Is It Possible to Date if You Can't Meet Women Through Traditional Means?

[Bigdave117]

Your social circle shouldn't stay stagnant and therefore you can keep trying as you add new people.

 

 

...but I already do that to no avail. I meet new people all the time

 

 

Dating isn't that easy for guys. You ladies can literally meet men anywhere at the drop of a hat. It's not like that for us. Especially in my case, I work in a male dominated environment and tend to have hobbies that lean towards male dominated (I don't know many women into videogames, bodybuilding, sports, etc...).

[Bigdave117]

Listen, it's clear you decided what you wanted to do before you started this thread. Our job (which we are failing at by offering you other ideas) was to confirm the following: 1. Dating for men is so hard, 2. A cold approach is a great idea, 3. You shouldn't change anything.

 

So I guess, go do it then. What do you need input for?

 

 

I never said a cold approach is a great idea. I've said many negative things about it as well - but at this point, it seems to be my best choice. A "great" way of meeting women is through school/job/social circle, but those avenues don't seem to be option for me anymore

 

I've received some good feedback on this thread - I still wanna try e-harmony and try comic con (I have very little faith in either but have more in E-harmony I would say). I need to get out of my shell and take more risks

 

I have to say the one thing that does kind of puzzle me is that I've received less female attention as I've gotten older. I don't know why this is. I look much better now than when I was 19 and I'm much more successful obviously. I had a really beautiful girl actually approach me when I was 19 years old and we went out on 3 or 4 date. I am not necessarily asking to be approached (although that would be great), but it would be nice to receive some signals and be in a situation where I can approach a woman who is clearly receptive to me

[Iwouldbetheone]

If you like sports you should try yoga (I have a feeling you might say that yoga is not a sport).

 

Anyway, that's where all the beautiful, fit, kind, self-aware single ladies are. Yoga studios are filled with them. I'd say the ratio is about 90% women 10% men. ... at least it is where I live.

 

Can't wait to hear what reason you'll give for not trying this one.

[Bigdave117]

If you like sports you should try yoga (I have a feeling you might say that yoga is not a sport).

 

Anyway, that's where all the beautiful, fit, kind, self-aware single ladies are. Yoga studios are filled with them. I'd say the ratio is about 90% women 10% men. ... at least it is where I live.

 

Can't wait to hear what reason you'll give for not trying this one.

 

Yoga a sport?

 

 

It's not a sport unless its 250LB men bashing each other's skulls in

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Im being facetious but I can't say I ever considered doing that. Seems kinda feminine. Has any guy had luck doing that? How do u try to make something happen there without coming accross as the creep who is just there to meet women?

[KORG]

BigDave, I already wrote you a long post which included my advice and suggestions, a summary of my positive online dating experiences to suggest you could do it too, and several reminders to work on your confidence, try new things, and really put yourself out there. It doesn't seem like restating what I've already said (and what many others have said countless times over) will make a further impact, so let me start this post using a different tactic. Rather than merely disagreeing with your approach (or lack thereof) and chiding you for dismissing everyone's advice, how about I instead tell you that I actually agree with some of what you wrote.

 

Many other posters made what I thought were really good suggestions about activities you could engage in where you might meet women. However, these weren't things you wanted to do and you remarked it would be disingenuous to pursue them if you weren't actually interested in them. I agree, you shouldn't take up an activity, hobby, or volunteering opportunity if you really aren't into it. You are therefore left with a couple different options: 1) finding an activity that you actually DO want to pursue for fun where you might also meet single women or 2) pursuing experiences that are truly dating-focused without the pretense of a generic recreational activity as the main objective.

 

For option 2, I still think online dating deserves a serious second try, but you could also try speed-dating events, singles-focused events through link removed, and things of that nature. These will allow you to meet available women in person rather than online, and it's less random than possibly running into a single woman while at the dog park, while volunteering, etc. Since you are into football, what about going to football parties, tailgating, attending games in person or watching the game at a popular sports bar? If you just have parties with your friends at your houses you'll meet less new people than if you do this in a more public place.

 

I think online dating can be a good opportunity if you pursue it the right way, and I think you probably didn't have the right approach or enough patience when you tried it before. With online dating, you don't have to wonder if that attractive woman accross the room at the bar/party/(other random social event) is single--basically everyone doing online dating is single and looking to mingle. Not everyone you contact online is going to respond, but at least they are in the game and might be potentially interested parties. And if they don't respond to an email, I find this feels far less like a harsh rejection than being turned down by a woman in person following a cold approach or asking out your cousin's girlfriend's friend from yoga class or whatever. Online dating may not be a perfect mechanism for connecting with people, and I know some people haven't always had great success, but all I can say is that it worked pretty well for me most of the time. I did Match, and from what I've heard PoF and OKCupid may have more flakes and people who aren't series about responding or actually meeting. The experience may also vary in different geographic locations or in different age groups, but I thought Match was decent. I also tried E-harmony but didn't get any good matches because of living in a low population town with too few registered users. Given your proximity to Chicago, maybe E-harmony could work OK for you. If you do any form of online dating, I think you should try it for several months up to a year and put in a real effort to show actual interest in what women write in their profiles. I would also recommend you message woman you think are cute but are not necessarily swimsuit models. Some women really do get rapidly bombarded by hundreds or thousands of messages, and you might be overestimating how attractive they will find you. Even if you genuinely are a good looking, athletic guy you won't necessary be every woman's "type". If your online dating profile has any pictures of you shirtless or flexing, you should get rid of those immediately; that would be unappealing to many women.

 

Regardless of how you choose to find more available women to pursue, you will need to have enough self-confidence to engage them in interesting conversation and show genuine interest in what they have to say. Avoid coming on too strong or acting needy or desperate, but at the same time avoid being aloof or being too shy or nervous. You sell cars for a living, so you are obviously not unable to strike up a conversation with new people. I realize that selling cars and dating are different: you have the power and control as the salesman, whereas you may feel powerless approaching a woman if you lack confidence in yourself as a desirable dating prospect. I think it would be annoying if you treated dates too much like your sales customers, but maybe you could channel just enough of your salesman persona to help you feel more confident when approaching a single woman.

 

No matter what you do, you will be taking a chance and you will incur the risk or rejection, but these risks come with great potential rewards. If you continue to do what you've been doing, you're vulnerable to no new risks but also no new rewards. You've got to stop talking about why things won't work for you, and just go out there and make it happen. Actions speak louder than words, so just go do it.

[KORG]

Yoga a sport?

 

 

It's not a sport unless its 250LB men bashing each other's skulls in

 

Im being facetious but I can't say I ever considered doing that. Seems kinda feminine. Has any guy had luck doing that? How do u try to make something happen there without coming accross as the creep who is just there to meet women?

 

For f*cks sake man! Do you actually want to find a girlfriend and/or at least get laid, or would you rather just argue on the the internet in a vain attempt to prove that you're too manly to do anything that might put you in the vicinity of women? I hate to break it to you, but women are feminine. If you think girls don't do enough manly hobbies for your taste, then either go find a tomboyish girl with manly hobbies or just start dating guys. Seriously, there is nothing wrong with being gay. If you really find women boring and love constantly being around men, maybe you have some soul searching to do.

 

And just for the sake of argument, plenty of pro-athletes (including football players) have done yoga and dance training to improve their flexibility and coordination, or in physical therapy in recovering from injuries.

[NorthDallas40]

Yoga a sport?

 

It's not a sport unless its 250LB men bashing each other's skulls in

 

Im being facetious but I can't say I ever considered doing that. Seems kinda feminine. Has any guy had luck doing that? How do u try to make something happen there without coming accross as the creep who is just there to meet women?

 

Enjoy your the rest of your life being single, brother.

[Blue Spiral]

Yoga a sport?

 

 

It's not a sport unless its 250LB men bashing each other's skulls in

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Im being facetious but I can't say I ever considered doing that. Seems kinda feminine. Has any guy had luck doing that? How do u try to make something happen there without coming accross as the creep who is just there to meet women?

 

I didn't know that yoga is a sport, either.

 

I'd love to see someone answer his last question, because that's something that I never figured out, either. If you aren't interested in something, and are just doing it to meet women, how can you hide it? And isn't that sort of dishonest, anyway?

[Bigdave117]

BigDave, I already wrote you a long post which included my advice and suggestions, a summary of my positive online dating experiences to suggest you could do it too, and several reminders to work on your confidence, try new things, and really put yourself out there. It doesn't seem like restating what I've already said (and what many others have said countless times over) will make a further impact, so let me start this post using a different tactic. Rather than merely disagreeing with your approach (or lack thereof) and chiding you for dismissing everyone's advice, how about I instead tell you that I actually agree with some of what you wrote.

 

I agreed with this on a post of mine on this page

 

 

Many other posters made what I thought were really good suggestions about activities you could engage in where you might meet women. However, these weren't things you wanted to do and you remarked it would be disingenuous to pursue them if you weren't actually interested in them. I agree, you shouldn't take up an activity, hobby, or volunteering opportunity if you really aren't into it. You are therefore left with a couple different options: 1) finding an activity that you actually DO want to pursue for fun where you might also meet single women or 2) pursuing experiences that are truly dating-focused without the pretense of a generic recreational activity as the main objective.

 

agreed accross the board

 

 

For option 2, I still think online dating deserves a serious second try, but you could also try speed-dating events, singles-focused events through link removed, and things of that nature. These will allow you to meet available women in person rather than online, and it's less random than possibly running into a single woman while at the dog park, while volunteering, etc. Since you are into football, what about going to football parties, tailgating, attending games in person or watching the game at a popular sports bar? If you just have parties with your friends at your houses you'll meet less new people than if you do this in a more public place.

 

 

Agreed as well. As far as football goes, I go out to sporting events, sports bars, etc... all the time. I have a very active social life

 

As far as online dating goes. Maybe I'm wrong here but to me the problem with online dating is that it is inherently one sided. Women get to use their strongest tool on OLD which is their appearance. As a man, you really can't use your strongest tool (your confidence/personality) so you are fighting a very big uphill battle. I think this is why many even good looking men complain that they have absolutely no luck on OLD unless they go way below their league. For me, I love women who are athletic and those tend to be in incredibly high demand accross the board

 

Online dating is basically a TON of work for very little return (in terms of just pure percentages) and in the end, you're usually settling for a woman who is not attractive as you are in most cases. I'm not saying that OLD is worthless - I've already said several times that I want to try it again but I don't know how much confidence I really have that it's going to work. I had horrible success with it and I don't think I was really going after the women who are bikini models at all. I can't imagine how difficult it would be to go after the women who are in great shape

 

 

Regardless of how you choose to find more available women to pursue, you will need to have enough self-confidence to engage them in interesting conversation and show genuine interest in what they have to say. Avoid coming on too strong or acting needy or desperate, but at the same time avoid being aloof or being too shy or nervous. You sell cars for a living, so you are obviously not unable to strike up a conversation with new people. I realize that selling cars and dating are different: you have the power and control as the salesman, whereas you may feel powerless approaching a woman if you lack confidence in yourself as a desirable dating prospect. I think it would be annoying if you treated dates too much like your sales customers, but maybe you could channel just enough of your salesman persona to help you feel more confident when approaching a single woman.

 

just FYI. I have no sales pitch and I don't have any way that I treat sales customers

 

I'm honestly just myself. I'm respectful, polite and genuine and people tend to like me for those reasons. I'm very low pressure and just all about finding a solution for people where they are happy with it and I'm happy with it

 

The big difference with sales and women is that at my job, people are coming in to buy a car. It's just up to me to be pleasant enough as an individual to where they buy from me. With women, you have to create everything cause you're doing everything - it's up to you to start the approach, keep them interested, keep them entertained and keep the whole process rolling. Women pretty much have all the control in dating. Also people come in everyday with the intention of looking at and buying a car. Approaching women, you have to find the right time and place where there are not a million obstacles in the way and you have to avoid all those obstacles that can derail your attempt - oh and you gotta hope they're not taken/gay/not interested in men at the moment. In my job, people help the process along quite a bit cause they're actively interested in doing something. I feel like in dating, men are expected to do absolutely everything.

 

On the flipside, I sell about 20 cars a month so I have to do that process over and over and over and over and over again. With dating, you only have to make one girl like you so it is easier in that regard...but even so, I find selling 20 cars to be much easier than talking to a few women in public cause the customers are so much more willing to help the process along, there are less obstacles, etc....

 

No matter what you do, you will be taking a chance and you will incur the risk or rejection, but these risks come with great potential rewards. If you continue to do what you've been doing, you're vulnerable to no new risks but also no new rewards. You've got to stop talking about why things won't work for you, and just go out there and make it happen. Actions speak louder than words, so just go do it.

 

You're absolutely right. I gotta put myself out there. I hate rejection but I hate being permanently alone that much more

[Bigdave117]

I'd love to see someone answer his last question, because that's something that I never figured out, either. If you aren't interested in something, and are just doing it to meet women, how can you hide it? And isn't that sort of dishonest, anyway?

 

 

 

I agree with you 100% here

[Bigdave117]

This thread is very quickly turning me off from ever attempting OLD -

 

 

Jesus, is it as horrendous as that thread makes it out to be for men?

 

 

I'm not a guy who has huge wit and humor based on the words I speak. I can't be funny and cocky the way others can. My real life likability is based on being respectful, fun, genuine, etc... Those are things you can't convey through an email cause it's all about your body language and demeanor

 

 

What am I looking at here? Months and months and months of hard work with the end game of MAYBE dating some women who are not attractive to me?

[KORG]

I agreed with this on a post of mine on this page

As far as online dating goes. Maybe I'm wrong here but to me the problem with online dating is that it is inherently one sided.

 

It's true that there are more guys on dating sites, but so what? Not everything in life is easy. Is it better to just give up and never try or is it better to try to face a challenge and really dedicate yourself if something is important to you?

 

Online dating is basically a TON of work for very little return (in terms of just pure percentages) and in the end, you're usually settling for a woman who is not attractive as you are in most cases. I'm not saying that OLD is worthless - I've already said several times that I want to try it again but I don't know how much confidence I really have that it's going to work. I had horrible success with it and I don't think I was really going after the women who are bikini models at all. I can't imagine how difficult it would be to go after the women who are in great shape - which to me, I can't say I'm not interested in. I am okay with the girls who are cute and in decent shape, but I would be lying if I didn't say the fitness model types are extremely appealing to me

 

For the record, not every guy has zero success with online dating. Over a year of online dating, I went out with somewhere around 30 women, and I didn't consider it a ton of work. None were bikini or fitness models, but that's not who I was looking for anyway. It's true that some of them didn't really look as attractive in person as their profile pictures suggested, but some were really quite attractive (some were indeed more attractive than their photos). Women say the same things about some guys not matching up to their profile pics. You have said that you look better in person than your photos, so what if you are dismissing lots of women that you might actually be attracted to in person despite their lack of flattering glamour pics? You can talk all you want about "settling for a woman who is not attractive as you", but that just sounds superficial, conceited, and an unrealistic approach if you actually want a real girlfriend rather than a fantasy that will live up to your standards. At the end of the day, you will remain single, lonely, and bitter while lots of other imperfect guys are happy dating their imperfect girlfriends while you concern yourself with dating being too hard and being worried about "settling".

 

You're absolutely right. I gotta put myself out there. I hate rejection but I hate being permanently alone that much more

 

If you really don't want to be permanently alone, you may not only need to put yourself out there but be more receptive the real women who are out there as well. I am not suggesting you date someone whom you're genuinely not attracted to, but you may actually find it possible to be attracted to a woman who is far from a fitness model type if you actually get to know her in real life.

[joffie]

GRR somehow i posted in the wrong thread

 

Well man I don't know - I am 25 and never had GF/Kissed ect.. but exactly I am not attractive.

 

Every female I know already has a BF or likes some cute guy.. the online thing.. meh.. only met one girl and that was it. I understand how frustrating it is "competing" with hundreds of other daily messages!

 

I, like yourself, would love to meet someone nice but no idea how. I have been to one meet link removed group but the people there were.. a bit.. odd.

 

Keep trying though..

[Bigdave117]

It's true that there are more guys on dating sites, but so what? Not everything in life is easy. Is it better to just give up and never try or is it better to try to face a challenge and really dedicate yourself if something is important to you?

 

 

I guess at this point I'm trying to figure out if it's worth it to really pour my energy into OLD or cold approach, or maybe a combination of both.

 

For the record, not every guy has zero success with online dating. Over a year of online dating, I went out with somewhere around 30 women, and I didn't consider it a ton of work. None were bikini or fitness models, but that's not who I was looking for anyway. It's true that some of them didn't really look as attractive in person as their profile pictures suggested, but some were really quite attractive (some were indeed more attractive than their photos). Women say the same things about some guys not matching up to their profile pics. You have said that you look better in person than your photos, so what if you are dismissing lots of women that you might actually be attracted to in person despite their lack of flattering glamour pics? You can talk all you want about "settling for a woman who is not attractive as you", but that just sounds superficial, conceited, and an unrealistic approach if you actually want a real girlfriend rather than a fantasy that will live up to your standards. At the end of the day, you will remain single, lonely, and bitter while lots of other imperfect guys are happy dating their imperfect girlfriends while you concern yourself with dating being too hard and being worried about "settling".

 

 

I look MUCH MUCH better in real life than OLD and I think you're misinterpreting my words. I'm okay with a girl who is cute and in decent shape - I'm not necessarily looking for a playmate or a fitness model but the decent looking girls turned me down left and right anyways

 

a decent looking girl with a great personality is a huge turn on of course. The more you care about a girl, the more attractive she appears

 

What you're talking about sounds fine to me. I don't know what you're doing to be successful. Most guys I've asked about OLD said it was absolutely horrible for them

 

 

If you really don't want to be permanently alone, you may not only need to put yourself out there but be more receptive the real women who are out there as well. I am not suggesting you date someone whom you're genuinely not attracted to, but you may actually find it possible to be attracted to a woman who is far from a fitness model type if you actually get to know her in real life.

 

 

I don't disagree with you here, although I cannot deny that I'm hugely attracted to fitness models. For me the perfect woman would be somebody like Alyssa Loughran but I'm realistic. Other aspect of it is that I am all about the fitness and bodybuilding lifestyle so I'm sure any woman I get involved with seriously will probably begin to get involved with that lifestyle too as long as she does enjoy an active lifestyle. Basically, what it comes down to is any girl who has a cute face and is not fat with a pleasant personality works for me.

 

I'm coming accross much much more selective than I really am. Like I said, I can go out to downtown Naperville on any given night and say that I would be open to dating like half or 40% of the women there. I don't think that's crazy picky.

[KORG]

I guess at this point I'm trying to figure out if it's worth it to really pour my energy into OLD or cold approach, or maybe a combination of both.

 

I'd try both, as well as continue to watch for opportunities to meet women in at the various sports-related social activities you enjoy attending. I think cold approaching a total stranger in a bar or coffee shop feels more forced than chatting with a woman seated next to you at a football game or tailgate party. If you have the game or other shared interests in common you can at least use that as an initial ice breaker to get the conversation started.

 

I think you're misinterpreting my words. I'm okay with a girl who is cute and in decent shape - I'm not necessarily looking for a playmate or a fitness model but the decent looking girls turned me down left and right anyways...

 

...although I cannot deny that I'm hugely attracted to fitness models...

 

I'm coming accross much much more selective than I really am. Like I said, I can go out to downtown Naperville on any given night and say that I would be open to dating like half or 40% of the women there. I don't think that's crazy picky.

 

OK, maybe I focused too much on your comments about fitness models and settling for women you believe are less attractive than you. If you really are trying to meet decent looking women with good personalities then I still think it might be partly what you say in your approach, and not just whom you say it to.

 

What you're talking about sounds fine to me. I don't know what you're doing to be successful. Most guys I've asked about OLD said it was absolutely horrible for them.

 

I think it's maybe 20% what I'm doing right and 80% what some guys are doing wrong. I'm really not being overly modest, I'm hardly a big online dating stud. I think many guys just write lousy first contact messages, have lousy profiles, or only contact women out of their league or contact women with whom they really have nothing in common. Even if you do everything right, the low women ratio means most guys will not get a reply to every message. However, if you make multiple blunders it really decreases your chances of getting any replies at all. I never kept an exact count of how many women I messaged, how many replied back, and how many I actually dated so I can only offer rough estimates. That said, I think about half of the women I messaged replied back to me, and then a little more than half of those that replied I actually went out with. I am surprised when I hear guys say they've had 1-10% response rate (or even lower). I was fairly selective in only contacting women with whom I thought I actually had something in common. Most of these women were not way out of my league in looks, but honestly I did go out with a few that were significantly more attractive than I am. I merely engaged in some good initial conversations (online and by email) to establish a good rapport and kept their interest with some witty and mildly flirtatious banter before meeting in person.

 

I guess I've had a different online dating experience than some guys, but I certainly don't believe it has to be a terrible experience.

[Bigdave117]

OK, maybe I focused too much on your comments about fitness models and settling for women you believe are less attractive than you. If you really are trying to meet decent looking women with good personalities then I still think it might be partly what you say in your approach, and not just whom you say it to.

 

 

As long as a girl has a cute face and is not fat/enjoys an active lifestyle, it's good to go. Truth be told, I can probably turn a girl who is decent looking into a swimsuit model anyways cause of the lifestyle I lead. One of my male friends was a skinny 140 lber when I met him and he started training with me and now he's a 170 pound stud muffin and looks great

 

 

 

That said, I think about half of the women I messaged replied back to me, and then a little more than half of those that replied I actually went out with. I am surprised when I hear guys say they've had 1-10% response rate (or even lower).

 

 

You're being overly modest cause that's a f*cking astonishing success rate. You're dating about a third of the women you're messaging...yea that's an astoundingly high rate

 

 

Can you explain more what you're doing? Are you an extremely entertaining writer where you can be very funny with just the words you're writing?

[Iwouldbetheone]

I hate to say this cause it's going to make me sound sexist, but I don't really find a ton of women to be all that interesting. I prefer talking to men cause they tend to have more interests and hobbies that are unusual while so many young girls tend to be a little generic

 

Does that mean that you prefer men?

[Blue Spiral]

Does that mean that you prefer men?

 

I'm guessing it means that he doesn't find women intellectually stimulating. If that's the case, well, he isn't alone...

[Bigdave117]

I'm guessing it means that he doesn't find women intellectually stimulating. If that's the case, well, he isn't alone...

 

 

kinda this. Although I tend to enjoy being around women in their mid to late 20s a lot more (30s/40s is great as far as being fun to hang out with but I can't date them because it's not really practical). I find the ones who are younger tend to be a lot less interesting to talk to

[NorthDallas40]

30s/40s is great as far as being fun to hang out with but I can't date them because it's not really practical

 

I know I'm not the only one who would like you to elaborate.

[Nightvision]

I hate to say this cause it's going to make me sound sexist, but I don't really find a ton of women to be all that interesting. I prefer talking to men cause they tend to have more interests and hobbies that are unusual while so many young girls tend to be a little generic

 

I've never been to the US and don't know how women around their 20's act but maybe you need to lower your standards a little. If I were in your shoes, I wouldn't dismiss options if they pop up.

And even though it's tough, keep at it with the online dating. If only to help boost your confidence and thicken your skin so you can handle rejection better.

Do not dismiss options because it's tough. You're the one always working to perfect your life, well, time to put some time and effort into this and not wait around.

 

When I read your post saying "well, this and that have very low success rates" make me feel you lack ambition and don't want to risk putting time into this.

[Bigdave117]

I've never been to the US and don't know how women around their 20's act but maybe you need to lower your standards a little. If I were in your shoes, I wouldn't dismiss options if they pop up.

And even though it's tough, keep at it with the online dating. If only to help boost your confidence and thicken your skin so you can handle rejection better.

Do not dismiss options because it's tough. You're the one always working to perfect your life, well, time to put some time and effort into this and not wait around.

 

When I read your post saying "well, this and that have very low success rates" make me feel you lack ambition and don't want to risk putting time into this.

 

 

The options I've dismissed over the last year or two were women I felt absolutely no physical attraction to. I can't go out with somebody who I feel no attraction for

[Bigdave117]

I know I'm not the only one who would like you to elaborate.

 

 

Older woman/younger male doesn't really work for long term dating for many reasons. Let's be honest here, the average single 30 year old woman is looking to have kids and marriage pretty much ASAP. I'm not in that same kind of rushed mindset. Those are things I wouldn't mind having soon but I don't know if soon for me would be what they would consider soon. This is not to say I would turn down an attractive 30 year old woman who came into my life who I liked and who was crazy about me, but the odds of that happening are very small and that's not something I'm going to actively pursue

 

 

Not to mention most women in their 30s and 40s want nothing to do with young dudes anyways. They want guys their same age who are more established and are pretty much ready to give them everything they want

[Nightvision]

I'm the same, if I don't feel attraction I can't go out. Maybe for one date, out of curiosity.

For me, online dating worked...after a year. And even though I did not find a relationship, I found a lot of dates. It's a struggle.

[ecaryn]

So... I've read through this entire thread, dozens of pages, dozens of posts, and have considered replying to some of your points on several occasions, but ultimately decided not to as I didn't feel it was worth the investment and frustration to try and convince you to change your mindset as many others here have attempted.

 

But... here I am. And that's what I think you need to take away from all of the advice you've been offered here if you're truly intent on finding a partner: the prospects may look hopeless and dismal, but you've just got to DO IT ANYWAY. Stop whining, analyzing, researching and finding all the reasons to not do something and instead put that same amount of effort into taking action to change what you are not satisfied with.

 

You're repeatedly offered suggestions, some you outright dismiss, others you say "you are 'open' to trying, but..." and then list every possible reason you can think of why that route wouldn't work, so it's ultimately not worth the extended effort to follow through with. Yet you are 'open' to trying it. Come on now. The only way to be open to something is to actually be open to it and actually do it. With a positive attitude. And there in lies your real problem.

 

You say you're a generally happy, outgoing and positive person in every other aspect of your life EXCEPT dating, but our interpersonal relationships are our lives. They are transforming and defining to who we are and who we are to become. You cannot compartmentalize that aspect of your life and expect your attitudes and pessimism surrounding that to not influence your overall person and character. Period. Your negativity, inflexibility, and defeatist attitude read through everything you've written here (and your other threads) loud and clear and, I assure you, are picked up by the women you are seeking to date. You're a Debbie Downer. And who wants to date that? Nobody. So stop it.

 

You're a salesman, you know the mantra of it being a numbers game. Same with dating, online or otherwise. There's billions of people on the planet, millions within driving distance of you, hundreds of thousands within a stone's throw... do you think it should be easy and quick work to sort through all of those people? For you or them? Of course not. Just because the numbers are there doesn't mean they all want a car, have the means to buy one, and are aware of your existence, waiting to sell them a car. It's simply luck and numbers... and perseverance. You've got to DO it. And keep doing it. Every option you have available. Online dating - SEVERAL online dating sites, cold approaching as you call it, meet ups, ComiCon, sporting events, concerts, dog parks, classes, move to Chicago, don't move to Chicago, visit more populous areas with your demographic more often...whatever. Anything and everything. Just actually go DO something. Lots of somethings. Over and over. Go with the intent of enjoying yourself, meeting people and becoming an interesting, positive person so you attract interesting, positive people. Leave the pessimistic attitudes and agendas at home. Give up when you're in the ground. But not before.

 

(And speaking of, you're 24... TWENTY FOUR!! Not to invalidate your feelings, but that is a ridiculous (ridiculous!) age to bemoaning the hopelessness of your romantic life! You're just starting! But you WILL end up in this position when it is too late to change your fate if you don't change your attitude. Change your altitude, change your life.)

 

So, there... I tried.