About rules of behaviour

[Iori_Yagami]

What is the outcome in a situation, if both involved people disagree?

It is usually either a victory of one and loss of the other, or a compromise between two solutions.

 

My particular situation is a starnge strong feeling towards a girl, who I know for almost 2 years, and this feeling is not reciprocated.

 

So, when I find someone especially attractive to me (I won't discuss details, but really she is a kind of girl whose image just makes me forget about everything other) I can't manage to make her feel something in return (in fact she shows signs of ultimate dislike, such as avoiding, trying to insult or even beat me), I become obsessively mad about this. Well, I actually do not stalk her, cause I understand this is both ridiculous and unpleasant. Still, when I approach her (I fight with myself hard not to ever approach her, but my will fails, and like a utter slave of my feeling, I subdue to it. Of course, our usual converstion is just like:

-Good morning, xxxx!

-What again to YOU want from me?

-I just greeted you, no offence.

-Ok, then get out of my sight!

-But, xxxxx, why? We could stay and discuss...

-I don't want you near me. Get away!

-You almost made me cry, but please give me a tip, WHY?

-I do not have to explain anything to you. Nor I want to take any converstaion with you.

 

Overall, she quite a friendly and communicative girl, when it comes to other people besides me. But ME. Oh , that's surely IS painful. I just can't understand, does she really hate me so much, or does she like to insult my self-pride? More of all, I can't understand that cunning feeling, which doesn't let me free my mind of her. It's SO PAINFUL. I actually have never been in a relationship or ever kissed a girl, but that's another matter...

 

The point I am trying to make -

person x wants to become a friend (or closer) to person y

person y dislikes (or says so) person x

What is the otcome in such a difficult case?

[OceanEyes]

I remember you posting something similar a couple of months ago. When a girl tells you to get lost, and doesn't seem to like you, this is what it means:

 

- She doesn't like you.

 

- She doesn't want to have to explain that to you every day.

 

I really don't want you to feel worse about this, and I'm not trying to be overly harsh. However, if I kept telling a guy that I didn't want to speak to him and to stay away from me, yet he kept persisting every day, I would consider it borderline harassment -- regardless of your intentions -- no matter how "good" you perceive them to be, it doesn't matter. She says, "go away" and you keep at her. This is very self-destructive behaviour, you seem to keep asking for the same treatment from her, despite how awful she is towards you.

 

The outcome of the matter, is that she will continue to abuse you because you continually ignore her requests to leave her alone. I would strongly advise some soul-searching on your part. You seem to be searching for confidence and approval in the wrong place. She doesn't want you to talk to her, has said over and over again that she doesn't like you, and seems to be a very mean-spirited girl. If you keep going back for more, I can only assume that you must like the feeling of being humiliated. People will respect you only if you respect YOURSELF.

[Iori_Yagami]

Oh, yes. I really have heard that all before, and have very throughly thought it over. I even sometimes hate myself for being such a weakling, but still I can't cope with that.

By the way, it is NOT every day. I said I try to keep myself in place and to pretend that I to do not want to make any kind of realtionship with her, and even I am happy enough on my own... That's difficult, might I say, fighting yourself.

I can easily make myself study all the night if I need, I can easily bear lack of food for almost a day, I am patient enough to hold a piece of my ice in my hand until it melts, and not drop it. I think I have the strong will. BUT this particular case is SO confusing to me (and her, of course, I often feel sorry, that I do bother her, so to speak. All my actions and words are unwelcome, despite my efforts to be just a little more attractive to her).

I understand, it is difficult to believe, but sometimes I think this is just because I am insane, or something. Did just anyone felt something alike?

[Day_Walker]

Obvisously she doesnt want anything to do with you? I dont know why originally she didnt want anything to do with you but if you are getting messages like that from her why would you even want to talk to her? What you are gonna have to do is let go, this is going to be hard to do but its what needs to be done. Its going to take self control but you need to do what it takes to not communicate with her again.

[Iori_Yagami]

She doesn't answer me on ICQ, she rejects my help when I offer, and she refuses to help me, when I ask.

I was quite painful, when she turned me down on St. Valentine's day, for which I prepared, but as always I spent that day all alone (as always).

I never ever got any cards at this event form anyone. Am I really not worth loving? It is so frightening and painful...

 

Questions:

 

1. What could be the reasons for such a negative attitude towards me (I mean in general, give any examples you can think of or have experienced in personal).

2. Have anyone experienced the same kind of feeling as I do? How did it end? How did you cope with that?

[Iori_Yagami]

Surely, it is amazing noone had this experience.

Am I unique?

[al7]

1. What could be the reasons for such a negative attitude towards me (I mean in general, give any examples you can think of or have experienced in personal).

2. Have anyone experienced the same kind of feeling as I do? How did it end? How did you cope with that?

 

1. She is not into you.She think she has to be a bit aggrassive to let you know she doesn't like you. It is her upbringing.

2. Mostly like you just eventually get over it with some frustration gained.

I'd estimate it is quite a common case in general.

[Iori_Yagami]

1. Does anyone have the right to be rude to answer normal approach? I mean, that's just too much of non-motivated aggresiveness. I'd feel Ok if I REALLY stalked her, phoned at night, etc. This way that would be adequate.

2. Frustration is summing up with all the experience. I have experineced this situation also before (with other girls) and it is geting worse, cause I find myself older and still no better at finding soul mate and love. Scary, isn't it?

3. Common? Why? Anyone I talked to, or anyone who by themselves wanted to help me commented that "I'd never behave like that, she's not worth your time and troube, respect yourself." Pretty good words, but their practical appllication is soooo questionable... It seems I barely can control myself when I'm near her (shivering, tremblin, difficult speech and such). I am probably too impressive.

[al7]

1. Does anyone have the right to be rude to answer normal approach? I'd feel Ok if I REALLY stalked her

 

2. Frustration is summing up with all the experience. I have experineced this situation also before (with other girls) and it is geting worse, cause I find myself older and still no better at finding soul mate and love. Scary, isn't it?

3. Common? Why? Anyone I talked to, or anyone who by themselves wanted to help me commented that

 

4. "I'd never behave like that, she's not worth your time and troube, respect yourself."

Pretty good words, but their practical appllication is soooo questionable... It seems I barely can control myself when I'm near her (shivering, tremblin, difficult speech and such). I am probably too impressive.

 

1. Women have much higher sensitivity in general. She thinks you started stalking her...

 

2. Yes it is true. Be ready for even more frustration since dating has always set a line of rejections.

 

3. It is not scary... it is normal and common. You know, people die and we find it sad rather than scary. We have to deal with it.

Dating is general nothing like perpetual fun. Why? cuz in order to find sombody we have to experience many many rejections. Think of it as if you are in HR dept: you gotta hire sombosy and gotta reject the rest.

It is a common way.

 

4. They said a right thing. Click NEXT man...it doen't matter if you can control yourself when you see her or not. Just move on to the next girl, can you do it? It is simple... I don't ask you to try to forget her. Just move on and dat eother girls. A simple practical application of the theory described

[Iori_Yagami]

Thanks for advice, but...

It seems it is just one of the cases where easier said than done.

 

Believe it or not, I am quite busy and not really much into relationships, girls, having friends, being socially active. In fact I thought I could live without ever having to love someone.

It is both amusing and amazing, but I am starting to think some higher force punished me for that thought with my painful infatuation towards one particular person...as though wanting to prove I am not a machine, but a human with feelings, which can hurt...

It happens now nad then, I know, but I just can't stop it.

 

Have anyone experienced this feeling? Surely, yes, but noone wants to speak about it. My feeling lasts usually 2-3 years, the longest period was 5 years (it was very sad, that girl didn't even know I liked her - I was so shamefully shy...).

[tanned_production]

Have you ever thought that she just isnt the girl for you? She obviously has no interest in you... so stop pursuing it. Harassing her isnt going to change the situation any.

 

Leave it alone! Go out and meet new people... try a different approach.

 

good luck

[al7]

Thanks for advice, but...

It seems it is just one of the cases where easier said than done.

 

Have anyone experienced this feeling? Surely, yes, but noone wants to speak about it. My feeling lasts usually 2-3 years, the longest period was 5 years (it was very sad, that girl didn't even know I liked her - I was so shamefully shy...).

 

Yes, it is familiar feeling. But what is your point?

The best thing you can do is to date somebody else. Do not try to forget her... just date other girls. What do you find "hard" about it?

[Iori_Yagami]

It is very unusual to watch this situation because

usually people try to cheer you up, the use to say - "that is easy if you try, do not stop, keep on working, be patient, etc" in mostly all life situations. Sounds like giving up is the worst thing ever to be done.

Hilarious, HERE it is directly opposite - anyone sees me as arrogant fool, who can't see that his action give me no fruit despite long and hard effort.

Is it really not the case you have to be patient? Does this effectively mean there ARE impossible things? Does this all mean "give up"? That would be weakness. I sometimes think others envy me because my stubborness and long-lasting feelings, because they would never had the guts to live with it, rather would be conformic (say, choose another girl, etc).

Sad, but it is true.

And, al7 I already said - I am not very sociable at all, I just don't have the need to meet another girl. I could possibly be quite happy on my own, if not that weird painful feeling. (They say, it is called limerence, infatuation, obsession, unrequited love, whatever).

[al7]

1. I already said - I am not very sociable at all,

 

2. I just don't have the need to meet another girl.

 

3. I could possibly be quite happy on my own,

 

4. if not that weird painful feeling. (They say, it is called limerence, infatuation, obsession, unrequited love, whatever).

 

 

1. I know what you are saying. Me neither. What does it have to do with saying NEXT?

 

2. Ok, there is no need, do not meet anyone.

 

3. Very good you don't need to date anyone. Cool man, you save lot sof time, money and energy. I envy you in a good sense.

 

4. You didn't make it clear: first you ask "what is the outcome of such situation"? I told you the outcome is not somthing you are going to like.

No you say infatuation... what do you WANT? Do you want to forget her?

Stop this infatuation? I don't see what exactly you want. Say it.

[al7]

Iori_Yagami,

 

I have an idea for you:

Write down this advice somehwere "Move on, date another girl" and put it in your desk. Then just forget about it for next couple of week and go for the girl you like: try to win her with eveything you can, do your best!

Put all your efforts in pursuing her!

I guess you are thsi type of person who learn through practice better.

[MyBoyfriendThinksImCute]

I agree with OceanEyes...saying hi to a girl that doesn't like you is prettymuch borderline harrasment in the girl's point of view eventhough you might not see it that way. She definitely isn't interested in you, and since you keep talking to her she thinks (and knows you like her) and it annoys her even more that you won't stop. You should just stop talking to her altogether....why waste your time on someone that finds you annoying?....there are always better people out there that will appreciate you.....you're twenty-two years old.....go out to a club there are always tons of girls there...good luck

[Iori_Yagami]

Yes, I see.

You all are probably right just because you speak more confident, and with a clear mind. As for me, mine is shrouded with emotions (emotions could be such a trouble sometimes, you know).

Anyway, I do not see her often these days. We haven't actually talked for over a month. Just a few glances at each other. Mine, sorry and shy. Hers, angry and annoyed. Yes, that's true - I understand there is no possibility that she would ever have something for me. I see it in her eyes quite clearly know. How sad, however...

I thought I forgot how to weep at age of 7, but I have mistaken...

 

al7

You're right. That was my biggest problem - moving from one side to the other like oscillator without ever getting clear what is my goal. One day I was desperate and the other I was almost cheating myself to believe everything will come out. Stupid, it was.

To answer your question, there are really two antagonistic wishes in my head: too win her heart (to solve this problem) and to forger her altogether (to solve it the other way). It is just not to stay in this state. It IS destructive and painful, everyone who experienced this would agree with me.

One thing, that is really important here is that I have already experienced that before, several times, towards our girls. Every so-called season lasted from 2 to 5 years, without hope, ending only when I accidentally met another girl, with who this all repeated.

It sometimes seems to me I'm doomed to repeat this pattern with any other girl I try to make relationships with. The roots are deep in my behaviour and I still can't figure them out.

[Dre_7]

I've been through something similar, I realized it's childish to try to force someone to like you. Just accept the fact not that everyone will like you, just like you won't like every girl that comes your way. For every girl you think is the most beautiful girl you've ever seen, there's 20 more. You just need to keep looking for the right one, with whom your attraction is reciprocal. To do this, just get out there and socialize, meet people. Most times when we get too caught up with one person who doesn't really like us, it is because we hinge all our hopes on being with them. But you have to realize that, it's not worth the pain and frustration. I'm sure you can find girls who you're interested in, and who will be interested in you. Don't confine yourself to a chase with no end. It's too mentally and emotionally draining.

[al7]

... moving from one side to the other like oscillator without ever getting clear what is my goal.

 

It sometimes seems to me I'm doomed to repeat this pattern with any other girl I try to make relationships with. The roots are deep in my behaviour and I still can't figure them out.

 

You don't even need to figure them out. You just have to move on and date somebody else. Although It seems to me you like your current state,

since you are not going to move on and neither to do your best to win her. For some reason you like this current pain.

See, if you didn't come up with a goal, no one can help with with advice... since it is not clear what you want.

[pchellak]

I was in a similar situation till sometime back. I really liked this friend of mine and started to like her more than a friend. It was almost like my life was starting to revolve around her and how she acted towards me each time i was with her. My last encounter with her made me realize that she looked at me only as a friend and i was starting to lose her friendship as well ( one of my friends said something like i was starting to act weird around her).

I decided to cut all contact with her for a while; In the meanwhile i am taking care of myself and taking every opportunity that comes along. The feeling that i wasted a year of my life thinking i would be with her someday is worse than actual rejection.

[Kitz]

I just have one question:

 

How did you meet this girl, and what did you go to make her hate you so much??

[Iori_Yagami]

Assuming that the last question was meant for me, I'll answer.

 

We study together in the same university, the same course and profile (it's IT, if it maters).

Our first meeting was quite ordinary. She didn't show neither anticipation, nor hatred, she was rather 'cold'. Later I tried to make a friendship-like contact with her, by helping with some study subject's undersanding (it was i8086 assembly, for the intrested). She told that she rather fail it, than take help from me, and that she has better people to help her. Seems it is a prejudice of sort.

 

All in all, quite a lot of time passed. We don't talk anymore. After she tried to hit me (pushing me on the ground - well, I'm heavier and she failed, but she sooooo mad at me, I honestly was afraid - it is when someone's eyes are flashing, their face totally red, and all moves rapid) I quit. She isn't a man, I actually can't either fight back, or calm her down, so leaving her alone is the only solution.

 

Honestly, now I don't think she really suits me. NEVER! Her character is purely that of choleric type - offensive, fast, active. Myself, being a mix between melancholic and flegmatic, I cannot match her tempo.

 

The main reason I'm still intrested in it, is wondering WHY? She refused to explain anything. What i know for sure, she doesn't have a b/f. All in all she is quite a wonderful girl in sense of attractiveness (sporty, fast, very young-looking) smart (not better than me, but still), but the character... It outweights all.

[Kitz]

Person "Y" needs to get a grip before person "X" pushes person "Y" down some stairs. She DOESN'T LIKE YOU and no matter how much you whinge, complain, and fake cry she isn't going to change her mind. You are annoying her, leave her alone.

 

Lol!

 

Look. Some people just dont need a reason to hate people and shouldn't have to EXPLAIN to the person why they hate them.. you could just talk weirdly or act strangely around her and it weirds her out a bit, you could be fat and she just has a thing against fat people, you could just be ugly. I dont know.. but if she doesnt like you, she shouldnt have to tell you! When she said that she would rather fail than get help from you, you should've taken the hint and backed off and never spoken to her again. You really shouldnt wait for someone to actually try and hurt you before you finally quit!

 

There are studies.. the more we are exposed to something the more we'll like that person or thing.. unless our intial reaction to it was negative, in which case it would make the hatred worse.. so every time you've spoken to her, it would've just resulted in making her hate you more.

[Iori_Yagami]

Yes, yes, do not get me wrong - I quit some 7 months ago, but I am analyzing everything from a distant view.

 

Why?

Actually, she insulted me. Don't I have the right to know why?

We all are equal. Different yes, but equal. I actually hate those people, who behave like you are in debt.

Personally I never insult anyone, even if he/she is a heavy drinking beggar.

[Iori_Yagami]

Long time no see, not-e-loners?

 

Now it's final year. I do really rarely see her (once a week or so) and still there is a very weird feeling in my ... errr. heart? soul? brain? Can't actually say, some clever people say it is just lust and social desadaptation which causes such problems with unrequited love or infatuation or simply unresponded kind feelings.

 

YES, I admit. I am a neurotic freak. YES, I do not want to argue on that matter. SURELY, my obsession with one particular person for two years while being clearly unwelcomed is REALLY not logical and understandible.

 

What I still want to talk about is - the origins of such feelings. Why me? What for? Why do I keep feeling the way I do? I ask myself - you are an IT specialist, you use logical reasoning and careful and thorough analysis. Why don't you use it to manage your own life? Afraid?

 

What is that value of emotion? Does it bring anything good? Does it move you to progress? Or does it stop you? So many questions, not so many answers.

 

We had to do a long-term group work on university's information system requirements analysis, and I (lucky? unlucky?) got into the same sub-group with her. Four people total. Me the leader. Oh, as soon as she realised that she fled without telling any reasons. Why? Finally, I have to do all the work now alone. Not fair, simply...

 

Is it good to move our personal conflict to this completely unrelated area? If I ever drown, will she help me to get out of the water or will she be glad? How angry and spoiled someone could be... I guess that is not only my own fault. I can't be blamed for everything around me. Tired of being scapegoat.

 

No, I can't ever argue with her. She's sooo beautiful to my taste. It is odd, but I always get so excited about her that I can't show a slightiest displeasement sign to her while she's somewhat near. Only "Please, Good morning, I could help you, How's going, etc"

 

Only later, when I realise that her answers like "get away, hate you, don't want to see you ever again, get lost, idiot" and such are truly painful to me, my heart starts to boil. Usually that night I see a dream about blood and needles. Knives, too. (NO, I'm just neurotic, not yet psychotic enough - these are just dreams anyway).

 

Why on earth beauty and good personal treats are almost always incompatible? Is it because we, who you call "plainly looking to ugly" have so much pain and disrespect that we learn not to hurt others, to listen patiently to them, to try to feel them, to be quiet and attentive all because we know hardsnips.

And they while never had felt despise or were pariahs, do not even realise that such behavior hurts others? Selfishness, yes, that is it.

 

And no, it was not said before. My vision is a little bit new. Usually beautiful and successful people are forgiven almost everything, but others are treated without such mercy. Selfishness also is a treat never discussed on a 1st type person, cause s/he's "popular", "cool", "powerful" or whatever you please...