do not mistake my kindness for weakness

[grashamm]

Hello, to you all. I have not posted in several months but I feel the need to now.

 

In February of this year. My ex of 3 years left me for another guy. After, moving her things out and trying to move on and rebuild a few months later she came back apologizing for how she had treated me. The other guy dumped her. I knew she was depressed and I thought if I showed her compassion and respect, we might have a chance at reconciliation.

 

During this time, I was away from home and only saw her a few times. We mainly communicated over the phone. I never really cared if she saw other guys, but I asked her for honesty in this matter and to tell me if she was seeing anyone, as to not be surprised.

 

A few months later, I was on my way home when she called and asked me for help with her phone bill. I agreed and called the phone company to pay the past balance and get her phone turned back on. When I got back into town that night. I met her at her work, where she informed me she was spending the night with another guy. I was crushed. I told her I felt manipulated and used, to which she replied "Sorry, I'll call you tomorrow."

 

The next day I was furious and went to her place and got my things from her, in a rage. That was the last time I talked to her.

 

I feel bad about losing my temper and I am trying to understand why is it that she could not show me the same respect and honesty I showed her. I feel like she took my kindness as weakness.

[Optigan]

I feel like she took my kindness as weakness.

I guess a lot of people tend to do that, I'm afraid it's the way of the big part of the world.

[jettison]

In this world, NEVER over "nice" someone. Just don't do it. There's no better way to make someone disrespect you then to match their disrespect with your respect. Don't do it.

 

If someone is disrespectful toward you then just leave them be. Don't do anything for them, nor against them. Just let them alone.

 

Your GF dumped you, slept with someone else, dated someone else, and then came crawling back to you after she got dumped. By the pure definition of the known dating world, you CAN NOT pay your ex-GF's phonebill, even if she's been a complete and perfect angel. Just don't do it.

[Censored]

Hi Grasham,

I have been in your position myself.

I only hope that this disresepct for you won't jade you for future relationships. it is really unfortunate that a lot of people do see kindness as a weakness.

[jettison]

Hi Grasham,

I have been in your position myself.

I only hope that this disresepct for you won't jade you for future relationships. it is really unfortunate that a lot of people do see kindness as a weakness.

 

I can only agree partially to the responses and to the OP. Kindness is a weakness when it is given disproportionately to people who aren't particularly kind. There are countless people in this world who deserve your kindness. Friends, family, strangers... if you give your kindness and generosity to those who have proven in the past that they don't deserve it, then it is indeed a sign of "weakness" in a sense.

 

You could have used the money you fronted on the ex's phonebill and taken a good friend out to lunch. When you're being kind in order to win favor or approval from someone who has rejected you in some sense, then the "kindness" isn't quite as pure. There is motive there.

 

Somewhere in you're head, you're thinking, "Hey, if I'm really good to this girl, it's possible that she'll see the light, see what a great guy I am, realized she messed up by dumping me, and take me back."

 

In fact, it basically never works this way. When you meet disrespect from a lover or former lover with kindness and generosity then it will usually be seen as a sign of weakness from your potential partner, no matter how enlightened he or she may be.

[hopefulromantic79]

I've always said the worst revenge you can take on someone who is disrespects you is to "kill them with kindness". Now, I also treated the ex this way .. in fact, one of the last things I said to him was "I hope God gives you everything you need and want in your life". I did mean this from the bottom of my heart, but I also realize that these words hit him hard (I could tell by some of the emails after I said that) and really made him wonder how he could have been so cold and cruel to someone who truly loved him.

 

In your case, I think she'll come to that conclusion...especially when your ex continues to seek men who will most likely hurt her (like her last relationship). One day she'll realize that kindness in a man matters more than anything else...and she had that (and lost that) with you. Don't change...this world needs more openly kind men...this is not a weakness at all in my opinion. I believe we should all be kind to everyone around us...I am trying to be this way and it's making me a much more positive, happy person!

[jettison]

It's not a bad tactic... especially when people are being compete jerks. However, the kindness that comes with being polite and encouraging is quite different then the "kindness" that comes with paying someone's phonebill.

 

Kindness is not the same thing as politeness which is really what you're talking about. Sure, always be polite. Great rule of thumb.

 

If you're good to someone simply to win favors or for some far away satisfaction that will come when that person realizes how terrible of a person they are for rejecting you, and how wonderful a person you are for taking the high road, then aren't you just really doing something for yourself? It's not for them at all. It's not "kind" in that sense, but just as selfish as if you had been honest and truthful and told them how you really felt.

 

If you are upset, put out, and angry, and then are "polite" via your words and actions, then who cares? There isn't anyone that doesn't realize that your words and actions are now false. It seems odd that we reward each other with our falseness. The devil is in the details when we combine the idea of "being kind" with "kill 'em". They're not very far off, and it's a pretty signfiicant and deliberate metaphor. Either way, you mean to put this person in their place and make them miserable somehow. Nothing at all kind about that.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

Hi Grashamm...great title for your post.

Kindness is a strength not a weakness and she is stupid and superficial if she views kindness as a weakness.

You are the better person in this case.

 

But yeah...don't let people like this use you to do favours for them in future...and don't feel bad about losing your temper - it's good that you showed her she can't get away with treating people badly.

 

Love Lady D x

 

I agree with Lady D. While I don't think you should have paid her phone bill, it is not a weakness that you felt at the time that you should do this in the spirit of goodwill. Sometimes when people are in trouble, a kind person's instincts kick in to help. Nothing wrong with that...that is what makes the kind person such a tower of strength...because they can rise above the bad things to do what comes naturally to them...acts of kindness.

[HajiMaji]

You didnt do anything wrong. You still treated her with love. At the time, there were no signs saying you shouldnt do this. Yeah, she left you, yeah this and that, but you were working at forgiving her and doing your thing. She didnt treat you well, but this isnt your fault.

 

If you never bend over backwards for someone, you will never have a sore back, but you will also never be worthy of a back rub.

[grashamm]

Let me say, I am not in the habit of paying her bills. This was not the first time she tried to get me to help her financially.

 

The only reason I helped her with that is we were both new to a big city and she has been having trouble making ends meet. She had no family and not too many friends there. No one else would have helped her and I knew her cell phone is her lifeline for family, support, and what not.

 

I was hoping that she would see the importance of people who truly care about her. I always imagined that we would become closer when we moved, because we didn't know anyone. Not the case here.

[grashamm]

If you're good to someone simply to win favors or for some far away satisfaction that will come when that person realizes how terrible of a person they are for rejecting you, and how wonderful a person you are for taking the high road, then aren't you just really doing something for yourself? It's not for them at all. It's not "kind" in that sense, but just as selfish as if you had been honest and truthful and told them how you really felt.

 

I was truly doing this as a benefit to her. I did not expect anything back. But I didn't expect to get stabbed in the back either.

[jettison]

Thoughts and gestures like that may very well make two people grow closer as friends. As romantic partners? Probably not.

 

If one of my ex's were in trouble financially, I admit, I'd probably do what I could to help them if they asked me. However, if I did help them out then I'd do it expecting no reciprocation whatsoever. I'd treat it like an anonymous gift.

[spainman_88]

Sadly this seems to be all too common.....I agree with the OP as another genuine hearted person who has had kindness mistaken for weakness. I don't think they are the same thing, because I feel one of the strongest things to do is to continue to be kind, (although there are ceses where no response is best). However, I would say most of the time kindness is not a weakness.

OP, my case is somewhat similar although not quite as harsh I think. My ex gf broke up with me after 6 months of a very passionate, loving, seemingly enthusiastic relationship and the break-up seemed to come out of the blue with her saying she 'can't be in a relationship." Yet she would call me afterwards when she was upset, came to visit my unannounced (only as friends) when she felt lost. I'd always be there for her to listen, but it was only when SHE wanted to talk or needed to, otherwise she would basically ignore me and my calls. I was nice to her throughout our whole relationship, and she constantly told me I treated her better than other guys had. Despite all that she left me, then after claiming she "couldnt have a relationship" or 'couldnt trust other people" she suddenly moves out of state and within days is dating a guy who she moved in with as "roommates". She didn't talk to me for a while after moving, but then suddenly called to catch up, as if nothing should be wrong. I feel as if all through the relationship and the aftermath she mistook my kindness for weakness, although she also said often how much she appreciated it.

As I said above, I do not agree that these 2 are the same, but too many people take advantage of kindness as weakness. Sorry, I don't have an answer, really just more of the same musings and feelings....it is upsetting though.

[grashamm]

Oh well. I'm not going to lie. I miss her and it still hurts but I can't be with someone like that. I don't really mind if she wants to be friends, but I don't think she wants to be my friend knowing she can't get something out of me. I only wish I had been more mature and just left her behind quietly.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

You didnt do anything wrong. You still treated her with love. At the time, there were no signs saying you shouldnt do this. Yeah, she left you, yeah this and that, but you were working at forgiving her and doing your thing. She didnt treat you well, but this isnt your fault.

 

If you never bend over backwards for someone, you will never have a sore back, but you will also never be worthy of a back rub.

 

 

That's a wonderful quote! I will have to remember that.

[tiredofvampires]

Hopefulromantic, my sentiments COMPLETELY. (Then again, I could have your alias as well as mine!) I do believe that by being not just kind, but also generous, we can heal that part in ourselves that wants to withdraw love and care for the person who hurt us.

 

Now the problem is that we are not enlightened, none of us, and so Jetts makes a GREAT point. Where the problem is, is the ulterior motives involved. We really do have to examine our motives when we are "kind". I have always prided myself in "giving to a fault." To "a fault"? Could it be true that this is not just giving, but a fault? It's an open question for me, that I'm still examining, because I am like you, OP and for the most part, have found myself overall more at peace with the mistake of "overgiving" and being taken advantage of than the one of "undergiving".

 

"Overgiving" is not, as I see it, a weakness or a fault, unless you cannot handle the outcome when it doesn't bring much of an outward "reward." I don't think that there is anything INHERENTLY wrong with paying her phone bill as you did. You could have done it just because you were flush with cash that month, and since she is a person in this world you have caring feelings for, who says that anything she has done in your dating history has to decide this is a wrong or right "move." Who cares about the way it's perceived, or taken for granted if you really feel that in the long haul, it will make you feel you've done a good turn, and can live with only a partial recognition on her part. If you had to do without paying your own bills for it, then I would say that is a sacrifice you shouldn't have made. I think the problem is when we don't know ourselves enough to be clear about our own expectations. And I think the problem was not so much the phone bill being paid, but that you expected somehow this would translate into her being honest about something else unrelated with the guy she is seeing. Those two are not connected in her mind, and they should not be in yours.

 

You have a right to be angry at her dishonesty and not honoring an agreement. But you need to disconnect that from paying the phone bill, and see them as separate, at least in your own mind. If she's come to the conclusion that you are "weak" or to be taken for a ride just because you paid her phone bill, then you don't have to share in that correlation at all. You paid the phone bill in good faith that you could do it, period. After that, her conduct toward you should be dealt with on its own. In other words, you shouldn't stick around to reconcile, because she is not upfront with you as a modus operandi, she uses you as a Plan B, and because she is self-absorbed. Not because you paid her phone bill and she was ungrateful.

 

I think you did nothing wrong, in any part of this, but now it's time to disengage yourself from expecting there to be a reciprocal emotional sense of loyalty and conscience. Which means stepping back from her, period.

 

I truly believe that unless you see yourself as weak, no one else can make you weak by their lacks.

 

And as hard as "unconditional giving, without ulterior motives" is, as Jetts points out, I think it's a goal worth striving for, and you cannot do it if you never practice trying to do it. Once achieved even once or twice, you will be the STRONGER for it. Which is why I keep dancing in that fire, myself.

[tiredofvampires]

If you never bend over backwards for someone, you will never have a sore back, but you will also never be worthy of a back rub.

 

Precisely. And beautifully put.

[grashamm]

that a good point you make tiredofvampires.

 

Nonetheless.

 

Why didn't she ask the guy she was seeing for his help? It seems to be his role now.

 

Also, If she saw me as a friend, she could've have asked her other friends to help her like that.

 

I dunno. I see how the two aren't connected in her mind. I understand that now. However, I am not a sugardaddy, her parent, nor a bank

[tiredofvampires]

I didn't realize that the guy she was seeing was during the time she needed the help. In that case, I wonder the same thing as you. I thought she was just single and needed the help, and it seemed like from what you said about her needing help, it was because there wasn't anyone else available in a new city...

 

I agree, if she had other resources, that was really exploitive, and more was involved than just a need being filled. Don't do such things for her anymore, if she targets you as "the money bag in her life."

[grashamm]

Yeah, the night she surprise told me she was having another guy over, was the same night she got my help. Then she said "sorry" and left to go meet him.

 

Hows that for awesome?

[Optigan]

Interesting discussion here, as is usual with Jettison around.

 

After my experience, I suspect that everyone who is very, very, very, very kind should try to get to the root of that kindness.

 

It might be the root of pure milk of humanity.

 

It may, however, have something to do with repressed insecurities.

 

I was kind as hell to my ex, matter of fact I still am, on rare occasions we have contact. I was like, the kindest of kind. With very few exceptions during our whole relationship, and the post-relationship desolate pigsty that my private life has become.

 

I mean, I was so kind you would probably not believe how kind I was.

 

Now I'll try and sum up the results:

 

1) She has no respect for me in any way, shape or form. You name it - she doesn't respect me.

2) When we're in "touch", she either pities me or

3) Actually accuses me of being rude.

Accuses.

 

ME.

 

rude.

 

silly * * * * * .

 

 

Anyway. Everything is meaningless now, and the whole thing has no reason to exist at all except in my head because she rendered it all worthless, but why, you may ask, was I that kind?

 

I'm not sure.

 

I mean when things seemed to go well, and I felt secure that I'll keep her, I was kind out of kindness, and because I loved her and was being myself. So far so good.

 

When things would go obviously wrong, but I still felt secure I'd get to keep her, I would protest.

 

However when things would go wrong and I felt our very relationship was in danger, I didn't voice my disagreement, annoyment and, ultimately, p.a.i.n. the way I should have. Instead I allowed myself, through being superkind, to be mercilessly shat on.

 

Important disclaimer: that was not a conscious decision. I mean, I was not even aware how far things had gone.

 

Fell apart, void, I was desperate and didn't even know it. And I was so, so kind, you know? Should have left or something, yes.

 

But I did not, so when the day finally came she broke up with me, I was like, "why, baby, did you meet someone else?" in like, a tiny wheeny little kind voice.

 

To hell with it. A man should respect himself better than that no matter what his shortcomings are, and no matter how thoroughly in love he is.

 

My point? Well let me think a bit about a point. Um...

 

No amount of love felt or offered should prevent a man from being himself. I mean of course, whatever you do you're yourself, but sometimes we wear masks we're not even aware of.

 

Kindness can be one of them.

 

Be kind, find your way, give the people what they want if that does not damage you, don't forget to breathe.

 

Such a wonderful advice, isn't it? But hard for me to apply when I'm this alone, alone, alone, alone.

 

I'm aware of my uselessness that stems from being afraid to care. I'm not sure I'll ever dare to care again.

 

And you see I'm still kind. But I'm afraid I'm not kind because I care, but because I worry.

 

Perhaps that's the way it's always been.

 

Good grief, ain't it fantastic that I'm almost 30 and I know this little about myself and this world.

[tiredofvampires]

Great post, Optigan.

 

Really good insights, and wading in the muck and mire of motives.

 

I really do have to say: I feel that if someone who is less kind, more opportunistic, and ultimately ungrateful turns my heart so that I don't want to be kind anymore, I feel that they have 'won' something. I don't know if this is another ego barrier, or that it is really true.

 

Being kind is a dying breed in this world. Being "superkind" is frowned upon by those who have learned "if you can't lick 'em, join 'em." Most people think you are weak if you are doing what used to get them hurt. Before they learned to give up the best parts of ourselves.

 

Do I want to give up the best part of myself, giving, just because I have trouble with the outcome?

[grashamm]

Well, i like Optigan's POV on this. I have come to a similiar conclusion. Maybe less dark.

The really ironic thing about my ex, is. When i first started dating her, i got a bad feeling and broke up with her several times. She just kept on coming back for more. I fell in love her for it. She wore me down so to say. Once she had me I guess i wasn't a challenge for her anymore. The reason we almost reconciled is because, I shed some tears, but then got her out of my life quick like and started moving on, literally, to another state. She came back REAL quick-like then.