Oh man, he called me!

[HeartGoesOn]

I guess I'm on the list of "those purposely making you feel bad," which IMO means it's not what you want to hear, and you'd rather hear from posters that agree with you, and justify your way of seeing this. With that said, I wish you the best, and hopefully you'll find your way...

[jbrooklyn]

ONCORE!! This is brilliant!

[jbrooklyn]

AMAZING!!! I mean it....JUST AMAZING!!! You got this baby!

[adviseseeker]

I guess I'm on the list of "those purposely making you feel bad," which IMO means it's not what you want to hear, and you'd rather hear from posters that agree with you, and justify your way of seeing this. With that said, I wish you the best, and hopefully you'll find your way...

 

No, you aren't (?)...

[squirl]

Hey adviseseeker,

 

One thing I would recommend, from an objective outside point of view, is that if your decision is actually to respond, you call again and leave a message. Most people would just say hey, I'm just returning your call.

 

I would not necessarily expect a person to "return" a missed call. For all he knows, you might have just purse dialed him. When you leave a message you remove all doubt.

 

And let it go after that.

[jbrooklyn]

I agree with the adviseseeker regarding your deliverance to situation. I remember being totally slamed by you and you was wrong and out of line. I agree with adviceseeker that you guys are here to bring advice and logic to a confused mind about a situation going on in each others lives. That is good. But when you start saying stuff like CRAZY IDEAS...that is not cool.

 

Adviseseeker really really loves this man. She has been brave enough to walk away for as long as she has. She still loves him and wants him in her life. BOTTOMLINE> Will it happen, I dont really know but this is her desire. She needs to see the truth and reality of the situation as it comes to her.

 

HE DID call her her. Now she called him back and ....he didnt answer....not good. I am starting to think that he is playing some kind of game to randomly call and then not answer when she calls back. At the end of the day, I think he cares but something is going on within him.

 

I do think sometimes you are hard. I have a friend that is raw like you and I really dont like her. Deliver logic and reason yes....but making me feel worst than I already do by lashing out on me.....NOT. She truly doesnt mean anything by it, she is trying to show sisterly love but truthful....I dont think I really have gotten over it with her and I dont really like her because of it. It is weird but it is very much true.

[jbrooklyn]

adviseseeker,

I can relate to every single thing you have said regarding this situation. I have to agree with Lavander it alot of ways cause I am living it. GOD knows how much I love my ex boyfriend. He brings a high to me I can find nowhere. I love this man with all my heart but he has followed the pattern of what Lavender called the "initator"

 

My friends are like forget him...move on....why you still trying to keep that alive....They dont understand. They want me to date other people, get out and mingle cause I am good looking. They say you will meet someone who will treat you better and forget about him. But at the end of the day, it really aint that simple or else I would have done that.

 

My ex was confused and all that. He is un-confused now I suppose. He has a chic he has been seeing for awhile. I dont think he is totally content with her but she is definitely apart of his life now. He was talking to me and stuff at one point and I was trying to play it cool but I made a stupid mistake and now the relationship is dead. You talking about pure pain. I was in church crying my eyes out. Friends dont get that. Just move on is all they say.

 

All I can tell you is that, you really need to be careful. If you guys talk and then he flips out and goes ghost again....let him stay gone. Right now we are not experiencing good and healthy love. I am much older and I still look good but I dont have a man. I cant spend alot of time on this situation for much longer. If he flips out again or doesnt SHOW you more soon...you are going to have to settle inside yourself that this is not going to work out.

 

Today, I may see my ex. I dont think I want to do it. he was so hard and mean the last time we really talked and I still feel the pain of the last conversation. He talked to me in a way he had never talked to me and I feel so disgusted inside about it. i expect when I see him that he will be mean and distant towards me and I dont know if I can handle that. I really think I need to keep my distance but I guess I want to see if he would be nice or decent towards me. But why would I even want that satisfaction? It aint cool.

[uncomfynumb]

Lavenderdove,

 

I read some of the reviews of book that you mentioned about uncoupling. It seems the book doesn't give answers on how to salvage broken relationships or does it?

 

Your advise to the OP mirrors my own in many ways, obviously you are far more eloquent in your presentation but what I'm wondering is how your advise to the OP about setting limits on how and when her ex should contact her reflects on the stage of uncoupling that you think her ex is in?

 

I hope my question makes sense. If you see my other thread here about when to hold on and when to move on it might help to understand where I am going with this. So for those of us who do not understand the uncoupling process from the ex's or dumpers perspective, when is the right time for the dumpee to communicate to the dumper that contact should only be made if the purpose is to resume the relationship?

[squirl]

I too have read reviews of Uncoupling. My understanding is that the author's theory is that it is too late once the departing partner starts to leave. But apparently this book is life-changing in understanding relationships.

 

Much more concrete and constructive seems to be Ron Turtle's advice. Perhaps it only applies to married couples, and correct me if I am wrong but he seems to say to mirror the other person and when they come back only spend half the time with them they want while you are reconciling. Thus, if they want to have dinner, meet them for coffee. If they want to hang out for an hour, say you can only give them 30 minutes because you have to run to meet someone. Or something like that.

 

I do not know if the ultimatum to contact only for reconciliation actually works to bring about reconciliation. I think it may work in the raw healing period, but in the end it is only a request and we cannot control what they do.

[uncomfynumb]

Squirl,

 

I understand what you are saying but again I wonder if there is some point of reference, a particular stage in the uncoupling process where you would no longer apply Al Turtles principles in working toward a reconciliation and give the ultimatium?

 

I've not read a whole lot of Al's stuff just yet but from what you have just posted how is that supposed to be effective? I'm assuming it has something to do with making your ex feel safe again and not overwhelming them?

 

What i would really like to know is it at all possible that people leave relationships soley because they are stressed and overwhelmed by their own personal circumstances? I'm thinking it is but very rare. But in that rare case, how do you know?

[lavenderdove]

The book 'Uncoupling' outlines research on how people break up, that really helps understand why people behave the way they do, and helps people to understand why the dumper behaves the way they do, and the stages the dumped partner must go thru before they really recover from being dumped.

 

In terms of salvaging relationships, the primary advice it gives is that one must be diligent and not get too complacent in a relationship, and should keep their eyes open for any signs of discontent in the relationship, and immediately make the partner aware that you are noticing the discontent, and to start working on resolving whatever is causing the discontentment in the partner.

 

This is why it always amazes me that people think they can bicker forever, or bury their head in the sand, when a partner is showing signs of losing interest or being unhappy. You need to address any conflicts or discontent and solve them rather than ignore them, or the initiator will start down the path of uncoupling on their own.

 

If the initiator gets too far along in the process of uncoupling, it is frequently too late to bring them back again, because they have formed a support system and life away from you, and don't want to come back.

 

This is why no contact sometimes work though... if the person is just thinking about leaving and still experimenting with the new life away from the partner (but hasn't fully decided that it is really over in their own minds), if you cut them off before they have that new support system in place and new people firmly in their life, they may feel the pain of being cut off and recognize what they are giving up and want to come back and work on it rather than leave.

 

And it is also why being 'friends' with a dumper frequently is the wrong choice. While you are being friendly and offering them a support system, they are very comfortable while looking for a NEW support system that isn't you. So they want to be friends, but will only do so until they have someone else in hand who fulfills your role in their lives. So you are actually HELPING them leave you behind by staying friends with them and giving them a backup plan that makes it safe for them to experiment with other people with you in the background.

 

But if they are far along in the process of mentally giving up on you and moving on, then it is really unlikely they will come back, regardless of what you try to do.

 

I also see more hope for couples who have some big blowup and part abruptly where there has not been too much conflict in the relationship, rather than a couple who bickers constantly for a long time, and has had multiple 'breaks' along the way. the multiple breaks usually indicate the initiator wants to break free, but just hasn't found something better for themselves yet, and will repeat this pattern until they have a new support system/partner in place.

 

I even see hope in some couples who have a single incident of cheating that was a drunken one night stand etc., which really wasn't about discontentment with the partner, but more about stupidity and immaturity. But if the person has a long term affair or mutliple incidents of cheating, it means that they are trying to emotionally separate from their partner and just haven't finished doing it yet.

 

So i would recommend that anyone read Uncoupling, if for nothing else so that they recognize the signs of discontentment in a partner, and can jump in and stop the process before it really takes hold and a breakup is inevitable.

 

btw, it is also interesting why some people who do uncouple, find a new partner and dump their ex for that new person, sometimes come back for a *short* reconciliation. They've established their new support system, then the new person leaves and hat rug is jerked out from under them, they feel awful, and return to the prior ex because they desperately need a support system. But once they are back with the ex, the original reasons for their discontentment are still there (i.e., they are still the same people), so they stay with that ex for a while, until they again form a new support system with yet a third person or their discontentment level gets so high they don't want it anymore, and they dump the person a second time.

 

So just getting an ex back for a while doesn't solve that discontentment. If the ex does reappear, you need to very aggressive in addressing what the original source of discontentment was, and fix that, or it will be round two of the relationship, but it will just disintegrate again, and much faster than the first time. You see a lot of cases of a relationship that goes on for say 2 years, breaks up for 6 months to a year, the dumper comes back again when they encounter some life stress and want a support system, but the relationship doesn't last long, maybe 2 to 6 months, and the person is gone yet again.

 

The relationships that permanently reconcile are those where the original source of discontentment is solved and the dumper comes back out of a recognition that they made a mistake to leave rather than solve the problems, not because they're lonely or have been dumped by their new partner and need consolation.

[uncomfynumb]

Wow... You know, I did the NC no friends thing for me and me only to move on, not to get my ex back so that good to read that this is the right thing to do all around.

 

I'm thinking there was a lot of things that my ex did not tell me when we broke up. But this is also something he does. For instance, after his surgery he could move alot or do any kind of lifting or squatting and he asked me to get all the beer from the fridge and put in the garage to hide fom his mom that was coming over. Now this is a grown man of 44 years. I asked him why he hid the fact that he drinks at all from his mom and he basically said to avoid conflict and to not upset her. She is a good, old baptist woman.

 

So did the book say anything about people who leave but don't have another support system in place? I know for certain that my ex was not testing out other relationship because of his physical condition and his financial condition. I know he felt bad for not being able to take me out on a proper date or even have sex with me. And a part of me feels bad for turning down his offer of friendship but I just could not do it. I felt that I had to start moving on for my own protection and sanity.

 

Sorry for the hijack but this thread is going to help more than one person here find the answers to their questions.

 

Thanks for taking the time to post all this information. It is invaluable.

[Brownstone322]

 

If the initiator gets too far along in the process of uncoupling, it is frequently too late to bring them back again, because they have formed a support system and life away from you, and don't want to come back.

 

...

 

But if they are far along in the process of mentally giving up on you and moving on, then it is really unlikely they will come back, regardless of what you try to do.

Lavenderdove, this is great stuff, and I agree with all of it. I want to make sure, though, that people don't misunderstand what "too late to bring them back" and "unlikely they will come back" actually mean. Those terms mean that the breakup is real, and there's little point in pursuing a reconciliation in the near term.

 

Time changes everything, though. Dumpers need time to see if this new "support system" is itself satisfying, and the possibilities for reconciliation after a long period of separation are likewise real, but only after significant disengagement on both sides. I have friends who went through that cycle with their current wives, but only after they were split for at least a year (in one guy's case, for several years).

 

In those first months of despair, though -- when emotional pain is at its worst -- I couldn't agree more with what you posted.

[lavenderdove]

The new life/support system isn't always a new romance... it could be a new lifestyle, a new set of friends with shared interests, a new job, going back to school, a new hobby etc.

 

What is common is that they are forming an emotional life that is separate from the partner, something for them to do/be away from the partner that makes them feel good and meets their needs. They just start to devleop a focus on new things/people that are not part of the relationship, and rely/interact less with their partner and more elsewhere.

 

The key is they stop investing themselves in the relationship, and start investing themselves elsewhere, on their own or in/with another person or people. Sometimes it takes the form of a new identity for themselves, as in they may develop a sudden interest in a new sport, change their look, start a hobby they know you aren't interested in, get tatoos when they know you don't like them, join a club you don't belong to etc.

 

re: Brownstone's comment, of course there are always possibilities of reconciliation, especially if the discontentment wasn't any true lack of compatability, but due to differences in growth stages, separations prompted by job changes, an ill advised attraction that was acted on foolishly etc.

 

the problem comes in that the timing has to be really right for reconciliation, and if two people part, odds are good that one or the other will meet a partner they like just as much or more in the interim, or continue to grow in a different direction than their former partner. If they are lucky and both have really similar goals in life and they are lucky in the timing such that they are both available at the same time and feel the parting was a mistake, then they can get back together.

 

Nothing is impossible, but some things are more probable than others, and one has to be careful not to squander one's life hanging onto something that has a small probability of paying off in the end. I think ALL people need to pursue their own healing when someone dumps them, and if life's curves bring that person back around again then fine, but they can't live their lives with the hope/expectation that will happen, nor should they turn down or turn away from other romantic partners waiting for an ex who has moved on.

[Live-N-Learn]

[quote=lavenderdove;

If the initiator gets too far along in the process of uncoupling, it is frequently too late to bring them back again, because they have formed a support system and life away from you, and don't want to come back.

 

This is why no contact sometimes work though... if the person is just thinking about leaving and still experimenting with the new life away from the partner (but hasn't fully decided that it is really over in their own minds), if you cut them off before they have that new support system in place and new people firmly in their life, they may feel the pain of being cut off and recognize what they are giving up and want to come back and work on it rather than leave.

 

Lavenderdove,

 

I am just wanting you advice. My ex and I broke up 3 months a ago and had been hanging out for the past 5 weeks, going out dancing , kissing and such. She even came home and slept with me one night. She has not in any way said she wants to come back. I know she dated a guy for awhile right after we broke up. Not sure if they are still seeing each other or not.

 

I finally had enough after this past weekend of going out both Friday and Saturday night dancing , drinking and kissing and her not coming home with me either night. Then going to the zoo Monday and being treated like I was friendzoned and her not talking about it.

 

I sent her a text and cut her off and went NC. Is she too far along to maybe want to come back? she obviously still has some feelings for me or she would not be going out dancin and kissing and such. Is feels like we just broke up this weekend all over again.

[adviseseeker]

Hey adviseseeker,

 

One thing I would recommend, from an objective outside point of view, is that if your decision is actually to respond, you call again and leave a message. Most people would just say hey, I'm just returning your call.

 

I would not necessarily expect a person to "return" a missed call. For all he knows, you might have just purse dialed him. When you leave a message you remove all doubt.

 

And let it go after that.

 

Hmmm I've been thinking about this quite a bit and, I just don't know! Last night I was considering writing a friendly text message but man I just don't know... The time he called me way back in January (before he wanted to take things slow) I was busy with a friend, he left me a a message and I called him back half an hour later. He didn't answer and I didn't leave a message (I really despise leaving messages I guess so I was concerned and then 20 minutes later I wrote him a text message saying I had been busy but if he wanted to hang out I'd be up for it, he responded saying he'd try me on wednesday which he did.

 

So, I really don't want to be rude or spiteful looking but at the same time I don't want him to think he's 'got me' or that I'm too eager. I hope it wasn't bad that I didn't call him back for two days... It's the 3rd day now for him not returning my call, and I know it's probably not good that I didn't leave a message - maybe I should have called back the next day He might be being cautious because he doesn't know how I'll react - he gets really afraid when he thinks I'm mad. But I'm wondering why he hasn't tried again, I thought I left the ball in his court - even if I didn't leave a message I still called back you know?

 

So, a friendly text message would be something like this: 'Hey, how's it going? I tried calling the other day but I guess your pretty busy. I've been cramming for exams, blech. Well if you wanna meet up for coffee sometime that would be nice, let me know if you're free'

 

What do you think?

[lavenderdove]

Scott, it sounds like she's using you for a security blanket and support system until she finds someone new... I honestly wouldn't give her all the attention and act like you're still together when you're not... so a good idea to cut her off. She needs to quit leaving you in limbo and either get back with you, or leave you alone so you can heal and find a new person to love.

 

If she calls again, i'd ask her what it would take for her to want to date you again... what was it about the relationship she didn't want, and is it anything you can fix (or want to fix). In other words, shift into a negotiation to see if she is willing to come back and work on it. If she's not or refuses to talk about it, then tell her to call you if she changes her mind and wants to work on it, otherwise it is time for you both to heal and move on and quite hanging out like teenagers, if what you want is a real relationship.

 

Perhaps your absence will snap her out of this, if she's suddenly on her own without you there to bridge the gap. But i would only agree to see her if she is willing to date you again and work on the issues that led to the original breakup. Hanging out as friends/pseudo-lovers is not getting you any closer to what you want from her.

[lavenderdove]

AS, it could be that he only called to say hi, was bored at the moment, lonely, whatever, and that moment has passed and now he's off doing other things so doesn't feel the need to talk to you or see you.

 

Again, if what you want is to get back together, then working on anything less than that won't do you any good. You need to be talking to him to resolve any issues, and if he won't talk to you about this, then you have to assume he is not interested in getting back together with you, and is perhaps using you as a safety net or security blanket until he finds someone/something else to fill his needs.

 

I'd just quit focusing on him entirely, and go about your business getting over him. If he calls you again, respond to him right away and ask him what he wants rather than playing phone tag games. And if all he's offering is friendship or brief 'how ya doing' calls, then you know that is not taking you in the direction you want so don't indulge him with that...

[Live-N-Learn]

I agree Lavenderdove,

 

That is why I sent this text and am on Day 6 of NC.

 

Hey ex, it’s been a lot of fun hanging out with you this past month or so. I have been doing some thinking and think we both need some time apart from each other. There are some goals in my life that I want to accomplish and did not want you to think I was being rude since I have not reached out to you since Monday. After a lot of thought, I think it was the right thing for us to break up and now I think it's time for us to go our separate ways. Who knows, in the future, maybe we can reconnect at some point. In the meantime, I really do wish you the best of luck and happiness in your life.

 

This was her response about 2 hours later.

 

"Wow, well i cant really say it was a surprise. But best of luck with your accomplishments you deserve it, it was fun. If you don't mind me picking up my sons toy or maybe dropping it off at my work sometime that would be great, he keeps asking for it. OK best wishes to you."

ME

 

I assume she said it she was not surprised because she know she had it coming. Just my thought. I doubt I will hear from her. I just need to move on. It is so hard to get all the things she told me over the past 5 weeks out of my head.

 

1. I have never connected with anyone like I connect with you

2. I have never had better sex than with you

3. I have never opened up and share my feelings with anyone not even my ex husband like I have with you

4. I have never had as much fun with anyone like I do with you when we are out drinking and dancin

5. I am so comfortable dancing with you, no one else can I feel this way

 

This makes it really hard to let go but I must.

[adviseseeker]

At the end of the day, I think he cares but something is going on within him.

 

My thoughts exactly.

 

adviseseeker,

I can relate to every single thing you have said regarding this situation. I have to agree with Lavander it alot of ways cause I am living it. GOD knows how much I love my ex boyfriend. He brings a high to me I can find nowhere. I love this man with all my heart but he has followed the pattern of what Lavender called the "initator"

 

My friends are like forget him...move on....why you still trying to keep that alive....They dont understand. They want me to date other people, get out and mingle cause I am good looking. They say you will meet someone who will treat you better and forget about him. But at the end of the day, it really aint that simple or else I would have done that.

 

My ex was confused and all that. He is un-confused now I suppose. He has a chic he has been seeing for awhile. I dont think he is totally content with her but she is definitely apart of his life now. He was talking to me and stuff at one point and I was trying to play it cool but I made a stupid mistake and now the relationship is dead. You talking about pure pain. I was in church crying my eyes out. Friends dont get that. Just move on is all they say.

 

All I can tell you is that, you really need to be careful. If you guys talk and then he flips out and goes ghost again....let him stay gone. Right now we are not experiencing good and healthy love. I am much older and I still look good but I dont have a man. I cant spend alot of time on this situation for much longer. If he flips out again or doesnt SHOW you more soon...you are going to have to settle inside yourself that this is not going to work out.

 

Today, I may see my ex. I dont think I want to do it. he was so hard and mean the last time we really talked and I still feel the pain of the last conversation. He talked to me in a way he had never talked to me and I feel so disgusted inside about it. i expect when I see him that he will be mean and distant towards me and I dont know if I can handle that. I really think I need to keep my distance but I guess I want to see if he would be nice or decent towards me. But why would I even want that satisfaction? It aint cool.

 

I'm sorry to hear this He's seeing someone new now? Well he may still be confused and trying something (someone) new to see what happens. I wouldn't pin all my hopes on it not working out with them, because sometimes it does unfortunately. You already seem to know all this though! The fact that he was hard and mean the last time you talked - was it hard and mean with an attitude? Or was it indifference and a lack of caring at all? I would think about that, because he may be irritated in his own situation and taking that out on other people. Or he may be totally moved on and doesn't care to be nice anymore. But sometimes people that are moved on are still nice in a friendly way...hmm. I don't know, I hate these situations.

[adviseseeker]

So, seeing as I want to get back together and work on things, and we would have to talk about the issues. Should I send the text message at all?

[lavenderdove]

I'm a big fan of deciding what you want, then being very open and honest in your communication of what you want from the other person and trying to negotiate with them... then they can decide whether they want to try to work on it with you or not.

 

Lots of what goes wrong in relationships is not really being open/honest with each other and communicating enough because you're afraid/angry/worried etc. But if you get it all out there, you're more likely to really know what is going on, so that you can take proper actions/decisions.

 

Since you two have never really connected and talked since his original call, i'd try to call him again and see if you get him, and if you don't, send an email and say whatever you want to say, and that you were hoping his call meant he wanted to be with you again.

 

That's the best you can really do, be honest and hope that he responds to your honesty/openness. He can either say yes, i want to try, or i don't know, or no, maybe but not now, or no response at all. But each of those tell you something.

 

If it is yes, then good, you move forward, and if it is i don't know then respond that he should call you again when he does know (and don't talk to him til he does know). And if he says maybe but not now, then you say call me when you figure it out and know what you want from me. And if he says no or you get no response back at all, then you have to assume he's trying to move on and best to do the same yourself.

 

The more you interact, the more data you have and the better that is in adjusting your behavior accordingly. But those interactions need to be very focused on what you want and the relationship and moving forward back into a relationship or else moving on, not just being his little buddy to support him til he finds someone he likes better. Many people fall into that trap, to be bitterly disappointed later when he does go off with someone else after you've invested ages being his buddy after the breakup hoping for more.

 

Remember it's OK if he's confused, but HE needs to say he's confused, not you just assume that. And if he's confused, then he needs to go off and figure it out, get counseling, clear his head, BUT just continuing to do nothing and drop in and out of your life using confusion as an excuse just doesn't cut it. And you should tell him that, a very valid thing to say to him. That jumping in and out of your life is not fair to you at all, and he needs to grow up and resolve his issues rather than jerking other people around because of them. But really, most of the time when people behave this way is it not confusion, it is selfishness on their part, and them using you as a security blanket while they search for someone new.

 

He needs to know that his option with you won't stay open forever, and he'd better get his act together and come back, or you'll have someone new. I've seen some guys waffle for years with a woman, until she lets him know he is free to do what he wants, but so is she, so she's going to move on with her life and start dating other people if he doesn't get back together with her now, and only then does he get serious again, because he doesn't want to lose her and sees the door closing. And if he lets the door close and doesn't try to stop you from dating others, then he wasn't really going to come back anyway. Again, people treat with respect things that they value and think they'll lose, but don't care if they lose something that they don't value that much. If he's willing to lose you, and really understands that his behavior is going to make him lose you, he might come back. And if he doesn't, he doesn't love you enough to make a relationship work.

[adviseseeker]

I read the stuff about decoupling. I'm going to write some more details on the situation to see what people think. Maybe it's not good to rehash this stuff but I'm just trying to understand the situation more.

 

For 4 months before the breakup I had gotten a job in the summer that was late shifts so we only saw each other 2 days a week for four months. That had an impact probably, he missed me and the time actually spent together was wonderful. All this was happening while he was having new experiences, new friends and having all these changes in his life from starting school but I just simply wasn't around to share it. We were still discussing our future plans together, doing new activities together - going for picnics, getting involved in a project together, having lots of fun.

 

After my job ended I decided to take a break before school so I was jobless. I also got pretty lazy and wasn't spending any time with friends. We had our 2 year anniversary of our first date. It was pretty big milestone though for him, he mentioned one time that getting married was scary for him when we were at home.

 

So then we go on a short trip to my parents house. As we are going to bed he is very quiet and acting funny, I asked if he was okay and he said yes. We hadn't been intimate the past few nights but I thought it was because he was stressed and tired. On the drive home the next night he gave me a 'talk' about I guess how he didn't think I was right for him - he mentioned things like how I didn't drink very much or party, I don't smoke marijuana, I don't listen to hard punk music etc. (he wasn't going around doing these things much). I was really startled and had nothing to say, I stayed quiet till we got home. Then he hugged me and apologized and said he wasn't leaving me. I cried for the first time in front of him.

 

I think a few days or a week after this he asked for a break - he said he needed space for a month and wanted to stay with his parents. He mentioned some new things - he didn't feel like he lived here and he didn't like that everyone referred to our apartment as my place. I told him I didn't think a break was a good idea and that he should stay and work things out with me, I cried, he left then came back and agreed to stay. We talked about things, then over the next few weeks I tried to make things better by making more room in the apartment, discussing things he could decorate with to make it more his place, we talked about moving out and getting a bigger place with 2 bedrooms so he could have his own space. He went to the landlord and asked her to put us on the list for any 2 bedrooms that open up. He told her we needed more space.

 

Then was the actual break/up. Few days after he cried on the phone (first time) and said he wasn't sure about breaking up, he was confused and didn't know and needed some space. He said we both needed some time apart to work on ourselves. When we met up and talked a week later, I asked him first if he was leaning towards breaking up and he said an unsure yes. I then asked what were the things he loved about me and he couldn't say anything. We started talking about it more, he told me all of these silly little things about me - I cleaned too much, I didn't let him cook enough, I didn't like swimming, I'm afraid of heights, he felt I had no friends and that I didn't love myself, he felt I wasn't over my ex, he felt I didn't understand the bisexual side of him. I defended myself a bit but tried not to make him feel stupid for feeling those things. At the end he told me he was really confused and didn't know what was going on with him, he said maybe his brain was screwed up but he really didn't know. He said he needed some space, he said he was going to cry when we hugged and he left. (He is visibly shaken and confused looking during all of the talks he had with me, he would get really hot and sweaty and it clearly was hard for him to do)

 

After writing a letter and confronting him a month later we sort of got back together, he admitted that the things he said were excuses and he was just looking for a reason to breakup. When we were alone he admitted that he was really afraid of the future, wanted his freedom, felt too young, we were hugging in bed and he said 'this is what scares me'. Then he pushed away the next day and I got upset, he got upset and said he needed space. That's when I stopped trying to push the relationship. He has been going back and forth this whole time, at the same time he was pretty heavily involved in school but now has finally finished so I can't assume he is busy and stressed about that anymore.

 

I hope this makes more sense because he never said during the breakup that the reason was because he was scared, he admitted that stuff later in a comfortable environment. I think he came up with all the reasons and things about me because he also doesn't know if I'm the right person for him. So I think he's scared of getting married and not sure if he wants to be with me at the same time. Since we had been together for 2 years, he knows that getting back together with me would not be to just 'see where it goes' and try being casual, because we already reached the stage of moving towards commitment. So I think he doesn't want to hurt me by making me think he wants it yet, he loves me still and cares but hasn't made up his mind about it. He never said we were done and finished, he has said the entire time he doesn't know and is confused. So he has left the door open, and disappears. I can't really know if he's not taking this time to figure his stuff out but it might take while for him to do that anyway - more than a few months. I can't wait around obviously, but I don't know what to do when he reaches out either.

[uncomfynumb]

The new life/support system isn't always a new romance... it could be a new lifestyle, a new set of friends with shared interests, a new job, going back to school, a new hobby etc.

 

What is common is that they are forming an emotional life that is separate from the partner, something for them to do/be away from the partner that makes them feel good and meets their needs. They just start to devleop a focus on new things/people that are not part of the relationship, and rely/interact less with their partner and more elsewhere.

.

 

Wow, I actually feel really bad because I don't think my ex had anything lined up at all. We saw each other every moment that we could up until the moment that we broke up. On top of that, as I said he really could do anything because he had back surgery and one of the last things we talked about before the blowup was how he might have to have the sugery again as it made him worse not better and how he could't afford the MRI his deductible was $1000.

 

He blind sided me with the breakup. I was in tune with him and asked a lot of questions and was constantly checking in. His sexual attraction to me was animal up until the breakup; we couldn't have intercourse but other things hee hee.

 

So as the story goes I said no to a friendship which seemed to really upset him. But he has respected me and hasn't reached out at all which I appreciate.

 

I've talked with him via email but I've never broached the subject of reconcilliation. I did however ask him again about why he handled things the way he did but once again, he shut down.

 

What I've learned since this is and from Al Turtle is his lizard freezes when he doesn't feel safe. And he and I are polar opposites when it comes to how we handle conflict; I confront it head on and he avoids it.

 

I'm not sure if I want to reconcile anymore at all but I do desire to know more, to understand more about why the relationship really ended as I don't buy the stress part, not completely anyway and this is the part that is the hardest to let go of. I feel if I knew more, perhaps what I did wrong from his POV, then it could help me in my future relationships. Unfortunately, I can't make him talk if he doesn't want to and water shedding is illegal ha!

 

I emailed today breaking my longest stint of NC ever. After reading all this, I got to really worrying about him and wanted to ask about his health and other things. I also told him about getting to know your lizard. Maybe he will open up, maybe he won't. I guess we will see. But I think it was the right thing to reach out regardless. I'm not in a place where I feel this will set me back at all.

 

Thanks again for all of this information. I'm going to order the book and probably pass it on to him when I'm done as he had a really diffcult time getting over his divorce.

[adviseseeker]

As long as you're in a place that you feel won't set you back I don't see the harm, if you're intentions on giving him that information were good and it was non-threatening then he might just take it to heart.

 

I'm in the place now where it won't set me back, we've been out of contact for a while and I've accepted that it might not work out. Him rejecting me at this point won't affect me as much, only help me move on further from him as every time he distances himself does.

 

I send him the text today, whether he responds or not I'll see! He could have just been thinking of me and wanting to know how my life was going, but by the sound of his voice it was more then that... makes me think he's still confused and has been so focused on school this whole time he hasn't thought too much about us and is finally starting to.

 

I think that giving him the space he needs helps a lot, I'm not going to cling onto the fact that he wanted to take things slow before but I really think he has some things to work out in himself and I honestly don't think there's anything I can do about it. Demanding that he make a decision about us I don't think will help, it may make me temporarily feel better but in the long run that's a decision he needs to come to without any pressure from me. I can still move on from him as I've been doing though. We both still care about each other so I think it will be a long time before we both separate for good - unless a reconciliation happens. I think a few more months down the line a resolution will come.

 

Thoughts?