Wife shopping with male coworker

[Blue_Skirt]

maybe my counselor will tell me that I need to walk away

He will not tell you that. You need to take that decision YOURSELF. You could have actually saved the money you spend on your counselor by listening to the free advice that everyone has been giving you here.

[tiredofvampires]

It would be one thing if you felt you'd been too controlling and paranoid about her activities, and put unnecessary demands on her, but she was a caring and respectful woman who wanted to work out the conflicts in a clear-headed way. Unfortunately, that is not the case here. You are dealing with someone who uses your fears and insecurities against you, manipulates you, guilt trips you, is vindictive (the ugliest trait I can imagine in a person -- I suppose going with her warped view of what the word "karma" means). Honestly, as I said, she is not relationship material at this point.

 

So even though I gave an example from my own life to play devil's advocate, and my comments about your end of the responsibility are worth considering for your own therapy and self-improvement, other than wanting to be trusted, this woman and I are universes apart. Had I acted like she's acting, I wouldn't have deserved his trust anymore. Because part of building trust is speaking with a desire to mend misunderstandings or hurt feelings, not create them, and her mission is all about stirring up misunderstandings so she can berate you for being put on edge, and hurting your feelings. It's not about coming to an understanding, it's about stoking the fires. You can't do that and then say, "You need to trust me!!" You can't have it both ways.

 

Now it also sounds like she's hinting or outright asking if she can have a night with a couple she had a 3-way with, so what's that going to be about? Her sleeping in the guest bedroom? Someone posted she might want an open relationship soon, and it sounds like perhaps that could be the case, but even if not, what she wants/intends isn't the issue anymore. It's her character. What she wants/doesn't want to do with these other people, whether the notion excites you or not as something kinky -- none of this is "stuff you have to find out". Frankly, that's barking up the wrong ttree.

 

Although I told you to see a marriage counselor, I think your goal should not be to fix this marriage, because her behaviors are too deeply rooted. The years you will spend miserable with her, even if she had the BEST attitude about changing her dysfunctional behaviors, will so outnumber the years you've already spent with her, you could be on your way to your own healing and a new chance at a healthy relationship by the time she's just starting to see the light.

 

Life is short. Is this how you want to spend the rest of it? Wasting what time you have left on people who make life a living hell, because some fraction of it is a thrill? I mean, if you knew you'd be on your deathbed in another 5, 6 years, would you have wanted to spend it fighting impossible battles and losing arguments to her, or feeling good about yourself, with someone or without them, and leaving the door open for a truly loving relationship?

 

Your focus in therapy should not be fixing your marriage. Your focus in therapy needs to be: why you are attracted to this, why you're a masochist, why you feel that sex and a beautiful woman are more important to grasp at than seeking happiness (do you feel old or unattractive, and therefore like she's some kind of "gift" to you?), what compulsions do you have -- and work hard on changing the way your mind has distorted itself around these issues.

 

Your focus really should be "how do I get out of this marriage, given my dysfunction makes me want to stay". IF you go to marriage counseling, it should be to have a formal and safe place to establish why you can't be together.

 

As others have said, a therapist will not tell you to leave the relationship. This is what you need to do: go to the therapist and say, "I know I need to get out of this relationship, but I don't know how. I have many competing desires and conflicts, but I know I need to get out, and need your help getting me to that point." THAT is what a therapist will do with you. It sounds like you've had lifelong emotional persistent obstacles, and I think everyone ought to have a shot at remediating those before they die -- now's a really great time, but I think it would take more in-depth work than people on a forum just telling you what you already know, which is that this relationship is sick, co-dependent, and toxic and that you are not served by it.

 

You should also look into CODA -- Co-Dependency Anonymous, a 12-step program for people who have troubles from early experiences with confusing love, sex, approval, etc. and therefore seek out unhealthy relationships with other unhealthy people. That's free, and will put you in contact with others who have worked through some of the confusions you have to a more sane life.

[Hazyillusions]

It's just obvious there's something severely wrong with your wife if she's had so many divorces in such a short time frame. She's not even 45 for God sakes. The common denominator here is her.

These are marriages. She treats them like the flavour of the month.

[mtk2419]

Ph suites, it is her house that I moved into so I really can't tell her to pack her &@$@ and leave, I'm sorry you didn't know that, I appreciate all the comments even the ones that say I'm spineless, hell it all hits home.

Tiredofvampires you totally rock, you got this nailed down, especially the part about her bashing me and then saying "you need to trust me"' at the same time.

Financially I'm cool though, I can move at any time, I have zero bills and my credit is amazing and I have a chunk of change in my checking account. So that's not an issue. I can pull all of my stuff out of here tomorrow if I want too.

But when I married this crazy ass I made a commitment, I like to stick to my commitments, as crazy as my wife is I Have seen her tears, I have seen the pain of my own mistrust inflicted on her, when there has been nothing that she has done other than be a total pain in the ass, and what's crazy is she knows she is a pain in the ass, and maybe I am the total idiot that sticks around and looks through all of her crazy ass faults and just tries to love her the best that I can.

There is something, something, that keeps me here, it sounds crazy, but I think in all of our craziness maybe we were meant for each other, maybe I am just a glutton for punishment.

In our relationship, I left her twice, I did move all my $&@$ out one time and when she came home she was devasted, we talked, she reeled me back in, and damn I knew she really loved me then. She said she wanted to marry me, I was hooked, she wanted me, pain in the ass and all.

I don't know what to say, it flies in the face of being rational I know, I'm not your normal kind of guy, I have a complicated background so I think that's why I'm sticking around.

[mtk2419]

Hazy, here's her marriage background, her first one at about 21 lasted 18 months, he was very controlling, wrote down her mileage etc. please take note that my wife got pregnant at 16 and raised a wonderful daughter.

Her second marriage lasted about 10 years, he was very lazy, and that really got on her nerves, she couldn't take it anymore and they divorced, she said she would have to hold a mirror under his nose to see if he was still breathing, not good.

And he is the one that is the father of their son, and they have an amicable relationship and he seems to be a decent guy, he still wanted her back when we first met though and I think he still does.

Her last marriage really wasn't a marriage, it was common law, he was an abusive alcoholic, she stayed in that relationship longer than she should have, she prayed to God for something to happen, it did, she separated from him and got a restraining order to keep him away.

That didn't work, she set up her lap top as a web cam, he came over to her house, she called the police, she came home, grabbed a pistol her friends gave her and told him to leave, he went out in the garage and hung himself, she blames herself today for telling God to take him away and he did, but it was for the best, that's her story.

[mtk2419]

And I like I said earlier I grew up in a non loving environment, it was all based on one emotion and that was anger, my parents should have divorced way before I turned 18 but they didn't, I found a way to cope, a way to escape, which resulted in a sexual addiction that I had from my teens until the I lost my first wife that I had known for 33 years.

And the pain and suffering of losing my first wife cured my sexual addiction, I was sucicidal, I had that @&$@ all planned out, how I was going to end my life, life sucked, it sucked hard, I didn't want to live anymore, but the 40 years of sexual addiction was not going to stop me, I prevailed, I'm ok now, but it wasn't easy.

And maybe that's why I'm so damn forgiving, that what my crazy ass wife gave to me was something that played into my past experiences, life is and can be complicated.

[chitown9]

I know, I'm not your normal kind of guy, I have a complicated background so I think that's why I'm sticking around.

 

Now I think we are getting down to the truth of the matter. What exactly does this statement supposed to mean??? chi

[mtk2419]

It means that my wife has played into my sexual addiction, and I have become addicted to her, like she had this couple that she used to live with, she came home early one time and they said don't come in we are naked, they were painting and they said In order to keep from getting paint on their clothes they would paint naked, me and the wife have down that and it's awesome.

She was in her bra and panties though and right in front of the picture window painting, and I thought that was really hot. I was totally in the buff, and we have been to parties before where she has exposed herself with my permission and again I think that plays into my addiction.

So that's what keeps me hooked, right wrong or otherwise.

[PH Suite]

...........

[tiredofvampires]

When I recommended CODA meetings I was also thinking of possible sex addiction -- and now you've filled in that piece.

 

You are still acting that out. This is a big part of your history, it's not just your lust for your wife. And it's a symptom of deep problems, as you well recognize.

 

Your problems with trust, jealousy, etc. likely have roots in being emotionally abandoned, and that's all playing out here, too.

 

Twice you've said, "Maybe I'm a glutton for punishment" despite finding all kinds of rationalizations for continuing just as you are.

 

This is the NATURE OF ADDICTION -- "I know this is destructive for me -- BUT." But I need it. But it helps me, makes me feel good. Etc. So you are not with your wife because you love her (though you may love her), you're with her because she helps distract you with drama and thrills and dopamine surges from your issues and pain. If you were doing what you know to be in your best interests, you'd love her but walk away.

 

But like anyone struggling with addiction, you are still getting more out of this than you're losing -- you haven't hit "rock bottom" as they say.

 

Your posts have been littered with the word "crazy" to explain this relationship in an almost adoring and endearing way. As long as you feel that way, you're going to be hooked.

 

If a man says he's crazy about me, that's romantic.

 

It's not romantic to stay with someone who is "crazy." It's not romantic to know what you're doing is "crazy", and continue.

 

It's just...crazy.

 

It's also not romantic to say "we were meant for eachother" as you hold hands and make an emotional suicide pact together, though it does make for a good box office hit.

 

And it seems you're angry at her for testing you with other guys/couples, but you also have given her the mixed message that what you love about her is how sexually adventurous she is; you are simultaneously turned on and mistrustful about her sexual mores, so you are giving her as many contradictory and mixed signals as she is giving you.

 

I don't think you're ready to end this. You would rather make this about a shopping trip for Christmas lights and candy canes.

 

Please check out CODA and sex addiction support groups (there is also one specifically for that with the 12-step group COSA, I just looked up), and get a private therapist since at least you have financial ability. Bear in mind that for therapy to help, you have to first want help.

DO YOU?

 

You are 50% of the problem in this marriage. And 100% of the reason for your own suffering.

[tiredofvampires]

By the way, it sounds like your wife may be a sex addict, too.

[kamurj]

The Thread has run its course. Closed.