Man, I remember when I first came here...

[blueidealist24]

LoveSoDeep is right. People are much more accepting in their 20s and 30s than they are in high school. There were probably people who would have wanted to be your friend in high school, but they were afraid to because associating with you might cause them to be bullied too. TBH, you probably became the target of bullies because you were a really short guy, not because of anything you personally did or said. I was bullied when I was 12-13 because I wore glasses. Middle school and high school kids will take any anomaly and pounce on it.

[EssexMan]

LoveSoDeep is right. People are much more accepting in their 20s and 30s than they are in high school. There were probably people who would have wanted to be your friend in high school, but they were afraid to because associating with you might cause them to be bullied too. TBH, you probably became the target of bullies because you were a really short guy, not because of anything you personally did or said. I was bullied when I was 12-13 because I wore glasses. Middle school and high school kids will take any anomaly and pounce on it.

 

This is soooo true, and it's all about group dynamic too, often saying more about the bullies themselves and about the prevailing fashions/ethos/standards at the school than about the bullied individual. I remember finding it really odd, having had a bad year or two at the very last school I attended, that almost the day we graduated the whole issue evaporated, and some of those very people who would never have had anything to do with me while we were classmates became perfectly affable!

[Batya33]

" I just wish it wasn't apparently so much harder for me for some reason, than it is for everyone else."

 

it's not "apparently" and it's not "some reason". Apparently means you don't know this to be true - or even close to true and "some reason" is just dodging your personal responsibility and accountability for the choices you continue to make that are not working. How about "it's hard for me to meet someone to date. I refuse to sit here and ruminate and even obsess about the "why" - instead - I'm going to do what many have suggested (i.e. Lovesodeep and others), get off my behind and be proactive and active in every social way I can think of and I will find other ways I have never thought of till today because I want to interact with people in a fun and comfortable way".

 

But first, you have to really really (really) want this. I know how it feels to want something that strongly and how it feels to get in one's own way. Do you really want this? Be honest because if you don't then it won't be worth the work.

[blueidealist24]

This is soooo true, and it's all about group dynamic too, often saying more about the bullies themselves and about the prevailing fashions/ethos/standards at the school than about the bullied individual. I remember finding it really odd, having had a bad year or two at the very last school I attended, that almost the day we graduated the whole issue evaporated, and some of those very people who would never have had anything to do with me while we were classmates became perfectly affable!

 

Yeah, that reminds me of something that was weird for me. These two girls were rude to me in high school because one of their friends didn't like me (before this friend decided they didn't like me I was sort of friendly with them), but then they started being super nice and friendly to me RIGHT after we graduated. Literally, they started talking to me a few minutes after we left the last final exam!

[MattW]

Yeah, I mean, consciously, I know people aren't all "bad" or whatever, but subconsciously, I just can't get away from the idea that nobody cares or would want anything to do with me. Especially now, everybody already has lives and friends of their own, so in a way, I don't expect anyone to welcome me into their lives, because they don't need me. That's probably a big reason I can never bring myself to approach and/ or chat up complete strangers, because they most likely already have the people they want in their lives, so adding more is unnecessary to them.

[LoveSoDeep]

Yeah, I mean, consciously, I know people aren't all "bad" or whatever, but subconsciously, I just can't get away from the idea that nobody cares or would want anything to do with me. Especially now, everybody already has lives and friends of their own, so in a way, I don't expect anyone to welcome me into their lives, because they don't need me. That's probably a big reason I can never bring myself to approach and/ or chat up complete strangers, because they most likely already have the people they want in their lives, so adding more is unnecessary to them.

 

Well, only you can change this. I'm a big believer in you get back what you put out there.....so if you're thinking "Poor me! No one likes me, no one has time for me, no one cares about me and they never will!" (even sub-consiously... the subconsious is very powerful) Then guess what they probably don't and they never will. You're going to have to change your way of thinking....and honestly I think the only way for you to do that is to see a therapist.

 

BUT we all know you won't do that or anything else we suggest you do......so I'm not sure why I even bothered to type that.

 

Oh, and I don't mean this to be mean or snarky but that's probably another reason why you have problems getting friends....people try....like me and you shoot them down over and over again.....you ask for advice but you never take the advice and do anything......Like this woman you said was going to help you but she's too tired b/c she's pregnant.....seriously do not run her off! She sound like she wants to help! You need to first care about her....contact her however you can and ask about her day, her life, her bab,y her husband/bf whatever is important to her....care about her stuff! Then maybe she will care about you (as a friend) and when she helps you and gives you something to do you HAVE to do it no excuses or she'll get frustrated just like me and everyone else and not want to help you any more.

[MattW]

Well, only you can change this. I'm a big believer in you get back what you put out there.....so if you're thinking "Poor me! No one likes me, no one has time for me, no one cares about me and they never will!" (even sub-consiously... the subconsious is very powerful) Then guess what they probably don't and they never will.

 

Just for reference, I don't have a "Poor me!" attitude, and I'm certainly not looking for pity from anyone.

 

Oh, and I don't mean this to be mean or snarky but that's probably another reason why you have problems getting friends....people try....like me and you shoot them down over and over again.....you ask for advice but you never take the advice and do anything......Like this woman you said was going to help you but she's too tired b/c she's pregnant.....seriously do not run her off! She sound like she wants to help! You need to first care about her....contact her however you can and ask about her day, her life, her bab,y her husband/bf whatever is important to her....care about her stuff! Then maybe she will care about you (as a friend) and when she helps you and gives you something to do you HAVE to do it no excuses or she'll get frustrated just like me and everyone else and not want to help you any more.

 

Well, thus far, no one I know really "makes suggestions" about stuff like this to me. I'm so socially starved, however, that I made a "policy" for myself to always take them up on any offers to hang out, get together, or do something. I just don't get those offers very often. I'm trying to maintain a friendly relationship with her, but like I said, I can't imagine she'll remember what she told me in a few months, and her priorities will (rightfully) shift to her child, rather than helping some losery guy get out there and meet people.

[Batya33]

Yeah, I mean, consciously, I know people aren't all "bad" or whatever, but subconsciously, I just can't get away from the idea that nobody cares or would want anything to do with me. Especially now, everybody already has lives and friends of their own, so in a way, I don't expect anyone to welcome me into their lives, because they don't need me. That's probably a big reason I can never bring myself to approach and/ or chat up complete strangers, because they most likely already have the people they want in their lives, so adding more is unnecessary to them.

 

I'm always open to meeting and connecting with new people even though I have several close friends and many friends - I assume I'm more typical than not. I agree that you get back what you put out there - and that's totally within your control.

[LoveSoDeep]

Just for reference, I don't have a "Poor me!" attitude, and I'm certainly not looking for pity from anyone.

 

 

 

Well, thus far, no one I know really "makes suggestions" about stuff like this to me. I'm so socially starved, however, that I made a "policy" for myself to always take them up on any offers to hang out, get together, or do something. I just don't get those offers very often. I'm trying to maintain a friendly relationship with her, but like I said, I can't imagine she'll remember what she told me in a few months, and her priorities will (rightfully) shift to her child, rather than helping some losery guy get out there and meet people.

 

Sorry....you do have that attitude....deep down you really do. You may not really want pity from others but you certainly pile it on yourself....even if it's WAY deep down. It's in there and we all can see it.

 

This is why you need to get out and meet NEW people! You've burnt out the ones you already know with your current attitude and they have given up trying to be your friend.

 

See what I bolded you already think this perfectly nice woman is going to blow you off and you're making excuses to make it easier for her to do it....I bet you already told her you wouldn't be mad if she forgot her promise after the baby comes b/c she'll be so busy....and while that seems like a nice forgiving thing to say....for you it's just allowing her to repeat the cycle again....you think she will and she probably will...this isn't b/c you're right about her it's b/c your self talk is all wrong. You just called yourself a loser! You think other people think this about you....you need to change that.

 

I'm really sick of your excuses....and I'm sure this happens to everyone eventually but I'm done.

[MattW]

See what I bolded you already think this perfectly nice woman is going to blow you off and you're making excuses to make it easier for her to do it....I bet you already told her you wouldn't be mad if she forgot her promise after the baby comes b/c she'll be so busy....and while that seems like a nice forgiving thing to say....for you it's just allowing her to repeat the cycle again....you think she will and she probably will...this isn't b/c you're right about her it's b/c your self talk is all wrong. You just called yourself a loser! You think other people think this about you....you need to change that.

 

I never said any such thing to her, no. Also, I hope it didn't sound like I'm vilifying her for not holding to what she said; she's going to be a new mother, at a fairly young age, so it's completely understandable that that's where her obligations will be.

 

As for the "loser" thing, eh, it's best not to scrutinize every little word I type. I didn't mean anything by it, I was just trying to further add to the idea that I'm a low priority in this particular situation, and with good reason.

[EssexMan]

That's probably a big reason I can never bring myself to approach and/ or chat up complete strangers, because they most likely already have the people they want in their lives, so adding more is unnecessary to them.

 

Many, perhaps most, people carry on making new friends all their lives. It's not like there's a quota and once they reach it they're not interested in engaging with anyone else.

[putter65]

I never said any such thing to her, no. Also, I hope it didn't sound like I'm vilifying her for not holding to what she said; she's going to be a new mother, at a fairly young age, so it's completely understandable that that's where her obligations will be.

 

As for the "loser" thing, eh, it's best not to scrutinize every little word I type. I didn't mean anything by it, I was just trying to further add to the idea that I'm a low priority in this particular situation, and with good reason.

 

it's a big waste of time using these forums for advice. People don't understand, they use the same tired reasons for why somebody is constantly rejected.

 

Everything is based on 'looks' yet nobody wants to admit it !

 

If your ugly or have a funny speaking voice or a dour looking face (eg me) then your ****ed !

 

It's nothing to do with 'loving yourself' or fixing the 'within' or whatever the new fad is.

 

I could go out every night and meet 'new people', it wouldn't help my chances at all ! Some people have NO CHANCE !

[SometimesShy]

Everything is based on 'looks' yet nobody wants to admit it !

 

Physical attraction will get you noticed, but beyond this it's not much help when you are shy.

 

I am an attractive man, but this hasn't helped me at all when it comes to dating, as almost all the women I meet follow traditional female behavior and generally won't approach men. ( I've been approached by single women about 4 times in almost 20 years )

 

In many cases being attractive makes people feel too intimidated to approach. ( they always assume you are in a relationship or are married )

[MattW]

Many, perhaps most, people carry on making new friends all their lives. It's not like there's a quota and once they reach it they're not interested in engaging with anyone else.

 

Still, "meeting people" and "befriending people" are two concepts that are just completely foreign to me. They're, like, basic human skills, and I just don't have or understand them at all, and it appears I'm not learning them very well thus far.

[Batya33]

Still, "meeting people" and "befriending people" are two concepts that are just completely foreign to me. They're, like, basic human skills, and I just don't have or understand them at all, and it appears I'm not learning them very well thus far.

 

I don't think that's the issue -you know what you need to do but you'd rather take the easier way out and make excuses as to why you "can't". It's not easy to make or develop friendships -for some people it is, for most not (wasn't for me). Force yourself to ban "appears" or "apparently" from your self-descriptions -that just feeds into your passivity. Take ownership of what is and what is not and assume that almost all of this is within your control.

[MattW]

It's not about being lazy, though, I just feel lost. My mind just can't comprehend the basic human skills of meeting and befriending people.

[BrianH46]

It's not about being lazy, though, I just feel lost. My mind just can't comprehend the basic human skills of meeting and befriending people.

 

No man, you comprehend the action necessary, I mean you can read. You just don't do it. You lack will, you lack drive, you lack resolve, all of which I would guess stems from your low self esteem. When you decide that you not only want a better quality of life for yourself but also that you deserve it; you will find your resolve and confidence. If you keep asking questions to which you already have an "answer" or excuse, you will not progress in life or personal development.

[Capricorn3]

It's not about being lazy, though,.

Actually, it IS about being lazy. Also, it is all about finding any excuse possible so as to avoid doing the REAL hard work in bettering yourself and making an effort to get what you want. After reading so many of your threads the thing which stands out the most is that it seems you sit back and WISH things would change for you, but you never make the effort to do anything about making that change. You have had so much incredibly good advice over the past years, all of which you have shrugged off with endless excuses as to why it can't be done. Nothing changes. Nothing. Ever. As long as you are NOT prepared to put in the effort to make the changes necessary, you will find yourself here on ENA for the next years, posting the same threads over and over again, getting the same excellent advice, and repeating the pattern. Your life WILL remain the same.

 

The choice is yours, and it seems you choose to stay stuck in a rut because it's easier than making a real effort to change what needs to be changed. YOUR CHOICE.

[blueidealist24]

It's not about being lazy, though, I just feel lost. My mind just can't comprehend the basic human skills of meeting and befriending people.

 

If you don't understand those things at all, you might have a mild form of Asperger's. I've known a couple of people who have struggled with the same things as you, who say that, and it turned out that both of them did have Asperger's. One of them was actually from this site, but has now left. I say "a mild form of Asperger's" since your problems don't seem to affect you much occupationally or educationally, only socially.

[Batya33]

It's not about being lazy, though, I just feel lost. My mind just can't comprehend the basic human skills of meeting and befriending people.

 

Then don't think - just "do" - go to places where you can meet people you might have something in common with, in an environment conducive to having one on one conversations -where others are there to meet people too - and take the plunge. No thinking necessary.

[MattW]

No man, you comprehend the action necessary, I mean you can read. You just don't do it. You lack will, you lack drive, you lack resolve, all of which I would guess stems from your low self esteem. When you decide that you not only want a better quality of life for yourself but also that you deserve it; you will find your resolve and confidence. If you keep asking questions to which you already have an "answer" or excuse, you will not progress in life or personal development.

 

I do "want" it, though. The "loneliness" is so bad that I feel like I'm barely hanging on by a thread, at this point. It doesn't help matters that, from my experience, potential friendships and relationships are so fragile. You can get along so well with people and be great together, and then one thing can happen, and it all just goes away. I don't connect with very many people as it is. To think that it's so easy to ruin this stuff is pretty distressing... I've known a decent number of people over the years that I've wanted to be friends with, and I always either don't push hard enough and they drift out of my life never to be seen again, or I push too hard and they get weirded out and back out anyway. It still bugs me how much I ruined things with the people I work with. I miss the friendship I had with that girl I liked, and I miss when I felt like I was getting closer with the other people I work with, as well. Now, everything is just back the way it was before last summer, I just feel unwanted, and I feel like everyone is indifferent to me.

 

That's kind of what I'm saying. I can *maybe* find some other people to hang out with if I'm lucky, and if I go all-out, but I'm just too socially inept to really develop a friendship (or especially anything more, when it comes to a girl). Every time I've tried to make friends, I've failed. There's been zero success, in my 24 years of life. I just don't know how to do it.

 

Actually, it IS about being lazy. Also, it is all about finding any excuse possible so as to avoid doing the REAL hard work in bettering yourself and making an effort to get what you want. After reading so many of your threads the thing which stands out the most is that it seems you sit back and WISH things would change for you, but you never make the effort to do anything about making that change. You have had so much incredibly good advice over the past years, all of which you have shrugged off with endless excuses as to why it can't be done. Nothing changes. Nothing. Ever. As long as you are NOT prepared to put in the effort to make the changes necessary, you will find yourself here on ENA for the next years, posting the same threads over and over again, getting the same excellent advice, and repeating the pattern. Your life WILL remain the same.

 

The choice is yours, and it seems you choose to stay stuck in a rut because it's easier than making a real effort to change what needs to be changed. YOUR CHOICE.

 

The problem is, the advice here basically boils down to "get out more, do stuff, meet people, make friends". I understand why it sounds like I'm "making excuses", but to me, that's pretty vague advice that's easier said than done for me. It's hard to "get out" and "do stuff" when there's not much that really interests me or even piques my curiosity. And it's hard to "meet people" and "make friends" when I'm introverted and socially inept. Again, I feel "lost". I don't really know how to explain it any better than that. If I can make a metaphor for a second here, I feel like I have a car, and I have a destination, but I don't have a map, or a GPS; I don't want to drive around aimlessly and hope I'll eventually find my destination. Does that make sense? That's the sort of feeling I have, with all of this. It's not that I'm purposely not listening, or making excuses just because, it's just not sinking in with me, it's not making sense to me, I'm not comprehending it.

 

If you don't understand those things at all, you might have a mild form of Asperger's. I've known a couple of people who have struggled with the same things as you, who say that, and it turned out that both of them did have Asperger's. One of them was actually from this site, but has now left. I say "a mild form of Asperger's" since your problems don't seem to affect you much occupationally or educationally, only socially.

 

Well... Great, so what next?

[Batya33]

"You can get along so well with people and be great together, and then one thing can happen, and it all just goes away."

 

Yes, that can happen. Do you (or would you) take an airplane, get in a car, cross the street? It's all about risks. Not to make this about me but I said to a good friend last year that sometimes it was hard for me to feel so close to my mother in law because she is elderly, not in great health, and I am so worried that I will lose her. My friend said "you have to look at it as what a wonderful opportunity you have had to feel so close to someone". She's right, that set me straight.

 

I will say that it's usually not one thing -it's usually more of a last straw or a cumulative number of things where the relationship dies a natural death. Don't avoid friendship and relationships because of the risks - it's all a risk, right?

 

You also wrote "get out more, do stuff, meet people, make friends" - you think that's vague? OK. I posted to you months ago to do (I think I wrote three) three specific things that week to meet more people and asked what those things would be. I think you replied with one thing -good for you. That was very specific.

 

Here are some specific things I did - I joined a women's networking group, found a book club, joined professional organizations, religious organizations and did volunteer work. I found ways (and still do this) to do favors for people small and large, I stayed well read and involved in my community. I am sure you've received a lot of specific advice from many people here and elsewhere. The next move is yours.

[EssexMan]

It's hard to "get out" and "do stuff" when there's not much that really interests me or even piques my curiosity.

 

Isn't that the core of the problem?

 

Forget friends and relationships for a minute. You obviously put a lot of energy into analysing your own situation, so why not apply that energy to something else?

 

I saw you posted on the jobs/careers board in the last 24 hours, and that's a good step.

[ExcitedtoSleep]

It's not about being lazy, though, I just feel lost. My mind just can't comprehend the basic human skills of meeting and befriending people.

 

As humans, we constantly go about comparing ourselves to others. Is your self-esteem low enough for you to think that you are comparatively worse than everyone?

 

Or like most people, do you view yourself to be below some and better than others?

[MattW]

Yes, that can happen. Do you (or would you) take an airplane, get in a car, cross the street? It's all about risks. Not to make this about me but I said to a good friend last year that sometimes it was hard for me to feel so close to my mother in law because she is elderly, not in great health, and I am so worried that I will lose her. My friend said "you have to look at it as what a wonderful opportunity you have had to feel so close to someone". She's right, that set me straight.

 

I will say that it's usually not one thing -it's usually more of a last straw or a cumulative number of things where the relationship dies a natural death. Don't avoid friendship and relationships because of the risks - it's all a risk, right?

 

The point I was making, though, was that it's not really a "risk" for me, it's an inevitability. I ALWAYS end up failing when I try to develop any kind of relationship with people. I question whether there's even a chance for a "reward" for me, at this point. When you fail so much and see zero success, it's difficult to be optimistic at all, yanno?

 

Isn't that the core of the problem?

 

Forget friends and relationships for a minute. You obviously put a lot of energy into analysing your own situation, so why not apply that energy to something else?

 

I saw you posted on the jobs/careers board in the last 24 hours, and that's a good step.

 

I'm trying to get away from the idea of socializing and dating. Ever since I let myself fall for that last girl, it opened the floodgates for all this stuff I'd been trying to put out of my mind for years, and I've just been having so much trouble getting it back out of my head.

 

Yeah, I'm dabbling around to see what's out there, job-wise, but even in the best case scenario (that being me finding a new job), all it really amounts to is a little change of scenery.