need advice, i want kids, she doesnt

[uncommital]

i will try to be brief, i know these things can drone on.

 

together five years.

broke up for seven months two years ago, she left but never let me go, so we got back together.

she has an 8 year old boy she loves more then life. i love him too.

the boy and i are very close

we dont live together becuase of my smoking

i have been trying to quit

two months ago she said she doesnt want anymore kids, too much work and pain.

i want a child very much and with her.

 

i told her two days ago that we should separate until she knows either 1. that she doesnt want any kids absolutely, or 2. that she is open to the idea.

the reasom i said seperation is to soften the blow and keep the doors open to change minds. and very important not to lose consistency with her son if we continue on together.

 

about her: stubborn and very very strong. funny, understanding when its clear she needs to be. emotionally distant and willing to be alone sometimes.

 

me: outgoing, passionate and intuitive, strong but not as strong as her. im willing to compromise but not to all my needs.

 

 

oh yeah, im 45 and shes 33

 

here are my questions:

am i dong this all wrong? should i give her a real chance to see life without me and the cost of her life choice? (which i dont deny her, it her life)

 

should we see each other still and intimately?

 

or am i stupid to put the ultimation as i have and "partially" left.

 

 

i dont know how to proceed. i put a time limit of five months for us both to think about this. i know this will open the door to us both dating others

 

 

suggestions?

[tyler711]

Keep in mind as you read my insight that I don't have any kids. I wouldn't necessarily call what you're doing wrong, because I don't know your whole situation and not my place to make that judgement. It sounds as if she has had enough from having one kid, and not wanting one more is perfectly understandable, and her right to choose. By your ultimatum, it sounds to me like you're saying this: "Either have kids with me and do what I want, or I will leave you." Is this correct? Making a choice like having children is a huge, mutual decision. You are putting her (and her son) in a very difficult situation, which is, if she doesn't give you a kid (or consider it) then you are going to end your entire relationship with both of them.

[seally]

Personally if she definitely doesn't want kids - leave. You can't not have children cos of one party. You'll just regret it.

[Tigris]

I agree that if she doesn't want anymore children then you aren't going to change her mind! All that you'll succeed in doing is having loads of arguments in front of her son and upsetting him.

[uncommital]

thanks for the replies guys. and you are right if she really doesnt want another kid then nothing i say or do will make it happen, or worse if she agrees but it isnt what she really wants then its wrong.

 

what i have said to her is that i want a child, that we would make wonderful parents, that i love her and i want her to be the mother of my kid. and if she is certain that she doesnt want another, then i have to go.

 

dont read ultimatum, read its very sad, we love each other but different paths, the seperation and time limit is for both of to consider how real out positions are when wieghed against the loss of each other. i want her happy even if its without me.

 

we never argue in front of her son, not our style, we disagree at times but important topics are talked about away from him. again thats why im using seperation and not just walking away, for him too.

 

what im still looking for though is how to approach this in general. stay together and talk it out over time? (one of you suggested that) or give her a glimpse of life without me? or is that too much arm twisting.

 

i want to do the right thing for both of us, i also have to look out for me. i hurt more deeply than she does and i have to watch out for that. she can turn her feelings off sometimes.

 

thanks, all advice is appreciated and welcome.

[Scotcha]

The decision on whether or not to have children is one of the few, if only conflict that cannot be compromised.

[fishrrshortae]

She may have concerns about having kids with you (ie. the smoking, etc). perhaps it would be in your best interest to find out what her specific concerns are.

 

Was she alone when raising her son, or did she have help? Personal experience here: raising a child is the hardest thing EVER. It is exhausting sometimes, honestly. A lot of the time. It is NOT something to jump into. She might be associating childrearing with being alone, having no help, etc. The best (only) thing you can do is to let her know that you would do what it takes to be a good parent, and you will do your fair share.

 

Beyond that, I can't say I would disagree with her decision, because for her, it's a huge responsibility that she would have to undertake if you and her didn't work out.

[shyanne]

if she really loves you, she'll have your child.. let her know how important that is to you. she has one child that she loves very much, so she must love children. if she doesnt' want too, i guess she can't love you that much

[Scout]

I'm curious, why isn't her existing child enough to satisfy your urge to be a parent? Not an accusatory question, I just wonder if maybe you've got the opportunity to be a dad right under your nose, but don't really see that. If it's because he already has another dad, you'd still be a parental figure in his life. I know my niece adores her stepfather, and appreciates the invaluable contribution he made in her life while she was growing up.

 

The whole point of being a parent is to guide a little one to making the right choices in life that lead to being a productive, contributing member to society. Not to "carry on one's name."

 

My two cents, anyway. And it seems you already care about her little boy very much, anyway.

[uncommital]

She may have concerns about having kids with you (ie. the smoking, etc). perhaps it would be in your best interest to find out what her specific concerns are.

.

 

 

good point, i will check with her more when we talk. her main thoughts were these which some of you have pointed out. and shes pretty good at spelling out what her needs are: "too much work" " too big an age difference with her son" "too much pain"

 

about her son being enough. call it primal instinct but he wouldnt be enough for me. i love him dearly, but i am his friend. mother and father roles are fully filled (dad is 50%). and i like my role in his life.

 

about doing it alone, she has had to be a single parent since he was 2-1/2. im suire she is concerned but she knows me. i would not walk away. we know each other well enough to know that we would work it through.

 

for me its the final wall of intimacy with each other, something too build from both of us. i cannot imagine it any other way. i know we will have less real time together with a kid but more unspoken connection (thats where i live).

 

thanks again. all the advice is great

[Hernj62]

She probably thought she knew her sons dad too.... and she still ended up by herself. You've ben together for 5 years, no real commitment? Marriage? But you want a child. You must understand that in our eyes, (females) unless we are alcholics or abusive or drug attics, 99% chance, WE are the ones that take full responsibility of the child if anything goes wrong in the relationship. And I doubt it that you are just her kids friend. If you really have been around for 5 years, I'm sure he looks up to you in a much different way than a friend. And if you're planning on sticking around, you will feel like a dad. B/c you would be the one helping him build a strong character. You would be considered to be the ultimate role model. And that has to be rewarding. If you love this woman, you would accept that. I wouldn't recommend leaving her b/c I think all middle age women are skeptical to bear a child. So what if you do leave, meet somone who does consider having a child with you, and then another 5 years go by... then what? Time is an essance. And time is what she probably wants. Shes probable thinking "God another 18 years?" That one kid will be enough for both of you to handle! HAHA. You still have at least 11 years of watching over. Thats a long time. And really after that, you both are in the clear. That's such a great advantage. It seems like to me you can have the best of two worlds but you're the one being stubborn. Think about it. An altimatum with this type of situation is REALLY harsh. You're making her choose under pressure, a lifetime commitment and a lifetime change. I mean marriage..yeah you can divorce. Smoking...yeah you can quit and live a lil longer, but having a kid....you can't fix that. Put yourself in her shoes. Seriously

[justpaisley]

if she really loves you, she'll have your child.. let her know how important that is to you. she has one child that she loves very much, so she must love children. if she doesnt' want too, i guess she can't love you that much

 

I disagree so much with this that I have to comment. The same could be said of the inverse - if he loved her, he'd give up on wanting a child. It's not about love, it's about common goals, something without which a relationship cannot survive. She could, at some point, change her mind, but don't count on it because it wouldn't be fair to her to stay with her expecting her to change.

 

Also, to uncommital, is the dad in the 8-year-old's life or not? You said that the dad role is filled, but then implied that he walked away from him.

 

Here's how I would feel, putting myself into your girlfriend's shoes.

1) Are you completely willing to marry her? That's a commitment boundary that would need to be crossed before I would even consider having children.

2) You keep emphasizing how much you would want a "child of your own." How would your relationship with her son change if you did? Would you favor that child? That's kind of an alarm that's going off for me, that you want so badly to have a child of your own, but that there's already a child there.

3) You can't emphasize to your girlfriend what great parents you would be without acknowledging the fact that you already are, indeed, parents. Your girlfriend and her son are a package deal. You can't be with her without fulfilling some sort of dad role for him, whether or not his dad is in the picture. I say this as a stepchild. (Not red-headed, though.)

 

You cannot try to change her goals. If you really want a child of your own, and are not willing to marry a woman who considers her family and reproductive life complete, this is not the woman for you. It is heartbreaking to realize that you have different goals in life, but you can't expect her to change any more than she can expect you to change. I'm sorry you're going through this.

[bodgerandbadger]

This doesn't mean this girl doesn't want to have kids. What it means is specifically she doesn't want kids WITH YOU. This girl has no interest in you, you should move on.

 

Ever since she broke up with you for that seven month period, she has been stringing you along. I would guess she has ahd very low interest in you for a long time.

 

DUMP HER and find someone who will love you properly

[Iceman26]

shes pretty good at spelling out what her needs are: "too much work" " too big an age difference with her son" "too much pain"

 

Too big an age difference? What a load of crap. There is a 14 year age difference between my younger brother and I, and we have a great relationship.

 

I'd dump her and move on to someone who is more willing to work with you instead of working against you.

[Scout]

I'd dump her and move on to someone who is more willing to work with you instead of working against you.

 

I'm not sure if this is an instance where they can really work together on a compromise. Either they have another kid or they don't. Just because her choice is not the same as his (at this time) does not put her in the wrong. It doesn't sound like he's being very flexible, either. In fact, he's the one that gave her an ultimatum, that's not exactly what I would call "working with each other."

 

At the end of the day, it's the woman who has to carry and bear a child and typically, ends up providing the bulk of the care. This is asking a LOT of her, especially if she already has another child. She also is not getting a great deal of assurance that this man would be committed enough to her own kid, he won't even quit smoking so they can all live together, and I'm sure his insistence on having his "own" child is giving her some real reservations that he might favor that child over the one she already has.

 

I am having a difficult time understanding the hostility towards this woman I'm seeing in the last couple of posts.

[Iceman26]

Who said she is in the wrong?

 

I simply told him to dump her and move on. If he wants a child of his own, then he should leave to find that woman who will want to have a child with him. She should find a non smoker and a guy that doesn't want kids of his own, yet is fine with taking care of another man's child.

[Scout]

Ok, let me reword it: maybe not that she's in the wrong, but that her reasons aren't justified. For instance, you referring to one of them as "a load of crap."

[Iceman26]

Well, because I personally think that excuse about the age difference between her son and a newborn is a load of crap. I have had many friends that were the only child, and every single one of them would have loved to have had a brother or sister.

[RayKay]

This is one of those big "dealbreakers" in my book.

 

I personally believe it is PERFECTLY fine to not want children, and it is PERFECTLY fine to want children however if one of each of those gets together, there is bound to be conflict and resentment when one has to sacrifice their want for the other.

 

I would say if she is adamant she does not want anymore children, and you absolutely want more it's best to move on. She has every right to not want more, but you can't force her to change her mind, just as she can't force you to change yours either.

 

Her reasons may not be valid for you, but for her they are. And she has every right to believe in them as you do to believe in yours.

[RayKay]

Well, because I personally think that excuse about the age difference between her son and a newborn is a load of crap. I have had many friends that were the only child, and every single one of them would have loved to have had a brother or sister.

 

It might not be the age difference persay, but the idea of starting over again with a newborn after her other child is already getting to be a fairly dependent child and she can kind of regain herself and her life again. Many people do try to "plan" their families to have children closer in ages together and raise them near the same age for various reasons such as career, or having time to pursue other things again.

 

I am not saying it's the only way - I know many families with greater differences - to point it was even a "second family" as the elder siblings were 15-20+ years older - but it is a way many people do choose to do it.

[Iceman26]

It might not be the age difference persay, but the idea of starting over again with a newborn after her other child is already getting to be a fairly dependent child and she can kind of regain herself and her life again.

 

 

Well I agree with that assessment, the poster didn't elaborate on what she meant by "too big of an age difference" with her son.