is my date cheap and should I mention this to him?

[treasure_island]

On 12/11/2022 at 1:52 AM, Tinydance said:

 

The thing is, some men might be happy to spend money on their actual girlfriend or wife and take her to a five star restaurant or hotel. But that doesn't mean they want to do that for basically a stranger. And in all fairness you did actually ditch him after the two dates so that just proves the point that he would have spent all that money on nothing. 

I also know in some cultures women are expected to really take care of their looks and dress up nice for men and so on. In Australia it's not like that but I think looking nice is actually the respectful thing to do when you're going on a date. Of course it's not a good look to just show up in sloppy clothes or something. I don't think your attitude is right because you're saying you made yourself look nice for that guy so he has to take you to a prestigious restaurant. Looking decent on a date is just what most people do. Men usually dress nice for dates too but just don't spend time on make-up (unless they wear make-up lol). 

I don't expect prestigious 5 star restaurant on the first date or any other date, but I did expect that he take me to a normal, basic restaurant.   He didn't work that day, so he had time to look up restaurants, rather than finding something on the go. 

And after that first date that he didn't plan out well, he had the guts to ask me to drive an hour to his place. Not that I would go to his house even if he took me to a 5 star restaurants....but still. He seems to me like he doesn't know how to properly court a girl. 

 

[treasure_island]

On 12/11/2022 at 1:59 AM, Tinydance said:

 

Well you are free to speak for yourself but I think many people wouldn't agree with you. First of all I don't actually see why it's bad if women are becoming stronger.

Back in the day women didn't get an education, a job. Their purpose in life was just to find a husband to financially support them. Often women ended up in an arranged marriage or married someone out of necessity. Or stayed in an abusive marriage. These days because women work and financially support themselves, they can choose a man for themselves that they actually want. In my opinion that's not bad - it's great.

Also why is a man weak just because he's not flashing his wallet around? He could be the nicest guy but just because he didn't take you to a Michelin star restaurant, he's not good enough?

Back in the day when gender roles were more prominent, there's no way a guy would ask a girl to come to his house for 2nd date. Especially if he didn't put in much effort for 1st date. 

He's not weak b/c he's not spending money, he's weak b/c he's being too "chill" and not properly planning dates, while at the same time hoping to sleep with the girl asap.

[treasure_island]

On 12/11/2022 at 2:16 AM, DarkCh0c0 said:

Now that I read more of your answers, I can see more where you're coming from. I'm more on the side of @smackie9 and @Cherylyn when it comes to dating. I like to be courted and I like a man with a plan. It's the little things that show their character. There's no right or wrong about this.

I see that you are aware that you are indeed materialistic in some way. You have x income and have a certain lifestyle. You'd like to find a man that matches that. I get it and there's nothing wrong with that.

Though, I'm definitely not moving to Southern California soon after reading all those horrible dating experiences! Any chance you can date less rich or outside of that area? Or maybe date from your social circle? (friends of friends). Maybe, because you're so focused on the material things, you've attracted men who are the same? Have you considered that? Instead of just looking for the matching $, look for character, having a good time/laugh, ect.

Moreover, try not to stay too long with men who show you who they are from day 1 and expect them to change. If he's 50/50 on dates 1-3, chances are he'll be like that all the way. That'll help you screen out quickly the ones who don't match your criteron so you can waste less time on wrong matches (like that 8 months guy).

Yeah I've dated all kinds of men from different income levels. Some were stingy and some were generous, and it had nothing to do with their incomes. And I have fallen in love with both stingy and generous men in the past. 

This particular guy wasn't flashy at all (which I liked) and seemed very humble.  And after the first date I was actually still interested in seeing him again (despite the bad restaurant). But when we talked on the phone and he suggested coming to his place for 2nd date, everything just fell apart in my eyes... and my guards went up and I started dissecting everything that happened the first date, and everything he said and did on second date.

It just wasn't meant to be I guess. Like you said, they won't change. 

[treasure_island]

On 12/11/2022 at 2:43 AM, Tinydance said:

I think the trouble with people giving feedback though is that feedback can be subjective. Unless you're always getting exactly the same feedback. Then you know you're the problem lol For example, if a guy asked me to go on a boat ride and picnic, I'd love it. I really love going on ferries and boats. I live in Australia and when I visit Sydney, as you know they have a big beautiful harbour. Taking ferries is part of their public transport so I just get a cheap all day ticket and ride the ferry. One day I just rode around on it for two hours lol

yes, it's so subjective. So many factors are involved. I understand that my post mostly revolves around money and how the guy spends money on the girl, so therefore other people might think I'm just some materialistic girl who is looking for a rich guy. But truth is, of course I evaluate other qualities of this guy too. My question on my first post was very subjective and obviously  there are many answers to this controversial topic. It's just that people are different, with different dating styles and different expectations. To each their own. 

I think sydney probably has amazing ferries and I wouldn't mind going on a date on those ferries. However the boat ride he suggested was more like the picture below. I just didn't feel enough trust or attraction toward that guy to go on a boat like that. 

[Batya33]

Please don't presume that because someone has a day off from work they have extra time on their hands especially if it's someone you don't know.  You don't know if he helps his friends, has doctor appointments, cares for relatives, etc.  I will share that I was asked out by a man I met at a religious service -he approached me after.  He had 10 days to plan the date.  We lived in the city and there were tons of restaurants convenient to both of us. He calls me that afternoon and asks me to meet him at 7 (after dark) on a street corner where there are restaurants (this was over 20 years ago). 

I told him "I don't meet on street corners and it's dark out - please call me back when you've chosen a restaurant."  He did and he teased me a number of times during dinner about how I refused to meet him on the corner.  I ignored it.  Wasn't interested in seeing him again.  About two weeks later he called and left a voicemail to invite me to the opera that Saturday night.  I said no because I wasn't interested in him but I sort of liked how he apparently reflected and realized he should have planned a proper date.  

I also had a number of experiences where a man would call me after Wednesday night for a weekend date (yes back then the answer was always no) and I would say no I had plans (I did typically or I was a better date than someone who considered me an afterthought) and quite often if the man was interested he'd call again much earlier in the week to ask me out for the weekend. 

Sometimes you simply act consistent with your standards and a person who is interested will take the hint.  I think your date likely was used to women delighted to drive to his house after dinner and hook up -or he'd had those experiences -and sometimes it takes a "no" for the man (or if roles are reversed, the woman) to ponder whether there is a better approach.  I think you should consider not being so uber-focused on who orders what at a restaurant and cut some slack for first date nerves. You two clearly are not compatible and I hope you find someone you do click with!

[treasure_island]

On 12/11/2022 at 4:03 AM, Kwothe28 said:

Then why are you doing things that even you think are shallow? Because I can assure you, counting every dollar he has spent and how he wasnt spending enough is shallow.

Also this is not some revenge plot. Just because some men would use you for sex doesnt mean you should ghost other men after dinner. Its nott a pass for you to also act bad. Nobody owes you anything. Just as you dont owe him sex because he paid dinner, he doesnt owe you to pay for dinners. The point of the date is to look presentable. But the point of the date is to also get to know somebody. And not just to count if he did spend enough.

That is because, imagine that, you are the definition of shallow and materialistic. In your, what, 20 messages here, I didnt see(and trust me I looked) anything regarding a mans character. Even not encountered if you considered him pretty. Not to mention stuff like if he is interesting, maybe funny etc. 

But you know what Ive encountered in those messages? Endless ammount of complaining how he didnt spend enough and how he is stingy, how you love "generous men"(that probably means somebody who would pay for stuff for you), how men are like this, women are like that etc. Its not the way you should date. And you wont get too far like that. 

Also, let me take the wild guess. The guy you dated before and who you paid for stuff was pretty. This one isnt pretty but he earns 200k. So when he didnt paid enough for you, the only alure he had, was gone. So now you just ghost him instead of just saying that you dont want to date him. Again, shallow and materialistic. If he flexed money you would already be on the 3rd date with the guy with the option to go to his house after lol

This one was actually pretty good looking too.  And yes I did evaluate his other personal characteristics, I just didn't write about them on this forum. This post is specifically about whether or not he's stingy, and I received a wide range of answers. It's such a controversial topic with no right or wrong answer. 

And I did tell him (twice) that I don't wanna continue dating him, but he tried to change my mind. 

And I did date men from all income levels and have fallen in love with both stingy and/or generous men. I know my post sounds like I'm the stingy/materialistic one, and I apologize for that, but it was just a question that happens to revolve around money. Of course deep down I know that not all of life/relationships revolve around money. I apologize if my post sounds that way though. 

[Batya33]

4 minutes ago, treasure_island said:

And I did tell him (twice) that I don't wanna continue dating him, but he tried to change my mind. 

Can't blame a guy for trying lol.  That's just not relevant -you do you.  You don't have to listen to someone try to "convince" you to date him.  I wouldn't -waste of time.

[treasure_island]

On 12/11/2022 at 4:14 AM, Batya33 said:

 

Please don't give yourself a pass just because of where you choose to reside.

Also -what's this about looking deep into someone's eyes - I mean sure if the spirit moves you but you make it sound as if you do that as a sort of way of flirting whether you really feel it or not -is a lot of this playing a role to you and testing a man to see what he can give you/treat you with? If so why? 

 

 

I don't give myself a pass, but it's safe to say that southern california is more materialistic then, say oklahoma. 

No I only look someone deep in their eyes if I'm attracted to them. It's sacred for me. I don't do that with someone I'm not attracted to. I didn't do that with this particular guy. 

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, treasure_island said:

I don't give myself a pass, but it's safe to say that southern california is more materialistic then, say oklahoma. 

No I only look someone deep in their eyes if I'm attracted to them. It's sacred for me. I don't do that with someone I'm not attracted to. I didn't do that with this particular guy. 

It doesn't matter at all.  You are responsible for your own values and standards. In the major city where I lived for 43 years and dated for over 20 years there was a huge emphasis on material items, on large diamonds, fancy restaurants, fancy homes, wealth, on and on.  I was never ever that way.  And to the extent I wanted nice things I earned the $ and bought them myself. 

My boyfriend now husband was and is really, really generous.  But when it was time to get engaged I told him I did not want a big diamond - I am petite and I don't like flashy stuff.  That was unusual in my city.  But I wasn't a sheep following along whatever the city was like - I was my own person.  Being my own person helped me become the right person to find the right person.  My husband also grew up in the same city.  He is not materalistic and neither are our parents.  Neither is my older sibling who lived in our city for over 50 years.

 

[Marseille]

I just think, what is the benefit for the man to treat you as a princess? Honestly, he has to pay, he has to think about place to meet, it must be sth. Fancy otherwise you will tell him off, it should be next to your house, so you will not waste your precious time.

Then you meet, after all of this, he is intelligent, eloquent,  he paid, he did efforts, and you? Have you added anything more then your presence which can be very subjective? 

This question is not to put you in a uncomfortable feelings, more to give an insight, what is beneficial for the human beeing? I dont care if is a man or woman, its just a person.

I am the woman, and I always enjoyed being independent, paying  for myself, b/c I don't  want someone to pay for a date, that maybe is not what they expected, and why they should waste their money on me, and vice versa? 

You have money, dobt be stingy! Buy the first lunch, you will feel better, and it can be a nice ice breaker opposite to all daddy's girls looking for the younger prototype.

 

[itsallgrand]

I don't recommend mentioning things like thinking a date is cheap even if you aren't going to see him. Not only because it's kinda rude, but because there are unhinged people are there and this guy is a stranger . You don't want to piss the wrong person off and you don't know who that person may be! 

This was a situation where you weren't feeling it, I don't see him as particularly cheap. I think your focus on money and some of your ideas of men and women might get in your way because some of it seems like more baggage stuff from previous burns. Instead of holding on so hard to the idea of "men do this, women do this" etc . , maybe look at how you are getting in your own way sometimes ? I would be turned off by the invite to come to his so early too. That's enough to politely pass on seeing him again. Early dating should be fun.

[Batya33]

2 hours ago, Marseille said:

ou have money, dobt be stingy! Buy the first lunch, you will feel better, and it can be a nice ice breaker opposite to all daddy's girls looking for the younger prototype.

Or -as an alternative -plan a first meet or date that doesn't involve a restaurant meal.  Go to a museum exhibit, a walk in the park or on a nearby trail if there is one (and if it's safe of course) and sure maybe you stop for ice cream or a coffee along the way.

[Jaunty]

19 hours ago, treasure_island said:

Back in the day when gender roles were more prominent, there's no way a guy would ask a girl to come to his house for 2nd date. Especially if he didn't put in much effort for 1st date. 

My second date with my longtime partner was ... a barbecue at my home.   

I think you're incompatible and that's completely valid.  I will chime in with the others on this point though:  I was taken aback by your noting of all the prices.   

[Cherylyn]

There is a difference between being cheap and obsessing about saving money by talking about it at every opportunity which is disdainful. 

My husband and I want to save money and we don't pay more for the same quality we can buy elsewhere yet we don't talk about it frequently especially during social settings.  

When we were dating, we were not spendthrifts yet again, we didn't emphasize our frugal habits to the point of being noticeably obnoxious. 

I've known men and women who constantly mention how much things cost and how they'll prevent from spending even a few cents more for anything whether it's food, tickets, driving, gas, etc.  That's all well and good as long as they don't mention it often.  These types of observation comments are ugly and most people don't want to be with those who pinpoint every nit picky expense ad nauseum.  It's too much.  Tightwads, penny pinchers and cheapskates are better off staying home and not do anything except perhaps take a walk because that won't cost them any money. 

It runs the gamut.  I've known people who earn over $200K per year yet they won't spend a dime on you if your very life depended on it and if they spend any money, they'll remind you what they'll do to save what they can.  They'll either dictate what their budget is or criticize what you order or buy.  It's rude to always think of money, money, money all the time and talk about it all the time. 

Some affluent types are not good tippers or so I've noticed.  My sister was a waitress long ago.  She said prosperous businessmen, doctors and lawyers tipped nothing or a pittance whereas truck drivers, blue collar workers and the like tipped generously.  Go figure.  🙄

Then there's my brother who doesn't earn a high income yet he's very generous with treating others to restaurant meals, buys gifts and VISA gift cards and the like.  He has a beautiful heart.  💓  Some affluent people in my life don't reciprocate and if they buy me anything, it's dirt cheap.

My next door neighbors are super cheap.  They pay journeymen for hire to do home improvement renovations yet pay a paltry wage especially if the worker is desperate for money.  They take advantage of the downtrodden yet they spend lavishly on themselves but no one else. 

Everyone is different in this world.  Choose a man who isn't a red flag all over the place.  A miser will give you a miserable life. 

[greendots]

On 12/10/2022 at 12:29 AM, treasure_island said:

This guy is not poor at all. I think he makes about 200k, just bought a house in the suburbs for over a million dollars. I should also mention that he has citizenship from his original country (where I'm also from), but also for Austria, where he used to live .

I would encourage you to let things flow naturally on a first date. Get to know your date and don't fret over the type of restaurant he chooses or whether it is takeaway food at a park. The idea of a date is to get to know your date. Observe how things unfold, see if you both are compatible and if you feel it's not for you, then end it. By the way, a man who has money may initially test you, as gold-diggers abound.

[Wiseman2]

On 12/12/2022 at 6:21 PM, treasure_island said:

. I know my post sounds like I'm the stingy/materialistic one, and I apologize for that, but it was just a question that happens to revolve around money. 

Agree it's not about money, per se. It's about being unrealistic with regard to online dating.

First meetings should never take place somewhere you need reservations. Second meetings should never take place somewhere in the middle of nowhere. You're the one who needs to be in control of that.

What you are doing is relationshipping, not dating.

Once you have several brief  public dates and there is confirmed mutual chemistry and interest, then you can worry about yelp reviews, reservations and picnics.