It just hurts

[Mishmash]

My stbx stopped by my workplace tonight. He had a co-workers son with him. He said that the co-worker was going through a divorce, so he was bonding with the boy.

He didn't even ask about his own kids. It just literally crushes me...

[annie24]

((((((HUGS))))))))) don't know what else to say.

[thejigsup]

Please, I think he was just trying to help a hurting little boy. I am sure he does the same with your kids when he has them. If this isn't the case, I would wonder why he needed you to see that. Strange.

[Mishmash]

Thejigsup - that's just it. He doesn't want anything to do with his kids. At the beginning of his affair he said his relationship with his online g/f was more important to him than his relationship with them.

In three months he hasn't called them (they have their own cell phones) or attempted to be with them. When we talk he doesn't even ask about them.

So yeah, maybe he was trying to help this boy, but there's none of that with his kids.

[LifesontheUp]

I think he's taken the easiest option and cut his kids out of his life rather than have to explain to them what he's gone and done. He's a selfish coward and deserves nothing more than to grow old grey and lonely.

 

I remember when my mum had her affair and my dad threw her out, she never once tried to get in touch with me, my sister or my brother, we were all teenagers at the time. She just launched herself in trying to get her OM to live with her and "be happy" I won't pretend her actions hurt us all but we loved our dad and rallied around him.

 

My dad eventually took my mum back, and to this day my sister and brother do not bother with her. They were so disgusted by her treatment of them and my dad, that they decided they didn't need her in their life anyway and have stopped all attempts she has made at reconcilliation. I'm the oldest and it took me years to speak to her, but I do occasionally these days. She always tells me her regrets that her other 2 kids don't want to acknowledge her. She tells me how lonely she feels, she has no family and stuff like that. To be honest, she is still selfish as she is still only worried about herself.......just like your stbx.

 

I think what I am saying is that your stbx will come to his senses at some point but it may very well be too little too late for your kids....that'll be their choice.

 

How are your kids dealing with this? Do they care if they speak to him or not?

[heavenearth]

Mishmash (interesting name I wonder what he's thinking, maybe if you hear something from him or ask the question if he have thought about contacting his own kids. Then we could probably understand him better be it good or bad?

[BeStrongBeHappy]

Some people who are extremely self centered or narcissistic are only interested in the 'package'. By that I mean, they want a love or family relationship, but aren't interested in the individuals involved because it is all about pleasing themselves.

 

So if they decide they've lost interest in one woman and want a different one, they will drop all trappings of the former relationship (including the children) because they are part of the 'package' they no longer want to participate in. They will entirely blow off the children from the prior relationship, and take up with the children of the new relationship or just make new babies with the new person.

 

People are like pairs of shoes to them, and when the old shoes don't fit right, they just discard them.

 

So he is playing 'happy family' with the new woman and is arranging his life in ways that fit in with her and her life. Obviously children from a prior relationship don't fit into his plan, and he is stroking his own ego and convincing himself he's a good guy by this kind of thing. If he's a narcissist, there is nothing in it from bonding with his own kids because they are probably hurt and may ask him questions or remind him of a reality he isn't interested in anymore.

[Mishmash]

BeStrong and Life - you both make excellent points and I can relate to a lot of what was said. I do think the main reason is that he knows they harbor negative feelings and he flat out said he doesn't allow any negativity in his life. To me that seems to be an excuse and not a reason.

 

Heaven - When I have to see him in person I tell the kids and ask if they want to talk or see him. They're older teenagers and with how things went down do not wish to see him and that is their choice. I'm not going to go in-between and try to force a reconciliation.

He's the adult/father and should be the one taking initiative and try to heal their relationship, not the other way around like he thinks.

 

I'm fine with dealing with his/mine relationship but I still get upset when it comes to this area. There was no reason for him to say that to me, unless he's trying to make me upset. I guess I just have to come to terms that these are his choices, and will be his consequences.

[just M.E.]

Mismmash -

 

I may be wrong but then again I may be dead right on this ....

 

My impression of your ex is that of a very selfish and narcissistic man. With that said, it fits the pattern of him needing approval in others eyes. With this child, he can be the hero both with the child and it's parent. He has already failed miserably with his own and a true narcissist cannot admit fault and work for reconciliation or forgiveness. If they did that, they would have to look at themselves honestly, and they are never really wrong, they apologize only in positioning themselves to look good or a means to an end.

 

Sounds harsh in my assessment but if he is like mine, these are the cold harsh realities. It is hard not to be hurt, but please realize, he is incapable of normal behavior. There is a very real possiblity that this is what he is doing.

[John Bendix]

Mishmash,

 

As has been posted and written about, my X has an estranged relationship with her children. One is 15 while the other two are 20 and 22. They all live with me.

 

When she left to find "happiness" and be on her own, she did the dance of coming by the house and waiting in the cul-de-sac for up to an hour at a time. She would not come to the front door even though I told her at the social worker's office that she could come by at anytime. 3/4 of the time my kids would not even answer calls to their cells or go out to see her. She seemed to be almost stalking them. We caught her several times going by the house at night without stopping or sitting at the end of the block. This tapered off after about 6-8 months.

 

When she would come by to get the minor son at the time specified in the agreement, he refused to go. She threatened to take me to court to force him, yelled and screamed at me, etc. I do not want my sons to have this kind of relationship with their mother but it is their decision.

 

She has never explained the kids why she left or appologized to them for just leaving except to say that she deserves to be happy. When I told her what this was doing to the kids her response was always that they were tough and they would get over it and to tell them to pull up their bootstraps.

 

They talk very little and always iniated by her after they tire of the phone ringing and they refuse to answer it or call her back.

 

The point being is that she is an emotional mess. She cannot take responsibility for her actions or even face them. It is always someone else's fault (usually mine). I have tried to help but she wants to do it her way which has never worked because it is all about her. The kids seem to be prizes thatshe covets but they have to react to her the way she wants them to or she gets upset. It is a sad state of affairs.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

>>'he flat out said he doesn't allow any negativity in his life.'

 

People who say they don't want any negativity in life are 'cream skimmers.' They are like infants, in which they expect there to be NO bad moments in life, no bad news, the world happy and bright and exactly the way they want it.

 

This is a fundamentally infantile view of the world, and the cause of extreme pain and stress in the lives of the more normal people around them. The infant must be happy, or everyone else pays!

 

It is a sad but very true fact that in many divorces, the children of the divorce may be far more mature and realistic than their own parent! You should be applauded as a parent if your children have good enough heads on their shoulders to recognize that their dad has gone bonkers. And they may be old enough to recognize where the blame belongs, with him and not with themselves.

 

This 'no negativity' kick of his is really just a desire to return to infancy. The world is a beautiful place, but it is also a very complex and harsh place too, and refusing to deal with negativity means someone else in his orbit must deal with it because that is the way the world works. So unfortunately you and the kids pay the price.

 

But honestly honey, the more i read about your ex the more clear it is that you are well rid of him. Once you two are really disentangled, you might feel a huge amout of relief to not have to deal with him, and can watch his antics for the comical dramas they are. It takes a while to get that distance so it doesn't bug you, but you will get there eventually.

[Mishmash]

I had to talk to him today about getting the house appraised. We're cordial towards each other, so I went ahead and ask him why he doesn't want a relationship with his kids. He says he does and that he is working on it.

I asked him 'how' he's working on it.

He replied that he needs to be out of their lives so they can heal on their own. Then, once they have healed he will be a father in their lives again.

 

So, now I know...

 

Thanks everyone for your input

[annie24]

i'm not sure that a father cutting out of their lives is the way to heal. maybe that works well for romantic relationships when they come to an end, but i don't see how that helps children, going NC.

[just M.E.]

It works for him, I doubt it works for your children.

 

When I was divorced from my daughters father, he often flaked out and disappeared depending on what was happening in his life. The more he had going on, the less he needed his daughter or had time for her. She was hurt and I told her it was like a toy or a car having a broken part. There is something within us that gives us the ability to give and love others, in my daughter's father that part was broke. She could understand that concept and it was easier for her to not blame herself, but children always wonder "What did I do wrong?".

 

In a child or teens eyes, it is very hard to really understand that this is about their father and they are ineffectual to change his behavior. That is hard to absorb and even harder to live with. I am sorry for your children, but in the end they may gain in learning this lesson early in life, just be there for them. At least you can give them the extra love he is unable to.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

Um, actually no... he is cream skimming again. He wants to disappear during the hard part when they are heartbroken, then reappear much later after YOU'VE dealt with the fallout.

 

This runs counter to what any child psychologist would say about how he should behave.... He needs to be there for them, and work thru it with them, not try to skip over it because it is easiest for him that way.

 

But i think it will never be the same in that they will never trust him again, and remember how immaturely and unkindly he behaved.

[John Bendix]

Mishmash,

 

What BSBH has said in these posts makes sense. How it turns out, we will have to wait for the future to unfold. If I repeat anything said, I apologize.

 

In MHO, the time that exists to deal with anything effectively is this moment. If he wants to put it off for the sake of their healing, he is just trying to deny and hide from his responsibility in this situation. Saying he does not want negativity in his life is his way of demomstrating that he is not "enlightened" enough to deal with negativity. And since "negative" aspects (since negative is just a label of judgement) are as much a part of the world as everything else, then he cannot deal with all the parts of his life.

[lostandhurt]

I have one question: Can he have more children? I hope not. As I know John or M.E. would do for their children I would literally give my life in an instant for my son. It is so.....crazy for the lack of a better word how a father could walk away from his children. Don't let his selfish behavoir control your life.

 

lost

[Mishmash]

Probably the smartest thing I did was suggest a vasectomy, if these two had children...

 

This was the last thing that bothered me, and now that I know his line of reasoning I can continue on.

 

Totally unrelated, but he said "If I am thinking or reasoning, I am not being".

I know this is in reference to the ego, as he's trying to be total detached from it.

All he has to do is ask me and I will help him achieve his goal...

[just M.E.]

So am I reading between the lines here and you are assuming his ego is seated in a certain portion of his anatomy? Why you silly girl,

 

In the kitchen, the quiet kitchen, Lorena grabs a knife .......

In the bedroom, the quiet bedroom John Bobbitt sleeps tonight .......

 

 

 

Mishmash walks along humming cheerily .....

[BeStrongBeHappy]

Oh heavens, it sounds like he's spouting some cultish Stupid Guru nonsense.

 

As they say, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing and he's read some catchy phrases somewhere (or heard that other woman spout it) and is interpreting it in every self serving way he can find.

 

Where are the deprogrammers when you need them...

[Mishmash]

So am I reading between the lines here and you are assuming his ego is seated in a certain portion of his anatomy? Why you silly girl,

 

In the kitchen, the quiet kitchen, Lorena grabs a knife .......

In the bedroom, the quiet bedroom John Bobbitt sleeps tonight .......

 

 

 

Mishmash walks along humming cheerily .....

 

You crack me up

[Mishmash]

Too funny Just M.E.!

 

He's coming over later this week and I'm so going to start singing this song. Maybe even do the dancing doggie \\

[just M.E.]

Funny thing is I always told my ex if he ever cheated on me, he should sleep with one eye open, no telling what I might do .... Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned!

 

I'd never do anything, but it was fun to have him wonder.

[thejigsup]

This guy is just low class. I am so sorry you are stuck with this loser. My God, those are his kids!!!

[John Bendix]

M.E.,

 

Remind me to hide all of the cutlery if we ever meat! Just kiddin'!