Is this what "settling" means?

[Ms Darcy]

Since you don't know the OP you can't really make that statement. The OP has clearly stated he doesn't go in for looks so much as wanting to feel a real connection. He actually does sound quite mature in his outlook, not wanting to date someone for the sake of dating. I believe his notion of settling has to do with being with someone who he doesn't connect as well with but being with someone just to have someone. That is how many people settle...they are tired of being alone so they find someone who is not ideal but will do. Settling has nothing to do with maturity...maturity is a completely different matter. Settling has to do with not finding the right connection so just taking someone for the sake of getting married and having a family or whatever other reason the person has to be coupled up.

 

It takes a myopic view of the post to assume it says that the OP is shallow. I said we only want what we may deem as attractive and if one reads closely I said that may manifest as shallowness.

 

I also clearly stated, in my opinion, that it is pain from failed or missed relationships that makes us refine our notions of who we want. Refining can mean narrowing or broadening as the case may be. In my own case, my first pain of loss taught me to be open to a wider swath of men (age-wise) who had similar values. This is the big lesson I emphasize and I do think applies to the OP.

 

As Brian said (and I quoted): "you do not date because you are in love with someone, you date to discover and nurture mutual love. Let go of your notions of "romance" and actually attempt to date someone or else your forever alone future is very viable." Sometimes we can have one girl in mind, one person, and think this is IT because so much time, focus, energy, and hope converged on that one person. Well, she didn't really want to date him. Does this mean he should mean he should be alone forever? NO!

 

I think as anyone dates, earnestly and with love in their hearts, they will mature.

 

What is "right" is often in our heads. If we open our heads and hearts, the options for "right" open up as well. I have a group of college female friends who, over years, ended up marrying guys in their 30s that they never would have dated in their 20s: one guy is black (she is white), one guy has major school debt, another guy has two kids, another guy is in a wheelchair, and the final guy is quite overweight. I know them all well and they are fantastic, loyal, loving guys.

 

In their 20s they would not "settle" for those guys. In their 30s, they are in happy relationships with them. Not coincidentally, every one of those ladies had their hearts ripped out by physically fit, 'able-bodied' guys in their 20s as well. So, that goes back to my point ... at this point they don't feel like they are settling at all. But it's a mindset. A mindset born of maturity it seems to me. Maturity born from painful experiences.

 

We grow up with a lot of preconceived notions that can stand in our own way to find love. Every single one of us. I am not too proud to admit that I probably would not be with my boyfriend today had I not let go of my own (unconscious) prejudice about people with speech impediments/hearing impairments. He could not really get audible words out to me in the beginning of our courtship and I was mishearing him a lot. I was not really attracted to him on our first couple of dates to say the least. (He was nervous ... aww!) But I kept an open mind and our dating ... then relationship ... slowly blossomed. And now I can't get him to shut up. LOL. I love it though!

 

There are plenty of great guys and great girls that get passed over because I am not sure people really have open hearts. It doesn't mean everyone should date everyone else but I think often times as people grow and mature some of their preconceived notions start to fall away.

 

I see no need to resist men or women when opportunities to find great ones are everywhere.

 

I am actually glad to clarify what I wrote, because I know people need to hear concrete examples as well as the theoretical.

[MattW]

I see what you're saying, Darcy, but I'm not sure if any of that necessarily applies to me. It's not that I write off girls for superficial reasons, or anything like that. My... "scouting" mostly relates to how I actually get along with individual girls. I try to figure out how compatible we are, personality-wise. Perhaps you could still consider that superficial, because it can come down to little nuances. But its not about "She has this quirk that I don't like" or "I don't like x kind of girls", or anything like that. Obviously, we all get along with some people better than others, and in essence, that's all I'm really looking for, a girl I get along with better than anyone else.

[The_Seeker]

I see what you're saying, Darcy, but I'm not sure if any of that necessarily applies to me. It's not that I write off girls for superficial reasons, or anything like that. My... "scouting" mostly relates to how I actually get along with individual girls. I try to figure out how compatible we are, personality-wise. Perhaps you could still consider that superficial, because it can come down to little nuances. But its not about "She has this quirk that I don't like" or "I don't like x kind of girls", or anything like that. Obviously, we all get along with some people better than others, and in essence, that's all I'm really looking for, a girl I get along with better than anyone else.

 

Matt, I think you are focusing short amount of time = higher attraction.

 

It has nothing to do with the connection. My definition of connection is different from you. So bare with me.

 

I truly think you need to take time to know girls before cutting them off based on your emotions.

 

I learned the hard way actually.

 

When someone shows they actually TRULY care about your well-being, you learn to respect. When you do spend time with them to get to know them more, you found something you never discover if you haven't spent time with them. You start growing more respect for that person you happen to like them as a person. Since you like spending time with the person because they make you feel good about yourself. You realize you may be falling in love with the person for WHO they are the longer you spend time with them. You realize the care they have for you and the love they have you is the greatest one you ever encounter.

 

It has nothing to do with attraction/personality/chemistry/connection etc.

 

It comes down to respect and taking the time to know.

 

SETTLING is when you do all your check list like grocery shopping or goal list making sure you conquer every task. In other words, you are busy establishing a chapter in your life instead of living it in a meaningful way without having to "achieve" for something.

 

I see many women and men just married because they want to achieve "not being lonely/all their friends are married so they wanted to get married/etc etc." This is the reason for high divorce rate because they are not being authentic but rather superficial.

[Ms Darcy]

I see what you're saying, Darcy, but I'm not sure if any of that necessarily applies to me. It's not that I write off girls for superficial reasons, or anything like that. My... "scouting" mostly relates to how I actually get along with individual girls. I try to figure out how compatible we are, personality-wise. Perhaps you could still consider that superficial, because it can come down to little nuances. But its not about "She has this quirk that I don't like" or "I don't like x kind of girls", or anything like that. Obviously, we all get along with some people better than others, and in essence, that's all I'm really looking for, a girl I get along with better than anyone else.

 

It's up to you, of course, Matt. For every person I have dated, I often get along better with them as I get to know them.

[Johnny Utah]

Much respect for the intelligent posts by Ms. Darcy and company, as well as Matt.

 

I share in your apprehension Matt. I felt that way all my life and that has not changed. But in my age, I have learned some of the wisdom the other posters are spouting.

 

Even if you are not superficial, you do seem to have a similar filter or checklist of criteria that some of us superficial types seem to have. For me, my attraction isn't a choice and I know there are certain qualities that I can't not have. With that said, I have changed in ways I didn't think possible. I have become attracted to more than just the physical.

 

You will grow to see that as you seem to be wise for your years, but perhaps a little anxious and lacking patience. Like the saying goes, I wish I know what I know now when I was young like you. Trust in what people have posted.

[llw11]

I am not too proud to admit that I probably would not be with my boyfriend today had I not let go of my own (unconscious) prejudice about people with speech impediments/hearing impairments. He could not really get audible words out to me in the beginning of our courtship and I was mishearing him a lot. I was not really attracted to him on our first couple of dates to say the least. (He was nervous ... aww!) But I kept an open mind and our dating ... then relationship ... slowly blossomed. And now I can't get him to shut up. LOL. I love it though!

Wow, well you sound quite understanding...should be more women out there like you. With most women, if you don't blow their minds and socks off the very second they see you, it's over with before you even open your mouth.

[galaxy71]

Since you don't know the OP you can't really make that statement. The OP has clearly stated he doesn't go in for looks so much as wanting to feel a real connection. He actually does sound quite mature in his outlook, not wanting to date someone for the sake of dating. I believe his notion of settling has to do with being with someone who he doesn't connect as well with but being with someone just to have someone. That is how many people settle...they are tired of being alone so they find someone who is not ideal but will do. Settling has nothing to do with maturity...maturity is a completely different matter. Settling has to do with not finding the right connection so just taking someone for the sake of getting married and having a family or whatever other reason the person has to be coupled up.

 

I am going to use an analogy to describe the OP. The OP is like the guy in some garage band who refuses to look for work because he is looking for that big record deal with a major record company. Instead of putting his resume out there and doing his job interviews, he is holding out for that deal with a record company. Why should you wait on tables or flip hamburgers when you can hold on to that dream of becoming the next Aerosmith? The OP doesn't realize that you have to knock on a lot of doors before you get a yes. Even the Beatles got rejected a lot of times before they got a record deal.

 

I think that this looking for a connection is just an excuse for not trying hard enough. Sure, there are guys who have a lot of success just asking out a limited number of women throughout their entire lifetime. The problem is that those guys are handsome, charming guys who have a lot of social connections. I don't know if that describes the OP. I feel like the OP puts women on his pedestal. Why would you devote a lot of posts to girls who don't spend any of their free time thinking about you? I wonder if the OP can stand up to women when they behave badly. When I think about mature people who are looking for a connection, I think of someone going through online websites looking for relationship prospects or someone asking their friends if they could be set up with someone. I don't think of a guy who puts women on pedestal and who thinks that he trying hard when in reality he is just asking out one girl a year.

 

Seriously would you support your friend if he was applying for one job a year?

[Crazyaboutdogs]

I think all of you are forgetting that there are different personality types and not everyone is going to approach dating the same way. It sounds to me like the OP does indeed get to know plenty of women, but unlike the masses out there, he doesn't fall for someone as easily as others do. It has nothing to do with not having an open mind, lacking "painful experience" that leads to "maturity" and a "better knowledge of what you want". It has to do with not being comfortable dating the way everyone says you have to approach dating. There are plenty of people who meet their match by being at the right place at the right time where everything just clicks. It sounds like this is what the OP is looking for...something that comes naturally, not something that is contrived..not trying to put a square peg in a round hole and saying...gee, even though that square peg in a round hole is not something I ever thought I could do but I am glad I did it. Some people actually do know what they want early on...not everyone needs to experiment and go through trial and error before they figure out what they want.

[BrianH46]

The OP's approach has left him thinking he will die alone. He has no experience whatsoever when it comes to dating he may assume he is a square peg looking for a square hole but because of his vast inexperience I doubt he even fully knows if he is a spare peg or not. Even if he did know what he was due to his approach of getting to know women I doubt he can even figure out what shape the woman he is interacting is.

 

His way of going about things are not inherently wrong, however if you look through his threads it doesn't seem like he is satisfied with his lack of companionship in both the friendship and romantic context.

 

Something has to change.

[Ms Darcy]

EI am glad everyone save one gets it. It is not about having a "different personality type" when dating. It is about encouraging him not to give up on finding love because the girl he wants is not interested.

 

Kudos to JohnnyUtah and others for at least encouraging him to broaden his mindset by dating or using this experience to learn something beyond I guess I have to settle.

 

It is bad advice to reaffirm negativity.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

EI am glad everyone save one gets it. It is not about having a "different personality type" when dating. It is about encouraging him not to give up on finding love because the girl he wants is not interested.

 

Kudos to JohnnyUtah and others for at least encouraging him to broaden his mindset by dating or using this experience to learn something beyond I guess I have to settle.

 

It is bad advice to reaffirm negativity.

 

It is not bad advice to understand where someone is coming from and to not make someone feel like they are all wrong for not fitting into the "the norm". Being the "save one" I fully understand what it feels like to have a different way of seeing things from the masses. It is often the case here on ENA where I have been taken to task for having a different viewpoint from the masses, being called negative or whatever.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

The OP's approach has left him thinking he will die alone. He has no experience whatsoever when it comes to dating he may assume he is a square peg looking for a square hole but because of his vast inexperience I doubt he even fully knows if he is a spare peg or not. Even if he did know what he was due to his approach of getting to know women I doubt he can even figure out what shape the woman he is interacting is.

 

His way of going about things are not inherently wrong, however if you look through his threads it doesn't seem like he is satisfied with his lack of companionship in both the friendship and romantic context.

 

Something has to change.

 

There are countless threads from people on this forum of all ages with tons of experience who are feeling just as lonely...not being able to find friends, not being able to find a life partner etc. People with tons of experience also keep finding the wrong people, try a multitude of different strategies and still come up with the same outcome. Tons of "experienced" people with "vast inexperience"..experience doesn't make all people very wise when it comes to friendships and relationships. I also think many of the posts on here rather patronizing to him because his modus operandi flies against the norm. To me it actually sounds like he knows what he wants and just hasn't been able to find it yet which is where the frustration lies.

[MattW]

While I understand what you're saying, again, for me, personally, that style of dating just doesn't make sense. Why would I go ask out a bunch of girls if I'm not yet attracted to them? Like I said, my mind just doesn't work that way. I can't meet a girl and instantly think "Wow, she's pretty, I want to go out with her!" or anything like that. That's just how I am. It's not a conscious "decision" I make, that's just the way my mind works. I have zero interest in asking out a girl if I don't know her very well and/ or have no "basis" for attraction.

 

Besides, let's say I did give this a try; let's say I went up to ten random girls I meet in passing today and asked them out, and one says yes. Would she really be a good "match" for me, just because she was the one girl that said yes? I understand that that's the risk you take, but that's a big part of the reason I "scout" girls the way I do, because I want to reduce the risk of bad/ awkward dates as much as possible. To me, it's a waste of my time, money, and whatever else, to take out a girl I barely know, not find a connection, or especially have a bad time. I don't care about "experience", there's no "rule" that says you have to date x amount of people before you're ready to find that special someone.

 

Like I said, I like to know a girl pretty well and see how well we get along, because this makes a "bad date" less likely (I know the possibility is still there, and that it never goes away completely), we get to skip all that "icebreaker" crap, and just have a nice fun date, being comfortable and able to be ourselves and have a good time. Is that really too much to ask for?

[BrianH46]

There are countless threads from people on this forum of all ages with tons of experience who are feeling just as lonely...not being able to find friends, not being able to find a life partner etc. People with tons of experience also keep finding the wrong people, try a multitude of different strategies and still come up with the same outcome. Tons of "experienced" people with "vast inexperience"..experience doesn't make all people very wise when it comes to friendships and relationships. I also think many of the posts on here rather patronizing to him because his modus operandi flies against the norm. To me it actually sounds like he knows what he wants and just hasn't been able to find it yet which is where the frustration lies.

 

Of course there are countless people who choose to ignore the lessons within those experiences and thus make tye same mistake over and over. Still you cannot deny that human experiences defines who you are as a person from the things you see to the interactions with people that will forever shape you. Relationships, dating are human experiences that will have

profound effect on a person. To ignore this will just hinder a person's growth if the unlikely coincidences even all align in his favor (current girl he is hung up on) and he actually is attracted to someone, does he have enough experiences to even get a date with her?

 

 

Matt has never been in a relationship, he has an irrational fear of a "bad date" he has grand delusions of falling in love and marrying a girl he does not know just because she interacts with him on a regular basis. I've posted on numerous shy guy threads because I was that shy guy myself. It does not have to be this way and I know that feeling of anxiety and depression when you see people with SO and wonder *** is wrong with you that you never even kissed a girl before. Times are different.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

I don't buy your argument. People have found "the one" without having previous experience. People without prior experience have been able to ask someone they like on a date (everyone started off as a novice at some point in their life and managed to be successful the first time around). Your personality and what you learn from others also defines you, not just hands on experiences. It doesn't take hands on experience getting drunk to know that it might result in loss of control.

[MattW]

Matt has never been in a relationship, he has an irrational fear of a "bad date" he has grand delusions of falling in love and marrying a girl he does not know just because she interacts with him on a regular basis. I've posted on numerous shy guy threads because I was that shy guy myself. It does not have to be this way and I know that feeling of anxiety and depression when you see people with SO and wonder *** is wrong with you that you never even kissed a girl before. Times are different.

 

I didn't say I had a "fear" of bad dates, I just want to reduce the risk as much as possible, is all I said. Like I said, to me, it just seems like a waste of a lot of things to go out with someone I don't really know or have any kind of rapport with. I'm not "afraid" of that scenario, but I'd rather not have to go through the hassle of dating a bunch of random girls and hope one of them becomes something more. I'm not saying I'm holding out for that one girl I'm going to fall for and get married to. But again, I want to find a girl I hit it off with, connect with, and have some kind of rapport with, so that the chances of having a nicer, more fun and relaxing date increase. Again, is that really so much to ask for?

 

Also, I wouldn't necessarily classify myself as "shy". I can be a bit reserved and quiet, especially around new people for a while, but I'm not "shy" in the sense that I'm "afraid and nervous around people". Similarly, I'm not "afraid" of approaching girls, or whatever, I just don't see the point of it if I don't have some kind of basis for attraction, and for me, that basis can take a while to appear.

[llw11]

^^While I agree with your method, and think it's good in theory, the fact is that it doesn't work out that way. Considering that I'm 10yrs older than you and have been using that method, I basically have nothing to show for it (I did end up in a long term relationship). Unfortunately, dating is a numbers game for men. Out of 20 women, 19 will not be single, and who knows what that one will think or feel about you. You really don't have the time to "scout" a person out. By the time you finish "scouting" a person you, about 6 months have gone by and you realize she never had feelings for you to begin with and she's already put you in the friend zone. Think of how many other girls you could have gone out with in all that time. Again, I've been using your method and it doesn't work! It sucks, yes, i know, and it's a chore and time consuming but you have to get your numbers up...and not to any overwhelming level either. Never focus on one girl at a time unless she commits to you. Keep in mind women never do...100% of the time, the one you're preciously "scouting", is seeing other guys at the same time. Unfortunately, you have to do the same (yes I know it sucks but its the way the game is played).

[lilylilylily]

Of course you shouldn't date random girls / girls you don't even like. But I do believe you're subconsciously dooming yourself to loneliness and drowning yourself in being too rational (ie; unlikeliness of meeting someone + waste of time/money = why bother? )

 

Maybe you're naturally pessimistic when it comes to Romance... ever taken a personality test? If it is because you're naturally pessimistic, maybe it wouldn't hurt to try and work on that in general?

 

You're right, no one can change the odds of how likely we'll bump into someone we'll fall in love with / be compatible with. But I think approaching it with a positive, hopeful attitude is what counts.

[BrianH46]

You and the girl you currently have feelings for were once strangers. Had you met in a different context you would not have known who she is now, you would have overlooked her and never had met her again. How many girls like the one above do you think you have unknowingly let go? The woman that I am in love with right now was and still is way out of my league, sexy as hell, kind, loving and an honor student at a very prestigious private university, had I not actively pursued her despite being strangers we would not be in love now. Hell I wouldn't have even known who she was. Dating a woman is seldom a waste of time, one you meet someone you otherwise would not have met. Two you find out what you want or don't want from experiencing them firsthand. Three you broaden your understanding of how vast the difference between different women are and learn to appreciate it. Four you either check off one more girl from the list of 3.5 billion

[BrianH46]

Or you actually find her. Also there are much more then just one girl for you so the odds are good.

[Ms Darcy]

Hmm, now it seems like we are moving towards a nature versus nurture discussion. Personality is not static but it is also not wholly shaped by environment.

 

Who we all are is influenced by both inherent traits and what surrounds us. There are hundreds of psychological studies to support that.

[BrianH46]

what you learn from others also defines you.

 

Is that not human experience that requires you to interact with others? If you want to define who you are and what you want out of a relationship don't you need to be in a romantic context? Cad you are wise and have experienced much more than I have so let me as you something: your notion of love and relationship is it still the same prior to having found love and losing love throughout the years? Do you still see love the same way as the 16 year old you?

[Crazyaboutdogs]

Is that not human experience that requires you to interact with others? If you want to define who you are and what you want out of a relationship don't you need to be in a romantic context? Cad you are wise and have experienced much more than I have so let me as you something: your notion of love and relationship is it still the same prior to having found love and losing love throughout the years? Do you still see love the same way as the 16 year old you?

 

I still know what I want and what I don't want..that hasn't changed. You don't need to be in a romantic relationship to know what you do or don't want. Just like anything in life, some people know early on what they want and some people don't. Some people know from the time they are in high school what kind of career they want while others go to university, get one degree, then another degree trying different things never quite knowing what they want to do until they test out a few different things. Same with relationships..some people know and others need to sample until they figure it out.

[superfan]

OP, I get what you are saying - more than you know.

 

I had one or two boyfriends in high school, but never felt any real connection to them and dating felt REALLY awkward for me. After that I went 6 years without any kind of relationship (and not a lot of "dates" in between) because I felt like I couldn't be bothered. I didn't become interested in guys fairly easily and I definitely didn't fall into the category of 'serial monogamist'. I had seen friends of mine jump from relationship to relationship and every time that person was "the one". I couldn't figure out how they could have such "intense" feelings for a guy and then a year later have someone new and claim to feel the same thing.

 

To me, I was waiting for that ONE person I thought I would instantly connect with. (It also didn't help that I was overweight, so when I did meet someone I had a vague interest in, most of the time, they would not show me the slightest bit of interest in return).

 

Eventually, when I was about 24, I decided to lose the weight. I was sick of disliking myself, didn't want to be unhealthy and wanted to feel attractive. I went on a vacation that summer to Scotland where I met my now husband. He and I talked for all of 3 hours. It wasn't an "instant connection" where I "knew" I would be with him the rest of my life. In fact, I didn't feel inclined to pursue it any further due to the distance, so I didn't bother to get his email or any contact information.) He was the one who sought me out when I returned to Canada (he asked a mutual friend for my email).

 

During the year we conversed online, I dated a lot of people. I had lost a lot of weight, and guys were now showing me a lot of interest. I decided that I was tired of being frustrated and convinced I would never find anybody, so I started actually dating. I learned a LOT from the people I dated. I kept in touch with my husband, but I didn't see him as a romantic prospect. He was too far away.

 

Eventually when he did come to visit something happened between us. We decided to pursue it, but even then it wasn't that "deep down feeling of rightness" that you are talking about. It was a slow process that took a while...I wasn't even sure I was 100% attracted to him at first.

 

Bottom line is, though you may not LIKE the idea of going out and meeting people that you haven't "scouted" and vetted first, the reality is that that is the nature of dating and falling in love. You sound like you want to come in at the end of the movie. You want to start dating someone that you already have that built in "connection" with....that doesn't usually happen (I wont' say never, because I don't believe in never) but very rarely and if you sit around waiting for it, you might just get more and more frustrated.

 

Go out with different girls. Try to get to know them before you "scout" them. It may feel exhausting or a waste of time, but it's better htan sitting there and feeling like you will never find anybody. I know how it feels to be convinced you are somehow "different" than everybody else. I had to let go of a lot of that before I was ready to meet my husband. And you are still young...you have TONS of time.

 

If I had any regrets it would be that I DIDN'T date more in my 20s and get to know different types of guys sooner. I may have come to that conclusion sooner.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

This anecdote actually supports the OPs thoughts. You went out bit the bullet and dated tons of people..in the meantime keeping up your friendship with this other guy. The guy you chose was not all the random dates you had as filler...but the guy who had actually struck up a friendship with you. Of course I am sure people on here will argue that it was your tons of experience dating so many others that made you appreciate what you had with your friend..but I would say that it was the developing friendship which over time blossomed into love on your part. I think this is what the OP is talking about...connecting on a friendship level and over time it blossoms. Is it necessary to force yourself to go out on tons of meaningless dates in order to figure out that your friend is the one you really care about...nope, not at all..figuring it out is a process that comes from within and is not necessarily dependent on running out and dating tons of others.