ArtLover51 Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 We have been together since we were 60. Our relationship is amazing when we are together. We ride motorcycles, travel, ride bicycles and basically have the best time ever together. He has consistently said that he might want to get married someday. Over the past 7 years I have had issues to the point of breaking up with him (2 times) over his inability to totally commit to marrying me. We always got back together. I really want to share the years we have left and be married to this man. He suffers from depression and OCD and says it’s just scary to think along those lines. I have had the worst year EVER, my daughter died from a brain aneurysm, I’m trying to deal with my grief, and missing her is unbearable, and then I got extremely sick with bronchitis. I have been feeling extremely vulnerable and alone and 4 weeks ago I told him I wanted to get married or break up. He left and I maintained NC for 4 weeks. However, I caved and I took over some stuff he left at my house. We started talking. I told him I was willing to shelf the marriage thing because I missed him so much and I am still in love with him. He called me last night and asked to have some time to think about it. He is unsure if I really mean it or if I will kick him to the curb in another 4 or 5 years if he doesn’t marry me or move in. Now I’m petrified he is going to say he wants to totally end this relationship. What should I do???? Link to comment
Jibralta Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 What does marriage mean to you? Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 21, 2017 Author Share Posted October 21, 2017 It means we would move in together and commit our lives to one another in front of God, friends and family. NOT a big splashy wedding, just a joining of 2 lives. I even suggested a promise commitment ceremony, if not a legal marriage. Link to comment
Jibralta Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 Would you be willing to move in together without being married? Would he? Link to comment
shessofly Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 It means we would move in together and commit our lives to one another in front of God, friends and family. NOT a big splashy wedding, just a joining of 2 lives. I even suggested a promise commitment ceremony, if not a legal marriage. What was his response to this? Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 21, 2017 Author Share Posted October 21, 2017 I told him that I did want to move in together and offered to help him pack up his place. He is paralyzed with fear. That is when he asked me for some time to think before we proceeded. I called him a couple of hours ago to clarify if he needed time to think about packing him up for the move to my home or if he needed time to think about getting back together. He responded that it was about getting back together. He was on his way to ride bikes and said he would call me later tonight to discuss since he was with another biker. So now I’m REALLY confused. I’m thinking he does not want to get back together at all! I’m devastated! It’s going to be a VERY long day! Link to comment
shessofly Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 But ...why get back together when he's not able/willing to give you what you want? It doesn't sound like you are happy with the way things are, as evidenced by this and prior threads. I think it's very wise of him to consider whether getting back together is the best choice for either of you, as you keep breaking up. You've been round and round with this - I do not think this is something you are going to be able to accept. It sounds like he knows that too. You don't want someone to marry/move in with you/have a civil ceremony based off of an ultimatum/nagging, etc. If he doesn't want to, whether it's fear or something else you either accept/compromise your own values or move on. Link to comment
shessofly Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 My condolences on the loss of your daughter. Link to comment
catfeeder Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 My heart goes out to you for the loss of your daughter. Marriage under duress is not the way to go. I'd ask myself, "If I knew that this is the most that BF will ever offer me--no less, but no more--would I stay or go?" If the answer is stay, then here you are--and back off of the marriage thing, it's poisoning the time you could otherwise enjoy with this man. If the answer is go, then knock off the pressure and tell BF, "I adore you, but I'm marriage material. If you ever decide that marriage is what you want with me, you can contact me and let me know. If I'm still available then, we can meet to catch up. Otherwise, I wish you the best, but I need to walk away while we both still think highly of one another." Pressuring someone to do what they wouldn't otherwise do voluntarily will always backfire. it builds resentment on both sides, and then you only have toxic soup rather than an equal, loving and thriving relationship. I'd quit the pressure cooker and decide whether this man's limitations are enough for you. If not, then grieve the relationship, but stop playing ping-pong with the man and go find someone who IS marriage material. Head high. Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 24, 2017 Author Share Posted October 24, 2017 Update: We have talked and he wants time to decide if he wants to re-establish our relationship and possibly move in together. He does say he still loves me and he misses me BUT he doesn’t want to go through this again. Obviously no-one can give a guarantee. He has called me every night and before he hangs up he says, “I’ll talk to you tomorrow.” However last night he did not say that. I feel in my heart he’s done. After reading your thoughts here, it’s probably the for the best. One thing that stuck with me after our last convo was that he said it didn’t seem like a month of NC for him. I was the total opposite. It felt like a year to me! I think that says volumes about us, don’t you? I didn’t break it off because I was mad or an argument or I didn’t love him. I was frustrated at treading water and I was devastated. It seems his life didn’t skip a beat and now that I’m willing to compromise, he’s not sure and is too afraid, and needs time to figure out if we should continue this relationship. He said his commitment to me ended when I took back my key and garage door opener....WHAT??? I’m completely confused! Link to comment
abitbroken Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 I told him I was willing to shelf the marriage thing because I missed him so much and I am still in love with him. Do not compromise. Even at 60. You want a husband, not a man who is too OCD and depressed to open his world that far. There are MANY MANY widowed (especially) and divorced men looking for a wife. So take time to heal and then get out there. I am so sorry for the loss of your daughter. He should have been a rock to you at your time of need and he wasn't. Link to comment
catfeeder Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I didn’t break it off because I was mad or an argument or I didn’t love him. I was frustrated at treading water and I was devastated. It seems his life didn’t skip a beat and now that I’m willing to compromise, he’s not sure and is too afraid, and needs time to figure out if we should continue this relationship. He said his commitment to me ended when I took back my key and garage door opener....WHAT??? I’m completely confused! What's to be confused about? You broke up to manipulate him, and he knows it. Most people wouldn't stick around for someone who's broken up with them once, much less multiple times. I'd back off and let him figure out what he wants, and if it turns out to be you, I'd figure out whether you can do this with him and his expressed limitations, or whether you're just going to tread water while resenting him and continuing to manipulate him--because if that's where this is headed, I'd rethink that. Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 That’s a bit harsh. I didn’t feel I was breaking up to manipulate him. I was at a critical point in my life and sick, overwhelmed with grief and disappointment that we weren’t moving forward. Repeatedly over the past 2 years he was telling me he didn’t want to go back to his place at all and if he didn’t have to pack up and move all his stuff, he’d already be there. I offered repeatedly to help him pack up but nothing ever came of it. He called last night and asked me on a date. I assured him if it was to let me down easy, no need to do it publicly, I was okay. He assured me he wants to have a date night and it was all good. I have no great expectations but I agreed to go and am looking forward to spending some time with him. We have never had a “bad” time when we are together! Link to comment
shessofly Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 ^^but you still aren't getting the marriage you want. Are you really prepared to accept just having a live in boyfriend (if he finally agrees to dump his house and move his things into yours)? Are you prepared to live wondering that he may only be doing it to appease you? You've put a lot of pressure on him even though he told you 10 months in that he was unlikely to commit in the way you wanted him to. What if he becomes resentful? A few years ago said you were done with him, but you are back with the same issue, which was the same issue a couple years before that, and.... I think it is going to be difficult, if not impossible, for you to accept the relationship on his terms because for you the marriage form of commitment is a deep-seated need. You keep trying to compromise your values and it's not working. It seems you keep going back in order to avoid the pain of missing him (as stated in your 2012 post) by taking him any way you can get him. Then after a while you are right back where you started. Perhaps he will come with the news you want to hear on your date. If he does not, or only agrees to move in, I find it hard to believe you will be content with continuing on the same path you've been on for the past 7 years. You make it sound like he was already living with you; but I guess he has to move his things in, in order to make it real for you. Will that really be enough? I hope you think long and hard about this, even if he does agree to move his things into your place. His definition of commitment is not the same as yours. Link to comment
abitbroken Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 That’s a bit harsh. I didn’t feel I was breaking up to manipulate him. I was at a critical point in my life and sick, overwhelmed with grief and disappointment that we weren’t moving forward. Repeatedly over the past 2 years he was telling me he didn’t want to go back to his place at all and if he didn’t have to pack up and move all his stuff, he’d already be there. I offered repeatedly to help him pack up but nothing ever came of it. He called last night and asked me on a date. I assured him if it was to let me down easy, no need to do it publicly, I was okay. He assured me he wants to have a date night and it was all good. I have no great expectations but I agreed to go and am looking forward to spending some time with him. We have never had a “bad” time when we are together! He doesn't want any commitment -- if you go on a "date" with him, you are giving him exactly what he wants -- everything on his own terms and none of yours. When he feels like going out with someone - there you are. Please cancel if you haven't gone already. He is not going to "let you down easy" if you are being a sucker and will go out with him no matter what. You know he doesn't want more. Also, what's troubling esoecially is that he can't have a calm conversation "you know Taylor, I understand you want to get married, but I decided awhile ago that I don't. I want to take life as it comes with no strings attached. I want to be free to leave when i feel" NOPE he has to get agitated and get upset when you even bring it up. That's awfully childish. so cut the ties, heal and find a man who can actually have a conversation. And wants what you want and its a matter of finding the right one Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 26, 2017 Author Share Posted October 26, 2017 The date was very nice. He initiated the date to see if there was anything left of this relationship. He told me he cannot go through another break up with me. He is too old to play ping pong. He feels dead inside since I told him to leave. I think I broke him. He kissed me goodbye, and that was that. His desire for sex, his desire for me are just dead things inside of him. I get what all of you are saying and I hate that I did this to him AGAIN. I think it would be best to start looking forward instead of back and find a new path alone. I didn’t want to hurt anyone. I just feel I no longer have an anchor, my port in the storm, it won’t be him and I can’t blame him. This is me and I have to accept responsibility for my actions. So thanks everyone for your advice. Link to comment
abitbroken Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 The date was very nice. He initiated the date to see if there was anything left of this relationship. He told me he cannot go through another break up with me. He is too old to play ping pong. He feels dead inside since I told him to leave. I think I broke him. He kissed me goodbye, and that was that. His desire for sex, his desire for me are just dead things inside of him. I get what all of you are saying and I hate that I did this to him AGAIN. I think it would be best to start looking forward instead of back and find a new path alone. I didn’t want to hurt anyone. I just feel I no longer have an anchor, my port in the storm, it won’t be him and I can’t blame him. This is me and I have to accept responsibility for my actions. So thanks everyone for your advice. That's awfully manipulative to ask someone out on a date to tell them you are "dead inside" about them. You don't get "dead inside" that fast. And if you were you wouldn't go out on a date with them. You are talking about what you did to HIM and that you are lost now. You were too dependent on him for your personal happiness. You did nothing to him --- you acted in your best interest. You want a relationship that leads to marriage. I wish for you that you could have just said that, he could have accepted that and none of this manipulative "you are dead to me" or "i don't have an anchor anymore". Work on yourself - go to meetup groups, get active doing things so that your life feels full without a man before you look to date again. I mean, you act like he abandoned you when in fact you did the strong thing to do what you needed for yourself. ====== now do not see him again! Link to comment
catfeeder Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 That’s a bit harsh. I didn’t feel I was breaking up to manipulate him. I was at a critical point in my life and sick, overwhelmed with grief and disappointment that we weren’t moving forward. Repeatedly over the past 2 years he was telling me he didn’t want to go back to his place at all and if he didn’t have to pack up and move all his stuff, he’d already be there. I offered repeatedly to help him pack up but nothing ever came of it. He called last night and asked me on a date. I assured him if it was to let me down easy, no need to do it publicly, I was okay. He assured me he wants to have a date night and it was all good. I have no great expectations but I agreed to go and am looking forward to spending some time with him. We have never had a “bad” time when we are together! Not intended to be harsh, but rather intended to be accurate. There's no point to 'breaking up' with someone you're not willing to let go of other than to manipulate. That's not accusatory, it's just an observation that may be uncomfortable to recognize. If you are willing to apply self honesty to it, then good for you. That's a step. Next step would be to recognize--for yourself, not necessarily for this forum--whether you are willing to accept this man's limitations. Not temporarily, for the purpose of continuing to manipulate him to get what you want, but rather, would you be willing to agree to no marriage, and for the duration? That's the work YOU need to do, and I'd suggest doing it before re-involving yourself with this man for two reasons: 1) if the guy is considering a return to the relationship you had before with no marriage on the table, you'll both need to be clear about that up front, otherwise he may not even decide in your favor, and 2) if you opt to skip the issue for the sake of seducing him back unencumbered by the very issue that broke you up in the first place, then you're just returning to the very same limbo you couldn't stand before--and you'll just snap like a rubber band again at some point over it. Who needs that? None of this is harsh, it's an address of the issue you've raised. While it might seem easier to set it aside for the sake of staying involved with the man you miss, it makes zero sense to do so. Gain your own clarity about where you stand, and then find out where he stands. Clarity is the only thing that can prevent you from drilling a deeper hole to climb out of. Head high. Link to comment
fabact Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I disagree about the the manipulation bit. If you think about it, HE wants to have the control of the relationship. On his terms. I would back off the marriage bit and just live together. I dont understand what this guy is waiting for. Heavens forbid something happen to him and then he needs u to take car if him. This is what growing old together means. It's not living like 20 somethings each in their own place. Also financially isn't it wiser to live together? He definitely has commitment issues and I think may be selfish too And I bet you're the giver in the relationship . Offer to get a king size bed and call it a day. Or two king size beds and if ur okay to give up the marriage issue just tell him you won't bring it up again. Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 27, 2017 Author Share Posted October 27, 2017 We chatted last night and agreed to go our separate ways, talking if we want, or not. He gets very depressed around the holidays and I will be out of town during Thanksgiving & Christmas, so we plan to maybe meet up after the new year to discuss if we are better off without this conflict in our lives. I hold little hope from someone who is completely apathetic toward me and a relationship. We have a couple that we traveled with and were our constant companions. They have more or less adopted him. They go motorcycle riding, ride bicycles, workout at the YMCA and lunch with him on a daily basis, so he is constantly kept occupied, especially by the wife. Sometimes the husband goes with them but for the most part it’s just him and her. I find this disturbing but I guess if it is okay with her husband, I don’t have a dog in that fight. She constantly texts me to find out about our status and on the day we had planned our date, 2 hours later she was texting him to go bike riding (which would have made the date with me not possible). I just found that very strange. Needless to say, I won’t be sharing information with her going forward. I don’t believe my guy had ANY interest in her but I do think she doesn’t really want us to get back together because she would lose her workout buddy. Her husband has medical issues and a less active lifestyle. Link to comment
abitbroken Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 We chatted last night and agreed to go our separate ways, talking if we want, or not. He gets very depressed around the holidays and I will be out of town during Thanksgiving & Christmas, so we plan to maybe meet up after the new year to discuss if we are better off without this conflict in our lives. I hold little hope from someone who is completely apathetic toward me and a relationship. Why are you planning to meet after the holidays if you broke up???why are your torturing yourself??? What "conflict in our lives" will you be discussing - the conflict of having a relationship or the conflict where you want to marry and he doesnt'. If you are going to reconnect after the new year and tel him 'well, maybe marriage isn't important to me" you are giving up yourself and your identity. DO not compromise that. That is not what you want and if you do so, in a year or two you will be back here heartbroken because you are longing to marry and have that kind of partnership. break up and MEAN IT it is about YOUR needs. so he gets depressed around the holidays - so what. That's up for him to deal with. Not your problem. Spend time with family and friends and be open next year to going on dates with DIFFERENT MEN As far as the other couple -- maybe that's the best thing for him - a married couple where the husband has medical problems and the wife is up for no strings attached entertaining. That probably is way more attractive to him Link to comment
ArtLover51 Posted October 28, 2017 Author Share Posted October 28, 2017 He changed his facebook cover yesterday from him & I, to a 20 year old picture of a group of 100 friends, which included he and his ex-wife in the front row. I say RED! I called him and said if his purpose was to stab me with a knife through my heart, he had succeeded! (Yes, in retrospect I realize this was immature and silly!) He apologizes and says he didn’t realize she was in the photo and he would change it, which he did about an hour later. Later that night I texted him to say, “Can we talk?” His response was, “I think that may lead to conflict and I don’t want to feel anxious tonight.” I did not respond back to him. I give up...I just give up. I guess the 7 years we spent together meant little to nothing to him. I won’t bother him again. Looking forward, not backward. Sad but this is just how it is. Link to comment
abitbroken Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 He changed his facebook cover yesterday from him & I, to a 20 year old picture of a group of 100 friends, which included he and his ex-wife in the front row. I say RED! I called him and said if his purpose was to stab me with a knife through my heart, he had succeeded! (Yes, in retrospect I realize this was immature and silly!) He apologizes and says he didn’t realize she was in the photo and he would change it, which he did about an hour later. Later that night I texted him to say, “Can we talk?” His response was, “I think that may lead to conflict and I don’t want to feel anxious tonight.” I did not respond back to him. I give up...I just give up. I guess the 7 years we spent together meant little to nothing to him. I won’t bother him again. Looking forward, not backward. Sad but this is just how it is. Will you please stop keeping this going? Block him on Facebook. Maybe he posted the picture because he was seeing all those old friends soon, who knows. Who cares. You keep thinking he owes you something for the 7 years. Enough talking about the relationship, okay? Its over. Its done. Kaput. You were firm about what you wanted -- and now you are going back to your old ways of acting like "i really didn't mean it" and hoping you will have him back. I had an ex where he wanted certain qualities in a woman and he wanted certain things in a relationship and i tried to change myself to be those things. That is what you are doing -- you want a husband. he doesn't want a wife. He is content to have his own place, casual relationships and hang out as a third wheel with another couple. So leave the guy alone and look forward to the holidays with your family and friends. Link to comment
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