csdude55 Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 Thanks, all Griff, you got me really tickled for a second, so especially thanks for that! Just to clarify, though, right now, I'm not exactly backed away from Anna completely, but I'm definitely getting more detached emotionally. That's a whole lot easier to do with her being pregnant with another guy's baby. I would never ask her to terminate the pregnancy, but I simply can't imagine the "honeymoon" part of our relationship being while she's pregnant with his child. She used to represent a future that I could really dream about... now, not so much. It sucks. It really sucks. Seven weeks ago, she made a decision to leave, and just like I suspected, she totally regrets it. But in those 7 weeks, she made another decision that led to her being pregnant, and there's just no coming back from that. We'll both regret it for the rest of our lives, I think, but these were all her decisions, so I just don't know what else I could have done. Short of a deus es machina, I just don't know how this relationship can progress. Like I said before, though, I don't see any reason to stop being her friend entirely, and I see no reason to "punish" her at this point by refusing to even talk to her when I know she doesn't have any other real friends or emotional support. But I really don't want to be with her under these circumstances. Unfortunately for both of us, I think she ruined any chance we had. With that said... For those of you that commented on being a little older and single (Shane, Star, Griff, BrownEyedGirl, etc), I have another question for you. Knowing what you know now, if you could go back in time and have a lifelong relationship with your best friend of the opposite sex (live together, be relatively happy, but not feel any real love or have any sexual desires towards them), would you do so? Or would you rather be single and still hope to find love later in life? Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 cs darling I hope this doesn't sound patronising cos I don't mean to ..but that last post you made , I feel a difference in your attitude and you are seriously talking cold hard facts now ..there are many parts in your post that tell you me you have acknowledged that this has turned into a freaking train wreck and also that anna has to take responsibility for HER actions ... she has made her bed and she willhave to sleep in it ...but that doesn't mean she has to drag you down on the mattress tucked up to her and her husband and you are really talking now like you will never let that happen . This has been a hard journey with many a twist and turn as they say and you are doing fabulous cs you really are . Knowing what you know now, if you could go back in time and have a lifelong relationship with your best friend of the opposite sex (live together, be relatively happy, but not feel any real love or have any sexual desires towards them), would you do so? Or would you rather be single and still hope to find love later in life? not only would I just carry on single , but I did ...and have .... Link to comment
browneyedgirl36 Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 not only would I just carry on single , but I did ...and have .... Yep. Me too. Part of the reason -- a big part -- that I broke up with my first real boyfriend (whom I dated from age 15-20) is that, while I loved him as a friend, I knew I wasn't "in love" with him in a romantic sense, and I knew that, no matter how great he was, I would be settling for a life lacking in passion. Now, granted, I don't have that at this stage in my life, either, but....I am also not trapped in a marriage, legally bound to someone (and possibly being the mother of his children) when I really don't want to be there. For me, that would be worse than being alone -- not just for me, but for him because he really was a great guy and deserved someone who would really be what he needed. There are worse things than being alone. Not saying it's my first choice, for sure. I would love to find someone to share things with, but if I don't, it won't be the end of my world, either. Link to comment
mhowe Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 The man I was in a relationship for most of my 30's had been a friend for many years. And maybe at one point I was in love with him...but certainly not the last few years. People around us said "he was my destiny"...and after that sunk in, I thought...Damn, if this is what my life is to be about, I got gypped! His cheating is what broke us apart...and I remained single for almost 10 years. Were the first years hard...sure. Because I had to rediscover who I was WITHOUT a partner. And then all of a sudden...I was having a blast. In fact, most of my married friends were envious of my ability to do what I wanted, when I wanted. And at age 49...found the love of my life. And at this age...with many of life's hurdles behind us..we are pretty free to do whatever we wish. Link to comment
Shane Falco Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Knowing what you know now, if you could go back in time and have a lifelong relationship with your best friend of the opposite sex (live together, be relatively happy, but not feel any real love or have any sexual desires towards them), would you do so? This sounds like one of Dante's levels of hell. I would easily rather be single than have that arrangement. Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I could have taken a different route if I didn't believe in love ..I have been asked to marry on several occasions ..one man asked me every day for months ... but I didn't love him .. I could have a ring on my finger and a 20 yr old marriage tucked under my belt now ..but it would be an empty , loveless , passionless existence . I would rather be alone for the right reasons than with someone for the wrong ones and I stand by that . Link to comment
csdude55 Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 This sounds like one of Dante's levels of hell. I would easily rather be single than have that arrangement. Shane, I recall you saying something similar before, but I don't remember if it was in this thread. Since you're relatively close to my age, I'm curious... how do you, personally, define "love"? What is it that you're looking for in a life partner? You see, I'm very torn between my romantic side and my logical side (I even have a fairly unique Myers-Briggs type). Logically, my ex-LTR has everything I should want in a partner, and going back to her makes the most financial sense... I just don't have any strong romantic feelings towards her. Romantically, Anna was a perfect partner, but as you can tell from this thread, she's not exactly a logical choice for several reasons. So I'm rather curious about the perspective of others; are the happiest people ruled by logic, or by romance? Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I know you asked shane ...but here is my love definition haha Love is what I had with the man who brought me here .... we complimented each other .. he brought me down on my crazy days with kindness and love , we understood each other , more I think than anyone ever has in our lives . There where never any games ..I never once had worries about unfaithfulness and him as well regarding me ..I didnt ever sit wondering if he would call or if I would see him .. he was a breath of fresh air ..it was honest and loving and true . I was hugely attracted to him ..well I still am , in that I mean if I saw him now my knees would go weak hahah our intimate life was perfect , we enjoyed each other , we laughed , we loved . He supported all of my plans ( I upcycle stuff and I am a photography enthusiast) he NEVER ever put me down or disprespected me , but he was still the " man" in the relationship ... Very importantly ...he loved my daughter and she him .. he went to parents meetings , her dance shows , he paid half her fees for everthing , but at the same time he would tell her off if needed ....infact my daughter once said to me " so this is what it is like to have a daddy" that speaks volumes . that to me ^^^^ all of that rolled into one ..is what love is ...I am just sorry we are not sat together right now to tell this tale . Link to comment
csdude55 Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 That's very interesting to read, Star, thank you! I noticed, though, that the wide majority of your description was based on logic, not emotion. If he had had all of those same qualities, but you weren't "hugely attracted to him", would you still consider it to be love? Or, if you met a man now that had those same qualities, and was fairly attractive, but didn't make your heart skip a beat... would you consider being with him? Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 That's very interesting to read, Star, thank you! I noticed, though, that the wide majority of your description was based on logic, not emotion. If he had had all of those same qualities, but you weren't "hugely attracted to him", would you still consider it to be love? Or, if you met a man now that had those same qualities, and was fairly attractive, but didn't make your heart skip a beat... would you consider being with him? no not at all ..the attraction has to also be there ...the emotion was all part of what I described , and the more I got to know him and the things that where right for us both the more the emotion intensified ..I loved him a bit more because of A and fell in love more intensely because of B and desired him more because of C ..do you get what I mean ... those qaulities where qaulities because it was him ... they way he did it , the way he said it , the way I would feel because it was him saying and doing it ..what you see as logic is actually my emotion that I felt for him ..oh god is this making sense. If I met someone ( I will have to pretend for this bit because I decided to take a path of celibacy ) who was supportive of my projects , and emily liked him and all the other stuff but my heart didnt skip a beat , then no ...not for a second would I be with him ..I could have had that 10 times over ... it is the real deal or it's not happening . Link to comment
Shane Falco Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Shane, I recall you saying something similar before, but I don't remember if it was in this thread. Since you're relatively close to my age, I'm curious... how do you, personally, define "love"? What is it that you're looking for in a life partner? You see, I'm very torn between my romantic side and my logical side (I even have a fairly unique Myers-Briggs type). Logically, my ex-LTR has everything I should want in a partner, and going back to her makes the most financial sense... I just don't have any strong romantic feelings towards her. Romantically, Anna was a perfect partner, but as you can tell from this thread, she's not exactly a logical choice for several reasons. So I'm rather curious about the perspective of others; are the happiest people ruled by logic, or by romance? Love is hard to define. Everything just fits, it feels right. It feels like home, and both people are willing to do whatever it takes to make that home a good home. Sure, there's definitely initial passion and intrigue, but "love" goes beyond that IMO. It's not something you need to think about or delineate, it just is. Honestly, it's not something I've felt very often in my life and the one time I did (with the woman that brought me here), it freaked me out. I'm sorry if that's kind of a sh*tty definition, but I was trying to think of a good way to phrase it but failed. Link to comment
mhowe Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 You didn't fail Shane...the mystery of the connection we call love...is indesribable. "Home" comes pretty close...as does the desire and intent to do whatever it takes to keep it healthy and growing. When I read about people talking about taking their partner for granted...I wonder bow that is possible. To find that connection and let it slip out of hand through neglect is unfathomable. Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 it is hard to define it ...to just write it down ..as I was answering I was remembering what I felt with the ex who brought me here and trying to put into words the desire and love and and friendship and togetherness ...and yes home ... home is a good word to roll all of that into one . Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 When I read about people talking about taking their partner for granted...I wonder bow that is possible. To find that connection and let it slip out of hand through neglect is unfathomable. yeah ....you wonder if they look back and realise and regret ... Link to comment
AintEasy Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Love is hard to define. Everything just fits, it feels right. It feels like home, and both people are willing to do whatever it takes to make that home a good home. Sure, there's definitely initial passion and intrigue, but "love" goes beyond that IMO. It's not something you need to think about or delineate, it just is. Honestly, it's not something I've felt very often in my life and the one time I did (with the woman that brought me here), it freaked me out. I'm sorry if that's kind of a sh*tty definition, but I was trying to think of a good way to phrase it but failed. Dude, this is a fantastic way to describe it I never thought of that. Love is like the home you always dream of building. It has everything you could ask for, and you have no desire to be anywhere else because it is the most comfortable, happy, and safe place you could live in. I like that. Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 How are things cs ? hope you are ok darling Link to comment
griff Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 How did lunch at "your place" and Anna go yesterday??? Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 How did lunch at "your place" and Anna go yesterday??? where is this ..I have missed this bit Link to comment
Shane Falco Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 where is this ..I have missed this bit I'm guessing he's referring to the restaurant. Link to comment
pippy longstocking Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I'm guessing he's referring to the restaurant. ahh yes ...I get , thanks shane . Link to comment
csdude55 Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 Honestly, I'm really not much better off now than before! I went to see her on Monday and we talked for about 5 minutes, but then other customers came in so we were never alone again. The conversation we did have was shallow, though, and I couldn't tell if she was shy and nervous, or cool and aloof. During those 5 minutes, she talked about how she and the father are fighting all the time, but that's all that I really know. She did have a bandage on her arm, though, which she said was a burn from making dinner, but it was weird... I said, "what happened to your arm" and it took her about 20 seconds to "remember" what happened. She also mentioned wrestling with the father, and I asked "playful or fighting?" She said, "well, both, I guess." Apparently it started out playful, but then he got mad and "accidentally" bruised her eye. So unless she's lying, I think he's taking that step towards being physically abusive, like I've always suspected. I'm going to go there for dinner again on Wednesday evening, and try one last time to talk for a bit. It's frustrating; she can't call me and she can't text because of the father, and when I see her in person she's busy. I don't know if the Universe is trying to tell me something or what. But I don't know, guys, I'm starting to give up on love in general. In 39 years, this was honestly the first time I've ever felt like I was truly in love, and it's just getting more and more complicated. I just don't know if it's worth all the pain and effort. For the first time, I'm starting to think that it's going to work out between Anna and I, and if it's not then I just don't see the point in trying again and again and again. Oh, and Star! I like your new profile pic Link to comment
Shane Falco Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I have a feeling you are going to go into white-knight mode. While domestic abuse (if it's going on) is deplorable, you really should not be involved in this. I know you are going to ignore this, but you can't be the shoulder for your ex to cry on while she tries to make it work with this dude. I know you want to be the hero here, but you aren't setting yourself as the hero at all. I would cease going to the restaurant when she's there, because this "one last attempt" is going to turn into another, and another, and another, until your transition from boyfriend to emotional tampon is complete. I know you think you are being virtuous and doing the right thing, and if you were actually a friend rather than an ex-lover trying to get back with her I'd applaud you, but I still don't think what you are doing is prudent. You can't be her friend when you are yearning to be her lover. It's just not possible. If she continues to dump her business on you, I would encourage her to see a counselor if I was you. The odds of her not only getting better emotionally, but also realizing your value in relation to the man she's with now, would be increased ten-fold if someone from a neutral perspective advised her. Link to comment
Doofus Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I'm sorry, but this is really way off base. CS may be one of the few people who knows that she is being beaten and is wlling (who cares why or what people think is his reason..) to do something about it. CS: This woman - and her children - are in danger, possibly mortal danger. Every year thousands of women children are killed by their abuser. Sometimes other things in life are more important than our own happiness, or, whether we are disappointed in romance. This is one of those times. Whether you and she end up 'together' or not, you it to her as a member of the human family, to help her get out of that situation. I don't know where you live, but there are places where the law makes doing something about this possible. Find out. Talk to someone who would know. Women and children are dying because good people see evil and do nothing. Don't be one of those people just because of your pride. Personally, I couldn't live with myself if someone I knew was killed because I feared a little emotional pain and, so, did nothing to try to prevent that. There are moments when you HAVE to step up. This is one of them. Link to comment
Doofus Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Here's a starting point: link removed Link to comment
Shane Falco Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Do we actually know for a fact that it's happening? I mean, I don't think it's conclusive. It doesn't sound great, but I don't think it's appropriate to go in guns blazing based on what has been said. If it is confirmed, then he should get the authorities involved or encourage her to seek professionals. I'll agree with that. I don't think this is an open-and-shut domestic violence based on what has been said in this thread thus far. Maybe csdude can expound on more instances, but I don't think we know enough to go scorched-earth on this guy. That being said, he shouldn't be using the guise of "your ex could be an abuser" as an attempt to curry favor. That's more of what I was trying to suggest. Link to comment
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