Would you RSVP and send condolences or ignore completely?

[Seraphim]

9 hours ago, Cherylyn said:

Thank you @Seraphim .  It's sad because I remember her good qualities such as bringing home cooked meals to my house after I brought my newborn sons home from the hospital.  She bought them cute clothes, too.  She bought 3 pairs of cute sandals for me years ago.  Stuff like that. 

She has changed.  She was actually a very nice person when she was married to husband #1 and their marriage lasted less than a year! 

Husband #2 was quiet when I first met him and then as he prospered and they moved into their palatial McMansion, they changed into narcissitic gaslighters.  BIL (brother-in-law) has a major mouth problem and becomes insanely jealous whenever my sister does not pay attention to him.  He constantly interrupts her during her conversations with others and if that doesn't work, he'll downgrade and say something very rude and unkind to chase you off.  No one is spared.  Should anyone call them on it, she'll defend her meal ticket by gaslighting you.  It's sick. 

Bad traits outweigh any good traits, unfortunately. 

My siblings think that being called a liar isn't a big deal and something to sneeze at.  They're in for a rude awakening. 🥴

I understand, but no gains can be made unless both parties are willing. I think too it is good remember your sister is a victim of abuse like your mom so she is not free to do as she would normally . As far as memories of childhood I think I spoke to that before. There are a lot of years between you she literally won’t have the same memories. My brother is only 3.5 years younger than me and in some cases he has completely different memories of the same situation and no memories of others. That IS his memories. I don’t seek to change them. I just tell him I was older have a more complete picture should he ever want to know. My brother was in an abusive marriage for 20 years and I hardly saw him . It was a devastating blow for both of us. We still suffer it now even though he has been gone from her for almost 10 years now. 
 

I know you don’t want to forgive now, but never is a long time. Leave possibilities open for when times are better. People don’t go from being a nice person to a narcissist as an adult. Personality disorders are developed much younger. She is trying to survive. 

[Lambert]

Hi @Cherylyn

I wanted to post on this thread again to explain something that I have been doing that has been helpful to me and might be for you.

Like you, I have a turbulent relationship with my sister and there are a lot of ***-for-tat things over the years, that trigger my monkey brain- rehashing, keeping score, rethinking what I said, planning what I will say next time... blah blah blah.  It was making me crazy and I couldn't seem to stop it.  

Then I started changing my thoughts.  I based it off something I learned in a yoga class.  Thinking of people and sending them love.  Whenever I think of her, I stop myself and send her love or kindness or peace.  It takes the sting out of the thoughts and I stop thinking of her so much because I am not feeding into my ego's negative self-talk.  

It's a practice and I "start again" a lot.  LOL but it does help.... 

[Seraphim]

4 minutes ago, Lambert said:

Hi @Cherylyn

I wanted to post on this thread again to explain something that I have been doing that has been helpful to me and might be for you.

Like you, I have a turbulent relationship with my sister and there are a lot of ***-for-tat things over the years, that trigger my monkey brain- rehashing, keeping score, rethinking what I said, planning what I will say next time... blah blah blah.  It was making me crazy and I couldn't seem to stop it.  

Then I started changing my thoughts.  I based it off something I learned in a yoga class.  Thinking of people and sending them love.  Whenever I think of her, I stop myself and send her love or kindness or peace.  It takes the sting out of the thoughts and I stop thinking of her so much because I am not feeding into my ego's negative self-talk.  

It's a practice and I "start again" a lot.  LOL but it does help.... 

Exactly I pray for those who have wounded me to the core because they need more help than I do. Those often the most in need of love are the hardest to deal with. 

[Lambert]

1 minute ago, Seraphim said:

Exactly I pray for those who have wounded me to the core because they need more help than I do. Those often the most in need of love are the hardest to deal with. 

Right!  It took me a long time to figure this out but now that I have-- it's a blessing.  It's easy to say and not as easy to practice, especially to start, but once I saw how it impacted my own well-being, I am not going back. 

[tattoobunnie]

Just text you "cant make it"  Then, ignore whatever else she says.  You are thinking too hard on how to please a narcissist.  You will never please them.  Their sole goal is to tear you down.

[catfeeder]

17 hours ago, Cherylyn said:

I need to stop being soft and stop thinking about people because they're not thinking of me regarding how to be nice and considerate.  That's my problem.  I tend be concerned about being considerate too much! 

Consider allowing yourself a gentle break while you are grieving, and recognize that militancy does not necessarily equal strength.

You're grieving the loss of a once-beloved sister who was not only loving and lovable, but who's memory you can't even retain in that state because of her drastic change into someone who has deliberately mistreated you.

That's big stuff. Other forms of loss don't contain the same element of betrayal. So allow room to process emotions over time, and don't impose a hurry to tie up a neat package with a bow.

Grief is messy, and that's natural and even healthy. Pressuring yourself to wrap it up, as evidenced by trying to game-plan a choice that's a full year away, can bottleneck grief.

You are allowed to think about this, your feelings are valid, and you are entitled to talk about them without a need to resolve anything--especially something a year away.

Big (((HUG))),
Cat

[Cherylyn]

13 hours ago, Kwothe28 said:

What kind of passive- aggressive garbage is that lol

Anyway, just politely turn down anything from her and don't give her too much attention. Narcissists love attention and drama and thrive on it. So don't let her that.

Narcissists are experts at gaslighting.  "You continue to stew and live sad lives."  <==Gaslighting. ☹️

[Cherylyn]

12 hours ago, Seraphim said:

I know you don’t want to forgive now, but never is a long time. Leave possibilities open for when times are better. People don’t go from being a nice person to a narcissist as an adult. Personality disorders are developed much younger. She is trying to survive. 

I agree, she is trying to survive as am I.  The only difference is I don't fight dirty. 

[Cherylyn]

11 hours ago, Lambert said:

Hi @Cherylyn

I wanted to post on this thread again to explain something that I have been doing that has been helpful to me and might be for you.

Like you, I have a turbulent relationship with my sister and there are a lot of ***-for-tat things over the years, that trigger my monkey brain- rehashing, keeping score, rethinking what I said, planning what I will say next time... blah blah blah.  It was making me crazy and I couldn't seem to stop it.  

Then I started changing my thoughts.  I based it off something I learned in a yoga class.  Thinking of people and sending them love.  Whenever I think of her, I stop myself and send her love or kindness or peace.  It takes the sting out of the thoughts and I stop thinking of her so much because I am not feeding into my ego's negative self-talk.  

It's a practice and I "start again" a lot.  LOL but it does help.... 

Thank you @Lambert

Sending and praying loving thoughts is what got me into trouble in the first place.  I've done so much for her.  I gave her a free car for her 16th birthday! 🚗  I gave her my wedding china which is currently displayed in her china cabinet along with various entertaining serve ware of all sorts which I also gave.  I've sewed quilts for her 3 children.  I've hand embroidered and glass framed pictures for her home.  I've given her expensive kitchen supplies.  I've sewed clothes and other crafts for her.  I've spent a lot of money on groceries and cooked for her large hosted home parties.  I've hand washed everything and cleaned up for her hosted holiday and social gatherings in her home.  I've brought home cooked meals to her house whenever her life was in tumult (births, hardship, etc).  I've given her very expensive gift cards.  Loving thoughts, caring and putting my money where my mouth was is what caused me to feel used and abused.  People who treat others badly, don't deserve to be loved.  They haven't earned my love and respect.  People who treat others badly are not entitled to loving thoughts by me.

[catfeeder]

20 hours ago, Cherylyn said:

Thank you @Lambert

Sending and praying loving thoughts is what got me into trouble in the first place.  I've done so much for her.  I gave her a free car for her 16th birthday! 🚗  I gave her my wedding china which is currently displayed in her china cabinet along with various entertaining serve ware of all sorts which I also gave.  I've sewed quilts for her 3 children.  I've hand embroidered and glass framed pictures for her home.  I've given her expensive kitchen supplies.  I've sewed clothes and other crafts for her.  I've spent a lot of money on groceries and cooked for her large hosted home parties.  I've hand washed everything and cleaned up for her hosted holiday and social gatherings in her home.  I've brought home cooked meals to her house whenever her life was in tumult (births, hardship, etc).  I've given her very expensive gift cards.  Loving thoughts, caring and putting my money where my mouth was is what caused me to feel used and abused.  People who treat others badly, don't deserve to be loved.  They haven't earned my love and respect.  People who treat others badly are not entitled to loving thoughts by me.

I hear, and we are all on your side. Nothing dismisses your generosity or overlooks your pain from the ugly turn in your sister. 

I view Lambert's suggestion as one of internally tending to our own pain without attempting to give anything more to the one who caused the pain. It's a method of relaxing into a lens of objectivity. It views the cruelty of others as an impersonal acting-out of their own wounds, and this affords us more guilt-free distance.

This practice can enliven a degree of compassion that is not targeted, but rather, it's about humanity, including us. It's a state of generalized comfort of the SELF, which helps us to 'unclench'.

This can relax our emotional musculature without setting ourselves up for more harm. It teaches us to grasp--from a distance--that people who harm others are the most damaged, themselves.

This doesn't mean that it's up to us to fix them or even forgive them. instead, it rationalizes why we'd want to impersonalize their acts and pull away without guilt.

Head high and write more if it helps. 

[Cherylyn]

3 hours ago, catfeeder said:

I hear, and we are all on your side. Nothing dismisses your generosity or overlooks your pain from the ugly turn in your sister. 

I view Lambert's suggestion as one of internally tending to our own pain without attempting to give anything more to the one who caused the pain. It's a method of relaxing into a lens of objectivity. It views the cruelty of others as an impersonal acting-out of their own wounds, and this affords us more guilt-free distance.

This practice can enliven a degree of compassion that is not targeted, but rather, it's about humanity, including us. It's a state of generalized comfort of the SELF, which helps us to 'unclench'.

This can relax our emotional musculature without setting ourselves up for more harm. It teaches us to grasp--from a distance--that people who harm others are the most damaged, themselves.

This doesn't mean that it's up to us to fix them or even forgive them. instead, it rationalizes why we'd want to impersonalize their acts and pull away without guilt.

Head high and write more if it helps. 

Thank you @catfeederThank you for your kind words of support. 

Before I fall asleep every night, I ask for blessings, joy and good health for family and friends without specifically mentioning certain names.  It's the best I can do in that arena. 

I agree about pulling away without guilt.  What helps is being reminded about spoiled, bad behaviors which were easily dispensed while the perpetrator thought they could get away with it.  They're in for a rude awakening because my passive aggressive behavior results in harsh consequences which the perpetrator is finally realizing.  It took a while but the perpetrator is discovering that bad behavior has very unpleasant, long term if not permanent consequences. 

[Lambert]

Thank you @catfeeder  Yes.  My suggestion is an internal one.  It doesn't require any contact with other people.

Hi @Cherylyn  I am sorry for your pain.  I understand the hurt you are feeling and the need to handle things in the way that works best for you.  I know it's a process and I hope you continue to do what you need to do to protect yourself.  (hugs) 

[Cherylyn]

12 hours ago, Lambert said:

Thank you @catfeeder  Yes.  My suggestion is an internal one.  It doesn't require any contact with other people.

Hi @Cherylyn  I am sorry for your pain.  I understand the hurt you are feeling and the need to handle things in the way that works best for you.  I know it's a process and I hope you continue to do what you need to do to protect yourself.  (hugs) 

Thank you @Lambert.  Yes, it's a process.  The more my self confidence grows, the stronger and tougher I feel.  It's about giving yourself self respect and knowing unfairness doesn't have to be permanently tolerated.  Forced change is hard and after a while, change doesn't feel forced because you want life to go your way.  ((hugs))

[Starlight925]

I am so sorry you have to deal with this.  She sounds like a gaslighting narcissist.  I know, we throw those words around so much these days,  but in this case, I believe it to be true.  
 

The best way to deal with her is the Gray Rock technique.   Every communication you have with her should be as bland as a Gray rock.  How’s the weather, I saw a great movie, this food is delicious.  
 

As to your original question:  If you’re invited to something, yes, you should respond.  And a simple “I’m sorry but I’ll be unable to attend” suffices.  
 

Sounds like you’re used to being used as the work mule.  You bring all this food, you clean up, you help entertain.  And instead of being a nice, sweet sister, she takes advantage of this instead of telling you to please enjoy the party, that she wants you to sit & enjoy.  Your free labor, which she exploits.  
 

You’ve been in this pattern, this role, for so long, that that’s where she keeps you.  Once you advocate for yourself, she will not take it kindly, so be prepared.  And by advocating, I’m not even suggesting you say anything.  It will be your simple declining of invitations, where her free workhorse isn’t going to attend, that will tick her off.  It will be, to her, akin to hiring someone to work her party, but then no-showing.

 

She will react by continuing to invite your in-laws, and by saying bad things about you to others.  Stay strong, girl.  You’ve got this.  You are no one’s free labor.

 

 

[Coily]

I'm in the camp of just politely decline and wash your hands of any other interaction.

Though for humor and catharsis, it could be fun to take all of her worst quotes and make a comical scrapbook (if that's still a thing). Something when you get frustrated you laugh at her expense and then move on with your happier life.

[Cherylyn]

5 hours ago, Starlight925 said:

I am so sorry you have to deal with this.  She sounds like a gaslighting narcissist.  I know, we throw those words around so much these days,  but in this case, I believe it to be true.  
 

The best way to deal with her is the Gray Rock technique.   Every communication you have with her should be as bland as a Gray rock.  How’s the weather, I saw a great movie, this food is delicious.  
 

As to your original question:  If you’re invited to something, yes, you should respond.  And a simple “I’m sorry but I’ll be unable to attend” suffices.  
 

Sounds like you’re used to being used as the work mule.  You bring all this food, you clean up, you help entertain.  And instead of being a nice, sweet sister, she takes advantage of this instead of telling you to please enjoy the party, that she wants you to sit & enjoy.  Your free labor, which she exploits.  
 

You’ve been in this pattern, this role, for so long, that that’s where she keeps you.  Once you advocate for yourself, she will not take it kindly, so be prepared.  And by advocating, I’m not even suggesting you say anything.  It will be your simple declining of invitations, where her free workhorse isn’t going to attend, that will tick her off.  It will be, to her, akin to hiring someone to work her party, but then no-showing.

 

She will react by continuing to invite your in-laws, and by saying bad things about you to others.  Stay strong, girl.  You’ve got this.  You are no one’s free labor.

 

 

Thank you @Starlight925.  Yes, gaslighting narcissist is spot on and unfortunately, I didn't even know there was a psychological term for it during the majority of my life.  It's fascinating to learn human psychology and what makes them tick or not tick honorably.

Yes, thank you, the "grey rock technique."  I've been doing that to my brother nowadays and it's highly effective.  I engage in brief, boring as hell superficial chit chat until I wear him down and we both lose interest in each other.  It keeps the peace and none is the wiser.  We're on peaceful terms however,  not chummy which works just fine.  Ever since he made it known that he doesn't care to have my back, I've been "grey rocking" him and no more gravy train.  I've since ceased giving him free dinners, free take out meals, free generous gas gift cards for his truck, free fast food gift cards to his favorite places and my previous generosity is no more.  He's feeling the pinch.  🤔

Instead of the "grey rock technique" with my sister, I've since eliminated her which was easier.  I also don't have to encounter her husband's major mouth problem anymore either.  I've killed two birds with one stone.  Eliminating people who don't behave with integrity is a heck of a lot easier and less work than dealing with them by far.  Less maintenance becomes no maintenance.   

Thank you, yes, regarding responding invites.  I postal mailed a postcard with "no thank you RSVP" and signed off with 'Happy New Year' while refraining from my previous, normal "Dear," greeting, "Love" sign off and childhood nicknames.  All former endearments came to a screeching halt.  I postal mailed the postcard because it was a deliberate one way communication without the potential risk of engaging in back 'n forth dialogue.  Same as the condolence postcard.  It was a strictly perfunctory, very terse note following her recent dog's recent death since in the past, she sent a postal sympathy card after my beloved dog died.  I did my part while remaining strictly very terse.    

Yes, I agree with you, my sister used me like an unpaid servant.  Ever since I've been onto her game, I've quit.  I prefer to sleep in and relax during my holidays instead!  Why should I spend a ton of money and labor for groceries and cooking for her shindigs when there's nothing in it for me?  How do I benefit?  How is it rewarding for me?  I get nothing in return other than bad treatment for the following 12 months of the year.  No thanks.  I say, "Go knock yourself out." 

She became spoiled from all of my expenditures, cooking, washing everything by hand, clean up and being a real workhorse.  She was also very spoiled from all the expensive gifts I gave her such as a free car for her 16th birthday, a lot of money through the years, a ton of generous gift cards for her and her family, sewed expensive, time consuming quilts and crafts for her, gave her my wedding china, expensive serve ware, kitchen supplies, etc.  No more.  I prefer to save my money instead and keep a fat bank account.

I agree, she'll continue to try to isolate me by inviting my in-laws and attempt to invite me again to no avail and an effort in futility.  Fortunately, my husband will ensure his relatives' loyalty to him and me so I have that covered.  Try as she may, she can't get what she wants anymore.  Her and her husband's bad behaviors are no more as long as we no longer cross paths.  This is exactly what enforced, healthy boundaries are.  As long as no one is in each other's lives, it is peaceful, very safe, I'm protected and out of harm's way. 

Her jig is up.  She can no longer use her guile and charms to get her way.  Narcissists and gaslighters panic and fear when they know you know.   

[boltnrun]

I'm curious, why is your sister inviting YOUR in-laws to dinner? Aren't they YOUR husband's parents? 

It never occurred to me to invite my brother's wife's parents to my home for dinner. 

[Cherylyn]

14 minutes ago, boltnrun said:

I'm curious, why is your sister inviting YOUR in-laws to dinner? Aren't they YOUR husband's parents? 

It never occurred to me to invite my brother's wife's parents to my home for dinner. 

@boltnrunBecause she's trying to isolate me, humiliate me if she is successful at gaining more for her team.  It's a sick, narcissist's (and gaslighter's) strategy.  It's a nasty way to circumnavigate me and win favoritism with my in-laws as she feigns innocence with:  "See what a nice person I am?  I'm inviting you to my house to eat!  Aren't I so hospitable?"  It's a charming, sneaky way to use her guile.  It's called manipulating her dynamic with me.  It's about her controlling and forcing the dynamic to her favor.  She tried to pull a fast one.  Fortunately, my husband has my back.  He called his mother the day before the party and when she found out we weren't attending, she and my sister-in-law (SIL) and her husband declined my sister's invitation much to my sister's aggravation, frustration and fury.  Her plotting and scheming ways were foiled courtesy of my husband. 

It never occurred to invite your SIL's parents to your house for dinner because you don't play dirty.  That's the difference, @boltnrun.   Do you get it now?  You have to think like a criminal in order to understand and fully comprehend why criminals and creatures behave the way they do.  They play nasty and never play by the rules.  It's called fighting dirty.

[Seraphim]

Do you think she is this way because of your dad? 

[Cherylyn]

4 hours ago, Seraphim said:

Do you think she is this way because of your dad? 

Funny you should say that because I once told my mother that she is reminiscent of my late father in an eerily uncanny way and she actually didn't dispute it.  She inherited his sneaky traits.

Another observation is the fact that he died when she was only 8 years old so she prefers to cling to her fantasy world of lies instead of face the brutal truth of the wife beatings, cheating, alcoholism, chain smoking and when he left us high and dry with nary a good bye nor a penny of child support. She prefers to say it was all lies just because she refuses to believe it.  It's one thing not to believe you and keep it to yourself.  It's another thing to flat out tell you that you are a bald faced liar which is unforgivable.

Another funny thing is that she was actually a very nice person when she was single and when she was briefly married to husband #1 for less than a year and shortly after that.  She was a nice person in the beginning when she married husband #2 and for a while, when husband #2 was new to me as my BIL (brother-in-law), he didn't stand out.  Then as he rose up the ranks in his field, his ego grew super inflated, they prospered and became too big for their britches.  Arrogance set in big time.  There was no more humble pie left. 

It's also power in their marriage because she's a SAHM and he wears the pants in the family.  He is very controlling and manipulates her because he can and she enables him because she's certainly not going to run back to my mother's house as a single parent and raise 3 children on her own.  Therefore, she puts up and shuts up for status' and appearance's sake and to keep up with the Joneses.  Should anyone complain about her husband's major mouth problem, she'll shut you down because she feels threatened that this issue will jeopardize her sham of a marriage.  Here comes the gaslighting as usual.   🙄

She has over 1000 FB friends.  She's very insecure and needs to post everything - where she went, what her family ate, where her family dined at, endless vacation pics, boasts and brags galore.  This is where I live, this is what my house looks like, see my remodeled kitchen, this is my backyard, etc.  I don't have to do that.  

You sleep with dogs and wake up with fleas.  Her husband is a bad influence on her.  Monkey see,  monkey do.  He's manipulative so he's her teacher.  She manipulates others in order to control the dynamic.  She had been tainted courtesy of her husband with major mouth problems. 

Insecure people are abnormal and act weird.    😏

[Seraphim]

It is a pretty solid understanding that personality disorders come out of childhood. Sneaky is common in kids and teenagers. If she was nice until she married this guy I tend to believe her responses are due to being abused by him. 
 

I won’t address the difference in your memories of childhood because I have tried every way to explain it and yet you are still or don’t want to see why there could be differences. I believe due to younger age and the fact her brain is trying to protect herself from reality of her life is the reason she won’t accept it. Everyone takes their own road to healing or not . 
 

She was abused in childhood and now again in adulthood which unfortunately is far too common. She may escape and she may not .  So even though what is happening is hurting you and you have a right to protect yourself I don’t think the reasons are as nefarious as you think, but again she isn’t my sister and I don’t know you guys. I just think leaving space in our hearts is best.  You may come to that on your own in time when you are less hurt and angry. 

[Cherylyn]

On 1/19/2023 at 1:04 PM, Coily said:

I'm in the camp of just politely decline and wash your hands of any other interaction.

Though for humor and catharsis, it could be fun to take all of her worst quotes and make a comical scrapbook (if that's still a thing). Something when you get frustrated you laugh at her expense and then move on with your happier life.

Thank you @Coily.  Yes, declining and washing one's hands of it is quick and does the job.

Yes, her quotes are quite the doozies.  She enjoys smashing me to bits with words such as the following:  "Slanderous,"  "loose cannon" and "liar."  We are fine as long as we don't cross paths and leave each other alone.  It's not an ideal situation but just like with divorce,  if two people are incompatible, no amount of force will make it function normally.  It's impossible.  It is a sobering harsh reality check indeed. 

[Cherylyn]

11 hours ago, Seraphim said:

It is a pretty solid understanding that personality disorders come out of childhood. Sneaky is common in kids and teenagers. If she was nice until she married this guy I tend to believe her responses are due to being abused by him. 
 

I won’t address the difference in your memories of childhood because I have tried every way to explain it and yet you are still or don’t want to see why there could be differences. I believe due to younger age and the fact her brain is trying to protect herself from reality of her life is the reason she won’t accept it. Everyone takes their own road to healing or not . 
 

She was abused in childhood and now again in adulthood which unfortunately is far too common. She may escape and she may not .  So even though what is happening is hurting you and you have a right to protect yourself I don’t think the reasons are as nefarious as you think, but again she isn’t my sister and I don’t know you guys. I just think leaving space in our hearts is best.  You may come to that on your own in time when you are less hurt and angry. 

Thank you, @Seraphim .  She had been tainted courtesy of her 'mouth problem' husband and sneakiness is not that uncommon amongst adults. 

I could see that she wants to paint her fantasy world with a false brush because it sounds and looks better than the brutal truth. 

She wasn't abused during childhood.  She had a happy childhood because our late father died when she was a child and at least she grew up in a tranquil household.  My mother, brother and I bore the brunt of family hell while he was alive.  After he died, life was financially hard but at least there was peace at last. 

The only nefarious and egregious offense was the name calling such as:  "slanderous,"  "loose cannon" and "liar."  She caused suicide in the sister relationship. 

Btw, in her party invitation, she "love bombed" me by showering me with praise and compliments for giving my mother clothes, meals and other items.  She was hoping her compliments would entice me to be receptive to attending her party yet I was shrewd enough not to bite the bait.  🤔  Narcissists are adept at love bombing, gaslighting, using their guile and charms in order to get their way.  Those sinister motives and tactics don't work for me anymore.  I'm no longer naive.  I know all the tricks of the trade.

No, there's no coming around at anytime.  The only exception would be a sincere, humble apology from her.  Since it will never be forthcoming in a million years, it's a sister relationship death.  As long as we don't cross paths,  I've deliberately created my own safe haven bubble.  As long as no one bothers me, I feel protected from harm.   <== It's called enforcing,  healthy,  permanent boundaries.  Estrangement = Peace.  Fortunately,  my husband is my buffer and shield against the world or between me and people who don't behave honorably.  I thank my lucky stars ⭐ ⭐⭐⭐ for him.  🙏  🙂