Like I don't love getting a text about running late when I'm already there (unless it's 5-10 minutes).  

I'm sorry you're frustrated!

[waffle]

Maybe I'm just old (I'm 50+ also) but it seems to be a sign of the times rather than a young person's issue to judge the quality of a relationship by your phone activity and the amount of time it takes to contact you.

[Batya33]

Just now, waffle said:

Maybe I'm just old (I'm 50+ also) but it seems to be a sign of the times rather than a young person's issue to judge the quality of a relationship by your phone activity and the amount of time it takes to contact you.

I judge level of respect and reliability so if someone says they're going to contact me or that they want to make a plan and then they don't I find that person unreliable.  Reliability is important to me in a friendship.I've had a number of people I've been in contact with through FB groups say they are very enthusiastic about meeting/having a phone call but when it actually comes time to do so it's radio silence.  To me that is low quality behavior - people do get busy but I am most comfortable with those who live up to their commitments or apologize if they cannot or forgot, etc.

[Seraphim]

8 minutes ago, waffle said:

Maybe I'm just old (I'm 50+ also) but it seems to be a sign of the times rather than a young person's issue to judge the quality of a relationship by your phone activity and the amount of time it takes to contact you.

I am over 50 as well. I think of texting or messaging the same as talking to a person’s face. Would I stand there and not speak when someone is talking to my face ? Nope. That’s rude. I was taught you respond when spoken to and you don’t call or message before 9 AM or after 9 PM. 

[waffle]

2 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I judge level of respect and reliability so if someone says they're going to contact me or that they want to make a plan and then they don't I find that person unreliable.  Reliability is important to me in a friendship.I've had a number of people I've been in contact with through FB groups say they are very enthusiastic about meeting/having a phone call but when it actually comes time to do so it's radio silence.  To me that is low quality behavior - people do get busy but I am most comfortable with those who live up to their commitments or apologize if they cannot or forgot, etc.

I guess?  I'm going to have to check my phone but a friend from high school said back in January "we should get together for lunch" . . . and I texted her sometime in early March (?) asking when would be a good time.  She answered me after two weeks apologizing for the delay and asking me if weekends or weekdays work better?  I answered fairly quickly--I think the next day--and said maybe a weekday evening . . . it's been several weeks and I've heard nothing but I'm not stressing, she'll answer when she can.  If she never answers, I move on with my already very full life.  My phone is just sort of an accessory.  I place very little importance on it or my communications on it.  Half the time I can't even find it.

[Batya33]

Just now, Seraphim said:

I am over 50 as well. I think of texting or messaging the same as talking to a person’s face. Would I stand there and not speak when someone is talking to my face ? Nope. That’s rude. I was taught you respond when spoken to and you don’t call or message before 9 AM or after 9 PM. 

So I don't feel I have to respond right away to a text and with my friends if we're having a text chat -and it's not really important/time sensitive -we both know we might not respond right away and it's cool.  

I have taken to silencing my phone at times I need me time -my meal times (I'm not an eat on the run gal) and I go to bed quite early so I shut the phone off about 45 minutes before then, to wind down.  I've told certain people about when I'm typically not available and there are people who still text or call at mealtimes, and late at night.  I absolutely don't expect everyone to remember my schedule of course but when the text comes in super late at night I'm a little surprised.

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, waffle said:

I guess?  I'm going to have to check my phone but a friend from high school said back in January "we should get together for lunch" . . . and I texted her sometime in early March (?) asking when would be a good time.  She answered me after two weeks apologizing for the delay and asking me if weekends or weekdays work better?  I answered fairly quickly--I think the next day--and said maybe a weekday evening . . . it's been several weeks and I've heard nothing but I'm not stressing, she'll answer when she can.  If she never answers, I move on with my already very full life.  My phone is just sort of an accessory.  I place very little importance on it or my communications on it.  Half the time I can't even find it.

Yes we have different standards. It's all good.  If someone says something tentative like that -that's tentative.  That's not a plan.  I mean if someone texts "let's meet in late February when I'm back from France for coffee" (this was months in advance) and I put it on my reminders to follow up in early February and I do - if she then replies "cool how about Feb. __ at __AM" -if I reply that that is good I think she should respond to confirm or reschedule or whatever. In that case -she did (and we hadn't seen each other in years!) - and then cancelled the day before because of a work deadline.  Her cancelling was completely fine and I appreciated that she gave me advance notice and it's fine with me that she hasn't been in touch to reschedule.

I don't place importance on my phone. I place importance on reliability and respect and consideration in a friendship.  Communication is part of that whether by phone or some other way. 

I have a good friend from childhood who has been very flaky the last 3 years(and was somewhat flaky the years prior).  I find it annoying because she's not good with her word.  We communicated last September- she told me -I have to go now but I will text (she actually did have a specific day in October in mind because it was a day she was off).  I haven't heard from her. I chose not to wish her happy Bday on FB last week because of her behavior the last couple of years - constant empty promises of "I'll text you very soon!".  I feel disrespected including because of this most recent exchange.  

[Seraphim]

Me, probably if someone answered me months later I wouldn’t even know what they were talking about or care. I consider someone who answers me 3 times a year to be an acquaintance, not a friend. 
 

I also have do not disturb on my phone to keep clients from messaging me during family hours, certain people can come through that block, my family and very good friends. 

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, Seraphim said:

Me, probably if someone answered me months later I wouldn’t even know what they were talking about or care. I consider someone who answers me 3 times a year to be an acquaintance, not a friend. 
 

I also have do not disturb on my phone to keep clients from messaging me during family hours, certain people can come through that block, my family and very good friends. 

For me it depends on context. I hav friends from childhood and high school where we can pick up exactly where we left off.  I have acquaintances I meet or speak to now and again. 

[Seraphim]

10 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

For me it depends on context. I hav friends from childhood and high school where we can pick up exactly where we left off.  I have acquaintances I meet or speak to now and again. 

True, I have high school friends as well that I haven’t seen in years and years, I saw one last summer and we talked for hours and hours when they came out our way. But they live 5000 KM or more away. If I have people close to me that I only speak to 3 times a year, nahhhhh not really worth the time . 

[Cherylyn]

I have friends and family who have the same habits as yours.  If I have a peaceful relationship with them and if I have to be the initiator to make any in person socializing possible,  I do it because I can't always depend on others to do what I want even if it's reasonable.  I've often complained about this very subject to my husband. 

For example,  for some relatives' various surprise home parties for 50+ guests,  I was the mastermind regarding all the food (catered food in chafing trays, a lot of homemade side dishes / appetizers / desserts),  background playlist (not too loud) music courtesy of my husband and everyone else is plain lazy with excuses galore.  In-laws only fired off online invitations,  set up tables,  chairs,  decorations and ordered a bakery cake.  How hard was that? 🙄 My husband,  sons and I did all the work.  In the past,  whenever I relied on others to host a party,  it was a failure.  Food tasted appalling,  there wasn't any enjoyable,  tasteful background music and guests were disappointed.   I overheard my relatives and in-laws jubilantly echo post-party:  "Wow, we really know how to throw a party?"  Uhh,  excuse me?   🙄  Who made the party a success?   Yours truly. 😒  I've come to the conclusion that if parties need to be done right,  I'll take charge and do it.  I am the Martha Stewart type.  🙂  It's better than me observing guests having a lousy time. 

I complained about relatives and in-laws deferring to me.  My mother put a different spin on it.  She said that it was an honor and a form of respect that I am reliable and never flaked.  She told me to consider it a compliment that I'm a doer and go getter instead of being the type of person who can't deliver.  She said that they wouldn't depend on me if they knew I didn't have a stellar track record.  I guess she is right as usual.  Even though I felt bitter and resentful at the time,  it actually paid off.  Nowadays,  my in-laws are extremely loyal to my husband and me when it counts the most.  Therefore,  in this regard,  blood is thicker than water and I've paid my dues.  It's been an ultimate boon for me.  ☺️

As for local friends,  many times I'll take the initiative and fortunately,  even if it takes some time to receive a reply,  we'll eventually make it happen such as shopping together,  dining out,  walks,  sometimes outings with husbands included and the like.  If we waited around for someone to take action,  it won't happen. 😒

My local best friend is from childhood and my other local friend is someone whom I've known for many years.  We pick up right where we left off even if it's been awhile.  We realize everyone is very busy with their own lives.  No harm,  no foul. 

It's the sign of the times.  I've complained to my husband about how rude various people are.  My husband is a 'go with the flow' type of guy.  He doesn't get agitated and irritated very easily.  He basically said to lower your expectations in people so your disappointment level in them is less.  I think he's onto something and there is truth to the matter.  It is actually good to have a wary and jaded attitude towards people so you're no longer surprised nor shocked.  Change how you think and you won't feel offended anymore.  You'll grow thicker skin and become numb. 

Keep trying even though you're frustrated @bungalo.  You have to light a fire under people's rears in order to make it happen.  It's the way it is for many. 

I agree regarding the age of the Internet,  social media,  cell phones,  electronic communication,  etc.  It either can bring people closer together or actually isolate people.  It is a double edge sword to be sure.  🤔

[catfeeder]

15 hours ago, bungalo said:

I was really happy to hear from him, and responded to his text the same day I received it, and I got nothing back.

Awww, I'm sorry to hear that. Had you asked him something that required an answer? For instance, were you trying to set up a date or time for something specific?

[Wiseman2]

15 hours ago, bungalo said:

  It had been four months since we had interacted.  I was really happy to hear from him, and responded to his text the same day I received it, and I got nothing back.

Sorry this happened. It doesn't seem like you're that close. Why did he reach out to you? What was your response?

That's ok. Perhaps if you or he have social media you could stay connected that way?

How is your work and home life? You mentioned "fairly happy". Are kids living at home? Do you and your wife socialize much? Do you have a lot of hobbies, interests and friends outside of home and work?