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Hi there.


I've been supported by this forum very often, and I thought I'd share something with you and raise a question. Let's read those opinions.


I thought my current relationship was falling apart but apparently it isn't really - at least not yet. Myself I've started to have recently the same feeling like ever so often in several relationships before this: I'm taken for granted, I feel whatever I do it's not appreciated and "doesn't buy me love"...for some reason I always end up dumbed and asking myself why men at the end of the day treat me like [PROFANITY REMOVED BY MODERATOR] when in the beginning they seem to praise I'm what every guy is looking for. Basically I've even seen a counsellor about this, why am I such a doormat.


My friend said me once that I can't pretend to be a [PROFANITY REMOVED BY MODERATOR] and distant if I love to cook for him and "be nice"...the one who'll love me for real will love me for what I am!


So my question is SHOULD we change? Become dream girls just to please? Isn't it wiser to move on (every time?) if the person starts behaving like he was not interested any more? Should we all be dream girls = alike?


I have to tell you something, maybe this will even encourage many of us who in a way like to search for flaws in other person and can't see own "mistakes".


Some time ago my boyfriend told me I've become too familiar for his taste. Right...I've been devastated ever since, just waiting for him to utter next (what I've heard so often) "I really like you and you are what every man would want their wife to be, BUT I'm not in love"...I've been TRYING to be more distant and interesting. It's hard, I wanna be myself.

Well last night we talked and he explained me that he just meant that he'd like to share, instead of me waiting every time at home with the dinner ready and doing everything for him, he'd like to cook together and see me doing things when he asks for that. I shouldn't be like his mother, because otherwise he'd get fed up and he said he critisized me only to avoid this. I was baffled: this has ALWAYS happened but those guys had given me other reasons for breaking up.


I have to say first I was hurt because being wrong hurts...and because I've sincerely thought all those guys should love me for doing those things (I don't force myself, I like "taking care") for them. But this morning I woke up quite happy - shouldn't I appreciate him telling me this? Poor guy just wants me to ask him to clean up together instead of always rushing to do things for him. Besides, it seems he WANTS to continue our relationship and keep it interesting.


I've been wrong and "selfish" in a way...just assuming I should be worshipped as a dream girl for what I do...


All I need to learn now - without following all the advice of self-help books and acting in - is to take him and his idea of a relationship more into account.


Hopely this could help some of you, too...maybe being a dream girl doesn't mean being a [PROFANITY REMOVED BY MODERATOR] after all, but just taking the other person into account in a not-mother-like-way?



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Hhi Princesa: I am just thinking about the same things you are saying.

I just read that book "Why men love B***".


I don't know what the answer is.

I truly believe the guys who are users and more selfish will prey on women who fall deeply in love and dedicate themselves to their man. But the good guys will lie that in us, and will respect us. So maybe it's the question of finding that guy (PS: I had one like that, my ex-husband, but I got bored and left him).

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Herein the irony of relationships.



You can be the good guy as you say and be there all the time, spend a lot of your free time , always be there for the girl etc and what happens !! Choose from the answers below


a) She suddenly need space.

b) She suddenly considers you a dear friend more than a lover

c) She suddenly loves but is not in love with you

d) She suddenly needs to find herself



So when whe choses which one of the 4 reasons she is going to give you to politely rip your heart from your chest and stamp all over it, she then proceeds to date a string of guys who are


a) unavailable

b) losers

c) Got problems/hangups

d) serial lotharios

e) plain old b£rstards



She will then resign herself to the fact that all men are b$rstards and out of the blue meet a nice guy who


a) Wants her as a soulmate

b) Respects who she is

c) Doesnt cheat on her

d) Gives her emotional support

e) Is willing for long term commitment





How many man have you heard on this forum and in other places say "I dont knwo what happened. I gave her everything I had"


Say what you like but I think there has to be a balance of power in a relationship. If the balance goes out out the relationship is doomed. I feel one of the most importnat aspects of a good relationship is mutual respect and I think unconditional love is in a way the antithesis of mutual respect.


I am not saying that I will be a b£rstard next time around but I will have issues that I wwont comprimise on and I will not be supportive in the face of emotional abuse no matter what the circumstances are.


I think that really successful relationships are built between two people that DEMAND respect from each other and not EXPECT it. Hereby the balance is maintained.

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Luciana, never change as there are plenty of guys out there who would give anything to have a g.f like that.


As for men liking B*****s, I for one do not. I prefer a nice girl who doesnt try and play games to keep me interested....games are immature to me and all they do is annoy me and make me not want to bother with the effort


Basically, dont change who you are to get a guy.......a guy should love you for who you truly are.....good luck finding him

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See! That's what happened to me. I had a girl that was the sweetest thing to me. Wanted to spend all her time with me. Cooked for me, (delicious!) Basically she took care of me. I loved her so completely that I never questioned it. I worked extremely hard at my job to take care of her too. Paid the rent, the bills, vacations, clothes, restaurants, anything she wanted. I am a designer, and I was working on what would have been a really cool one of a kind engagement ring. Almost had it finished.


She got bored of me not being around enough, (being at work) and left me for a ballroom dance instructor/former car thief. Who knows if he appreciates her and loves her completely, but I sure did. Sometimes, we find what we seek, whether it's a selfish man or a selfish woman. I don't think I ever treated her as a doormat, but I could have paid more attention to what was really going on. I probably should have been a bit more of an A hole to her, and maybe she would have respected me more.


It's important not to take each other for granted, even if you both do it.

It doesn't balance out. It just adds up.

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The problem with many relationships is that people never discuss the power arrangement in the relationship. There are few human relations where the power arrangement is not important, yet it is routinely ignored in the most important relationship in our lives.


And balance is not always the answer. There are people in this world who wish to follow and those that want to lead. There are those that want to be of service to others and those that do not.


My own dear wife lives to be of service to other people. As long as I have know her she has taken jobs that paid poorly so that she could work to make other's lives more pleasant. This post reminded me of our early relationship.


and because I've sincerely thought all those guys should love me for doing those things (I don't force myself, I like "taking care") for them.


It's a mistake to confuse a desire to be of service or to make other peoples lives easier with being a doormat.


For as much as my wife lives to be of service she is by no means a doormat. She will tell me very clearly, often loudly, when I have screwed something up or when she is not happy about something. But she does "take care" of me, and I do love her for it. She brings me coffee every morning and serves me supper every night. She gets up every morning before I do and prepares my clothes for the day. And unlike my father's generation, I know exactly how special and valuable that is.


But, for 18 years there was an undercurrent of dissatisfaction in our relationship, because, she did not want to lead but could not let herself be a "50's housewife". While I could not bring myself to follow, but thought it unfair to expect her to do things, "just because I wanted."


Seven years ago we renegotiated our deal, only this time we really negotiated, as in talked about who wanted to do what and who was good at doing what.


For the seven years since we have been very happy. The only time we have had problems is when I don't uphold my end of the deal. It's my job to make most of the decisions in our lives. If I don't make them, they don't get made. This actually was hard at first; it gets easier with practice. The best part is since I am responsible to make decisions we are both happy with, I spend a lot more time talking to her, or more importantly, listening to her.


If you want to take care of a guy, find a guy that wants to be taken care of. If you want to be waited on, there are guys out there that would love to wait on you. If you want to lead find a follower, if you want to follow find a leader. If you what to share it all, find someone that wants to share.


But, don't do what we did and wait 18 years to decide how it's going to work. When you talk about a permanent relationship, when you talk about having children together, take the time to talk about who has what rights and what responsibilities in the relationship, who makes decisions about what. Who leads and who follows, or when its one and when the other.

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I know Dr. Phil is corny and usually over the top, but I do believe it when he says "start out as you intend to go on". In other words, don't be anything but yourself. That doesn't mean we shouldn't continue to improve ourselves, but we should do it for ourselves, not for others.


I have been in enough relationships to know that you can't make someone love you, no matter what you do. So changing yourself to keep someone is just plain wrong, and it will usually backfire.


The key to maintaining a successful relationship is communication. And if you feel like you are being treated like a doormat, then talk about it. Finally, another Dr. Philism you have to consider, "You teach people who to treat you".

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Hi there,

I don't know if you have read this book, but the main idea is to keep your dignity while in a relationship.


Nice girls often get taken advantage of in a relationship because they give too much too soon. It doesn't say you should stop doing the things you want to do, like cook for him, you should just do it at the appropriate time.


Several of the main ideas are: Keep your own friends and your own interests. Don't persue a man or push yourself on him( maybe he is not that interested?). Have a voice and speak up when you don't like something, don't go along with something you don't like just to keep him happy--or keep the relationship.


One story in particular ( in the book) is about a woman who will drive in the middle of the night to see a man. He has been out partying and calls her up--and there she goes. What she should do is hold her ground and say " I don't think so" she will have his respect, but most importantly she will respect herself and have boundaries.

--It's the middle of the night! what if she is sleeping? doesn't he care about her safety? he could have gone to her place instead... he was out clubbing, why didn't he take her out?


You get the picture.


This book is not about being mean to men. You should be nice but don't sacrifice yourself in a relationship. Let a man do nice things for you, you don't have to do it all.


Most women already know this... they don't need a book to tell them.

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Thanks guys for your comments. I mostly agree.


Yes, that's what may happen...we would get deadly bored with a boring guy too. So why being so routinary then? I consider myself a very interesting person, but I have to admit my being available all the time and cooking every d$£%ed day just because I'm used to may be a bit too much to soon...


I don't think men really want to have a b%£ch as a girlfriend, but they get bored by nature if everything is so obvious and routinary. No matter how much love in between. This applies for women too, we get bored too. Maybe this is why women really tend to fall for car thiefs and scumbags in general...


I agree that it's all about mutual respect and power arrangements and not taking or being taken for granted. Like I said, I had made the mistake myself that I have EXPECTED things to go that way (girl is lovable, man loves girl forever) - and always got disappointed. I have completely ignored that maybe this other person doesn't expect the same. But it's also very difficult to know in the beginning what the other person expects. Also one thing is to say beforehand what you expect (I know this because I met my boyfriend through internet and I thought we had cleared the expectations part before we even met!) and then how you FEEL in the relationship (mutual chemistry etc).


I want to stress too that I didn't mean I had been doormat in a way that I have no own opinion or never oppose to him - it's just like Luciana said, I want to spend time and effort on him. Too available you could say. And it's difficult to just say "you have to respect yourself", because I do, I don't think by wanting to cook for him I disrespect myself just because I want to please. I do that out of love, without thinking.


BUT in my relationship in his opinion the problem is that I did that expecting he wants it (=I did the opposite I wanted and ignored him). So now I hope I have learned my lesson and try to ask from now on what HE wants to do, to eat out or should I cook something?

To be honest, after that conversation things have been a lot better and I feel a lot better myself too, because he asks me to do things too, and obviously it is a bigger satisfaction when you are asked = wanted.


Gotta read that book though... - in order not to forget!


Good luck guys, Princesa

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