Should I Cold Call?

[DarkCh0c0]

5 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I didn't see where he said he was LGBTQ (the other thread /poster said he was bi- were you confusing the threads?)

Woups! I did indeed. Sorry OP!

[Whirling D]

Well… I texted her… But I didn’t yet ask her out or say anything to that effect.  Perhaps I should have.  No response yet after a half an hour.

I just made a couple of goofy remarks and said I hope she is having a nice week… I figured I would wait and hear back from her and then I will start talking to her about making plans.  Maybe see if she likes to banter a bit by text.  I usually do fairly well through texting… Which is not a great strategy, but I’m probably better at bantering and flirting in text than I am when I first meet someone.

I will wait to ask if she wants to join me for the small outing further away until after I meet her. Thanks for encouraging me to not ask her that, although she seems like the type that might appreciate that kind of spontaneity… No way to know.

Doesn’t seem like she is online all that much… If someone tried to contact me through any portal, I would know within minutes. I guess I’m a bit of a technology junkie in that regard…

I hear what you guys are saying about not judging her based on first impressions or appearances… I am trying not to do that, but my gut says that my past experiences have shaped those perceptions.  Although, the way you present yourself certainly lends credence a bit about who you are.  She is flashy and colorful… Calls herself the free spirit. That could be interpreted in many ways, of course, because I could also probably be called a free spirit… But there’s different kinds of free spirits… And not all would likely be compatible.

I am usually pretty good at just letting go of things and taking one step in front of the other once things get rolling. And in the likelihood this date or meeting will happen, I’ll just go in with my best attitude, and try to be at ease, sociable, maybe even a little silly… It’s hard to be silly upon first meeting, though. There’s not enough foundation there yet.

Did I wimp out with my correspondence? I guess it’s not very confident and aggressive.

 

 

[Wiseman2]

5 hours ago, Whirling D said:

.  Maybe see if she likes to banter a bit by text.  I usually do fairly well through texting… Did I wimp out with my correspondence? 

In a way. If the point is to get to know her and date her, text banter seems like stalling. Try not to build a dossier in your mind about her from a few FB posts.

Perhaps you're nervous and it's showing up through text banter rather than meeting in person? 

You may not feel like you're sabotaging this by trying to make a text buddy, but eventually anyone will tire of that.

[Kwothe28]

8 hours ago, Whirling D said:

Did I wimp out with my correspondence? I guess it’s not very confident and aggressive.

 

You did fine. If she likes you she will respond and you can maybe ask for a date.

Dont get caught up on time she needs to respond. Maybe she is busy so she cant instantly respond but will respond when she has time. Its a red flag if she always needs couple of hours or more. Nobody is that busy and if she cares she would try to respond in timely manner so you wont think she isnt interested and go away.

[Batya33]

4 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

In a way. If the point is to get to know her and date her, text banter seems like stalling. Try not to build a dossier in your mind about her from a few FB posts.

Perhaps you're nervous and it's showing up through text banter rather than meeting in person? 

You may not feel like you're sabotaging this by trying to make a text buddy, but eventually anyone will tire of that.

Yes. I didn't have a cell phone when I dated but had email and messenger and the dating site email.  I didn't message back and forth except to get a phone number for a phone call, have a 10-20 minute phone call or more and at the end either we made a plan to meet or I moved on -or one more phone call if one of us was about to leave town for a trip, etc and would then make a plan in a week or so. 

If he wanted to keep messaging/typing then I assumed he wanted to date online or have a chat buddy, not date in person.  I wanted a first meet in person to see if we should date.  I had enough chat buddies.  I met over 100 men in person and this was before I had social media and I never checked someone's social media.  I did google to check basic facts and sometimes cancelled a date based on what I found.

[Batya33]

9 hours ago, Whirling D said:

Did I wimp out with my correspondence? I guess it’s not very confident and aggressive.

I would avoid any aggressive behaviors especially with a stranger who is female.  Asking for a first meet isn't aggressive, it's normal.  It's why you're on a dating site.  I asked for first meets but let the man ask me for a first date (with very rare exception). I wasn't aggressive. I was reasonably confident. 

[boltnrun]

Wait, you deliberately delayed your reply by a few days but if she does the same thing it's a bad sign?

Maybe she's playing the same "I don't want to seem desperate" game you're playing.

[Whirling D]

I am so incredibly impatient. Maybe because I judge a woman’s behavior based on what I feel I would do under similar circumstances…

For example, this latest potential date Texted me on Sunday night and told me to text her some night this week… Although I didn’t text her right back, I waited until Tuesday night, and said hello a brief hello… Finally, I see mid evening tonight that she actually picked up the message, but no response.

There is no way in purgatory if that if I was interested in dating someone, and they texted me first on a given occasion, I would not text them right back and at least tell them I was busy but I would talk later. No way would I not do that.

I just don’t get that with lots of these women. But, maybe I do… I suspect that this women, like Many, get tons and tons of male attention, and they are high value. That makes guys like me low value, and she probably knows it. Thus, if she doesn’t feel like texting back, she won’t, because she knows that if I turn out to be a dud, there may be many more to follow suit. That leaves the priority and the need to be punctual almost nonexistent. I think it was the same with the dating site girl last week. Meeting someone new just isn’t high on the list. they don’t really feel the need to work at it. I certainly do, which kind of makes me feel at a disadvantage with higher value women.

Also, I’ve experienced what Bat was talking about several times.  One time, about a year and a half ago, I started to chat with this nice lady on a dating site… She was a little bit younger than me, and a very nice looking lady. We texted for about a week, And one Friday night, we spent about six hours texting back-and-forth until about three in the morning. We made plans to get together that Sunday, and she told me to text her the following day and we could solidify the plan.

In the meantime, Near the end of our talk, I texted her all of my contact information, just so that she would feel secure and comfortable making a plan to get together.

So, the next day, I texted her early afternoon. No response. I texted her later in the afternoon. No response. I never heard from her again.

About eight months later, I saw she was still on the dating site with new photos, so I texted her and said hi, and asked her if she would be willing to explain what happened back then and why she just disappeared. No response.

there is really only one of a couple of possibilities… She either just chickened out, which wouldn’t jive with the evidence found regarding updating her dating profile, or she gave me a Google search and found my Facebook page, which has a few clear pictures on it, whereas my dating site really had a very pixelated and blurry close-up. I knew it wasn’t a great picture, but I was too self-conscious to put a full array, which I now do. So, I suspect she saw my photos and determined she could never date me.  That’s the only real explanation.

This lady seemed awesome when we were texting. Although, it was foolish to get sucked into that, which I don’t nearly as much these days. I got sucked into something knowing full well that it could fall through for any number of reasons, which clearly it did.

I have many stories similar to that, So it is probably no wonder that when something seems like it’s a potential, I get quite anxious and perhaps a little over excited… Because when those who don’t get many opportunities think there may be an opportunity, it’s a big deal.

So, this recent lady not at least texting back to say hi tonight, just seems like more of the same. “Well, I’ll just talk to him whenever I feel like it, because there would be more of people like him lined up for me if he doesn’t work out“.

why would that make me even the least bit interested in pursuing this girl?  That, I don’t really know.

 

 

 

 

[boltnrun]

5 minutes ago, Whirling D said:

 I didn’t text her right back, I waited until Tuesday night

Why is it OK for you to wait two days, but yet

5 minutes ago, Whirling D said:

There is no way in purgatory if that if I was interested in dating someone, and they texted me first on a given occasion, I would not text them right back

You say this?

[Whirling D]

1 hour ago, boltnrun said:

Why is it OK for you to wait two days, but yet

You say this?

I think there’s a subtle difference bolt.

She asked me to text her in a couple of days. That’s what I did.

If she had initially said to me, “hey, nice to hear from you, text me when you get this”. I would’ve texted her in a nanosecond. Each and every time.

if she had reached out to me first on the dating site and said, “hey… We are neighbors, it would be nice to say hi.“ I would’ve texted her back in a nanosecond. Each and every time.

I do think there’s a difference. I followed her instructions.

 

[Wiseman2]

Unfortunately you seem to place too much emphasis on "text banter".  You don't seem to be asking anyone out. You tell yourself coffee is no good. 

Then when they lose interest in this text banter, you get upset . After that you begin your inner dialogue about what they should do. 

To be honest, it sounds like you are afraid to meet in person because you're afraid of rejection, so you  manufacture the demise before you even get to that point. Mostly through excess text banter .

 

[Kwothe28]

4 hours ago, Whirling D said:

There is no way in purgatory if that if I was interested in dating someone, and they texted me first on a given occasion, I would not text them right back and at least tell them I was busy but I would talk later. No way would I not do that.

 

You are placing too much emphasis on those women and their reaction. If I had to stress about every woman who I ever messeged that didnt answered back or wasnt interested, I would go insane. Those women are basically strangers to you, especially ones on dating sites. Try to look at it from the different angle so you wouldnt be dissapointed so much. For example

1) She messages. Its all good, maybe we can get to know better

2) She doesnt answer. Its also good, I can move on and wouldnt waste my time there as they dont want to get to know me better, their loss.

You need to be able to brush off stuff like that and not get dissapointed. As you would need to message some other girl tomorrow, some other next day etc. Not to mention that you would need to able to deal healthy with stuff like that. As there are far more worst stuff that can happen during dating. What if you took her out and she doesnt want to continue? You need to be able to brush of even that. Its not good for you that you cant deal with people not messaging you. As it will only lead you to dissapoinment like that.

[Batya33]

I think it's a big mistake to text for 6 hours with a stranger from a dating site.  I would do a 15-20 minute phone call where you determine whether you think you could have a pleasant convo in person for 45 minutes to an hour and resolve any doubts -politely or with google searches -you might have about whether what they wrote as far as age/marital status etc is accurate.  (One man bragged to me about how wealthy his ex wife's  family was which was kind of a red flag but because of his bragging I discovered he was lying about his age since he told me hers plus their age difference). 

I made three exceptions with the hundreds of men I spoke to through dating sites.  The first was a guy who I messaged with longer than usual. He then disappeared for a couple of weeks, messaged again and we had such fun banter -we did make a plan but not right away due to scheduling.  We actually dated three months. 

Another guy called me almost every night between the time we first contacted and our planned first meet a week later. Big mistake on my part because when after our second date I told him very nicely that I wasn't feeling chemistry and since he lived an hours drive away I didn't want to lead him on and make him travel to see me (my traveling to see him made little sense -as he agreed) - he accused me in emails the next day (after  thanking me for being so honest) of leading him on by talking to him so often on the phone.  Sigh. 

Third sort of exception was a long distance guy -we decided to meet a month later when he would be visiting his family in my area - so we did talk in between. I cancelled because he wanted me not to meet anyone else till we could meet in person.  We remained in touch as friends, we met a few years later as friends and have met a few more times since he has family in the city I live in now and, he now helps us with IT stuff, 16 years later! 

I'm so glad I kept to my no messaging rule because I was able to date in person, meet many more people since I had very spare free time and no interest in hours of emails or calls with a stranger, and I was very good at screening out dealbreakers on the 15-20 minute phone call. 

Also I had greatly reduced expectations as compared to what you describe with how you ruminate/get attached/make these assumptions about people who are strangers for dating purposes. Just my take. Good luck!

[boltnrun]

9 hours ago, Whirling D said:

I think there’s a subtle difference bolt.

She asked me to text her in a couple of days. That’s what I did.

If she had initially said to me, “hey, nice to hear from you, text me when you get this”. I would’ve texted her in a nanosecond. Each and every time.

if she had reached out to me first on the dating site and said, “hey… We are neighbors, it would be nice to say hi.“ I would’ve texted her back in a nanosecond. Each and every time.

I do think there’s a difference. I followed her instructions.

 

See, I wouldn't text back in a nanosecond. I don't keep my phone on me constantly. If I send a message I usually press the send icon and then walk away. I don't have my phone in my hand anxiously waiting for the person to respond. And even if I read a message, unless it's an urgent matter I usually don't reply immediately

And maybe she's doing what you said you were doing which is trying to "play it cool". Or...maybe she has other things to do besides wait for messages to come in. 

You seem to be getting really worked up about this whole messaging thing. I get you want to meet someone and have a dating relationship but those things take time to build. 

I can tell you that when I leapt on the first guy who gave me attention those things never worked out. 

[Whirling D]

11 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately you seem to place too much emphasis on "text banter".  You don't seem to be asking anyone out. You tell yourself coffee is no good. 

Then when they lose interest in this text banter, you get upset . After that you begin your inner dialogue about what they should do. 

To be honest, it sounds like you are afraid to meet in person because you're afraid of rejection, so you  manufacture the demise before you even get to that point. Mostly through excess text banter .

 

Duly noted wise, but in each of these cases, there’s been no banter.  I sent this last girl one text… telling her I’d like to chat or meet.  She seemed happy to engage.

If she’s turned off because I didn’t offer her a plan 2 days later, that kinda seems like a red flag.

woild someone really be turned off upon receiving just the second text, which was meant to create a dialogue?

Im not crazy about sitting at a coffee shop for a first meeting. Most dating sites say to try to avoid that also… it’s too intense  and lacks activity, which would be a much better environment to get to know someone.  If there are no other alternatives, I’ll do coffee.  I’ve been on coffee shop dates many times. It’s no big deal. I just prefer to do something else.  Hasn’t gotten that far yet, though.

[Whirling D]

OK… I have an update…

but before I get into that… I’ll say this, although I’ve probably said this many times already…

I think the experience of dating is vastly different for those who are pursued regularly and aggressively, and those who are virtually not pursued at all.

yes, I am highly anxious regarding hearing back from people, because I’ve spent most of my life not hearing back from people, or hearing back negatively from people, and almost never, or at least rarely do I hear anything positive when I reach out to try to date someone. So, when I do get some positive feedback, it’s probably like an animal that hasn’t been fed in a long while… And like the animal, I get very anxious and eager to see when the next meal will come. 

it’s not like I hang around pacing waiting to hear from someone… I keep busy and go on with my life, but I have enough free time, being semi retired, that I can think about it a lot, and I can write on here to try to manage my thoughts.  But I do spend a lot of time reeling and an inordinate amount of time thinking about this stuff.

so… I feel like it is good news…

I heard back from this lady… I think it’s positive… She began by referencing a goofy remark I made in my first text with her own goofy come back… and then said… 

———

“Hi (my name)… Not running (from the weather, which was related to my goofy comment) like the gingerbread man… Sorry! Still in the midst of moving!!  
More of an undertaking than I imagined! 
Talk real soon! 
✴️. 
(Her name)”

———

I may have been more long-winded than I should have been with my response just a few minutes later, but here’s what I said:

“Moving? What the heck?

Where are you moving to? Or to be grammatically correct… To where are you moving? 🙂

Thankfully, I haven’t had to move in 17 years… Longest I’ve been anywhere.  

Hope you are looking forward to your new digs.  Moving is quite a big ordeal, for sure...  ughh…

Give me a holler when you can, ok?

😊😊🎶🎶😊😊”

——

So… One of the reasons that I wasn’t a little more assertive with saying “hey do you wanna go…” It’s because I haven’t been at all clear about my daughters schedule for the weekend, and I’m booked pretty solid right up through that time… And it seems that she’s busy, as well.

Would you have tried to ask her for a date during this latest back-and-forth, or wait until she seems less distracted?

I feel a little more excited, but I shouldn’t. That would be getting way too ahead of things… Although I can’t help myself, usually. If I sniff a potential meal (hungry animal reference), I can’t help but feel the neurotransmitters starting to fire up… ughhh… let the anxiety flow.  Not.

 

 

 

[Batya33]

I would have replied "good luck with the move!  please get in touch when you can make a plan to meet -looking forward!  Best, ___.

Obviously you don't have to meet for coffee -the point is short and sweet.  A walk in the park works just as well.

[Kwothe28]

4 hours ago, Whirling D said:

“Hi (my name)… Not running (from the weather, which was related to my goofy comment) like the gingerbread man… Sorry! Still in the midst of moving!!  
More of an undertaking than I imagined! 
Talk real soon! 

"Me busy. Talk never."

Sorry. But over the years I developed a skill where I can read between the lines very good. Its a burden sometmes, but at least I know how to read what somebody thinks of me based on a conversation. It helps in a situations like yours. For example, if she asked at least some questions, even simple ones like "How are you doing?" it would mean there is at least some interest in continuing conversation. If she says "I am busy now, talk later" she might as well be saying "Yeah, I dont have any interest to talk to you, bye". 

I wouldnt expect too much out of this one. Again, sorry.

[Whirling D]

5 hours ago, Kwothe28 said:

"Me busy. Talk never."

Sorry. But over the years I developed a skill where I can read between the lines very good. Its a burden sometmes, but at least I know how to read what somebody thinks of me based on a conversation. It helps in a situations like yours. For example, if she asked at least some questions, even simple ones like "How are you doing?" it would mean there is at least some interest in continuing conversation. If she says "I am busy now, talk later" she might as well be saying "Yeah, I dont have any interest to talk to you, bye". 

I wouldnt expect too much out of this one. Again, sorry.

You have a good point, Kwothe.  I hadn’t really thought of it that way. I think I’ve been too caught up in the notion and excitement of meeting her, but I haven’t really read between the lines.

I don’t think it’s all dire, since she hasn’t cut off communication… But you’re right, she hasn’t really asked me anything about me, and she is pretty much making me play my cards… Basically saying… “Would love to chat, give me a text sometime this week”, rather than saying “I’ll text you later in the week”… And now “talk real soon” which is closed ended and puts the control in her court. Almost as if she doesn’t really want to do any of the work.

but then again, I get the impression that she either is, or thinks she is, a high value woman, and she may very well be, with lots of potential suitors… She may believe that she can be in control of that destiny, and that’s not a terrible place for a human being to be…

on the other hand, there could be a little bit of self absorption there, expecting that things will come to her and that she will be in control of things, rather than sharing in such situations…

there is really no way to know, and I can only speculate on what her interest and character is.

it’s in her court… I texted her last, as you could see… And it’s really up to her to reach out next… Unless it goes a week or 10 days, at which point I may check in.

i’ll take the steps, but try to concentrate on moving forward and other areas, as well. Not like I have a lot of other potential dates. I’ll try really hard not to hang my hat on this one. Maybe I’ll get to meet her and things might be interesting, or maybe I won’t. I’ll try not to balance my self-worth on it, and I’m getting better at not doing just that. 

 

 

 

[Wiseman2]

11 hours ago, Whirling D said:

“Hi (my name)… Not running (from the weather, which was related to my goofy comment) like the gingerbread man… Sorry! Still in the midst of moving!!  

More of an undertaking than I imagined! 
Talk real soon! 
✴️. 

This seems like the friendzone but then again you never met in person.

"Ta ta, gotta go, so busy, seeya" means she's not interested in a textationship,  no less much else.

Leave this on the back burner.

Get on some of those silver/over 55 dating apps. Unlike Tinder, there are more female than male users. That may help your confidence.... if you decide to get out from behind the screens.

[Whirling D]

4 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

This seems like the friendzone but then again you never met in person.

"Ta ta, gotta go, so busy, seeya" means she's not interested in a textationship,  no less much else.

Leave this on the back burner.

Get on some of those silver/over 55 dating apps. Unlike Tinder, there are more female than male users. That may help your confidence.... if you decide to get out from behind the screens.

Yeah, sadly, I think I’m gonna stop thinking about this girl, at least for awhile.

I have a subscription to match.com, and have my profile on about four other ones that I’m not paying for… Historically, it hasn’t really mattered which dating site I am on. I get virtually, not virtually actually, no responses from any girls that I actually like, but do get an occasional like From girls I would never really date. I feel so superficial and judgmental when someone likes my profile and I think… No way. But I’ve tried to change my expectations and try to be with people that I don’t initially find attractive or interesting, and it just seems to always backfire. I feel it’s kind of one of my shortcomings. 

my childhood friend, who lives in a different country, texted me yesterday and said he thinks I have too many conditions and should loosen up a little bit.  He’s probably right, but I think if a girl was even close, I’d probably at least see where it goes and date for a while. I usually don’t even get that far.

as far as this girl goes, I think she’s just at a stage in her life where she thinks it would be nice to have someone, but if not, she’s perfectly happy as she is… That’s the perfect place to be for anyone, that’s just not the place I’m in, obviously.

I was watching a video the other day of this fairly slick life coach, and she was saying that it’s ridiculous when people say that you should be able to just love yourself and not feel incomplete if you are not partnered. I wish I could feel that way, and I’d probably be better off that way, but I spent a good chunk of my adult life feeling like an outcast, and that kind of propels this interest to be partnered, for better or for worse, even though almost every time in my life I have been partnered it turns out to be a disaster, a lot of times because I end up feeling often avoidant and neurotic as hell.  You can probably tell that just by what I write. I feel like I’m damned if I do and I’m damned if I don’t.

I still will wouldn’t rule this latest girl out, but I’m gonna spend a few days putting it on the back burner, kind of like I’ve done with the last dating site girl after we got our signals crossed.

I probably shouldn’t have ghosted her, since it was marginally understandable how we got our signals crossed, but even when I finally did text her through the dating site at about 6 PM, when we were supposed to get together at 7:30, she didn’t even look at the message until the next day around mid day, so she clearly wasn’t paying a huge amount of attention to whether or not I was trying to get in touch with her. That just tells me that she’s not really that eager to prioritize meeting someone.

The question then becomes, can someone who is eager be easily partnered with someone who is not?  I think I’m the kind of person who needs quite a bit of validation, which is not really what relationships should be all about, and is likely destructive on my part. I’ve gotten considerably better at not being this way over the last few years, and I think age and diminishing libido have a big part in that… But still… That need for validation dominates my actions and reactions in situations like this.

 

 

 

[Batya33]

6 hours ago, Whirling D said:

I think I’ve been too caught up in the notion and excitement of meeting her, but I haven’t really read between the lines.

I actually would avoid doing this sort of first meet stuff if you are this excited about meeting a stranger.  Too much risk of a crash, losing steam, getting jaded. I remember doing more than one first meet in a day and one particular day talking to a friend a couple of hours later -midway into the convo she says "ok so ..... how did it go??"  I was going on so many I completely forgot I had one that day at lunch time.  

If you live your life such that your mindset and expectations shift to "I'm going to meet this stranger for an hour walk in the local park, maybe we'll grab some ice cream or something and if we click maybe I'll ask her out on a proper date and if not, I'll get some exercise" - then meeting strangers through dating sites is a good alternative.

Sure I got "excited" about certain of the men but I chose to react by working on myself -keeping busy, reminding myself not to get hopes up, that my job was to show up/look nice/be nice and take on 50% of the conversation.  

This woman has lukewarm interest.  I always worked crazy hours, unpredictable hours when I was dating especially in my late 20s-late 30s and I found a way to make time to meet people whether first meets or events or set ups or through volunteer work.  Or if I really couldn't I made sure to tell the person "I can't because I am on deadline.  I think I can next week but I will call you ___ day and let you know" -sometimes I couldn't do a week in advance because of work - but the person knew I was going to follow up and when. 

And then I did.  Tried very hard not to leave it open ended if I was interested in meeting. And that didn't mean I was interested in dating or "excited" because it was a first meet with a stranger.

[Batya33]

55 minutes ago, Whirling D said:

I think I’m the kind of person who needs quite a bit of validation, which is not really what relationships should be all about, and is likely destructive on my part. I’ve gotten considerably better at not being this way over the last few years, and I think age and diminishing libido have a big part in that… But still… That need for validation dominates my actions and reactions in situations like this.

 

Relationships are about giving.  A need for validation if taken to an extreme is self-absorbed or selfish.  

Also part of clicking and chemistry is unpredictable. I never ever thought I'd feel a spark with my ex fiancee the night we met for a casual catch up dinner in 2005.  I think he was so surprised too.  I never lied to myself that being single my whole life was enough for me.  I never lied to myself that I would meet the right person.  Both are true.  I did love myself, I did have a fun fulfilling life, and I also knew I had three top goals - my career, marriage, family.  I'd done the first and was satisfied by the time I was in my late 20s/early 30s with that aspect.  I was not lonely.  I enjoyed living alone. It was quite painful to watch a number of my friends getting married and having babies. 

But I made a life that was full of positive stuff -friendships, volunteer work, exercise, book clubs and networking activities for many years, religious activities and events and retreats, a successful career, travel.  I was an involved Aunt when my nieces and nephew were young.  And I knew for sure that I wanted marriage and family. For me it was nonsensical to lie to myself like my friend's older sister said to me at my friend's daughter's 1st bday party "but you are [my career] !" meaning why should I want "more".  Ridiculous. 

I am psyched for people who are whatever about being in a relationship or marrying or being a parent -they should follow their dreams.  I love when people are doing that whatever that means to them.  I knew what it meant to me.  No guarantees but you make sure you are the right person to find the right person and you increase your chances so much.  That is how it worked for me. 

And I am not in a blissful state being a married parent - and I am happy, content, know for sure I made the right choice in all.  I know I won the lottery.  I know I defied the odds giving birth at 42, meeting my awesome husband -again- at almost 39. 

And is each day blissful? No.  Today I get to count pairs of socks for our upcoming trip.  Mine and my son's.  Today I get to launder all the sheets so when we get back our bedding is clean and I can cross that off my list and I get to go through my exhaustive pack list to make sure we have all the mundane stuff.  That's not bliss.  You probably have cleaning to do and all that stuff too - it's not just for families - but yes it's exponentially more when there is a child/children involved (or when a person has aging/disabled parents they are the primary caregivers for - which happens with single people too of course!) There are no guarantees of bliss.  Or that a person will "validate" you. 

Much of marriage and parenting involves having to make a choice and not let yourself second guess.  To feel like you're doing it all wrong and even your partner validating you isn't enough.  Neediness is ok in small doses -at certain times - not in large doses or all the time. Then it becomes selfish.  

I think you can do this because I think you are self-aware -you say a lot of self-deprecationg and self-defeating stuff but that is stuff you can work on -not just say you work on but actually work on on a daily basis -and figure out for you what that work looks like.  If you want to and if you're ready.

[Whirling D]

14 hours ago, Batya33 said:

Relationships are about giving.  A need for validation if taken to an extreme is self-absorbed or selfish.  

Also part of clicking and chemistry is unpredictable. I never ever thought I'd feel a spark with my ex fiancee the night we met for a casual catch up dinner in 2005.  I think he was so surprised too.  I never lied to myself that being single my whole life was enough for me.  I never lied to myself that I would meet the right person.  Both are true.  I did love myself, I did have a fun fulfilling life, and I also knew I had three top goals - my career, marriage, family.  I'd done the first and was satisfied by the time I was in my late 20s/early 30s with that aspect.  I was not lonely.  I enjoyed living alone. It was quite painful to watch a number of my friends getting married and having babies. 

But I made a life that was full of positive stuff -friendships, volunteer work, exercise, book clubs and networking activities for many years, religious activities and events and retreats, a successful career, travel.  I was an involved Aunt when my nieces and nephew were young.  And I knew for sure that I wanted marriage and family. For me it was nonsensical to lie to myself like my friend's older sister said to me at my friend's daughter's 1st bday party "but you are [my career] !" meaning why should I want "more".  Ridiculous. 

I am psyched for people who are whatever about being in a relationship or marrying or being a parent -they should follow their dreams.  I love when people are doing that whatever that means to them.  I knew what it meant to me.  No guarantees but you make sure you are the right person to find the right person and you increase your chances so much.  That is how it worked for me. 

And I am not in a blissful state being a married parent - and I am happy, content, know for sure I made the right choice in all.  I know I won the lottery.  I know I defied the odds giving birth at 42, meeting my awesome husband -again- at almost 39. 

And is each day blissful? No.  Today I get to count pairs of socks for our upcoming trip.  Mine and my son's.  Today I get to launder all the sheets so when we get back our bedding is clean and I can cross that off my list and I get to go through my exhaustive pack list to make sure we have all the mundane stuff.  That's not bliss.  You probably have cleaning to do and all that stuff too - it's not just for families - but yes it's exponentially more when there is a child/children involved (or when a person has aging/disabled parents they are the primary caregivers for - which happens with single people too of course!) There are no guarantees of bliss.  Or that a person will "validate" you. 

Much of marriage and parenting involves having to make a choice and not let yourself second guess.  To feel like you're doing it all wrong and even your partner validating you isn't enough.  Neediness is ok in small doses -at certain times - not in large doses or all the time. Then it becomes selfish.  

I think you can do this because I think you are self-aware -you say a lot of self-deprecationg and self-defeating stuff but that is stuff you can work on -not just say you work on but actually work on on a daily basis -and figure out for you what that work looks like.  If you want to and if you're ready.

Batya… I really appreciate the time you’ve taken to engage… I enjoy your stories, and find value in your experiences. I really do.

you and I are not similar in many ways, as I read your stories… You’ve had 100 opportunities on dates to meet people. That’s about 95 more than I have ever had. That makes the two situations hugely dissimilar.

Plus, this lady that I am interested in is older. I tend to think that her somewhat aloof demeanor, and it’s not entirely aloof, but very casual, is likely due to the fact that she’s 67 years old, and she’s been there and done that with men, and there’s a strong likelihood that she could probably take or leave getting to know new men that may be interested in having a relationship with her. That’s probably hugely common.

before the last month or two, I was starting to get used to that same kind of notion… That maybe I was better off single, because I typically go through all kinds of emotional turmoil when I do start to get close to someone. Either I do or they do, that’s for sure.

as for working on myself… That’s pretty much mostly what I’ve done throughout the majority of my adult life… I followed artistic pursuits in my 20s, spent my entire 30s as a full-time college student and grad student, then found an admirable career that led me down a 20 year path… Which went down in flames five years ago at the hands of a terrible relationship I had with an employer. What a surprise.  

I have asked for help from almost literally no one in my entire adult life, have been part of the therapeutic process either directly or through research for most of the last 30 years, so I’m certainly not a stranger to self improvement.

ironically, despite a lot of the self deprecating things that I say, which you accurately point out, I feel like I’m a really sweet decent guy… I’m generally pleasant to be around, I have a lot of interesting things that that I do and can-do… But they’re just not the kinds of things that the average woman in my area finds value in. They’re just not. 

it’s hard to be motivated and feel wanted and desired when the outcome is almost always the same.  I look at the presentation that this new lady puts forth into the world… How she dresses, what she wrote in her profile, the way she carries herself… I have never ever attracted women like that. Ever. How can I delude myself into thinking that I could be different this time around?  I shouldn’t, but I still have this glimmer of hope that maybe this time it will be different, and maybe some high value woman like her may actually value the kinds of skill sets and offerings that I do.

Who knows, wonders may never cease. 

 

 

 

[Wiseman2]

It's fine to march to your own drummer, do your own thing and be whoever you want to be.

However the key to success is being able to do that as well as operate in other spheres.

Using reverse prejudices to cushion oneself such as "too rich for my blood" and other such musings simply isolates you.

You can be as unique as you want to be, but try to accept other's uniqueness as well. That means not pigeonholing people based FB pics. For example you assume she's snobby because in your mind she comes across as well heeled.

You know nothing, absolutely nothing about this woman, yet you seem to have this entire analysis worked up in your mind.

But when you assume people do that to you, you get upset and claim they won't like your hair or area you live or whatever. 

Perhaps that's why you think people do that to you and make all these judgements about you? That's not always the case and sounds more like projection.

In a nutshell, it sort of comes across as sour grapes. You feel as if they are out of your league so you attach a negative reason for their (reasonable) reactions.