mood swings, trying not to take it personally

[exhibitA]

I've been seeing a guy for about 3 mo. He's pretty sensitive, in that I can see that he reacts strongly to things that happen. I feel pretty understanding about it, since I've been the same way most of my life, although I think I've learned to let things roll off my back a bit more over the years. He also seemed during the first month or so we were getting together, very anxious about things, always worrying he did something that might be misconstrued or mess things up. I could tell he was a nervous wreck sometimes so I just did my best to put him at ease.

 

He's also very slow to open up. Over the last several months he's slowly let me in a bit more, relaxed more when we're together, and has eased into the physical stuff. So far, I've felt it is worth being patient because I think he's a really good guy, caring, insightful, and sweet. It has been somewhat difficult, however, since I feel he's a bit unpredictable. Sometimes he's interested in connecting, getting together, etc., and other times he seems to be depressed and withdrawn. He's mentioned that he often has a "dark cloud following him."

 

Last week we had sex for the first time, and he was very nervous, but told me that it "usually resolves itself after a bit." I initially worried he'd disappear after that (it happens), but we got together a few days later, and everything seemed good. He told me to let him know if I want to get together over the over upcoming weekend because he wants to see me.

 

So, I asked him on Fri if he wanted to get together Sat, whcih was NYE. I'm pretty busy and not a NYE party-it-up type, so I initially didn't register that it was NYE. He really isn't a party-hard guy, either, and doesn't drink, so I dind't need to do anything fancy.

I didn't make any suggestions, though. He did not respond to my msg for about 11 hrs. I had an invite to go to dinner with some ppl I didn't know that well, so I sent him a second msg telling him I needed to firm up my plans so I could let them know, and to let me know if he wants to get together. He responded right away saying he was sorry it took so long to respond but he hadn't been feeling well all day. He told me some friends of his were getting together Sat night and he hoped I'd come rather than go to dinner with these other folks. OK, so we made plans.

 

Next day he tells me a close friend's dog died (he knew the dog for about 12 yrs), and he was feeling down about it and didn't think he was up for going out/wouldn't be a very good date, etc. I did seem like an extreme reaction, but I know he was worried about this dog, because when it got sick a few weeks prior, he told me how upset he was. When he broke our plans, he told me he really hoped I didn't take it the wrong way bc he has been ejoying spending time with me, but just can't bring himself to go out. It crossed my mind that he was lying/blowing me off, but it honestly doesn't fit with anything I know about him. Like, I thought he might have been waiting on something better, didn't hear about it, made plans with me, and then canceled when he heard back from someone. I think that's just paranoia, though. He volunteered a few weeks ago that he's not seeing anyone else, I can't imagine him behaving like any kind of player, he had wanted to get together over the weekend, and it just doesn't fit with his personality to pull stuff like that. I would also probably find out about it via his friends, anyway. He may have been lying about being upset only about the dog, however. He may have just felt really crappy/depressed and thought he needed a more specific excuse or I wouldn't understand. That's my gut feeling, anyway.

 

I told him I hope he feels better, and offered some low-key company in case he wanted it even though he didn't want to go out. I also mentioned that I was going out to dinner near where he lives and would like to stop by for a min on my way home to say hi, see how he's doing, etc. I was kind of concerned about him. It did seem like an extreme reaction to me, too, but I know he's had a lot of losses in his life over the last couple years (deaths in the family) and I know he's sensitive, so I just figured he was having a rough time. He said he didn't want any company. I realize it was a little selfish on my part, but it just hurt my feelings that he was so curt and cold about it, and I stupidly sent him a msg saying I felt like he was kind of pushing me away. He got upset and said "this exchange isn't helping."

 

I apologized via email and tried to explain why it hurt my feelings, and his response was that he's had ppl bring up things when he's feeling the worst and that it's difficult for him and he doesn't want to get on his moral high horse but he doens't want that stuff to happen again. Uh, to me this is just a bit of an overreaction. I did not really get upset with him or start dramaa, just explained that I felt pushed away and why that hurt my feelings. I do think the tming was bad, however. I apologized again and explained that I recognize that the timing was bad. He seems to have come out of his shell a bit in the last couple days and we're getting together tonight. I'm a little apprehensive, now, though.

 

So, I'm wondering if maybe he's dealing with some kind of moodiness issue, or just a lot of anxiety and depression. He's done this once before, a couple months ago, where he made plans and then canceled them in the pm that day bc of something that happened, and then he disappeared for days. Other times he is very communicative and wants to get together more. It just feels very inconsistent and unpredictable. I feel like anything could happen tonight, from him just ending it with me for reasons I don't anticipate to him being very sweet and affectionate and open. I can deal with it if he is open with me about it, but just being in the dark is hard on me. I am not sure how to broach the subject, though. I've been wanting to let him bring it up when he's ready, but now that it is starting to feel like it affects me more, I kind of need to get some clarity about it.

[Batya33]

Have you been attracted before to men where you can feel like the heroine, saving them from the darkness of depression? I used to be -I dated someone like him for 4-5 months and the first flag was when he cancelled a third date because he was feeling down and not good company - and what followed was lots of that type of behavior. I think it is subjective but IMO it's extreme to cancel plans because of the death of a friend's dog -to need to be apart from a person you've been intimate with because of that sort of loss, on NYE where you didn't expect him to go to a party or social event. Huge red flag. And cumulative of the other flags -there's sensitivity and then there's depression. Why do you need that in your life especially when you've discovered this so soon -he will continue to subject you to his bad moods by being rude to you and thoughtless. If he gets help and decides to stop that behavior that's different. But he shows no signs of it.

[DN]

This guy is not relationship material. Don't waste your time on drama kings and move on to someone more stable and less self-absorbed.

[exhibitA]

I don't thinK I really have. However, I've been that person myself. I have canceled things due to anxiety, feeling overwhelmed, etc. I've been on the other end of this. So I kind of get it. I am much better about things now (I'm 36, and I was kind of a depressed/anxious wrck in my 20s). It's probably my karma catching up to me.

 

His friends were planning to go out to a bar and party it up. He said he wasn't up for that, which is why I suggested something more low-key. But he wasn't up for that either. What bothers me is that he didn't seem to be very interested in how this affected me other than to tell me he hoped I didn't take it the wrong way. It really hurt my feelings that he just wanted me to go away. But then I ended up apologizing! I really do like him and think he has a lot of wonderful qualities, but I also wonder if I should pursue this further. It would be hard, as I've grown attached at this point.

 

Thinking of giving it more time, but I need to talk to him about it I think and I'm not sure how to do so in a way that isn't an attack.

[25thfloor]

3 months in and you have all this to deal with? Cut your losses. Dating is supposed to be fun. 3 months is the honeymoon period. I'd run. He sounds like a broken bird. he needs to fix himself, it's not your job.

[Batya33]

I would put it all on you when you tell him "I understand you're going through a rough time. I have to take care of me, too, though. I can't take care of myself properly if I don't respect my values and standards when it comes to reliability and being treated with respect. I'd love to be a supportive friend and help you find ways to get help if you want to get help but I think I need to take a step back from a romantic relationship with you. I'm sure you understand since your behavior is about taking care of yourself too.

[Justnotsure]

I've dated a few of these guys -- definitely depression, possibly personality disorder. It's subtle - he seems 'normal' - but odd things keep happening and somehow you end up apologizing or feeling bad. He has great qualities, so when these things happen, you can't really understand how someone who was so sweet and caring the day before has suddenly become so self-absorbed and seemingly cold.

 

It has nothing to do with you and everything to do with his inability to form intimate connections with people. Sex thing is another symptom of that. Also, his brain does not work the same way that yours does -- so you will continue to try to figure it out and empathize, but you will end up frustrated each time because you don't function the same way.

 

It's very sad and it doesn't mean he's a bad person at all - it just means that having a relationship with him will be very tumultuous and you will go through things like this often. I understand how it is to be "in it" and by the tone of your post, I don't think you're ready to give up, but know that nothing you do will change his behavior.

 

Good luck.

[exhibitA]

I would put it all on you when you tell him "I understand you're going through a rough time. I have to take care of me, too, though. I can't take care of myself properly if I don't respect my values and standards when it comes to reliability and being treated with respect. I'd love to be a supportive friend and help you find ways to get help if you want to get help but I think I need to take a step back from a romantic relationship with you. I'm sure you understand since your behavior is about taking care of yourself too.

 

But I don't really want to end it quite yet. Also, I wonder how much of my reaction stems from the fact that I kinda think being really upset that someone else's dog died is a bit over the top. But for someone who lost both his parents recently, it might just be hard on him. I don't want to be unfair.

[chickydoodle]

His behaviour sounds like someone I knew , who had a drug habit???? That or personality disorder as mentioned by JustNotSure

[exhibitA]

I very much doubt there's a drug habit, but I do suspect something else. What kind of personality disorder?

 

I did once date a guy for 4 yrs who had periods where he needed to just shut the world out. It was easily managable, though, because we talked about it, I knew what was going on, and I just let him be when he felt bad likt that, which was maybe once every few months. But this might be somethign more difficult. I just don't know.

 

I know this guy has had long term relationships before, and I know he values them. But I am kind of at a loss as to how he managed.

[25thfloor]

But I don't really want to end it quite yet. Also, I wonder how much of my reaction stems from the fact that I kinda think being really upset that someone else's dog died is a bit over the top. But for someone who lost both his parents recently, it might just be hard on him. I don't want to be unfair.

 

It's not about the doggy, you're already seeing a pattern (yep...i've been there a couple of times....I was the hero of all relationship! I could FIX them!)...you'll see that there is always something that is wrong. There will always be broken plans, broken promises and things that will make YOU feel bad because you're trying to be a good person. I mean this in the nicest ways....he has a broken wing, and he needs to heal himself or go to a doc. But I promise you, YOU can't fix him.

[exhibitA]

It's not about the doggy, you're already seeing a pattern (yep...i've been there a couple of times....I was the hero of all relationship! I could FIX them!)...you'll see that there is always something that is wrong. There will always be broken plans, broken promises and things that will make YOU feel bad because you're trying to be a good person. I mean this in the nicest ways....he has a broken wing, and he needs to heal himself or go to a doc. But I promise you, YOU can't fix him.

 

I'm not talking about fixing him. Everyone has some broken in them. I'm trying to discern if this is something I can manage and abide or if I have to write him off altogether.

[Justnotsure]

Of course I can't diagnose a personality disorder from a few posts -- but I woudn't be surprised if he had traits of BPD. Something is definitely "off" -- and not in a "we all have problems" way. I've been there and thought the same thing, but the truth is that your problems are very different than someone who has a medical condition. At his core, in his childhood - attachment got screwed up - very difficult, if almost impossible, to change -- especially not without lots and lots of therapy.

 

Again, I'm no expert, but I can just see so many similiarties to what I've experienced. If it means anything to you -- the two men that I've dated who were similar have both been in therapy for 10+ years, tried medication, and are proactive about their condition -- but still it is a daily struggle.

[exhibitA]

Of course I can't diagnose a personality disorder from a few posts -- but I woudn't be surprised if he had traits of BPD. Something is definitely "off" -- and not in a "we all have problems" way. I've been there and thought the same thing, but the truth is that your problems are very different than someone who has a medical condition. At his core, in his childhood - attachment got screwed up - very difficult, if almost impossible, to change -- especially not without lots and lots of therapy.

 

Again, I'm no expert, but I can just see so many similiarties to what I've experienced. If it means anything to you -- the two men that I've dated who were similar have both been in therapy for 10+ years, tried medication, and are proactive about their condition -- but still it is a daily struggle.

 

Yeah, of course i don't even want to try to diagnose, just wondering what kinds of things might make sense. I looked at the BPD signs and I'm not sure. He spends a lot of time alone. I don't see him feeling like he doesn't want to be alone. I also have no sense that he engages in anything impulsive, really. So I dunno. I do know he gets depressed and is quite sensitive. But so am I, so I am not sure what to make of it.

[25thfloor]

I'm not talking about fixing him. Everyone has some broken in them. I'm trying to discern if this is something I can manage and abide or if I have to write him off altogether.

 

I'm talking about broken wings...no all of us don't have broken wings....when I did, I got them fixed by a doctor. Generally folks have a splinter or two. It sounds like you're in so deep after 3 months, you may be drawn to this type of behavior. I know that I was, and those ex's were definitely mental cases. For real. I take care of myself and I expect to enter into romantic relationships with someone that is mentally stable also. but, that's just me. I don't have the time or need to 'understand' why someone would treat me like this guy treats you. I wouldn't care about 'why'.

[chickydoodle]

'''I very much doubt there's a drug habit, but I do suspect something else. What kind of personality disorder? '''Quote

 

 

Sorry I shouldnt have thrown that term around so loosely. But it may be helpful to check the DSM definitions (just in case.......he has traits)

His behaviour is a bit baffling.

I Dont think he would be suffering from depression at this stage if he was 'in love' ? Would not being in Love over-ride it?

[Justnotsure]

Again, could be *just* depression (still quite a bear, and a clinical condition) -- could have traits of a personality disorder (there is a whole spectrum and many that I'm not familiar with). I think the bottom line is that you know that this will be a struggle, and the one thing I can guarantee is that these things won't stop coming up. I mean, you know that -- this was his friends' dog -- if that's enough to cause a rift, just think of how many things life will throw at you/him that will be difficult to deal with.

 

I think that's a big thing I noticed when I was dating someone similiar - everyday life is just SO TOUGH for them. Things that you would never think would be an issue can be MAJOR. And even if you are empathetic and understanding, you will never be ENOUGH. You can say do/everything right (even while thinking "this seems ridiculous") and I guarantee you, you still won't be able to comfort him or take away his anxiety and depression. The urge to do so is strong - especially for someone caring and empathetic as yourself.

 

That said, I understand where you are right now. Totally get it. The best advice I can give is to set your boundaries. Don't lose yourself in this thing. Sure, apologize if he was hurt by the dog incident - but honestly, my best guess is that he'll act as if it never happened. That's another thing to watch -- one day it'll seem like he's angry/upset/relationship is doomed....next day: like it never happened. Continue to validate yourself and your feelings and realize that you're entitled to them. You're not "crazy" or "insensitive."

[exhibitA]

Hm yeah. All this went down via email/text so I said in my email to him that I would like to apologize in person when he's feeling better. He never replied, so I called him that eve. He didn't pick up, but texted me about 30 min later thanking me for the email, saying no apology was necessary, that he's not that upset but was just letting me know what was hard for him, and saying he's not "writing me off" (I did kind of act like I thought he was really pissed at me.)

Um ok. I let it go, didn't respond. Next eve he asks me if I want to get together for lunch (we do often, bc we work a few blocks apart). My work week was really busy and I couldn't really, so I proposed we get together for dinner. I also kind of want to talk about this a bit and didn't think that could happen in a public lunch place. So, we're getting together tonight, and I feel literally anything could happen, from him pretending like nothing happened, to dumping me, to talking about like an adult, to just picking up as his old sweet self. NO IDEA what to expect. And THAT bothers me. I guess I'll see how it goes and make a call from there.

[Justnotsure]

Yeah, it's not fun not being to predict someone's behavior -- or at least general way of reacting to events (i.e. rationally or irrationally).

 

Good luck tonight - update the thread if you can!

[exhibitA]

I honestly really don't even want to go tonight.

[chr8st8na]

OMG... that sounds like a guy I used to date (the OP).... I think he was bipolar.

3 months in to this... you should get out now and if he wants you, he'll come back better.

[exhibitA]

Hey, yeah I thought bipolar as well, but my understanding of that is that mood swings are not so short. Like, he seems to go down for a few days, not months or weeks. But I dunno.

I sent him a text asking if he's still up for tonight. Gives him an out, in case he isn't really feeling this or something. That wouldn't be consistent with how he was acting just a week ago, but for all I know his cancelation had more to do with not wanting to pursue this than some grand theory of emotional problems. Who knows. We'll see. Kinda have one foot out the door, tho.

[exhibitA]

Ok, so update:

 

He and I talked about what happened, on his initation, and it seems pretty legit that he was upset and not doing well when he canceled. He honestly seems like very sensitive person, and I can fully imagine him being upset about a dog he looked after every week for 12 yrs, especially after losing his parents recently and having residual griefy * * * * going on and not feeling well for a few days before it happened. I told him I was hurt that he pushed me away and he said that he might not have if he knew me better but that I've never seen him that way and he's never seen me that way and he was self-conscious about it. I don't doubt that. He also said that this is somethign that is sometimes in issue for him in his relationships, that he withdraws when he's not doing ok. Frankly as long as I understand that, it really isn't an issue. If that's all he does, I am not sure I have much to complain about if I understand it. I just don't know when to think it's *me* and when it's just him having trouble.

 

Things seem pretty good otherwise, he seems to be making an effort to reassure me and to communicate that he intends to stick around. I think he's just a very sensitive, emotional, and moody guy, but all that contributes to why I like him in the first place. A lot of those qualities stem from the same things that case him to be a bit moody. He's very emotionally honest but also very sweet and caring. Last night he spent the night and I woke up at 5am and he was gone, had just left. I thought oh * * * * he had some kind of freakout or something and this is just untenable and I can't handle this * * * * . Then he sent me a text saying he was really sorry but that I was snoring a lot and even with earplugs he couldn't sleep so he went home, but that he was bummed about it beecause he really enjoyed being so close. It was very sweet. So I dunno. I really don't want to dump this guy. I sincerely hope I can come to understand enough that I won't take this stuff personally. I think he's a really good guy.

[EmmaB78]

Wait - he left at 5am because you were snoring, and you don't see that as a problem? I find that very weird. He couldn't just move to the couch? Are you guys never supposed to sleep together?

[exhibitA]

You really think it's that weird? Pretty sure I've had to move from the bed bc of a snorer in my life a few times. I'm not sure there's anywhere he could have gone. I have a loveseat, not a couch. A person could not sleep on it, and it's roughly 9 feet from my bed anyway. I'm not sure I always snore, so I don't really know if it's an impending problem or not.